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  • MRF Against Policy of Intolerance

    MRF Against Policy of Intolerance

    3 April 2006 | 07:10

    During their sixth National Conference the Bulgarian ethnic Turks’ party Movement for Rights and Freedoms /MRF/ adopted a declaration, which states that the Movement would seek the agreement of all democratic parties for explicit opposition to newly-formed parties and tendencies, which aim at revising the national priorities and conduct a policy of political, ethnic, racial and religious intolerance within the context of Bulgaria’s joining to NATO and the EU.
    Meanwhile politicians from different parties commented for FOCUS the widely-known explanation of the MRG leader Ahmed Dogan for the circle of companies of the parties. A day earlier Dogan attacked the media, saying that his statement regarding the companies was not interpreted correctly.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Bulgarian



      Caption: 'A dispute arose as to which of the two - a Turk or a goat - smellt the worse. An enquiry was held - (1) The goat was brought in and the President fainted; (2) The Turk was brought in and the goat fainted. The enquiry was closed.
      Bulgarian, what were you actually trying to point out here? What do you have against goats?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by TurQ
        Bulgarian

        I'm wondering which European country had a minority in their governments prior to mid 20th century.. Ottomans had Armenians in Palace and in Ottoman government for centuries.

        You should be grateful for the Bulgarian government at least follows Ottoman example (eventhough it is like about 4 centuries later or so)


        Here is the list


        ----------------------------------
        You may find many Armenians who became Ottoman ministers, generals, ambassador, businessmen, banker, jeweler etc. The Palace Bankers were from the Armenian Duzyan Family (Divrikli) during the 18th century. The General (Pasha) Mehmet Pasha was Armenian (16th Century). Most of the Palace Doctors were from the Armenian Sasyan family. Many Ministers for the Ottoman Mint (darphane) were from the Armenian Bezciyan family in the 19th century. And again some of the Ministers for the Arsenals were from the Armenian Dadyan family. The Foreign Ministry of Ottoman State employed a lot of Armenians under the Abdulhamid II rule. There are many Armenian ambassadors and other diplomats in the Ottoman foreign missions in these years. The Ottoman Sultans had many Armenian advisers and experts in all centuries as well. The Ottoman Army also employed many Armenians as soldiers (in low and high ranked positions) even during the First World War. I list the Armenian high-ranked figures in the Ottoman past:

        Agop KAZAZYAN (Minister for Finance)
        Maresal Garabet Artin DAVUT Pasha (Minister for Communication)
        Mares¸al Garebet Artin DAVUT Pasha (Minister for Public Works)
        Andon T?ng?r YAVER Pasha (Minister for Communication)
        Oskan MARDI?KYAN(Minister for Communication)
        Berdos HALLACYAN (Minister for Public Works)
        Baristor Krikor SINAPYAN (Minister for Public Works)
        Krikor AGATON (Minister for Public Works)
        Gabriel NORADUNKYAN (Minister for Public Works)
        Gabriel NORADUNKYAN (Minister of Foreign Affairs)
        Agop KAZAZYAN Pasha (Head of the Ottoman Treasury)
        Mikael PORTAKALYAN Pasha (Head of the Ottoman Treasury)
        Sak?z OHANNES Pasha (Head of the Ottoman Treasury)

        Senators

        Mares¸al Ohannes KUYUMCUYAN Pasha
        Abraham ERAMYAN Pas¸a
        Manuk AZARYAN
        Gabriel NORADUNKYAN

        Directors in Thresury

        Artin Zeki
        Agop CI?NCI?YAN
        Aram HURDACI
        M?g?rd?ç HEKI?MYAN
        GARABET
        TOMAS
        H?mayak SEFERYAN
        Aram ADI?L
        Kevork TORKOMYAN
        Melkon MI?LOYAN
        Behram YAKUPYAN
        Sahak YEREMYAN
        Levon PAPAZYAN
        Kevork KORAN
        Dikran ÇÜBERYAN
        Kevork ÇÜVERYAN
        Hovsep TAKVORYAN
        Krikor TAKVORYAN

        Armenian MPs in Ottoman Parliement

        1876

        Ohannes ALLAHVERDI? Deputy to Parliement Speaker

        Sebuh MAKSUDYAN (Istanbul)

        Rupen YAZICIYAN (Edirne)
        Sahak YAVRUMYAN (Bursa)
        Hamazasb BALLARYAN (Erzurum)
        Manuk KARCIYAN (Halep)
        Mikael ALTINTOP (Ankara)
        Agop S¸AHI?NYAN (Sivas)
        Taniyel KARACI?YAN (Erzurum)

        1908

        Krikor ZOHRAP Istanbul Milletvekili
        Bedros HALLACYAN Istanbul Miletvekili
        Agop BABI?KYAN Tekirdag<breve> Milletvekili
        Agop BOYACIYAN Tekirdag Milletvekili
        Artin BOS¸GEZENYAN Halep Milletvekili
        Dr. Nazaret DAGAVARYAN Sivas Milletvekili
        I?stepan I?SPARTALIYAN I?zmir Milletvekili
        Hamparsum BOYACIYAN Kozan Milletvekili
        Kegam DERGARABEDYAN Mus Milletvekili
        Karakin PASTIRMACIYAN Erzurum Milletvekili
        Vahan PAPAZYAN Van Milletvekili

        1914

        Istepan CIRACIYAN (Bas¸kanl?k divan? katibi) Ergani Milletvekili
        Onnik I?HSAN I?zmir Milletvekili
        Bedros HALLAÇYAN Istanbul Milletvekili
        Krikor ZÖHRAP Istanbul Milletvekili
        Agop HIRLAKYAN Maras Milletvekili
        Kegam DERGARABEDYAN Mus Milletvekili
        Artin BOS¸GEZENYAN Halep Milletvekili
        Dikran BARSAMYAN Sivas Milletvekili
        Matyos NALBATYAN Kozan Milletvekili
        Karabet TOMAYAN Kayseri Milletvekili
        Sasun Bag<breve>dat Milletvekili
        Varteks SERENGÜLYAN Erzurum Milletvekili

        Armenian Permanenent Undersecratries in Ministry of Foreign Affairs

        Ohannes SAKIZ Pasha
        Artin DADYAN Pasha
        Harutyun DADYAN Pasha
        Manuk AZERYAN

        Other Hing Ranked Armenin Civil Servants in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs

        Agop GIRCIKYAN
        Krikor AGATON
        Kevork STI?MARAÇYAN
        Sahak ABRO
        Krikor MARGOSYAN
        Sabuh LAZMI?NAS
        Krikor ODYAN
        SERKI?S
        HURYAN
        PARNASYAN
        I?stepan ARZUMYAN
        Minas MI?NASYAN
        Bogos AS¸VAN
        Yakup YAKUPYAN
        Ohannes SÜRENYAN
        SIRABYAN
        Ovakin K. REI?SYAN
        Edvar MISIRLI
        Maksut SEFERYAN
        Hrant NORADUNKYAN
        MI?KAEL, GULLABYAN
        Osep SERPOS
        I?lyas ÇAYAN
        DAVUT
        Nis¸an SEFERYAN
        Humayak SEFERYAN
        Haçik PAPAZYAN
        Mihridat BABAYAN
        Levon SÜRENYAN
        Simon PAPAZYAN
        Rupen KARAKAS
        KRI?KOR
        Dikron DEMIRCIYAN
        Antreas HASUN
        CIRACIYAN
        Hrant ABRO
        CI?VANYAN
        BOGOS
        KERESTECIYAN
        FROM THE MANAS FAMILY: Rupen, Sebuh, Zenop, Pol, Piyer, Gaspar, Puzant, Aleksandr, Jozef MANAS

        Armenian Ambassadors and Councillers in Ottoman State's Foreign Missions

        Garabet Artin DAVUT Pash (Berlin and Vien)
        Dikran ALEKSANYAN (Brussels)
        Yetvart ZOHRAB (London)
        Hovsep MISAKYAN (The Haig, Netherlands)
        Maresal Ohannes KUYUMCUYAN Pasha (Rome)
        Dikran TINGIR (Berlin, Germany)
        Mihran KAVAFYAN

        Armenian Other Councillers in the Ottoman Diplomacy

        Hrant DÜZ
        Ohannes MAGAKYAN
        Mihran KAVAFYAN
        Hovsep AZARYAN
        Serkis BALYAN
        Dikran HÜNKARBEG<breve>ENDI?YAN
        Miyas YERAM
        M?g?rd?ç EREMYAN
        Ohannes NAFI?LYAN
        Hrant NORADUNKYAN
        ARSEN
        AVYAN
        Manuk AZARYAN
        Puzant MANAS
        Rupen MANAS

        Other Armenians in Ottoman Embassies

        Ohannes ABRAHAMYAM
        Harudyun MARKARYAN
        Levon YERAMYAN
        Dikran DADYAN
        Avedik SAHUMYAN
        Zenop MANAS
        Gaspar MANAS
        Pol MANAS
        Sebuh MANAS
        Pier MANAS
        Alexandre MANAS
        Diran ALIKSANYAN

        Important Armenian Figures in the Ottoman Ministry for Communication

        Ministers & High Ranked Civil Servants

        Maresal Garabet Artin DAVUT Pasha (Minister)
        Andon T?ng?r YAVER Pasha (Minister)
        Osgan MARDIKYAN (Minister)
        Krikor AGATON (General Director)
        Kevork Sabit FINCANCIYAN

        Some of the Armenian Civil Servants

        Jorj SERPOS
        Mis¸el MISIRLI
        ERAMYAN
        I?STEPAN
        HAMPARSUM
        ARSEN
        PARLADI?
        GARAABET
        FRAN
        Piyer HASSUN
        Avedis S¸ALÇIYAN
        Mikael ANKARALIYAN
        Paskal KAZANCIYAN
        Andon KÖSEYAN
        Dikran ARAKELYAN
        Ohannes ABRAHAMYAN
        Melkon YÜZBAS¸IYAN
        M?g?rd?ç ACEMYAN
        Karekin ÇERKEZYAN

        Ministry of Finance - Some of the Important Armenians

        Önemli Memurlar
        Agop Kazazyan PASHA (Minister)
        Sak?z OHANNES
        Çam?ç OHANNES
        Ohannes ALLAHVERDI
        Sak?z ARMENAK
        Yeremyan ÇELEBI?
        Osep BEHLEMYAN
        Artin DUZ
        Serkis DUZ
        Ohannes DUZ
        Mikael DUZ
        Bogos DUZ
        Agop DUZ
        Krikor DUZ
        Garabet DUZ
        Mihran DUZ
        I?stepan SASYAN
        I?stepan ARAPYAN

        Ministry of National Education - Some of the Armenians in This Ministry

        Mihran DÜZ (Müstes¸ar)
        Tomas TERZI?YAN
        Nis¸an GUGASYAN
        Tavit ÇIRACIYAN
        Sebuh TABI?BYAN
        SARYAN
        Artin OHANNESYAN
        Hovsep YUSUFYAN
        Agop BOYACIYAN
        Yervant
        OSKAN
        Mikael AS¸CIYAN
        Krikor OSKI?YAN
        Rahip Kleman SI?BI?LYAN
        Prof. Krikor KÖMÜRCI?YAN
        Artin SARAFYAN
        Hamazasb HAKI?

        Ministry of Justice and Danistay (The Council of State) - Some of the Armenians

        Dan?stay Uyeleri (Council of State) Members

        Andon T?ng?r YAVER Pas¸a Dan?s¸tay Üyesi
        Abraham YEREMYAN Pas¸a Dan?s¸tay Üyesi
        Mihran DÜZ Dan?s¸tay Üyesi
        Bedros KUYUMCUYAN Dan?s¸tay Üyesi

        VAHAM
        Serkis KARAKOÇ (Und.)
        Artin S¸inasi PEKMEZOG<breve>LU (Undrs.)
        GARABET (Undr.)
        GASBAR
        Diran PARGAMYAN
        Bogos S¸AS¸YAN
        Dikran YUSUFYAN
        Takvar HAMAMCIYAN
        Kapriel KAPRI?YELI?YAN
        Ohannes TOROSYAN
        Viçen HOKOSYAN
        I?stepan KARAYAN
        Markar UNCUYAN
        Tateos REFKI?
        Diran AS¸NANYAN
        Kapriel NES¸TERCI?YAN
        Artin MOSDI?ÇYAN
        Ovakim REI?SYAN
        Kevork FI?KRI?
        HAYRABET


        Ohannes TINGIR
        Bogos MISIRLIYAN
        Krikor ODYAN
        Serkis DÜZ
        Artin DADYAN
        Sahak ABRO
        Zareh DI?LBER
        Ohannes NURYAN
        I?lyas ÇAYAN
        Duran DADYAN
        Andon KÖSEYAN
        Bedros Zeki GARABETYAN
        Krikor HIDIRYAN
        H?rant ASADUR

        --------------
        Ministry of Internal Affairs - Some of the Armenian Civil Servants

        Mares¸al Garabet Artin DAVUT Pas¸a
        VARTAN Pas¸a
        Krikor S¸ABANYAN
        Osep AMI?RA
        Haçadur DERNERSESYAN
        Nis¸an KAZAZYAN
        Mikael MAMI?KONYAN
        Bedros KAPAMACIYAN
        Karakin DEVECI?YAN
        Servet PARACIYAN
        Sisak FERI?T
        Minas GAMSAR
        Levon SÜRENYAN
        Yervan YUSUFYAN
        Bogos PARNASYAN
        Harutyun HANDANYAN

        Vali Muavinleri

        Ohannes FERI?T
        Ohannes ASASYAN
        L.AYCI?YAN
        Antranik BI?LLURYAN

        Mustesar Muavinleri

        Nazaret
        Gazaros SAYEBAG<breve>LIYAN
        HAGOP
        Mihran BOYACIYAN
        Harundyun APARTYAN
        Levon
        Minas CUKASIZYAN
        Nazaret ARMENAK
        Fikri ASLANYAN
        MANUEL
        Garabet ISRAELYAN
        BEDROS
        NI?SAN
        PASKAL
        Sarim CUKASIZYAN
        Dikran KIRISCIYAN
        Hagop FERI?T
        Garabet TOROSYAN
        Hagop YAVER
        Krikor PAPAZYAN
        Nis¸an AGAH
        Armenak BOYACIYAN
        KRIKOR
        Dikran KEVORK
        Avedis SISLIYAN
        Minas HEKI?MYAN
        Garebet TEKVORYAN
        Artin ZEKI
        Asadur KUSADALIYAN
        Andon GOCEYAN
        Simpat DERNERSESYAN

        H?mayak SEFERYAN
        Aram ADI?L
        Kevork TORKOMYAN
        Melkon MI?LOYAN
        Behram YAKUPYAN
        Sahak YEREMYAN
        Levon PAPAZYAN
        Kevork KORAN
        Dikran ÇÜBERYAN
        Kevork ÇÜVERYAN
        Hovsep TAKVORYAN
        Krikor TAKVORYAN

        Some of the Armenians in the Ottoman Ministry of National Development


        Maresal Garabet Artin DAVUT Pasha (Minister)
        Bedros HALLAÇYAN (Minister)
        BAristor Krikor SINAPYAN (Minister)
        Krikor AGATON (Minister)
        Gabriel NORADUNKYAN (Minister)

        Armenicam Civil Servants

        Krikor ODYAN
        M?g?rd?ç SINAPYAN
        Ohannes KARDAVYAN
        Bedros HORASANYAN
        Kevork PAKARAD
        Bogos HANLIYAN
        Melkon NAZIKYAN
        Karakin GAZAROSYAN
        Edvard Yervant SAMUELYAN

        Agriculture Office


        Krikor HEKI?MYAN
        Eram
        Haygaz BEGYAN
        M?g?rd?ç HEKI?MYAN
        Kevork TORKOMYAN
        Nis¸an KALFAYAN
        Bedros KUYUMCUYAN
        Onnik I?HSAN
        While I can appreciate the Christians did hold high positions at times in the Ottoman Empire, it was not due to enlightenment or Ottoman liberal ideals. They were ambassadors because they spoke foreign languages, knew their European counterparts and being Christian, this gave them more politcal understanding and mileage in Europe. Had there been no pressure (Tanzimat reforms and thereafter) from Europeans, there would have been no Armenians parliamentarians and I would speculate that there presence was purely symbolic (and the very nature of how they arrived at those positions probably made them hated). The reason that we call April 24, 1915 the start date of the Genocide even though the killings began the previous year, is that many of these parliamentarians were murdered on that day. Some were even Dashnak which further complicates the situation because it shows that their involvement in the gov't did not mesh with the popular Turkish view that they were fully focused on statehood in the 1914/1915 period ( in that respect it kind of mirrors the Kurdish situation today)

        With regards to various finance, economic, and development ministers, they provided an expertise due to their education and experience in business dealings. For generations it was the work the dhimmi did and was not something held in high regard from their Muslim counterparts. Muslims did not deal with banking, finance, brokerage, etc. often due to relgious reasons but mostly because culturally, its just what Armenians, Jews and Greeks did and excelled at and what they were allowed to partake in unlike say the military or as regional governors or large landowners, etc.

        My point is that I see quite often that it is used in the standard lexicon of the Turkish official position that "hey look at how many Armenians were in the gov't, that shows there could be no genocide"
        Well, the simple case is that the Ottoman Empire needed accountants, bankers, artisans, architects, financiers, etc out of necessity and when the genocide occured, the fact of their murder, exile, etc is glossed over.
        Armenians, Greeks, Jews, Assyrians, were there out of necessity not because they were welcome or respected. Some did survive into the Republican period (Dilicar comes to mind) but only because they were irreplacable at the time.
        General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

        Comment


        • Exactly Joseph.

          The Ottomans where forced to reform and in anycase their reforms were limited and uneffective. The Turks in the Ottoman empire were too stupid to do the jobs that Armenians and Greeks carried out. The Greeks and Armenians were killed because they were the rich ones (just like the Jews that died under the Nazis). I dont see a difference between the Nazis and the Young Turks. The Nazis copied the Young Turks and used modern German technology to update the methods used by the Young Turks. Talat was killed in Germany wasnt he? Isnt it possible that more Young Turks fled to Germany and perhaps met Hitler and other Nazis to give a better insight into commiting Genocides.

          TurQ what can I say apart from the fact that Turkeys very own minorities have many protests (of course Turkeys laws which are close or at the very least mimic those of a facist state) consider these people as terrorists.

          If the Bulgarian government followed the example of Turkey then we would have to massacre the 1 million+ Turks in our country. I know that even the most ardent Bulgarian nationalists wouldnt dream of doing this. Just wait until our coalition gets into power the Turks will get their commupance.

          Whats the matter TurQ cant you at least critise the any of those Turks that killed that Greek Cypriot in cold blood. Or the Turkish Cypriot politician who shot dead that guys cousin a few weeks later because he climbed a flag pole with the Turkish flag. Cant you at least critise Turkeys facists the MHP were the ones who created forest fires in the Greek Aegean islands and who try and prevent any debate on the Armenian genocide or who tried to kill the late pope. Not even one word of critism? My my my TurQ we all know your true colours dont we???

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Bulgarian
            Exactly Joseph.

            The Ottomans where forced to reform and in anycase their reforms were limited and uneffective. The Turks in the Ottoman empire were too stupid to do the jobs that Armenians and Greeks carried out. The Greeks and Armenians were killed because they were the rich ones (just like the Jews that died under the Nazis). I dont see a difference between the Nazis and the Young Turks. The Nazis copied the Young Turks and used modern German technology to update the methods used by the Young Turks. Talat was killed in Germany wasnt he? Isnt it possible that more Young Turks fled to Germany and perhaps met Hitler and other Nazis to give a better insight into commiting Genocides.

            TurQ what can I say apart from the fact that Turkeys very own minorities have many protests (of course Turkeys laws which are close or at the very least mimic those of a facist state) consider these people as terrorists.

            If the Bulgarian government followed the example of Turkey then we would have to massacre the 1 million+ Turks in our country. I know that even the most ardent Bulgarian nationalists wouldnt dream of doing this. Just wait until our coalition gets into power the Turks will get their commupance.

            Whats the matter TurQ cant you at least critise the any of those Turks that killed that Greek Cypriot in cold blood. Or the Turkish Cypriot politician who shot dead that guys cousin a few weeks later because he climbed a flag pole with the Turkish flag. Cant you at least critise Turkeys facists the MHP were the ones who created forest fires in the Greek Aegean islands and who try and prevent any debate on the Armenian genocide or who tried to kill the late pope. Not even one word of critism? My my my TurQ we all know your true colours dont we???
            Bulgarian,

            I didn't mean it in a racsist way. Turks in Turkey are obviously in occupying those jobs now in Turkey and doing fine.
            General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

            Comment


            • Where was I racist. Im getting tired of being called a racist. Cant you see the link between the Young Turks and the Nazis that followed them?

              I know Turks are doing fine. The reason they are doing fine is because of what they did to the peoples all around them. Do you think if the Tuks didnt impose their religion and their language amongst the peoples of the Balkans, the Caucasus', Anatolia and the Middle East. Do you think the Turks would number so many? Do you think there would be a Turkey? Dont you think there would be an larger Armenia, an actual state called Kurdistan and a larger Greece.

              Why are there many white Turks who look no different from northern Europeans? Why are there so many tanned Turks who look no different from Armenians and other peoples from the middle east and southern Europe. Why did Turkey get away from the punishment of losing WW1? What there finally treaty gave them was as if they won WW1! Time and time again Turkey double crosses everyone and Turkey displays slyness. They have illegally invade Cyprus. They have an embargo with Armenia. The poll which said that Armenian youth favour relations with Turkey is probably true because the Turks have crippled Armenia (yet again) so the Armenian youth are desperate. Turkey defies international laws. Turkey is against the largest race in the world from establishing a homeland even if that homeland is outside of Turkey. Turkey uses NATO and US weapons to commit inhumain crimes against the Kurds. This is just the tip of the iceburg.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by TurQ
                I'm wondering which European country had a minority in their governments prior to mid 20th century.
                I would suggest that every European democracy had minorities in their governments. Can you prove otherwise?

                For example, Britain even had a Jewish prime-minister in the 19th century.

                Originally posted by TurQ
                Armenian MPs in Ottoman Parliament
                1914

                Istepan CIRACIYAN (Başkanlık divanı katibi) Ergani Milletvekili
                Onnik İHSAN İzmir Milletvekili
                Bedros HALLAÇYAN Istanbul Milletvekili
                Krikor ZÖHRAP Istanbul Milletvekili
                Agop HIRLAKYAN Maras Milletvekili
                Kegam DERGARABEDYAN Mus Milletvekili
                Artin BOŞGEZENYAN Halep Milletvekili
                Dikran BARSAMYAN Sivas Milletvekili
                Matyos NALBATYAN Kozan Milletvekili
                Karabet TOMAYAN Kayseri Milletvekili
                Sasun Bağdat Milletvekili
                Varteks SERENGÜLYAN Erzurum Milletvekili
                How many of them were murdered in 1915?

                There was a discussion about this on another forum, when I was trying to identify the name of the Armenian member of the Ottoman parliament that Nogales saw being driven off in a car to be murdered by Turkish soldiers in Mush in 1915.
                Plenipotentiary meow!

                Comment


                • Joseph

                  An average Enderun(Palace University) student could speak at least 5-6 langauges. In Ottoman beurocracy this was a very common thing, mst of the soldiers serving in Balkans knew Greek, Serbo-Croat and Hungarian. that was not only the case for Armenians, probably Armenians learned those foreign langauges in Ottoman Universities.


                  [QUOTE=Joseph]While I can appreciate the Christians did hold high positions at times in the Ottoman Empire, it was not due to enlightenment or Ottoman liberal ideals. They were ambassadors because they spoke foreign languages, knew their European counterparts and being Christian, this gave them more politcal understanding and mileage in Europe. Had there been no pressure (Tanzimat reforms and thereafter) from Europeans, there would have been no Armenians parliamentarians and I would speculate that there presence was purely symbolic (and the very nature of how they arrived at those positions /QUOTE]

                  Comment


                  • Read your posts once more, you'll see that you're racist

                    Originally posted by Bulgarian
                    Where was I racist. Im getting tired of being called a racist. Cant you see the link between the Young Turks and the Nazis that followed them?

                    against the Kurds. This is just the tip of the iceburg.

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                    • I know Varteks was hanged in Istanbul,
                      dont know the rest
                      But the thin is before 1915 Ottomans didnnt see Armenians as being Armenian threat bu a general eastern problem, and it's obvious that the claims about Armenians being second class citizens in Ottomans is a false claim, they had these high ranking positions which you can not see any of the western countries of that time. CUP and traditional Ottoman styles are different,

                      Originally posted by bell-the-cat
                      I would suggest that every European democracy had minorities in their governments. Can you prove otherwise?

                      For example, Britain even had a Jewish prime-minister in the 19th century.



                      How many of them were murdered in 1915?

                      There was a discussion about this on another forum, when I was trying to identify the name of the Armenian member of the Ottoman parliament that Nogales saw being driven off in a car to be murdered by Turkish soldiers in Mush in 1915.

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