Why we keep on failing...

[xBaron Dants]

Just a quick look around these forums reminds me again and again that as a people, despite being at a critical point in our existence, we are far from being respectable.

It seems our very existence is based on bashing each other, and creating differences.

Andrey tries to advertise a party that will raise funds for the ACYO, and the whole world comes crashing down on him. Jeez, if you don't want to go to the party, don't! But at least have the decency to not discourage others from going too! (I've been guilty of doing this myself in the past, by the way).

And then, we move on to the pathetic display that has become our Armenian discussions part..

One fellow saying he'd rather save a single Turk than save 1000 Armenians from the middle east.

Another one telling me a while back that the only diasporan Armenians that Hayastantsis like are Kirk Kerkorian and Charles Aznavour, because they sent a lot of money. Interesting... Maybe you'll start liking me when my bank account reaches the billion dollar mark..

And yet another saying "this is why we (arevelahays) hate arevmdahays".... while he had, a short time earlier actually started a thread about a potential symbol for Armenian Unity. Here's the best symbol I can find that shows Armenian Unity. That's how laughable and oxymoronic the term "Armenian Unity" really is..

http://clear.msu.edu:16080/dennie/clipart/laugh.gif

So for all those who think we're getting anywhere (and I would have been in this category a short while ago), we have a looooong way to go. BUt it seems that we're more comfortable right where we are.

[Hayq]

And yet another saying "this is why we (arevelahays) hate arevmdahays".... while he had, a short time earlier actually started a thread about a potential symbol for Armenian Unity. Here's the best symbol I can find that shows Armenian Unity. That's how laughable and oxymoronic the term "Armenian Unity" really is..

Holy sh!t that is totaly me! HEY EVERYONE! THAT WAS ME!

I always thought Armenians would work together to make a better home. But some Armenians think their home is Haleb or Beirut, or even a Church in LA. I told a girl if she were willing to help fund a company in Armenia...she rather give money to the Armenian churhc.

PHUCK CHURCH, God is not going to do anything.

[xBaron Dants]

But why would she invest in Armenia? Don't you arevelahays hate us? Is she supposed to be some sort of milking cow for you?

[Hayq]

She is half-and half. I dont think like that. I consider all Armenians the same.

Another thing Western Armenians have told me, is that they want to move back to the lands that the Turks have taken away and would not want to even GO to Armenia. See, we need to overcome this attitude of there being two Armenians. We need to have one mentality when it comes to being Armenian. Obviously we dont, so I will work on bashing all the Armenians into one type of Armenian. It gets soo nerve wrecking when you hear a Western Armenian talk more about God then a state...they believe God is going ot save Armenia and that America is going to be Armenia's savior. Phuck it.

[dstyle]

Hayq your generalizing a bit too much, maybe a few believe that, a lot more believe in the State itself. You talk as if Arevmdahyes are bad, thus proving Baron's points.

[xBaron Dants]

God and America are the two things that Armenians overrate most. Both have failed us, and both don't deserve our trust (I'm sorry if I got the evangelicals from California all riled up now).

You're a weird kid you. Sometimes I agree wholeheartedly with what you say, and some other times, I just want to punch you. You keep on switching from your "unity" talk to the "Eastern Armenians are clean Europeans and we will not let the dirty Western Armenians corrupt our minds" talk. Being open to arevmdahays only when it comes to investment is not going to work..

[XxgoeyxX]

Holy sh!t that is totaly me! HEY EVERYONE! THAT WAS ME!

I always thought Armenians would work together to make a better home. But some Armenians think their home is Haleb or Beirut, or even a Church in LA. I told a girl if she were willing to help fund a company in Armenia...she rather give money to the Armenian churhc.

PHUCK CHURCH, God is not going to do anything.

I tell myself not to comment in such threads because I get so upset with what people say. But I have to, so here it goes.

Some of you are upset that Armenians eat hummus and say yella, but then you (Hayq) say you are more Americanized then other Armenians. If that is the case then maybe you should stop calling yourself more "Americanized," because that means you're not working to make a "better home." It's all contradiction to me.


As for your comments about God...Well speak for yourself buddy.

[xBaron Dants]

All of Hayq's arguments are contradictory.

[Hayq]

:) Yup. Because I am not static. No reason to be Static. it is all bull sh!t forum talk.

I just came here to check out what the local Armenians were thinking...because I was banned from xxxxxxxx because they are kikes....bastards.

[Tigranes]

One fellow saying he'd rather save a single Turk than save 1000 Armenians from the middle east.



I said "Armenians" like that imbecile...
I know many Armenians who were raised in the Middle East whom I respect very much, much more than certain ex-USSR Armenians (I'm talking about the internationalist, commie xxx garbage). Those people know that the differences between Armenians and the current "culture" or lack thereof among the descendnats of the survivors of the Genocide is an abomination, sick consequence of the Genocide and they do their best to get rid of those influences not EMBRACE them like pathetic weaklings.

[Armenian]

Well, let me stick my Armenian nose into this one:

I really like "Barnon Dants" and "Hayg." Ideologically they make a lot of sense and they are true Armenian patriots.

Moreover, generally speaking, they are both right in their respects regarding "Eastern" and "Western" Armenians. Nevertheless, I, being a Western Armenian, much prefer Eastern Armenians - generally speaking. True Western Armenian Culture was extinguished on the eve of April 24th 1915. Today, all we have left within Diasporan Armenian communities are pockets of surviving Western Armenian intelligencia who will, within a generation or two, disappear altogether. However, we have an independent Armenian Republic within the Caucasus that has a lot of potential and we all need to recognize this and embrace this.

Let us put aside the "Rabiz," who are essentially sore thumbs within our communities - they don’t represent Armenian culture within Armenia (anyone who has visited the nation can see this clearly). I personally have great respect and adoration for Armenians from our Republic. After all it was they that single handedly (with Diasporan support of course) defeated the Turks in the battlefield. Moreover, Armenian Nationalists from Armenia tend to be very progressive, western oriented, highly educated and the people in general have a lot of artistic talent.

The only thing I would like to tell Baron Dants is that we Armenians are not as problematic as it may seem, we are just very opinionated, temperamental and not to mention - obsessive. This is all natural because for thousands of years we have been stuck in the middle of ideological differences. Thus, it is very natural that there will be a severe ideological divide amongst us. Not accepting this divide is to disregard human nature - and we Armenian are only human.

Nevertheless, our ideological divisions did help preserve our nation through the worst of times. When the Persians defeated the Armenian Byzantine faction within Armenia, it was the Armenian Persian faction that administered Armenia. When the Romans defeated the Armenian Persian faction within Armenian, it was the Armenian Roman faction that administered Armenia. When the The European Crusaders entered the region, it was the Armenian "Latin" faction that administered Armenia. The same could be said of the Arab invasions, the Mongol invasions, the Memluk invasions and even the Second World War.

During the Second World War, Armenians had forces on both sides of the battlefield. Although, the Armenian forces within the Whermacht were fighting the Red Army which included large numbers of Armenians, the Armenians of the Whermacht were instrumental in saving the lives of tens of thousands of Armenian prisoners of war. If Hitler had won the war, theoretically at least, Armenian Nazis would have administered Armenia - thus ensuring survival yet again. It so happened that the Red Army won the war and we Armenians were recognized by the Kremlin as great contributors and, thus, we were given more rights within the Soviet Union. In the end, it has all worked out for us - that is the reason why we are here today discussing this.

All nations, including xxxS, have serious internal problems - much more so than us Armenians. We Armenians at the very least have a common goal, our approaches may be a bit different, but the common goal is the preservation of the Armenian Republic and our unique identity. My comment to all those Armenians who rather go to western Armenia instead of the Republic of Armenia: You can all go to hell. Moreover, Armenians who think we are Middle Easterners are just ignorant children. Nevertheless, Armenians who think we are "Europeans" are just self-hating. We are Armenians, ARMENIANS, we are a unique bunch. We are not primitive Middle Easterners and we are not foofoo Europeans.

If anything, we are what Europe aught to be and what the Middle East could never be.

However, I did vote for Europe. :)

[xBaron Dants]

What Europe ought to be and what the Middle East could never be?

Haha, I love it.

I agree with most of what you're saying. However, just because the xxxs or whoever else have internal problems does not justify our own. We are still in a precarious state, and the survival of our Republic is also in a precarious state. This cannot be said of most of the other people we tend to comapre ourselves to (xxxs, Greeks, Italian).

Also, it is not ideological differences which I criticize. Ideological differences are healthy when people know how to exploit them. I am usually the first one to get involved in political debates. There is nothing wrong with that. What I hate is differences like "he is from Syria, he must be an arab-wannabe, or "he is from Armenia, he must be a rabiz gangster". Nothing ideological there. Just bickering...silly bickering.

I have a tremendous amount of love for both Diasporans and Hayastantsis. First of all, both have the same "joie de vivre" and attach the same importance to family. The Hayastantsis, during Soviet times, have played an amazing role in "recreating" a new vibrant Armenia, with great new authors, composers, singers, architects, scientists, chess players and everything else. As for the diasporans, to paraphrase Saroyan, they have been able to create a New Armenia wherever they have been, and have made their names both in foreign culture, and our very own.

Together, we should have no difficulties in establishing a strong and flourishing Republic....unless the rabiz gangsters don't want to work with an arab-wannabe like me...

[Che_Ka]

We are not primitive Middle Easterners and we are not foofoo Europeans.



You had me until the last sentence... :confused:

[gggpearl]

how many of you have been in Armenia?

[Hayq]

I have been to Armenia twice. ONce when I was 10, and the other last summer, when I was 16.

The recent trip really angered me. They are putting cafe's on the opera house lawn and the factories have remained closed for a decade and a half! The large amount of Iranians there was kind of a shock, I heard Tehran was a nice city, I dont know what they are doing in Armenia. I met an Persian girl in Armenia in fact, she was perty and I talked to her for a while..spoke good English and some Armenian. Thats not the point...

Armenia is ruining itself by turning into a country like Greece! I hate Tourism soo much! I rather have Armenia be like Poland (make good use of soviet equipment), but their situation is not all that great either...

Another thing that pissed me off, they are building more Churches! ! ! Turns out, operating a Church is big money in Armenia. I also saw the olympics in Armenia, big dissapointment, Armenians won, but Armenia did not...because you need to find a sponsor and the sponsors pick their friends. Good Job to the Turks and that big Persian guy, they lifted a lot of weight. (thats not the point either)

The POINT I was trying to make but my fingers got me sidetracked is that Armenians (west and east) need to work on East Armenia, the Republic we have left. Its the only thing we have. The Western Armenians give me a lot of BS on how we need to get those lands back from Turkey so they can go back and live in Van...PHUCK! That is so retarded.

[dstyle]

Hayq every post you talk smack about Arevmdahyes, stfu already.

[violette829]

Armenians are just bitter sometimes. I think the desire to top eachother will ultimately lead us to extinction. :( Just look these forums. This is the perfect example of how IGNORANCE and STUPIDITY have taken over us. It's like a dark cloud above our heads. Yes, we drive nice cars, wear nice clothes, but we are in a fantasy. This is all bullxxxx when it comes to the real world and real life. We take pleasure in looking down on anyone who is not up to par with our expectations. My neighbors are A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF THIS. I live in a complex, in the only townhouse, and the rest of the apartments are like 1-2 bedroom shiitholes. Well, maybe not shiitholes, but anyway...My neighbor has 2 sons, and one of them recently got married. Here's what our parking lot looks like. Mine: A Ford Exploder, 98 (whatever car). Next to me is their spot, or shall I say spots: 1 Mercedes S500. 1 BMW 745. 1 X5, 2 Yukon XL Denali, 1 Mitsubishi Galant. Hmm....guess what? The dad is the only decent one in the family with the intelligence to even raise his head and say hello to my mom and I in the garage. They hold their heads up HIGH TO THE SKY, with a BOGHAZ (big neck) the size of Afghanistan...just looking at them makes me sick. When we moved in, the 2 neighbors that actually came to welcome us were the 2 parskahye women on either side of us. The other one, WONT EVEN SAY HELLO! The son, as RABIZ AS CAN BE, just smirks when he sees me. Perhaps it's because he knows I spit on his cars (not literally), and that I don't give him any attention. WOW LONG TANGENT!!!!!! '

I didn't realize this until I moved to HELL, but there are major differences between the types of Armenians. Just because I'm parskahye, the hayastansi neighbors look down on me. Just because I don't have 200 cars in my 2 car garage, they don't think I'm deserving of their hello. Well, maybe I'm not. But, it's a common courtesy. Even the homeless guy sleeping in the corner will say hello as you pass him. What does he have? Nothing.

[Hayq]

Hayq every post you talk smack about Arevmdahyes, stfu already.

Mods! I demand dstyle be banned for trying to shut me up. I thought we were friends. :crying:

[!EEK]

I don't know any of those kind of attitudes from Armenian in Belgium, maybe it is because they aren't a lot :p

ANyways, this kind of attitude is also common to Lebanese people. Some are really nice and everything, but the rest, don't get me started over it...

[IAmMadAtAC]

Mods! I demand dstyle be banned for trying to shut me up. I thought we were friends. :crying:

Haha well I concure (agree), as a "Western" Armenian I feel you talk way too much smack about us. You act like just because we feel more deeply connected with Western Armenia instead of the republic (you would too if you were from there), that we don't help Armenia out. We don't give money to Turkey to fix up the towns we came from obviously, we are all united in helping out the republic. You can't blame us for being homesick though.

[Hayq]

Haha well I concure (agree), as a "Western" Armenian I feel you talk way too much smack about us. You act like just because we feel more deeply connected with Western Armenia instead of the republic (you would too if you were from there), that we don't help Armenia out. We don't give money to Turkey to fix up the towns we came from obviously, we are all united in helping out the republic. You can't blame us for being homesick though.

I saw a documentary how western Armenians were beginning to help Turkish farmers irrigate lands in Turkey just because it is their homeland.

And no, I would not think like that. We need an Armenian dictator that would get all the Armenians in the world and mold them into one through force. Because Armenians are after all stubborn fools, a stalinist man is needed to crush the west, east, persian, and russian armenians together to form ONE. Only through brutal force can this be achieved amongst Armenians, because obviously you guys are stubborn jerks who dont want to be one but rahter different people who come together. :cool:

[Thai-Samurai]

I'll volunteer for that job.

[Thai-Samurai]

NOW GET TO WORK DAMIT!! NO POSTING!! We don't have time for posting, I WANT YOU ALL TO IRRIGATE YOUR BACKYARDS NOW!!!!






Can I add something? I've come across the word 'rabiz' many times already in this forum. What the hell does rabiz mean, I've deduced it's a type of Armenian, but it sounds like the xxxish rabi, so I keep imgining an Armenian w/ xxxish hair, so if I'm wrong can someone please explain rabiz to me.

[!EEK]

Can I add something? I've come across the word 'rabiz' many times already in this forum. What the hell does rabiz mean

I also asked this question a month ago or so...

I was aid rabiz is a negativ word designing those Armenians that think they are above all other armenians and are the best at representing Armenia. They usually spend all their money on shiny cars and watches and neglige the ones they think aren't worth their attention. Big neck..



I might have forgotten some stuff but thats the only thing I rmemeber about "rabiz"

[Thai-Samurai]

oh I see, yes I don't like the thuggish ruggish armenians either.

[IAmMadAtAC]

I saw a documentary how western Armenians were beginning to help Turkish farmers irrigate lands in Turkey just because it is their homeland.

What...? First of all I have NEVER EVER heard any Western Armenians EVER express or give any help to Turkey ever. Nor have I ever heard of such a program. Which western Armenians were these, where were they from?
Second, are you trying to say that somoeone actually bothered to make a documentary on Turkish irrigation and/or Western Armenian support of it??

[Hayq]

It was a short 10 minute segment I saw in Armenia on the BBC.

Rabiz is someone who is into that sad music played on the duduk, the backwards Armenians.

[Thai-Samurai]

but that music is good though.

[IAmMadAtAC]

It was a short 10 minute segment I saw in Armenia on the BBC.


Did it say where the Western Armenians were from, what country in the Diaspora? Because NONE of the US WAs I know feels connected enough to actually help out Turkey, unless possibly if it was to renovate an Armenian church or something but Turkey obviously would never allow that now would they?

Rabiz is someone who is into that sad music played on the duduk, the backwards Armenians.

No, that is cool music. Rabiz are those that love rap and black types stuff. Ones who think they are thugs.

[Hayq]

No. Rabiz are teh guys who walk around with leather jackets, italian shoes, 80s tinted glasses, talk in a wierd way, and listen to duduks and aram asatrian.

the ones you are describing are the fobers, I think thats what they are called.

[violette829]

Here's a RABIZ....

[!EEK]

Here's a RABIZ....

:laugh: where yougot that from? Random search on AC?

[violette829]

:laugh: where yougot that from? Random search on AC?

Went to Yahoo images, typed in Rabiz..and BAAM! :laugh: Funny isn't it?

[!EEK]

Went to Yahoo images, typed in Rabiz..and BAAM! :laugh: Funny isn't it?

Rabiz is only for armenians or its for anyone that acts like that?

[violette829]

Rabiz is only for armenians or its for anyone that acts like that?


ONLY ARMENIANS ACT LIKE THAT> :laugh:

[!EEK]

ONLY ARMENIANS ACT LIKE THAT> :laugh:

I hope they don't show a bad image of the common armenian over there.....:(

[IAmMadAtAC]

Seriously... Rabiz is mainly restricted to Armenians because no one else would dare dress that like! I hate Rabiz trash!

Hayq I'd still like to know where what country those Western Armenians are from that help Turkish irrigation.

[Hayq]

How the phuck should I know? It said, "Armenians move to Turkey to begin new life".

[IAmMadAtAC]

How the phuck should I know? It said, "Armenians move to Turkey to begin new life".

Well you knew they were western armenians after all... or are you just ASSUMING they were because clearly all western armenians are evil?

[Hayq]

I was assuming because all Western Armenians are evil...I assumed because they had were using their dialect...

[gggpearl]

just wanted to make some clarifications about rabiz...
originally it comes from Russian - (rab)ochee (is)skustvo=rabis which means working art, i.e. art of working class. then as most of the russian words it went some phonetic changes and become rabiz as it sounds now. i guess in the beginning nobody thought that it will get such a negative connotation but now it is really used only with a negative reference.

as for western and eastern armenians i always wonder why people try to find only the negative things in each other, after all there are so many wonderful ones in spite of everything and the life is too short and the armenians are to few and they are too good to be bad...

[HyeJinx1984]

I saw a documentary recently in which someone stated that the Armenian's secret to survival has always been the ability to develop a double identity. To be able to blend in and become a integral part of whatever society they are in, but at the same time retain their "armenianess" and whatever that means to them and pass it on to their kids. I actually whole heartedly believe in this... this why generation after generation Armenians in Iran, Lebenon, Syria, Argentina, and many other places in the world haven't assimilated yet. However, why is it that merely a generation or two in America we're seeing such a quick decline in Armenian responsibilty and cultural awareness?

The answer is because the American system is very indvidualistic and self centered, traits that Armenians are too quick to fancy. Call me a pinko commie or whatever, but the ammount of individualism that the American system offers makes us forget about everything but outselves.

My dad lived in an Apartment building in Tehran growing up, he used to play with all his neighbors and knew all of them. My mom grew up in Baku, she knew all her neighbors, families would be over at each others houses all the time. I'm SURE it's the same way in Armenian, Russia, Lebenon, etc... Now, I was raised here in America, I've lived in this building for 10 years now... I don't think I know a single person's name, let alone made any close friends with the kids. There's no sense of community here, no sense of camaraderie.

So what's the point of this diatrabe that seems to have no relation to the topic at hand? The point is, America holds more Armenians than anywhere else outside the former soviet union... and we're all being "poisoned" by the "virtues" of this land. It's because of this carefree "Be a good girl and go to work in the morning, come back at night, go to the nightclub on the weekend to enjoy your freedom and run back to the hamster wheel on monday" system that relieves us of all responsibilty to anyone but ourselves and our bills that we send to big brother every month. The common man has no agenda here. Forget the protesters you see in the streets... how many individuals, Armenians or otherwise, living in this country have passions (outside themselves)? causes (outside themselves)? agendas (outside themselves)? Almost no one. It's because of this EXTREME individualism that no one thinks twice after muttering the words "but, it makes me happy"

We rally around politicians who supposbly have our best interests in mind. Where are the revolutionaries? where is the man who's sick of coming home from work every day to world he hates even more than his job? where's the mother who's sick of watching the apple of her eye turn into a piece of garbage cause he watches too much BET? Where are the preservers of culture, the warriors? I'm not talking about elected officials or legends or national heroes. I'm talking about YOU, I'm talking about your parents, your GRAND parents, your children... Why do we think OTHERS will help us? Why don't each and everyone one of us become a one man (or woman) campaign against everything that would eradicate us? Becuase.... America doesn't work that way.

So... you want me to go up to someone raised in this system, with an "ian" at the end of their name or not, and say "Hey, why don't you help out?"

[Hayq]

ok i didnt even bother to continue to read ur bull xxxx post. ok. first of all armenians are not comfortable where we xxxxin are. im not comfortable pple in my school callin me armo. mmmmmmmkkk. im not comfortable when think about all those kids in armenian who are poor and live on the streets. the only armenians who are comfortable are the xxxxxxxs who only think about the cocasians they make fun of and the chinese pple. get over the fact that are nation is comfortable. sure we're better than we were but thats no reason to say we're comfortable where we r. BECAUSE WE ARE xxxxIN LOSING LAND AND ONLY HAVE ABOUT 8 MILLION OF US!!!!!!! OUR MEN ARE SEXIST ARE WOMEN ONLY CARE ABOUT GOSSIP AND THE FOOD THEY NEED TO COOK FOR THEIR HUSBANDS. THE KIDS ARE FOBS WHO DONT UNDERSTAND ANYTHING. OUR GRANDMAS GOT MARRIED BEFORE THEY EVEN GOT THEIR PERIODS!!!! SO DONT xxxxING SAY WE ARE COMFORTABLE RIGHT WHERE WE xxxxING ARE!!!!!!!!!!

You can help by learning English, getting a job, and making something of yourself. :)

Armenian men are not sexist, it is Western men who are pushovers. Women gossip, true...but they do take care of kids. The kids are fools, no doubt.