Who owns what in Armenia

[Artashes]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

I like how the guy at the end points out that this is a systemic issue. The truth is most countries suffer from similar systemic issues. Be it the appointment of governors in Armenia by the ruling party or the appointment of politicians in America by special interest groups...the results are very much the same. Corruption is inherent in governments with varying degrees of scale and scope but its effect is invariably the same. Corruption is the loss of sovereignty of a nation and will invariably lead to its demise. Since this is a systemic problem, only a systemic solution can fix it.

-–-- only a systemic solution can fix it ----
Are bullets considered a systemic solution ?

[Eddo211]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

yes....but they gotta be hollow points. No injury to innocents.


What is that saying?.....a running man with a knife at night can cut a thousand throats.
Example Hitler and the night of long knifes. Bad example but true.

[Mher]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

I like how the guy at the end points out that this is a systemic issue. The truth is most countries suffer from similar systemic issues. Be it the appointment of governors in Armenia by the ruling party or the appointment of politicians in America by special interest groups...the results are very much the same. Corruption is inherent in governments with varying degrees of scale and scope but its effect is invariably the same. Corruption is the loss of sovereignty of a nation and will invariably lead to its demise. Since this is a systemic problem, only a systemic solution can fix it.

I disagree, such relativism is not a realistic approach. If we are going to be realistic about the world we live in: the systematic problems are much more serious in Azerbaijan than Armenia, there are much more serious in Armenia than Georgia, they are much more serious in Georgia that Hungary, etc


The fact is in Armenia, there is no faith in the constitution. You can't be sure that what is promised to you in the constitution will in fact be enforced in a court of law. This is not the case in most developed countries. In most developed modern countries, if you are wronged by another party and go to court, you can expect the court to reasonably be impartial. Or if a particular judge is impartial, you expect him not to get fired the day after for having been impartial.

I should add this is specially key in foreign investment. The higher the level of trust and reputability of the rule of law in a country, the higher the likelihood of investment. For example, I can be almost certain that in Sweden or Germany, if I invest a few million dollars, I can be sure that I will not face any "Liska"s or "Lfik"s asking for money to stay in business. I know the rules are what the laws say they are, and I have the rights that it says I do. That those laws will not suddenly change, my property can't be taken without due process be ceased, that if I go to court I can expect a reasonably impartial court, etc.

Yes there are systematic problems in any country, however that doesn't mean they aren't much worse in some countries whereas they are almost negligible in others. Just saying there are problems in any country is literally what Aliyev does.

If a traitor criminal thug and his family act like they own a quarter of a country and kill people at will in that region, in most countries that criminal thug would be in prison. This however is not the case with Liska in Syunik. So let's take our head out of the sand, and work towards improving the situation instead of pretending our problems are comparable to much better countries. While pessimism and nonconstructive criticism doesn't help, neither does avoiding dealing with problems. Armenia's come a long way, but there's even longer to go.

[Eddo211]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Well said Mher

btw, I think we couldn't have asked for better leader of Azerbaijan than sultan coward ratass Aliyev.

[Shant03]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Armenia's come a long way, but there's even longer to go.

Lets do it!

[londontsi]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Lets do it!

Agreed,

With or without the mess?

.

[Artashes]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Agreed,

With or without the mess?

.

Without the mess .
Well planned and executed , surgically very clean , and final .

[Haykakan]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

I disagree, such relativism is not a realistic approach. If we are going to be realistic about the world we live in: the systematic problems are much more serious in Azerbaijan than Armenia, there are much more serious in Armenia than Georgia, they are much more serious in Georgia that Hungary, etc


The fact is in Armenia, there is no faith in the constitution. You can't be sure that what is promised to you in the constitution will in fact be enforced in a court of law. This is not the case in most developed countries. In most developed modern countries, if you are wronged by another party and go to court, you can expect the court to reasonably be impartial. Or if a particular judge is impartial, you expect him not to get fired the day after for having been impartial.

I should add this is specially key in foreign investment. The higher the level of trust and reputability of the rule of law in a country, the higher the likelihood of investment. For example, I can be almost certain that in Sweden or Germany, if I invest a few million dollars, I can be sure that I will not face any "Liska"s or "Lfik"s asking for money to stay in business. I know the rules are what the laws say they are, and I have the rights that it says I do. That those laws will not suddenly change, my property can't be taken without due process be ceased, that if I go to court I can expect a reasonably impartial court, etc.

Yes there are systematic problems in any country, however that doesn't mean they aren't much worse in some countries whereas they are almost negligible in others. Just saying there are problems in any country is literally what Aliyev does.

If a traitor criminal thug and his family act like they own a quarter of a country and kill people at will in that region, in most countries that criminal thug would be in prison. This however is not the case with Liska in Syunik. So let's take our head out of the sand, and work towards improving the situation instead of pretending our problems are comparable to much better countries. While pessimism and nonconstructive criticism doesn't help, neither does avoiding dealing with problems. Armenia's come a long way, but there's even longer to go.

Sure there are indeed differences with the main difference being scale and scope. While Liska and his family are terrorizing his marz, the Bush's were terrorizing Iraq. The main problem is corruption in both cases. Here in USA the constitution is regularly spat upon with the war in Iraq being a good example. The externalities from that war are ravaging the entire region today. I think the difference in scale and scope makes it difficult for you to realize how similar and related these issues are. The legal system is just as bad here in USA but again the scale and scope is so different that you again fail to realize the similarities. Sure rule of law is imperative to economic development but here again you will see that the western economies are heading into oblivion and the corruption of legislature, legal system, and executive braches have a lot to do with it. There may be some good examples somewhere where corruption is limited and things are looking good but that will be the exception to the rule and rather irrelevant. It is irrelevant because time and time again we have seen the much more powerful corrupt government take control or force lesser powerful yet less corrupt governments and make them do exactly what they want. We saw great example of this as USA forced the European countries to impose sanctions on Russia which were devastating to those countries. These countries did not want to impose sanctions since that was not in their interest but they have lost sovereignty and had to do what the master told them to do. To understand the issues at hand one must see and understand the concepts that are at work. These concept are not always so obvious and are often disguised.

[Shant03]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Without the mess .
Well planned and executed , surgically very clean , and final .

Diaspora should operate more like a mafia. For example: anytime there is a family or specific political figure compromising our goals for Armenia to be prosperous. Diaspora should have personnel to go in and remove this person from authority. I feel like hereyas have this down.

[Haykakan]

Re: Who owns what in Armenia

Diaspora should operate more like a mafia. For example: anytime there is a family or specific political figure compromising our goals for Armenia to be prosperous. Diaspora should have personnel to go in and remove this person from authority. I feel like hereyas have this down.

That whole mafia mentality is a big problem for all Armenians. A mafia style of government is all we have known since we have not governed ourselves in a long time. The problem is that this type of mentality will not build a country you will want to live in. If we Armenians are to succeed in forming a viable state/nation we will have to get rid of some of our old habits.