Military Notebook: Military Discussions

[Haykakan]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

No warnings from Turkish jets before attack – Russian Su-24 rescued pilot first interview

Everything about this incident screams of provocation to engage Russia vs NATO. This is a lot like the situation in Ukraine only they cant blame the downing of the Russian jet on the Russian forces this time. Turkey is not acting alone here. I do not think it would do this if it did not have the backing of USA in pursuing such a coarse of action.

[Armynia]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Russia is already exacting its revenge on Turkey for downing a Russian warplane



Just over 24 hours after Turkey shot down a Russian warplane on after claiming the jet had violated Turkish airspace, Moscow is already exacting its revenge — albeit subtly.

"We're not going to wage a war against Turkey. ... But we will seriously reconsider our agreements with the Turkish government," Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said in a press call on Wednesday, according to The Associated Press.

"Our attitude to the Turkish people hasn't changed," Lavrov continued. "We only have questions about the Turkish leadership."

Turkey defended its decision to down the plane on Tuesday, contending that the plane was in Turkish airspace and had been warned repeatedly before it was shot down by Turkish F-16 jets. But Russian President Vladimir Putin said the plane was destroyed by a Turkish missile while flying in Syrian airspace, roughly a mile from the Turkish border.

By Wednesday morning, Russia had begun bombarding rebels — including Turkmen insurgents, who have ethnic ties to Turkey — in Syria's Latakia province, ignoring demands made by Turkey over the past week to end its military operations close to the Turkish border.

Russia also announced Wednesday that it would deploy state-of-the-art S-400 missile systems to the Russian Hemeimeem air base near Latakia, Syria — 30 miles south of the Turkish border, the AP reported. The missiles, which are able to hit a plane with extreme accuracy, are evidently meant to deter Turkish jets from shooting down Russian planes in the future.



Additionally, Russia issued an official travel warning advising its citizens against visiting Turkey. And Russian travel agencies announced on Wednesday that they will withdraw their business in Turkey until next year, according to a translation by Boris Zilberman, a Russia expert at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies, a Washington, DC-based think tank.

Russian tourists account for a huge portion of Turkey's tourism industry — 3.3 million Russian tourists visited Turkey in 2014, the second-largest number of tourist arrivals after Germany and around 12% of total visitors, according to Reuters.

And in a largely symbolic gesture on Wednesday, the Russian parliament proposed a five-year jail term for anyone who denies that the mass killings of Armenians that began under Ottoman rule in 1915 constituted a "genocide," according to an article translated by Foreign Policy columnist and Russia commentator Julia Ioffe.

Use of the word remains a charged issue in Turkey, which staunchly objects to such a characterization. Eastern Armenia remained part of the Russian Empire until its collapse in 1917.

And there is one other way that Russia could retaliate against Turkey more directly: Namely, by drawing attention to the NATO ally's suspected ties to the Islamic State in Syria.

'Accomplices of terrorists'
As The Soufan Group noted on Wednesday in its daily briefing, Russia "is likely to use intelligence and disinformation to highlight Turkey’s dealings with the Islamic State."

Western officials have long harbored suspicions about Turkey's links to the Islamic State, also known as ISIS, ISIL, or Daesh. One official told The Guardian's Martin Chulov in July that a US-led raid on the compound housing ISIS' "chief financial officer" produced "undeniable" evidence that Turkish officials directly dealt with ranking ISIS members — namely, by purchasing oil from them.

Separately, experts, Kurds, and even US Vice President Joe Biden have suggested in the past that Turkey has helped enable ISIS by turning a blind eye to the vast smuggling networks of weapons and fighters during the ongoing Syrian war.

For his part, Biden charged that countries like Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates were so focused on ousting Syrian President Bashar al-Assad that they did not properly vet the opposition groups to which they sent money and weapons. (He later apologized.)

Turkey joined the US-led anti-ISIS coalition in late July, after a suicide bomber with links to the terrorist group killed 32 activists in the southeastern border town of Suruc. Still, lingering suspicions remained about Turkey's commitment to fighting ISIS, as it embarked on a dual campaign to wipe out a Kurdish insurgency in its southeast.

Those suspicions were all but put to rest last month when an ISIS-linked suicide bomber killed more than 150 people at a peace rally in Ankara — the deadliest terror attack in Turkey's recent history.



But one day after Turkey downed its warplane, Russia has already begun to bring Turkey's murky history with the group back into focus in order to discredit Ankara's role in the anti-ISIS coalition — and legitimize its own.

"Turkey has demonstrated that it is protecting ISIS," Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev said Wednesday on Twitter, adding that the damage from "Turkey's criminal actions ... will be hard to repair."

Medvedev was seemingly echoing a statement made by Russian President Vladimir Putin on Tuesday, when he referred to Turkey as "accomplices of terrorists."

"We established a long time ago that large quantities of oil and oil products from territory captured by the Islamic State have been arriving on Turkish territory," Putin said from the Russian Black Sea resort of Sochi before a meeting with Jordan's King Abdullah.

Lavrov added on Wednesday morning that "terrorists" have been using Turkish territory to plot attacks on other countries, the AP reported. He claimed that the Russian warplane Turkey shot down had been targeting the extremists' oil infrastructure in Syria.

In any case, this war of words may be as far as Russia is willing to go — for now.

"Putin's initial reaction — calling the incident 'a stab in the back by the terrorists' accomplices' — is about as bellicose as could be imagined. But Putin is no stranger to harsh rhetoric, and he has broader interests to play for," geopolitical expert Ian Bremmer, president of Eurasia Group, told Business Insider on Tuesday.

Bremmer noted, however, that the "huge egos" of Turkish President Erdogan and Putin certainly won't help future efforts to mend Turkish-Russian relations.

http://www.businessinsider.com/russi...ed-jet-2015-11

[Eddo211]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Go Putin.....that was a Turkish low blow, thats all they can do. You can liquidated them.

[Eddo211]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Russian Jet engines are guzzlers but have high performance. Without aerial refueling they never make it.

[Artashes]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Russian Jet engines are guzzlers but have high performance. Without aerial refueling they never make it.

Although their (Russian) latest engines are significantly more efficient with less vibrational waste, your right about less efficiency than west engines.
How the white swan (T160) according to the stats carries 130 tons of fuel internally and can cruise at just under 600 mph for 15 hours. Even with afterburners blazing (all 4 of them) these aircraft can get quite a distance and return with no refueling required. They (swan) rarely use refueling except if the gotta go from one extreme end of Russia to the other and return.
A thousand mile trip & back ain't nothin for these birds and return on internal fuel alone.

[Haykakan]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

pretty cool ways to use a shotgun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RP4FjODPDFA

[Artashes]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

I hadn't read that the backstabbing, terrorist supporting, genocide commiting liers had also stopped their illegal flights into syra. If so for sure they need to fear (FEAR) the S 400. However, if their aircraft have identicle equipment as their USA counterpart, they were ordered by USA to stop until further notice.
The hominoids my play some petty games in this regard but will have to be less effective if they do. USA ain't gonna play no games.

[Eddo211]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

pretty cool ways to use a shotgun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RP4FjODPDFA

Incendiary 12 gague shells,,,,cool stuff.

[Eddo211]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Turkish F-16s don't stand a chance against SU-34

[Haykakan]

Re: Military Notebook: Military Discussions

Russian Jet Fighters in Asia: Why Politics Still Matters


Moscow faces competition in attempting to sell its most modern jet in Asia. Its best selling point is still politics.



20150704_200326

By Benjamin David Baker

December 09, 2015




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Russia is known for exporting combat aircraft throughout the world. From the beginning of the Cold War onward, Soviet and Russian MiGs, Sukhois and Yaks have formed the backbone of many air forces throughout the world. This was partly due to old Cold War politics, where states were basically obliged to acquire military equipment from whichever bloc they were aligned with.

Russia has inherited much of its old military R&D and production capabilities with regards to military aircraft. Soviet and Russian planes are still in high demand throughout the world. This is primarily due to three thing; costs, quality and the lack of arms sanctions often imposed by western states on unsavory states.

This is also true in Asia. As The Diplomat has covered recently, several Asian states are looking to update or replace their fighter fleets. Sweden’s Saab Gripen, France’s Dassualt Rafale, the Eurofighter Typhoon and Boeing’s F/A-18 Super Hornet are all models that are being offered.

One of Russia’s main contenders in this game is the Sukhoi Su-35 (Flanker-E, also known as the “Super Flanker”). Based on the venerable and widely exported Su-27, the Su-35 has been touted as a “fourth generation plus” for the many advanced technologies installed in the aircraft. According to Militaryfactory.com, the Su-35 integrates an in-flight refueling probe, provision for electronic countermeasures and a forward and rear- facing Phazotron AESA radar capable of simultaneously tracking 24 different targets at a hundred kilometers’ distance over uneven terrain. Avionics include an Irbis-E passive phased array radar system.

The Su-35 is powered by twin powerful Saturn AL- 41 (117) turbofans. These engines have thrust vectoring, allowing the aircraft to climb at a greater rate than its predecessor, the Su-27, and serves as a testbed for Russia’s fifth generation fighter, the SU PAK-FA. The aircraft can reportedly reach speeds of Mach 2.25, roughly 2,400 kilometers per hour on internal fuel tanks.

Moscow is planning to operate an air regiment totaling 48 Su-35s. It is primarily intended as a stepping-stone between its current fourth generation fighters and the PAK-FA. However, Russia has also been marketing the Su-35 for export to a number of Asian states; China and Indonesia have both agreed to purchase the aircraft, and several others, including Pakistan and North Korea, are rumored to have an interest in the model.

The most significant confirmed buyer of the Su-35 is Beijing. As Franz-Stefan Gady reported for The Diplomat, China is set to purchase a total of 24 aircraft, at a price of between $83 and 85 million per model. It is suspected that the People’s Liberation Army Air Force’s (PLAAF) main motivation behind this purchase is more likely to be access to the Su-35’s technology for its own indigenous fighter.

Especially relevant is the Su-35’s engines. As I wrote last week, the PLAAF needs to acquire more powerful engines for its fifth generation aircraft, the J-20 and J-31. While China is currently developing its own fifth generation turbofan, the WS-15, the Su-35’s AL-41s will be a good interim solution. Considering that Beijing is subject to western sanctions following the Tiananmen Square massacre in 1989, and the fact that China already has an advanced indigenous military research and development capacity, makes Russia the only realistic, legal source of military technology.

Indonesia has also announced that it will purchase 16 Super Flankers to replace its aging U.S. F-5 “Tigers”. There were many competitors aiming to win Jakarta’s aircraft bid, notably the other aircraft listed at the beginning of this article. The reason Sukhoi won the bid is probably due to a combination of factors. Under Indonesian law new defense acquisitions must include a minimum 30 percent direct offset, while the selection criteria have been weighted 30 percent for aircraft/system performance, 30 percent acquisition/life-cycle costs, and 40 percent for industrial cooperation.

Furthermore, Jakarta has a mixed historical record of relying on western kit. In 1986s, Indonesia purchased a batch of F-16s, intended to supplement its fleet of F-5E Tigers. However, after the U.S. and EU imposed sanctions following Jakarta’s involvement in the 1999 East Timor independence, these quickly dilapidated due to a lack of spare parts. As a result, the Indonesian Air Force acquired Russian jets, notably Su-27s and Su-30s. One motive for the acquiring the Su-35 might be to prevent that kind of unpleasant situation in the future.

Pyongyang has apparently expressed interest in the Su-35. According to the JoongAng Ilbo, a North Korean military delegation approached Russian officials in November 2014 about the possibility of acquiring the aircraft for its dilapidated air force. However, due to the international arms embargo on Pyongyang, Moscow has apparently declined the request.

Pakistan is another potential candidate for the Super Flanker. According to Dave Majumbar over at the National Interest, Russia is apparently negotiating to sell Pakistan the Su-35 along with Mi-35 Hind-E attack helicopters. Perhaps more amazingly, the Russians don’t seem to understand that their Indian partner is likely to react extremely negatively at the prospect of such a deal. Acquisition of the Su-35 would probably give Pakistan a marginal edge in terms of capability over India’s two-seat Su-30MKI if it is bought in numbers, but will probably increase New Delhi’s turn to advanced western and indigenously produced combat aircraft.

All in all, the Super Flanker is in demand in some Asian states. However, most of the states looking to buy the Su-35 are doing so due to political reasons; either because they are unable to buy western kit, or because they are worried about future sanctions. As with all the fighters I’ve covered over the last couple of weeks, this does not mean that the Su-35 is an inferior platform at all (Peter Wood actually calls it the best non-stealth aircraft in the world.)

It means that the competition is tough, and that politics do still play a part of states’ arms acquisitions. Russia’s arms exports to the region have been decreasing steadily as its big traditional customers have developed their own defense industries or diversified their suppliers.