Who makes use of hate between Armenian and Turkish People?

[Vogelgrippe]

There is no official statement in regards to that.

Also, the two major conditions Turkey requires in order to open the border is for Armenia to drop Genocide charges and to return occupied Karabagh and its surroundings to Azerbaijan. Something like blackmailing if you ask me. And of course, neither one is going to happen for obvious reasons.

Turkey's major condition is that Armenia withdraws from Karabagh + 20% of Azerbaijan proper. Obviously it won't be realistic to expect that Armenia withdraws once from all of these areas. But they can at least withdraw from the proper Azerbaijan as a sign of goodwill. Otherwise, it would be a hypocricy to search justice for the sufferings of your ancestors 90 years ago on the one hand, and supporting the continued sufferings of hundreds of thousands displaced people at present on the other.

About the border issue, I believe the main issue (for Turkey) is the recognition of the border by Armenia rather than the dropping of the genocide subject. I also believe that the opening of the border should have nothing to do with genocide discussions, because it seems, and probably is, simple blackmailing. But declaring the recognition of the border as a precondition seems morally correct to me, since it is an innocent attempt by any state to secure is existence.

You personally may not have claim on Turkish territory, but neither the Armenian government nor many Armenian forumists here do not share your opinion. The Armenian politicians statements in this regard are vague at best, and far from reassuring. Is it therefore so unjustifiable that Turkey acts carefully against a neighbour which doesn't respect its territorial integrity?

[Joseph]

Turkey's major condition is that Armenia withdraws from Karabagh + 20% of Azerbaijan proper. Obviously it won't be realistic to expect that Armenia withdraws once from all of these areas. But they can at least withdraw from the proper Azerbaijan as a sign of goodwill. Otherwise, it would be a hypocricy to search justice for the sufferings of your ancestors 90 years ago on the one hand, and supporting the continued sufferings of hundreds of thousands displaced people at present on the other.

About the border issue, I believe the main issue (for Turkey) is the recognition of the border by Armenia rather than the dropping of the genocide subject. I also believe that the opening of the border should have nothing to do with genocide discussions, because it seems, and probably is, simple blackmailing. But declaring the recognition of the border as a precondition seems morally correct to me, since it is an innocent attempt by any state to secure is existence.

You personally may not have claim on Turkish territory, but neither the Armenian government nor many Armenian forumists here do not share your opinion. The Armenian politicians statements in this regard are vague at best, and far from reassuring. Is it therefore so unjustifiable that Turkey acts carefully against a neighbour which doesn't respect its territorial integrity?

This is opening up a whole new can of worms. Along with Artsakh, the Armenians control about 14% of Azerbaijan. The Azeris bagan the 1990's by massacring Armenians and deporting them from the Shahumian and Hadrut regions and shelling Stepanakert (Operation Ring) If you are going to argue that Armenians should submit to Azerbaijan, I would argue that Cypriot Turks first do the same with the Greek Cypriots.

Turkey has made it clear officially on several occasions there principle regarding th border.

1. Armenian recognition of the borders
2. Armenians (Not just in Armenia) stop trying to have the genocide recognized
3. Armenians submit to Azerbaijan.

Although some ( and I must emphasize "some") Armenians want land from Turkey, the Armenian state does not.
The other two points are impossible as Armenia will not abandon the Armenins in Artsakh and you already know how Armenians feel regarding the Genocide.

[Aytug]

Cypriot Greeks were killing Turks and they still celebrate its days..This is a very clear right for entering Cyprus as the rights coming from the guarenteer. But in Karabag, Azeri Turks were killed, can you deny that? You have made reverse and both killed and occupied Azerbaijan..

[HayerMiacek]

Cypriot Greeks were killing Turks and they still celebrate its days..This is a very clear right for entering Cyprus as the rights coming from the guarenteer. But in Karabag, Azeri Turks were killed, can you deny that? You have made reverse and both killed and occupied Azerbaijan..

And you are saying that no Armenians were killed during the war?

What about the attacks on Armenians in Baku, Sumgait, ethnic cleansing that Azeris commited in Armenian villages?

It was war, both sides suffered, now what is your god damn point?

[Silver]

And you are saying that no Armenians were killed during the war?

What about the attacks on Armenians in Baku, Sumgait, ethnic cleansing that Azeris commited in Armenian villages?

It was war, both sides suffered, now what is your god damn point?

And you are saying that no Turks were killed on 1915?

What about attacks on Turks on all eastern villages, ethnic cleansing that Armenians commited by being provoked by Russians and French?

It was war, both sides suffered, now what is your god damn point?

[Aytug]

And you are saying that no Armenians were killed during the war?

What about the attacks on Armenians in Baku, Sumgait, ethnic cleansing that Azeris commited in Armenian villages?

It was war, both sides suffered, now what is your god damn point?

It is a war, surely Armenian soldiers were killed, but looking into many videos of GENOCIDE in Khojaly and Karabagh, how could you deny these murders?

[HayerMiacek]

And you are saying that no Turks were killed on 1915?

What about attacks on Turks on all eastern villages, ethnic cleansing that Armenians commited by being provoked by Russians and French?

It was war, both sides suffered, now what is your god damn point?

This is where you get owned

During the Azeri-Armenian war, two countries were at war, during the 1915 Genocide, there was NO Armenia, in fact all Armenians living in the Ottoman Turkey were Turkish citizens, so how in the hell you call that a war? Didn't Armenians, who again were Ottoman citizens have the same rights to be protected as other Ottoman citizens? But, what happened instead?

And second of all, how in the hell can a lousy 2 million Armenians, who were not allowed to carry arms do against the powerful Ottoman army???

And the uprisings that you are refering to, were acts of defense, if Armenians in those villages did not defend themselves, the whole Armenian race might have been wiped out.

Again, there is a big difference between when people die in wars and in genocides!

[Aytug]

powerful Ottoman army???

Read some history then..

[HayerMiacek]

Read some history then..

so you are saying the Armenians were more powerful than the Ottoman Army, an ally of Germany during WWI?

amigo, wake up and smell the roses lol

[Silver]

This is where you get owned

During the Azeri-Armenian war, two countries were at war, during the 1915 Genocide, there was NO Armenia, in fact all Armenians living in the Ottoman Turkey were Turkish citizens, so how in the hell you call that a war? Didn't Armenians, who again were Ottoman citizens have the same rights to be protected as other Ottoman citizens? But, what happened instead?

And second of all, how in the hell can a lousy 2 million Armenians, who were not allowed to carry arms do against the powerful Ottoman army???

And the uprisings that you are refering to, were acts of defense, if Armenians in those villages did not defend themselves, the whole Armenian race might have been wiped out.

Again, there is a big difference between when people die in wars and in genocides!

Yes there was no Armenia we know that. Thats why France and Russia used that fact and promised the Armenians an independent country(a promise they wouldnt keep) if they help them against Ottoman. So the Armenians attacked us wearing French and Russian soldier uniforms and using their guns. They started killing muslims on all eastern villages. Although the Ottoman government tried to refrain from sending them to exile, it became necessary after Russia invaded Van with the help of Armenians. This made it clear that Ottoman army would keep getting backstabbed by Armenians so the government sent them to places where they can't actively help Russia and France. So yes there was a war. It was between Ottoman and imperialist invaders who used Armenians as a pawn. They are still using you as a pawn actually. Hope you see that.