Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The political west today would love nothing more than to wrestle Armenia away from Russia's influence, no matter what the price. They wouldn't care if they turned it into another Georgia, where significant portions of the country are lost, or another Ukraine...civil war. But unlike the aforementioned countries, Armenia as zero room for error. The loss of Artsakh or Zangezur would put Armenia at the direct risk of elimination off the map. Any civil war scenario, as in Ukraine, could give our enemies the green light to go in for the kill. Our geographic location doesn't allow room for a lot of flexibility or experimentation. So, no matter how bad Russia might be, its our best option, because the only other option is a scenario similar to Ukraine and Georgia, and in our case, we may not survive it. Giving credit where credit is due, the Turks have never violated Armenian airspace due to the Russian factor, whereas they have violated Greek airspace on numerous occasions. When the Turks occupied half of Cyprus, the west didn't pull the type of shiiittt it did when Crimea was liberated. For our country, security is the number one priority, something the West can't assist us with.

With all that said, I can't stand it when Armenians bash eachother's heads over the west and Russia...we've got Turks to worry about. This type of infighting only serves Turkish interests. Whatever each side does, it does strictly out of self-interest. As a people, we have to be conscious of that. For example, it is a matter of fact that Russia is not interested in an Armenia that exercises independent policy, but one that is dependent on Russia. However, does that mean we turn to the West? What will that give us? So there's all these calculations involved. It's not all black and white, but there's clearly areas where we can't put our security at risk, and vehemently anti-Russian projects, such as those advocated by Richard Giragosian and Lragir, are clearly against the state interests of Armenia.

I could not agree more!

[Serjik]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Bro you put it very articulately. I guess this place has more intelligent people than I thought LOL

but what would you do if you have a army of anti-Russian activists in our society always doing their best to wrestle armenia away from russia? Let them turn armenia into a georgia or ukraine or cyprus just because they are armenian? No way! When explaining does not work because they are getting paid to spread anti russian stuff bashing their heads in is the only way to save armenia.

The political west today would love nothing more than to wrestle Armenia away from Russia's influence, no matter what the price. They wouldn't care if they turned it into another Georgia, where significant portions of the country are lost, or another Ukraine...civil war. But unlike the aforementioned countries, Armenia as zero room for error. The loss of Artsakh or Zangezur would put Armenia at the direct risk of elimination off the map. Any civil war scenario, as in Ukraine, could give our enemies the green light to go in for the kill. Our geographic location doesn't allow room for a lot of flexibility or experimentation. So, no matter how bad Russia might be, its our best option, because the only other option is a scenario similar to Ukraine and Georgia, and in our case, we may not survive it. Giving credit where credit is due, the Turks have never violated Armenian airspace due to the Russian factor, whereas they have violated Greek airspace on numerous occasions. When the Turks occupied half of Cyprus, the west didn't pull the type of shiiittt it did when Crimea was liberated. For our country, security is the number one priority, something the West can't assist us with.

With all that said, I can't stand it when Armenians bash eachother's heads over the west and Russia...we've got Turks to worry about. This type of infighting only serves Turkish interests. Whatever each side does, it does strictly out of self-interest. As a people, we have to be conscious of that. For example, it is a matter of fact that Russia is not interested in an Armenia that exercises independent policy, but one that is dependent on Russia. However, does that mean we turn to the West? What will that give us? So there's all these calculations involved. It's not all black and white, but there's clearly areas where we can't put our security at risk, and vehemently anti-Russian projects, such as those advocated by Richard Giragosian and Lragir, are clearly against the state interests of Armenia.

[Artsakh]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Bro you put it very articulately. I guess this place has more intelligent people than I thought LOL

but what would you do if you have a army of anti-Russian activists in our society always doing their best to wrestle armenia away from russia? Let them turn armenia into a georgia or ukraine or cyprus just because they are armenian? No way! When explaining does not work because they are getting paid to spread anti russian stuff bashing their heads in is the only way to save armenia.

You will find people from both sides that won't or are incapable of listening to reason. I find those who insist its "Russia and that's that" just as irrational as those who rip their assses for the West. There are instances of both betraying us heavily in the past. The current situation is one of working with what we've got, making the best out of our situation.

For instance, when that pre parliament organized the car march to NKR, authorities came down pretty hard, and that wasn't necessary. They could have exploited that, and tried to. Fortunately, things didn't get out of hand.

[argin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The political west today would love nothing more than to wrestle Armenia away from Russia's influence, no matter what the price. They wouldn't care if they turned it into another Georgia, where significant portions of the country are lost, or another Ukraine...civil war. But unlike the aforementioned countries, Armenia as zero room for error. The loss of Artsakh or Zangezur would put Armenia at the direct risk of elimination off the map. Any civil war scenario, as in Ukraine, could give our enemies the green light to go in for the kill. Our geographic location doesn't allow room for a lot of flexibility or experimentation. So, no matter how bad Russia might be, its our best option, because the only other option is a scenario similar to Ukraine and Georgia, and in our case, we may not survive it. Giving credit where credit is due, the Turks have never violated Armenian airspace due to the Russian factor, whereas they have violated Greek airspace on numerous occasions. When the Turks occupied half of Cyprus, the west didn't pull the type of shiiittt it did when Crimea was liberated. For our country, security is the number one priority, something the West can't assist us with.

With all that said, I can't stand it when Armenians bash eachother's heads over the west and Russia...we've got Turks to worry about. This type of infighting only serves Turkish interests. Whatever each side does, it does strictly out of self-interest. As a people, we have to be conscious of that. For example, it is a matter of fact that Russia is not interested in an Armenia that exercises independent policy, but one that is dependent on Russia. However, does that mean we turn to the West? What will that give us? So there's all these calculations involved. It's not all black and white, but there's clearly areas where we can't put our security at risk, and vehemently anti-Russian projects, such as those advocated by Richard Giragosian and Lragir, are clearly against the state interests of Armenia.

Best reply I heard in few years I been here that addresses all these anti Russian and pro western chatter. It is pointless nontheless dangerous for our existence

[argin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Anyone know the dollar figure?
Azerbaijan announces defense spending for 2016
[ 14 September 2015 17:51 ]
Baku. Shahriyar Alizadeh - APA. Azerbaijan is likely to allocated AZN 1,837.8 million for the defense sector in 2016, it was said at the presentation of the drafts of state and consolidated budgets for 2016.

The 2015 military expenditures amounted to AZN 1,778.5 million.

[armnuke]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The political west today would love nothing more than to wrestle Armenia away from Russia's influence, no matter what the price. They wouldn't care if they turned it into another Georgia, where significant portions of the country are lost, or another Ukraine...civil war. But unlike the aforementioned countries, Armenia as zero room for error. The loss of Artsakh or Zangezur would put Armenia at the direct risk of elimination off the map. Any civil war scenario, as in Ukraine, could give our enemies the green light to go in for the kill. Our geographic location doesn't allow room for a lot of flexibility or experimentation. So, no matter how bad Russia might be, its our best option, because the only other option is a scenario similar to Ukraine and Georgia, and in our case, we may not survive it. Giving credit where credit is due, the Turks have never violated Armenian airspace due to the Russian factor, whereas they have violated Greek airspace on numerous occasions. When the Turks occupied half of Cyprus, the west didn't pull the type of shiiittt it did when Crimea was liberated. For our country, security is the number one priority, something the West can't assist us with.

With all that said, I can't stand it when Armenians bash eachother's heads over the west and Russia...we've got Turks to worry about. This type of infighting only serves Turkish interests. Whatever each side does, it does strictly out of self-interest. As a people, we have to be conscious of that. For example, it is a matter of fact that Russia is not interested in an Armenia that exercises independent policy, but one that is dependent on Russia. However, does that mean we turn to the West? What will that give us? So there's all these calculations involved. It's not all black and white, but there's clearly areas where we can't put our security at risk, and vehemently anti-Russian projects, such as those advocated by Richard Giragosian and Lragir, are clearly against the state interests of Armenia.

Very well described, that was my initial point. No one asked to be enemies with Russia, that would be insane for us. That being said, the gap between the West and Russia is widening over the Ukraine crisis, sanctions, etc..The Ruble has depreciated 50% over the past year, Russia has introduced sanctions on EU foodstuffs and over the past week has asked us to do the same. Are we a country that could impose sanctions on the EU?! I don't think so. The balance between Russia and the EU is completely absent, and that's exactly why the Eurasian Union was created, and that's exactly why it will fail IMO. The experience of many countries (Cuba, Iran, Syria, Venezuela, NK) tells us that after wasting so many years, no country could isolate itself from the West, or try to create an empire of its own. Let's admit it. Given all that, yes, we are in dire need of Russian weapons with one dictator to our east and another to our west.

[ArmeniaSacra]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Anyone know the dollar figure?
Azerbaijan announces defense spending for 2016
[ 14 September 2015 17:51 ]
Baku. Shahriyar Alizadeh - APA. Azerbaijan is likely to allocated AZN 1,837.8 million for the defense sector in 2016, it was said at the presentation of the drafts of state and consolidated budgets for 2016.

The 2015 military expenditures amounted to AZN 1,778.5 million.

Around 1.8 billion $s

[argin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Around 1.8 billion $s

That's good they haven't spent the whole 4 bln

[Aslanov]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

That is excluding the "expenditure on special projects and activities of defense", which is the arms procurement spending.

For 2014 it was $1.5 billion and for 2015 $1.6 billion (by then value of manat).

http://www.maliyye.gov.az/sites/default/files/Budget_law_2015.pdf

http://www.maliyye.gov.az/sites/default/files/Budget_law_13.02.14.pdf

As for 2016, total expenditure figures are not released yet.

[Armynia]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

That is excluding the "expenditure on special projects and activities of defense", which is the arms procurement spending.

For 2014 it was $1.5 billion and for 2015 $1.6 billion (by then value of manat).

http://www.maliyye.gov.az/sites/default/files/Budget_law_2015.pdf

http://www.maliyye.gov.az/sites/default/files/Budget_law_13.02.14.pdf

As for 2016, total expenditure figures are not released yet.

This is baboon username right here!