Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Mher]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Yes random Russian officials or representatives arguing on the basis of feasibility or economics is a totally different situation than them saying that the official Russian government releasing a statement saying the railway is a bad idea, and its a bad idea because its drives Armenia away.

And for the record, in terms of financial profit, in terms of the railway by itself, the railway is a loss, and financially not feasible in regards to paying back for itself. So what they have said is not false. The point is, its very beneficial for the country as a whole in the benefit it will third parties, in doing business in the country. Not to mention the political and economic benefits.

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

It's not confirmed. Anyway, there was a Russian "base" (actually a radar station) at this same location until a few years ago and it did not change anything in terms of Russian relations w/ Armenia vis-a-vis Azerbaijan. Also to add that the radar station is exclusive for usage by Russia and is meant for long range missile detection. It is not connected to Azerbaijan's air defense grid.

That said, maybe Armenia can offer to host this same type of radar station on its soil if it covers the appropriate range that Russia wants by placing it in Azerbaijan.

I looked into the Kabala radar station years ago when it was shutdown.
It's a huge, immovable structure. It's a phased array radar of enormous proportion. If I remember , it can see at least 1,500 miles or more. The time it takes to turn it off and on for recalibration/reorientation is long and costly.
When the tatar demanded that Russia show them and teach them how to use it the Russians laughed. Monkeys tried to force a technological transfer from Russia (lol).
Russia removed key tech parts/equipment and left the monolithic chunk of concrete for baboons to ponder, lol again.
Since then Russia has built other phased array radar on russian soil to compensate for Kabala loss.
The new radars are modular in design and not as cumbersome. However, they cannot see as far because they are further away. Significant coverage was lost.
My guess is Kabala goes back up. This has more to do because of west's pressure and nothing to do with our conflict with the jerks to our east.
The Russian base if realized will be exclusively for radar op and zero else. Radar is for detection over 1,000 miles away.
Don't think Hayastan location is as good as current location for radars purpose.
The cost to bring Kabala back up is tiny compared to new station as they only need to bring key high tech components back.
Also that particular type of radar will probably never be built again. Size, time, cost, immobility are too prohibitive. However, the power of that type is off the charts . That puppy ain't short on wattage or ability to use the juice.
The base is no threat to us.

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

“Unity 2015 – Heirs of Victory”: Summary of Day One
2015-08-18
August 17th saw the award ceremony for the winners of the “Knife Throwing” and “Wall to Wall” competitions in the the international youth-oriented military-educational competitive event “Unity 2015 – Heirs of Victory: Armenia.”
Based on individual results, the number one team are the youths from the military-patriotic club "Chance" of the city of Ivdel, in the Sverdlovsk Region of the Russian Federation. Based on team results, first, second and third places were occupied by the “Tigran the Great,” “Desantura, and “Red Army” platoons respectively. In the “Wall to Wall” competition, during which each team is tasked with forcing the opposing team from a predetermined territory, the winner was “Desantura,” with the second and third places going to “SOBR” and “ALPHA” respectively.
The winners were awarded by Chief of the Department of Information and Public Affairs Vardan Avetisyan, Chief of Monte Melkonian Military Institute Vitali Voskanyan, and Deputy Chief of the Monte Melkonian Military Institute Karen Avagyan.
In addition to the competitions, swimming, weightlifting, firearm usage, and defence against chemical and biological attack lessons took place on August 17th.
The day ended with the “Armenia Day” cultural program, during which the Armenian team in the “Unity 2015 – Heirs of Victory: Armenia” held a presentation of Armenian history, culture, song and dance.

http://www.mil.am/1439902719

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Yes random Russian officials or representatives arguing on the basis of feasibility or economics is a totally different situation than them saying that the official Russian government releasing a statement saying the railway is a bad idea, and its a bad idea because its drives Armenia away.

And for the record, in terms of financial profit, in terms of the railway by itself, the railway is a loss, and financially not feasible in regards to paying back for itself. So what they have said is not false. The point is, its very beneficial for the country as a whole in the benefit it will third parties, in doing business in the country. Not to mention the political and economic benefits.

Agree with all points made.
In regard to point made in 2nd paragraph, exceptional!
That's been my goal for years, unfortunately I've fallen on my face repeatedly.
To invest without gaining personal profit or even to get invested money back, but rather to see any and all profit go to the country is actually profitable (highly) for the country.
The benefits are remarkable for the country, but alas, may not get someone there own Greek island.
Mher's 2nd paragraph has insight that is invisible to the greed ridden. Also , the greedy does not want that understanding to be perceived by the underfunded.
It's very important for the manipulators that every thinks (only) through the "profit/loss" road game that things are possible. Otherwise, the world would address things based on need and merit compared to profit.
The concept in Mher's 2nd paragraph is extremely important to understand.

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[gokorik]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

--- the majority refused to attack --- ?????
Where did you get that info?
Concerning 1915 exclusively ... The kurd population supported the genocide and expulsion. The kurd population at large supplied the kurds (voluntarily) to assist in the murdering, rape ( dehumanizing) and abduction of the --- ENTIRE --- Armenian population in western Armenia.
Did I say voluntarily, yes, but I forgot to say --- eagerly ---.
This group came from the general kurd population, and when the murdering , rape , abduction , we're done they went back to there respective villages and consolidated as much of the Armenian wealth as they could for the specific benifit of kurds.
Amongst the " ? Non participants ? " we're the women who searched any and every dead Armenian women on the ground for any valuables they could get. The reason why they (kurd women) only searched dead Armenian women was because of a kurd taboo on men searching women. The kurd men searched every single dead Armenian men.
Amongst virtually every Armenian village where the Armenians were --- expelled --- there were murdered Armenians that never went on the forced marches and never met the volunteer kurd murders. Instead, there dead bodies, homes, property, valuables, met the general kurd population.
1915 was not an isolated event. What the kurds did then, they have been doing for --- hundreds --- of years. That's why they had the population in the areas circa 1915 that they had.
Look at Adana and Hamidan ... What participation did the kurs have and what happened to all that land of approx 330,000 murdered Armenians? What happened to any survivors?
Monte is not with us that I may argue my point with him.
The kurd right now (today) is --- NOT --- struggling for the (justice) rights of any Armenian. Their intention is to turn western Armenia into north kurdistan.
I'll agree with you and Monte and Hakob, that to fight them and turcs (both east & west) is counter productive.
The politicle motivated apology for 1915 by by ?which kurd? Doesn't represent the Kurd at large lol. They have no thought of restoring what's ours. NONE. Their thoughts extend no further than themselves.

As a practicle realistic approach, I can understand. However, the only shared interest we have is the demise of the wretched turc.
yes, both turcs and kurds assisted in helping "thousands" of Armenians --- HIDE --- via some sort of phony assimilation, whilst they took everything.
I would suggest everyone not confuse politicle expediency for trust of the kurd.
The kurd has not changed.

Sorry for the late response. Im not sure why I wrote most Kurds refused but i was trying to say that out of the millions of Kurds that lived in the Ottoman Empire a small fraction of the total kurdish population killed Armenians. It's not like millions of Kurd left their homes and went on a killing spree.

I agree millions of kurds looted and stole property but do you think they took evrything with the idea of completing a genocide?Do you think all Kurds hid Armenian childrento Kurdify them? I don't and I can't hate an etire race for being poor and taking things that were now abandoned. Don't think I don't care about what was stolen. My families home is a part of what's stolen. I just disagree with the idea that attacking the Kurds to force them out somehow equates to justice, which is where this disscussion started.

One thing I can say is my understanding of the extent of kurdish involvment in not only the genocide, but before and after, has been expanded. I don't see them the same way as i did a week ago.

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Sorry for the late response. Im not sure why I wrote most Kurds refused but i was trying to say that out of the millions of Kurds that lived in the Ottoman Empire a small fraction of the total kurdish population killed Armenians. It's not like millions of Kurd left their homes and went on a killing spree.

I agree millions of kurds looted and stole property but do you think they took evrything with the idea of completing a genocide?Do you think all Kurds hid Armenian childrento Kurdify them? I don't and I can't hate an etire race for being poor and taking things that were now abandoned. Don't think I don't care about what was stolen. My families home is a part of what's stolen. I just disagree with the idea that attacking the Kurds to force them out somehow equates to justice, which is where this disscussion started.

One thing I can say is my understanding of the extent of kurdish involvment in not only the genocide, but before and after, has been expanded. I don't see them the same way as i did a week ago.

I have no desire to kill the incredibly intelligent kurd peasant.
---- it's not like millions of Kurds went on a killing spree ---
No, your right. Those heartless freaks were supplied by the millions.
You agree an incredible number of Kurds looted and stole property. Me too.
Do I think they looted with the intent to complete a genocide?
I don't think the kurd has the IQ to formulate such vision into the future.
However, the outcome was identicle to the outcome if they had that intention.
Do I think (ALL) kurds ...
I wouldn't say all, but that's the outcome.
Do you know of --- ANY --- kurd that hide an Armenian or any Armenians that supported them and helped them retain their identity? Do you think any cared up until a few short years ago?
Read of a kurd who owned an Armenian church. This Kurd and his entire tribe went to battle to protect the Armenians circa 1915.
When the Armenian (fella who started comitis) sp? Asked how he could own an Armenian church, he explained, after everyone was killed or marched off, he inherited that and all surroundings.
When asked by Hayr what he's going to do with the church, he emmediately gave the church and 7 surrounding pieces of church property to said Armenian.
No mention of the rest of ... No dought there was no thought either.
If there was a church there, the community surrounded it.
Ok, so their actions coincide with the intentions of the genocide (but) they didn't possess (?) those intentions. They just wanted the property etc.
Oh ya, and they were poor.

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Don't think I'm presenting my point adequately .
Let me just say ... Something doesn't sound right with your argument .

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The kurd paints the picture that what is happening to them is like what happened to us.
Are the Circassian attacking them too? Are other renegade evil Kurds also attacking them?
And they compare their situation to a genocide.
I'm having trouble finding words.

[Artashes]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

For gokorik
Let me try one more time.
Wheresoever the kurd lives in western Armenia, there are (or were) Hayr graves.
In the modern times many (any?) have been destroyed by ????????
We're they forced to do that?
What was their motivation for breaking all those katchkars????
Do you think (maybe) they were trying to erase our presence? Or maybe it's cause their poor and that's what poor people do (lol ??? NO , I mean for crying out loud).
How about the holes dug round the churches??? And the reason was ... Mmm, I know, the turcs made them do that.