Hayastan yev Russya.

[TurQ]

It was not secret in Ottoman times.
Sabatay Zevi(Sevi) of Selanik,, declared himself as the long awaited Messiah for the Jews. The Jews were not comfortable with his seperatist and extremist views. The Jewish community complaint about this and other problems they cause. They also told to Sultan that Sabatay Sevi was saying " I am the Messiah even the Sultan will be my slave". He was sentenced to death, but Zsevi declared that he became Muslim and denounced what he said, so he narrowly escaped from being executed. He asked his followers to become Muslim as well, but in heart they were not. They developed their own way of prayers etc. Jews never accepted them, Ottomans knew who they were. There was nothing unjust about Sabatay Sevi, nobody was converted by force that was Zsevi's decision to become Muslim and inorder to continue control over his followers he asked them to become Muslims by name, so that he could maintain his leadership in his cult.

Going underground is their choice, during the last years of Ottomans they burnt all the official documents about Zsevi's followers. Going uunderground was their choice. They could go on living like ordinary Jews. You can ask Turkish Jews to learn more about this issue.

I'm saying how funny twist of fate can be
A nation that converted their minorities for hundreds of years unjustly got secretly converted themselves!

[Gavur]

Russian Expert Says Israel Likely to Bomb Iran in Spring

Russian Expert Says Israel Likely to Bomb Iran in Spring
Created: 15.01.2006 12:58 MSK (GMT +3), Updated: 12:44 MSK


MosNews


Israel could launch a missile attack on Iran in the upcoming spring, Director of the Russian Political Research Institute Sergei Markov was quoted by Interfax as saying Saturday.

“Israel is in the state of a bitter cold war with Iran and might become the first victim of a nuclear weapon attack: therefore, I deem it very likely that the Israeli Air Force could launch missile strikes on military, nuclear targets in Iran as early as this spring,” Markov told Interfax.

This move, however, would create serious problems for Israel, Markov said. “This would lead to a significant destabilization of the situation in the Middle East, including a dramatic increase in [terrorist] attacks by Islamists on Israel,” he said.

At the same time, the international community will be increasing pressure on Iran, Markov said. In particular, Iran might be subjected to economic sanctions, “which would at first be mild but would then grow tougher and tougher, up to an embargo on purchasing Iranian oil,” he said.

[Joseph]

No you shouldnt be banned but should be delivered to a mental hospital. FOr your own good.
But the following was a good one.
Armenians kicked Turkish butt in Artsakh? So you are still not aware that you wouldnt get an inch of KArabah withour Soviet/Russian help? ANd you caused whole Soviet breakhdown? )
That was a good one, give a lecture at Yerevan state University on this ))

The Russian assisted both sides with mercenanaries and material.
The Soviet Unions demise was most certainly accelerated by events in Nagorno-Karabakh which the politburo lost control of as well as event in Georgia and the Baltics. When Arkady Volskii lost control of event in NK and the Soviets pulled out prematurely, even the notorious Soviet press could not cover it up and it fanned the flames of seccesion all over the Soviet Union

[Turanist]

The Russian assisted both sides with mercenanaries and material.
The Soviet Unions demise was most certainly accelerated by events in Nagorno-Karabakh which the politburo lost control of as well as event in Georgia and the Baltics. When Arkady Volskii lost control of event in NK and the Soviets pulled out prematurely, even the notorious Soviet press could not cover it up and it fanned the flames of seccesion all over the Soviet Union

Russia is God at Divide and Rule.

[Joseph]

I agree with you on that point but I'd still rather have them as magnanimous friend at the very least. For Armenia to pull away from Russia would be a disaster.

[TurQ]

In one of his article Gerard LIbardian says, for security reasons Armenia is more inclined to Russia, for Economic reasons more inclined to Turkey. It seems security concerns are overriding economic concerns.

For me security concerns are mostly artificially created by the hardliners. KArabag being first, now Javakheti. Russians know about these concerns and easily manipulate Armenians, and they know Armenians are easy to provoke. Russian spies distribute a leaflet in Javakheti saying "You will be slaughtered as your ancestered in 1915", and Armenians are quick to point their fingers to Turkey. Zsarist Russia manupulated them easily, Soviets did the same, now new Russia. Russia successfully created the war in KArabag and made Armenia even more inclined to themselves.

I think Armenians have to get used to sleeping with Bear in same bed..

I agree with you on that point but I'd still rather have them as magnanimous friend at the very least. For Armenia to pull away from Russia would be a disaster.

[Joseph]

In the long run it would be beneficial for Armenia to have economic relations with Turkey, I agree. But Armenia's security concerns are very real and whether your agree or not, Turkey is seen as a threat and Armenia has no real reason to trust Turkey's intentions. With Russia you at least know what you're going to get and although you can argue that Russia is a master manipulator, our collective experiences with them have been much more positive as compared to Turkey.

Let's face it, it's a rough neighborhood where everyone is playing a zero- sum game and it seems Armenia is very well aware of this. It pays to be cautious. Nothing ever comes for free in that region.

One day, I'd like to see the border open and normal relations, I think most Armenians in Armenia would.



In one of his articles Gerard Libardian says, for security reasons Armenia is more inclined to Russia, for Economic reasons more inclined to Turkey. It seems security concerns are overriding economic concerns.



I think Armenians have to get used to sleeping with Bear in same bed..

[Kharpert]

The lion and lamb may one day sleep together, but the lamb will have a very fitful sleep.

[imported_Hellektor]

Dazed and Confused

Turanist
He is Armenian. I'll try to find Turkish resources if available in English.
But for now I suffice to state that He is from Kayseri + He is Orthodox Christian = He is Armenian.

For the Greeks they probably want to share his name.
What I dont understand is that, Hellektor and his sort blames Ottoman Armenians being loyal to Turks H., like he accuses H. them as being slaves to Turks. But at the same time he is proud of Mimar Sinan, and Mimar Sinan is a proud Ottoman and a proud Muslim. Normally Sinan should be traitor for people like Hellektor.

It shows there is a serious comprehension problem when you "read" my posts.
I have NEVER accused the Armenians and NEVER blamed the "Ottoman Armenians being loyal to Turks". It's your imagination or your reluctance to understand what I say that you misinterpret my posts.

It's the tyrannical Ottomans who misused and abused the Armenians the way they liked.
And NO people under occupation like the occupiers, especially when the occupiers are 11000 years behind civilization. The Armenians were millet i sedika because they didn't have a choice and could in no way defeat the cruel Ottomans militarily.

[Gavur]

Armenian President Accepts Russia's Ultimatum In Exchange For Maintenance Of Gas

ARMENIAN PRESIDENT ACCEPTS RUSSIA'S ULTIMATUM IN EXCHANGE FOR MAINTENANCE OF GAS TARIFF FOR ANOTHER YEAR: "KOMMERSANT"

YEREVAN, JANUARY 23. ARMINFO. Armenian President Robert Kocharyan has accepted Russia's proposal to participate in the construction of Iran-Armenia gas pipeline in exchange for maintenance of the price of the Russian gas for another year, the Russian newspaper "Kommersant" writes.

According to the source, at the end of 2005, Moscow unexpectedly for Yerevan demanded $110 per cubic meter of the gas supplied to Armenia instead of the former $54. Russia demanded its only strategic partner in the Transcaucasia to pay the same sum for gas as Georgia. Armenia was to pay the new price for gas or to pay in terms of the two key industrial facilities i.e. the fifth power unit of Hrazdan TPP and the whole gas and transportation system of the country. The ultimatum took the Armenian authorities unawares. Those in Yerevan hoped that the active pro-Russian position and the support to all the foreign political initiatives of the Kremlin will help Armenia avoiding the fate of other CIS member-states. However, Russia insisted on market relations in the gas sphere. The new tariff proved to be too high for the not rich Armenia. President Kocharyan had thought over the ultimatum for about a month and at last decided to accept the conditions forced by the Kremlin. A high-ranking official of the Armenian President's Administration told "Kommersant" that Robert Kocharyan arrived in Moscow with a project, wherein he proposes Russia to participate in the construction of Iran-Armenia gas pipeline (the construction is to be completed in the current year). Factually, Armenia gives Russia the only strategically important energy facility, the source of guaranteed incomes for future. Due to this pipeline, Russia will be able to control over transit of the Iranian gas to Georgia, Ukraine and Europe.

In its turn, Armenia began to think about transferring the relations with Moscow to "market base." Armenian observers think that the only trump of Robert Kocharyan in "the wrangle" with Moscow is the Russian military base in Gyumri. At present, Russia pays nothing for the base, wherein C-300 missiles and fighters MiG-29 are placed within the framework of CIS United Anti-aircraft System. Armenia pays even for communal expenses of the base. The Armenian president may demand payment for the leasing and correct the tariff every year depending of the amicability level, the newspaper writes.

In the meantime, early in the morning on Sunday the gas supply to Georgia and Armenia was suspended because of explosions of the gas mains North Caucasus- Transcaucasia and Mozdok-Tbilisi. Gas supply to Armenia was cut on the very day when President Kocharyan left for Moscow on negotiations. Moreover, the temperature in Armenia started to fell sharply. "ArmRosgazprom" tried to calm the population stating that the reserves of Abovyan gas holder will be enough till restoration of the pipeline Mozdok-Tbilisi. Nevertheless, the population was called for economizing. The explosions made Armenia understand how it is to remain without gas in such a cold winter. The sabotage may influence the Russian-Armenians talks at the presidents' level, for example, making Robert Kocharyan more complaint. The results of the talks will become known already today, the newspaper writes.