Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Haykakan]

The irony is that if the people were given a choice, Ukrainian or Armenian, or even Russia for that matter, without any intimidation from Putin or Sargisyan, they would almost always choose to work with the West instead of against the West.

The beaches of Sochi are so lovely, and Lada Nivas are such cool looking cars, but ask any of these diehard patriots, they'd trade it all for Miami and Mercedes.

Nobody in this forum has suggested that we should not work with the west. When your arguments fall apart you make false statements in desperation. Just look at the comparisons you are making with Sochi and Miami or Lada and Mercedes...so pathetic that you feel you have to resort to such measures since you cannot back up your arguments with facts. Excluding options, be they west or east.., is a mistake and to its credit the Armenian government has done a remarkably good job at not excluding anyone. This is the strong point of this government as it has fostered good relations with everyone except the turks. Be it India or China, Russia or USA,.. all are welcome to invest and form partnerships. In this regard the accomplishments of the government are pretty remarkable. The government has many failings but its successes should not be ignored either. Armenia has moved on from the either or mentality you are still struggling with.

[HyeSocialist]

Nobody in this forum has suggested that we should not work with the west. When your arguments fall apart you make false statements in desperation. Just look at the comparisons you are making with Sochi and Miami or Lada and Mercedes...so pathetic that you feel you have to resort to such measures since you cannot back up your arguments with facts. Excluding options, be they west or east.., is a mistake and to its credit the Armenian government has done a remarkably good job at not excluding anyone. This is the strong point of this government as it has fostered good relations with everyone except the turks. Be it India or China, Russia or USA,.. all are welcome to invest and form partnerships. In this regard the accomplishments of the government are pretty remarkable. The government has many failings but its successes should not be ignored either. Armenia has moved on from the either or mentality you are still struggling with.

The argument that he was making and that I should have answered until letting you creep up with this statement is that, even though Russia was invading Ukraine because NATO was creeping up on Russian borders, it must be remembered that the only one that put a gun to Ukraine's head and told them to choose either or was RUSSIA. The Ukrainians wanted, willingly, to move towards the West.

My argument has always been that it is Russia that is choosing an either or situation for Armenia, not Armenia willingly. Armenian leadership simply does everything Russia says because 1) Their regime is backed by Russia, and not the sovereign people of Armenia 2) Russia gots Armenia by the balls in energy infrastructure.

[Azad]

“put a gun to Ukraine’s head and told them to choose"

Russia did not place any gun to their head. It did tell them to choose between subsidized energy, tax free commerce, joint military/civilian manufacturing vs NATO and EU dumping their products with perpetual debt.
They chose the “West” so did the Russians in the East chose Russia. The Russian offered them energy at regular pricing while EU and NATO did not replace that energy need.
Most EU countries are fed up with all their trade loses constantly forced (put a gun to their head) to complying with sanctions on half of the planet that benefit the British/US interest.

“Russia gots Armenia by the balls in energy infrastructure.”

That’s what all powers/countries do. There is no free lunch. You don’t think the Iranians of the turks will do the same? Will they provide Armenia free energy and free pipelines?

[Haykakan]

The argument that he was making and that I should have answered until letting you creep up with this statement is that, even though Russia was invading Ukraine because NATO was creeping up on Russian borders, it must be remembered that the only one that put a gun to Ukraine's head and told them to choose either or was RUSSIA. The Ukrainians wanted, willingly, to move towards the West.

My argument has always been that it is Russia that is choosing an either or situation for Armenia, not Armenia willingly. Armenian leadership simply does everything Russia says because 1) Their regime is backed by Russia, and not the sovereign people of Armenia 2) Russia gots Armenia by the balls in energy infrastructure.

I agree that Armenia is limited in her sovereignty but you make a false assumption that getting rid of Russian influence is the cure. That will simply create a vacuum which can be easily filled by Turkey, USA, Iran,.. My point is that most people who think getting rid of Russia is the answer, do not have a good understanding of what the alternatives are. I doubt Russia wants Armenia to participate in NATO drills, I doubt it wants her to send troops to Kosovo or Afghanistan but Armenia does these things. You, Vrej and others blantantly disregard facts you deem inconvenient to your arguments. Disregarding facts is the same as buying a one way ticket to hell.

As for Ukraine, the Russian history and presence there should not be ignored in your quest of making an argument. Many Ukrainians did not want to move away from Russia, some of them were executed by your western minded kin. The story of Socrates has much you can learn from regarding these matters.

[burjuin]

Russia MOD: Armenia ready to join international coalition for demining Syria
14:18, 28.08.2017


Armenia and Serbia are ready to become members in the international coalition for demining Syria.

Aleksandr Novikov, head of the International Military Cooperation Department at the Russian Ministry of Defense (MOD), stated about the above-said, reported RIA Novosti news agency of Russia.

In his words, the Russian MOD is carrying out activities to set up a coalition for demining Syria.

“Respective petitions have been sent to representations of the defense agencies of Iran, Egypt, Serbia, Armenia, Turkey, and the United Arab Emirates,” Novikov added. “Armenia and Serbia are ready to send their [respective] divisions. A possibility is being developed to engage Chinese snipers.”

https://news.am/eng/news/406766.html

[Azad]

My argument has always been that it is Russia that is choosing an either or situation for Armenia, not Armenia willingly.

"Armenia, EU to sign new deal this fall - President

“We were negotiating with both the Eurasian Economic Union and the European Union, because both had said at the beginning the two would not contradict each other. However, we could do nothing after the EU declares it’s incompatible,” Serzh Sargsyan stated."

https://www.armradio.am/en/2017/08/28/armenia-eu-to-sign-new-deal-this-fall-president/

^^^ Now that's a true gun on one's head.

[DieHard69]

"Armenia, EU to sign new deal this fall - President

“We were negotiating with both the Eurasian Economic Union and the European Union, because both had said at the beginning the two would not contradict each other. However, we could do nothing after the EU declares it’s incompatible,” Serzh Sargsyan stated."

https://www.armradio.am/en/2017/08/28/armenia-eu-to-sign-new-deal-this-fall-president/

^^^ Now that's a true gun on one's head.

Good example there Azad, but here's my recommendation for Armenia, be neutral and don't side with anyone to deep but don't be alone, Russia is our only ally, but that doesn't justify our government sucking Putin's xxxx so often.

I also agree with the fact that no one is the good guy in this world, the sanctions put on Russia was a horrible idea on Nato's side but they had no other choice but to do it, either have more Russian influence or take more damage economically on all countries. Many people don't know or the western media downplays it but during 2014-2016 we were suffering a recession with declining oil metal prices and giving sanctions to Russia was like ramming a tanker truck at a blazing fire, you can say entire regional economies halted/declined at a horrifying level, 2017 is the recovery year with strong economic activity with all countries.

[Hakob]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8HrxXHKBw34&ebc=ANyPxKrh7J9gGskjRJrJ0aVgh9ZlU1MU6qIKiWWxQS1Xr6OXfIyKZVWGNC1SJfO4Ry4UNnpGISXob7q62t7PO6agc4tEejsi1A

[burjuin]

Armenian Air Force. Su-25UB

[burjuin]

2nd Karabakh war. Separate repair and recovery base of Nagorno-Karabakh Defense Army