Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Bro, not all Kurds were attacking us. When you account for the Kurdish total population and the number of Kurds attacking us it doesn't even come close to forming a significant percentage. The majority refused at attack. This nerrative that all Kurds took part in killing Armenians is BS. The nerrative that all Kurds want to "complete the genocide" by living in western Armenia is BS.
If both Kurds and Armenians want to weaken Turkey, we have a better chance if we coaperate and watch eachothers backs. That's the logic behind Montes calls for allying ourselves with the Kurds. Sorry bro, but I'm going to go with Monte's logic over yours.

--- the majority refused to attack --- ?????
Where did you get that info?
Concerning 1915 exclusively ... The kurd population supported the genocide and expulsion. The kurd population at large supplied the kurds (voluntarily) to assist in the murdering, rape ( dehumanizing) and abduction of the --- ENTIRE --- Armenian population in western Armenia.
Did I say voluntarily, yes, but I forgot to say --- eagerly ---.
This group came from the general kurd population, and when the murdering , rape , abduction , we're done they went back to there respective villages and consolidated as much of the Armenian wealth as they could for the specific benifit of kurds.
Amongst the " ? Non participants ? " we're the women who searched any and every dead Armenian women on the ground for any valuables they could get. The reason why they (kurd women) only searched dead Armenian women was because of a kurd taboo on men searching women. The kurd men searched every single dead Armenian men.
Amongst virtually every Armenian village where the Armenians were --- expelled --- there were murdered Armenians that never went on the forced marches and never met the volunteer kurd murders. Instead, there dead bodies, homes, property, valuables, met the general kurd population.
1915 was not an isolated event. What the kurds did then, they have been doing for --- hundreds --- of years. That's why they had the population in the areas circa 1915 that they had.
Look at Adana and Hamidan ... What participation did the kurs have and what happened to all that land of approx 330,000 murdered Armenians? What happened to any survivors?
Monte is not with us that I may argue my point with him.
The kurd right now (today) is --- NOT --- struggling for the (justice) rights of any Armenian. Their intention is to turn western Armenia into north kurdistan.
I'll agree with you and Monte and Hakob, that to fight them and turcs (both east & west) is counter productive.
The politicle motivated apology for 1915 by by ?which kurd? Doesn't represent the Kurd at large lol. They have no thought of restoring what's ours. NONE. Their thoughts extend no further than themselves.
How many times did the kurd join forces with the hominoid turc to attack Nakijivan in the last 300 years?
The only way there could be a mountain turc (kurd) in Anatolia , is to have killed the original mountain people (us).
As a practical decision I can see where you and Monte are coming from, but to think a kurd actually cares about us or has any remorse for their conduct is far from reality.

Guys imagine a scenario(it can happen or cannot, but in politics everything is possible as long as you are inventive enough).
Kurdish movement goes to full fledge civil war, turkey is boiling with unrest and NATO is not up to preventing it's ally's disintegration. Kurds declare autonomy and kick out Turkish army. As soon as Nakhijevan looses it's direct contact with Turkish military, war in Artsakh breaks out which turns to full fledged hostilities between Armenia and Azerbaijan. Using the pretext of nessecity we take over Nakhichevan and clear it.
Being in touch and with agreement with Kurds and in order to establish srcurity, our army takes over Igdir and Kars.
Having convinced Kurds in necessity of establishing security zone and controll over trade roads we jointly press north and cut out a section of Black Sea coast.
We convince Kurds to give the necessary oversight of Armenian cultural monuments to us and also in ensuing years some part of population around Van, Tigranakerd and other places comes out and converts back to Armenian roots. We have a possibility of a second Javakhk in our south. But we controll Nakhijevan (thus, more security against Baku) Kars, Igdir, sarikamish, Ardahan and Ardvin with opening to Black Sea in Hopa. No more blockade. No more begging for trade. We choose with whom we trade.
Sounds impossible?
But a fiew years ago nobody could dream that Soviet Union would not be anymore and we would be independent. Iraq and Syria would collapse and borders would be redrawn all over.
Some powers like Russia or Us would not let it happen? But there's also so many things that have and do slip out of their hands all the time.
I know one thing. It will be better version of events for any near future than fight Kurds fight this fight that without knowing the outcome.
One thing for sure that we need for good things to happen is to strengthen Armenia.

As a practicle realistic approach, I can understand. However, the only shared interest we have is the demise of the wretched turc.

ofc not all kurds, remember also turks helped many armenians, thats not changing anything at all, right now there are kurds who living in our lands, thats means alot, i dont meant that we must do genocide on kurds, i meant that our artillery is ABLE to make it if its needed!

yes, both turcs and kurds assisted in helping "thousands" of Armenians --- HIDE --- via some sort of phony assimilation, whilst they took everything.
I would suggest everyone not confuse politicle expediency for trust of the kurd.
The kurd has not changed.

[Hakob]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

QAs long as Kurds see Turks as enemies, we can have all the possible scenarios happening.
We don't need Kurds as enemies. Our best first choices should be diplomacies. While with Turks the lines are drawn in the sand, with Kurds, despite sad past, it has yet to be drawn.
As long as Kurdish leadership has extended their hand for us, we shall not leave it in air.
Actually our government should stop chickening and Exchange Diplomatic missions with Kurds in Iraq or northern Syria.
In the least benefit by doing so, we can guarantee that Armenians in that war torn regions can count on Kurdish support.
Now can someone tell me how are Kurds treating Armenians in territories under their controll? I have no info.
I hope not negative.
We need as much info about those Kurdish leadership as we can get.

[Hakob]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Artashes,
I agree with you about the past %100%, but I don't see the benefit of letting any new developments fall under that sad pasts shadow.
Who the Kurds are and what they did, or what they are capable under right circumstances is a fact. But I don't see any benefit of letting a new state be our enemy even before it is born.
Haven't we got enough enemies?
What Kurds did as ethnic group under Turkish mentors controll can be totally different from what future leadership or general population of a country that is based on different geopolitical needs and aspirations will do.

[HyeFighter2]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Sorry for off top, but this kind of shocked me, any ideas??

[Eddo211]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

So if west tries to keep new Kurdistan under controll who do you think will oppose them?
If you guessed Russia and Iran, you are correct. It will be "come to papa" sort of thing.
Who's on the first line bordering Kurds? We.
Let's stop about war between us and Kurds ok? It will never happen. We don't need to.
Fighting Kurds and making them accept Turkish friendship once again will seal the fate of our lands away from us.
Kurds and us are going to be very close is we are smart. We need those orphans to get home and we will be like a permanent guest there.
We don't need Kurds defending against us.
No war, ok?
When giving privileges to Kurds over Armenians in eastern Anatolia did not get the results Turks wanted, namely wiping out Armenians by Kurdish help, Turks started scaring Kurds that " soon Armenians with Russian soldiers are going to come and kick you out of your lands and make the area all Christian".
That propaganda worked. Fear works.
We have to stop big mouthing our possible allies away, and serousely start thinking how the landscape and relations can be post Turkish domination.

I was not calling for war on Kurds....someone else did I agree with you. I just don't trust Kurds. Even say if they were fight along side us they cannot be trusted. They hide behind you and just blow through Mags so e can go back. Without us they won't move an inch forward. They are controlled by US, Israel, NATO, Turkey and they are yes man with all of them.

Also I want it to point out a war with Kurds will trigger an attack by Azerbaijan.

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Armenian Army

[londontsi]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Sorry for off top, but this kind of shocked me, any ideas??

In the past there has been talk about creating a government in exile.

The argument against this has been that

The Republic of Armenia represents the Armenian nation.

There is no Eastern and Western Armenians. There is one Armenian nation.

We are not the result of merging of two nations but the forced separation of the same nation.

There are Eastern and Western dialects which is the result of our our history.

.

[Mher]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

In the past there has been talk about creating a government in exile.

The argument against this has been that

The Republic of Armenia represents the Armenian nation.

There is no Eastern and Western Armenians. There is one Armenian nation.

We are not the result of merging of two nations but the forced separation of the same nation.

There are Eastern and Western dialects which is the result of our our history.

.

Yeah I think it's absolutely pointless. This doesn't mean anything, change anything. You can't be a citizen of a pretend place that doesn't exist at the moment. Become a citizen of Armenia, and contribute to its advancement, so one day, when the opportunities presents itself, we are ready to retake what is our: which is just another part of Armenia.

As far as the Kurds, i think it needs to be understood that there are different factions within the Kurds, and we need to best understand that to make the best of the situation. The Kurds in Turkey, as far as the PKK is concerned, are about as left wing as it gets, and this puts them far them far away from either Islamists or NATO. At this point it needs to be understood they represent a different entity that those who committed the Genocide.

[Spetsnaz]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Azerbaijani diaspora leader killed in Ukraine - VİDEO
17 August 2015

http://en.apa.az/xeber_azerbaijani_diaspora_leader_killed_in_uk_230864.html

Two more Azerbaijanis reportedly killed in Kherson and Crimea
18 August 2015

http://en.apa.az/xeber_two_more_azerbaijanis_reportedly_killed__230896.html

I wonder who is interested in killing Azeries.

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The "Union 2015" international contest-gathering was launched in Tsakhkadzor
Viewers: 114 22:57 17.08.2015


The launch of the "Union 2015: Heirs of Victory – Armenia" international contest-gathering was given on August 17 in Tsakhkadzor.

More than 500 youngsters from different parts of the world will attempt to be the best in different competitions for two weeks. There are various competitions and sports: 3km marathon, overcoming obstacles, first aid service, alpinism, shooting, fencing, etc..

The Heirs of Victory event first time took place in 2007, in Kirgizstan, and after that in many republics of former USSR. It takes place in Armenia for the first time.The contest-gathering is dedicated to the 70th anniversary of victory in the Great Patriotic War.

http://www.1tv.am/en/news/2015/08/17/Union-2015/21549