Monte Melkonian Interview

[Joseph]

Video 1:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EA70A1qIv9I
Video 2:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jCys72ydQY
Video 3:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpLev9nZHcQ
Video 4:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYMRD9ci_2I
Video 5:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flFV9B3OMFc

[Hovik]

This thread, and the links have been updated, they should work now... Lets discuss what Commander Avo had to say...

[Joseph]

This thread, and the links have been updated, they should work now... Lets discuss what Commander Avo had to say...

Thanks!

[Hovik]

Happy to help!

[Joseph]

One Must Always Have Faith In The Passage Of Time

The following is a 1997 interview with Louis Joinet, who served as an advisor to French President Francois Mitterand

[June 11, 2007]

- What memories does the name Monte Melkonian bring to mind?

- My recollections can be categorized into three groups. Let's remember that in 1981 he had multiple identities. At the time I served as a judicial advisor to then Prime Minister Pierre Mauroy. On November 18, 1981, we received word that a passenger in transit from Milan was under police surveillance. The passenger was bound for Beirut and went under the name Avenesyan or something similar. (When Monte is later arrested he calls himself Khatchig Avedisyan, a citizen of Turkey-E.B.) The whole affair was cloudy. Here's a person traveling to Beirut from Italy, of Armenian descent, with Turkish citizenship carrying a Cypriot passport. Of course he attracted our attention. We then find out the passport's a fake, which he later doesn't deny. At this point he claims his name is Dimitriu Georgiu.

A month prior to this, there had been an attack on a Jewish synagogue. It turned out that the prime suspect also carried a Cypriot passport whose serial numbers closely resembled those of Monte's passport. Thus, our three suspicions about Melkonian.1) The undeniable fact that his passport was a fake, which in itself is a crime in France. 2) His suspected links to the synagogue bombing in Copernicus Street. 3) That he himself executed or was involved in the attack against a Turkish diplomat in Rome that occurred a month before his arrest in France.

We should remember that the Socialist-Left in France had just come to power and was suspected of having links to various terrorist groups. Soon rumors began to fly that the government wanted to set him free.

Of course, this wasn't the case at all. We began our investigation of the synagogue bombing and even sent an agent to Cyprus to check the passports, but to no avail. So we couldn't link Monte Melkonian to that attack.

We were then only left with the fact that Dimitriu Georgiu was a passenger using a fake passport, an everyday occurrence. Anyway, he was charged on the passport infraction and given a four month suspended sentence. Afterwards he was deported to Beirut under police custody. After his arrival there he gave a press conference during which he revealed his true identity as Monte Melkonian. This is my first recollection of Monte.

The second was somewhat dramatic in nature but interesting politically. Remember that this all took place when ASALA was under the leadership of Hagop Hagopian. I could never tell if Hagopian was one person, a fake collective name, or what? Some ASALA members had started to criticize the leadership for being too authoritarian and for carrying out senseless acts of terrorism, something that reached its zenith with the Orly Airport incident. Some people, Melkonian included, understood how this could be used against the Armenian Cause since those victimized by these acts had nothing to do with the recognition of the genocide or with the current situation in eastern Anatolia. Remember that ASALA had also called for the liberation of occupied Armenian lands there. The French-Armenian community slowly found itself in a precarious position and could be negatively impacted by this type of terrorism. What resulted was a process that started in 1982. The Armenian National Movement in France, lead by Ara Toranian, along with the Popular Movements in England and Canada, started to unite around Monte Melkonian and his more pronounced political orientation. This was an overall strategy that didn't rely solely on a militaristic approach but also included a political component. It was important that someone like Monte assume leadership of such a movement for which a political analysis of current realities was paramount. While I didn't accept all the actions taken by the new leadership, I think history proved us right when he had our doubts about Monte's involvement in the Copernicus bombing and other tit-for-tat killings, something that certain government agencies would have us believe. This is my second recollection.

My third recollection stems from news articles I read about him going to Nagorno-Karabakh to fight in the liberation struggle there after Armenia declared its independence. He assumed some high-level responsibilities in the north, if I'm not mistaken, and heroically commanded several military units. We were told similar stories of his bravery when my wife and I visited Karabakh on a vacation. It was a very moving experience. In this way he became a hero. History is strange…When I first met him I only saw another terrorist, just like the rest. But later… It just goes to show that one must always have faith in the passage of time.

- In this context you're probably not surprised to hear that he's a national hero in Armenia?

- Based on what I've said, no, I'm not. I can't say if he personally participated in any anti-Turkish acts. I'm against such things. As a lawyer I abhor the use of violence, even political violence. When we take into account how he developed a political line counter to Hagop Hagopian's, I'm not surprised that his destiny lay with his people and that he met his end within the democratic upheavals of those lands.

I don't know if they are aware of this in Armenia (I know it's mostly forgotten in France) that when the groups coalescing around Monte Melkonian wanted to somehow split from ASALA, they were all banished. This included the group “Armenian National Movement-ASALA” in France that had started to take a more political orientation in its analysis as opposed to mere militarism and eventually dropped the ASALA link from its name. To clarify the ongoing split even further, the Monte Melkonian-led faction of ASALA adopted the title, “ASALA-Revolutionary Movement”. Taking all this into account, I'm not surprised at the praise bestowed upon him or his fateful demise.

- Mr. Joinet, it's not often that a foreign diplomat, much less one from a western nation, vacations in Karabakh. What were your impressions?

- At the time I was an advisor to French President Francois Mitterand. I wound up becoming friends with both President Ter-Petrosyan and with President Kocharyan. This is what happened. Levon Ter-Petrosyan was an opposition leader during the Gorbachev era and was arrested in Moscow. Here in France a defense committee was organized in which others and I became involved. (We had also worked on the genocide issue and we are generally concerned with developments in Armenia). That's how we met. In addition, during the run-up to the Presidential election when Levon Ter-Petrosyan had declared his candidacy, he found he needed to undergo a medical surgery that had a better chance of success in France. It was all very hush-hush at the time. A group of friends organized and financed the whole affair and the operation was performed without a hitch. On a subsequent return visit to France he invited all of us to dinner. Then, I received an invitation to spend my vacation in Armenia. My wife and I spent eight days in the care of a very friendly couple, especially Mrs. Ter-Petrosyan with whom we became close friends. We spent four days in Karabakh and I spent the time exploring the country. In those places where we were recognized we were received by welcoming committees, music, etc.

- It's impossible not to mention in passing the role you played in the European Union regarding the Genocide recognition issue.

- I didn't play a direct role in the E.U. but rather in the United Nations. Many in Armenia will remember the infamous Paragraph 30 history. A Special Rapporteur had been appointed to offer proposals to make the work of the upcoming Genocide Convention more productive. In his draft he mentioned the Armenian Genocide along with other historical examples. Turkey and her allies worked to have this citation removed. Afterwards, the Special Rapporteur literally vanished from the scene. In the United Nations it's not easy to replace an appointed rapporteur; it only happens in cases when the person resigns or dies while in office. A procedure was enacted, in which I was involved, that allowed for a new individual to be appointed. It was a friend of mine, Ben Whittaker, who was nominated. As a specialist in United Nations procedural matters we were able to reinstate the deleted Paragraph 30. In this capacity I attended several meetings and this reinstatement was truly a big step forward in the Genocide recognition campaign

While I understand the difficulties involved, I believe that any future mutual accommodation between Armenians and Turks (let's not say reconciliation) will only result from recognition of the genocide. Let me add that more time needs to be devoted to this issue. We had to wait until President Chirac was in office for France to formally and publicly recognize the Genocide. Neither General De Gaulle nor Presidents Giscard and Mitterand took this step. It was the responsibility of the Vichy government for the deportations during the Jewish Holocaust. President Cardoza of Brazil followed Chirac's lead and also recognized his government's complicity. The same happened in Germany and somewhat differently in South Africa. Thus, we see a progression, which I hope continues.

- What's your opinion regarding Kocharyan, the newly appointed Prime Minister?

- I know him from my travels and have met him often. My first reaction was that his appointment would further complicate matters with Azerbaijan. I believe the experience he gained while governing Karabakh will serve him well in his new position.

- What are your predictions regarding a settlement of the Karabakh conflict, especially given France's involvement in the process?

- There's a French saying that goes, “You can't be a prophet in your own country, but you can in someone else's”. With each passing day, we continue on the right track. Strategies for peace are often colored by cultural factors. In places where there's a long standing ceasefire in effect there comes a point where the people involved long for some tranquility, if not peace. This reality does have an effect on political leaders. Every day that passes without a shot being fired is a positive step in the peace process. But I can't tell you when a final settlement will be reached.

- Don't you think a contradiction exists between the principles concerning the rights of individuals and the rights of nations, in other words the right of self-determination as opposed to the right of a country's territorial integrity?

- This issue manifests itself all over the world and each case is different. As far as I know till now there hasn't been a case where the right to self-determination has been applied according to international norms; in other words, a referendum. The only possible exception was the French issue of New Caledonia. According to UN standards a referendum in Karabakh would have to include all former residents, including Azeri refugees. Presently, this isn't a realistic scenario. While somewhat regrettable, a settlement will most likely result from traditional peace processes rather than a national referendum on self-determination. It will result from a political agreement between the opposing sides. If a referendum were held today those favoring self-determination would win, but this outcome would have no political significance for Azerbaijan. Thus, I think the political approach is the correct way forward. But then, I'm not Armenian, nor do I live in Karabakh. So I say in all modesty, I may be wrong.

Interview conducted by Edik Baghdasaryan
Paris, 1997

[Joseph]

http://www.hetq.am/eng/society/0706-monte.html

On June 12, 1993 Monte Melkonian was killed

[June 11, 2007]

In the early morning the self-defense forces of the Martuni region of Nagorno Karabakh began an operation to destroy the military strongholds in the villages of the Aghdam region of Azerbaijan. Everything was going as planned. By noon the operation was over. Monte, Komitas, Saribek, Saro, Hovik, and Gevork entered the Marzili village riding in a Vilis. After examining the territory they were to determine the new positions. When they were approaching a crossroads they noticed an armored vehicle and stopped the Vilis. At a distance of 40 meters a group of soldiers gathered around the vehicle. Komitas, who was wearing an Azerbaijani military uniform, got out of the car and walked towards them. He called to them, “Are you Armenians?” They answered “No” in Azerbaijani. Komitas would later say that the moment he asked the question he knew they were enemy soldiers. He opened fire and retreated. The others jumped out the car and took positions, firing.

The vehicle's large-caliber machine-gun joined the enemy's submachine gunners. During the first burst of gunfire, the men were lying on the ground. Monte rushed towards the wall of the nearest house. The second machine-gun burst resounded. It hit the wall… A large fragment of a shell pierced Monte's head. Four of the men were already wounded. Holding Monte, Hovik called for help over the radio transmitter - 00 is shot, 00 is no more… They took position around their commander and continued to resist. The relief forces destroyed the Azerbaijani detachment, and took a prisoner. The reconnaissance chief, Saribek Martirosyan, was bleeding profusely and died as soon as they reached the hospital.

[Joseph]

http://www.hetq.am/eng/society/0411-monte.html

Monte Melkonian: hero, intellectual, leader, friend

[November 24, 2004]

November 25 marks the day that we remember Monte Melkonian. For Armenians, Monte Melkonian is remembered as Commander Avo, the national war hero, who dedicated his life fighting for the rights of Armenians: the right to live with dignity and equality: the right to grow and thrive as active members of a community: the right to live without fear of indiscriminate persecution. Armenian's, because of their homeland's location, at a strategic crossroads of commerce and empire, have had to struggle exceptionally hard to defend their rights. With courage and selfless determination, Monte gave his life to this struggle.









But the rights that Monte Melkonian fought to protect are not just the rights of the Armenian people; they are basic human rights. Monte recognized the universal scope of his work. By the age of twenty-two, he had traveled throughout North America, Europe, Asia Minor, the Orient, and South America. By the time he made the decision to take up arms, he had witnessed the human condition throughout the world. On this day, when Armenians claim Monte Melkonian as their national hero, it should be remembered that his actions were taken with an understanding of people around the world. To Armenians, Monte Melkonian is a national hero, but to all who believe in the sanctity of human rights, he is an international hero as well.

Had circumstances been different, Monte could have engaged as a diplomat or statesman. He was exceptionally articulate and was fluent in several languages. At the University of California Berkeley he was a top ranking scholar and was offered a graduate fellowship to Oxford University in England . His intellectual prowess, communication skills, and tireless determination would have propelled him into a leadership position whether in government, industry, or academia. But he chose to focus his energy on regions that required immediate military action: first in Lebanon in defense of the Armenian community during the civil war and then in Nagorno Karaback following the pogroms in Sumgait and Baku . Monte Melkonian was destined to be a leader, not because he desired power, but because he possessed the qualities needed to be a leader.

I first met Monte at the age of five, on the first day of our first year of school in the small town of Visalia , California . Visalia is near Sequoia National Park where the biggest trees on earth grow. It is at the base of the Sierra Nevada mountains, near Mt. Whitney , the highest mountain on the continental United States . I will always remember Monte as a reflection of the highest and the greatest. We were best friends; we attended Berkeley together. Of course all who knew Monte will probably remember him as their best friend. It was another one of his extraordinary qualities. He befriended people wherever he went. His energy was infectious and he drew out the best and strongest in others. I remember Monte as the fearless kid, swimming across the strongest current in the Kaweah River and diving from the highest cliff. His fearless spirit of investigation took us far beyond the limits of our home town. As kids, we rode our bicycles for hours into the countryside, anxious to make new discoveries about the world around us.

Today Monte Melkonian is remembered as a symbol of national pride for Armenians. For me, I will always remember him as a paragon of how best to live life: to face challenges with steadfast determination: to confront hardships without fear: to be a dedicated friend throughout time: to search for an understanding of the world: to look beyond oneself for a place where one's efforts are bound together in the common goal of creating a better world.

Joel Condon

[Joseph]

http://www.hetq.am/eng/society/0706-monte-1.html

There’s No Country Or Court That Has The Right To Judge Our Struggle

[June 11, 2007]

In 1985 Monte was in France. The police didn't know this. Levon Minasian, one of the leaders of the “Armenian National Movement” had been arrested. Monte had come to France to testify on his behalf. Since Monte was barred from entering France his friends negotiated a secret deposition. The investigative magistrage was taken hostage in order for Monte to submit his testimony without reveling his location. Monte testified but his entry into France was thus revealed.

“On Thursday, November 28, police from the French Counter-Intelligence Agency (DST) arrested Monte Melkonian, the head of the A.S.A.L.A.-Revolutionary Movement. Also arrested was Benjamin Keshishian, a staffer at the Hay Baykar newspaper, who was meeting Melkonian for a press interview. That same evening a young French-Armenian woman, Zepyur Kasbarian, was also taken into custody. The French police stated that a gun belonging to Melkonian, some electronic equipment, a photo of the Turkish ambassador, and a list of Turkish ships anchored in Marseille harbor were all found in her apartment. Zepyur denied any prior knowledge of these items as well as knowing Monte's true identity. All three were charged with “criminal conspiracy”.

Hay Baykar, December 20, 1985



At the time, local Armenian activists were subjected to increased police surveillance. Monte had found himself on the streets of Paris with no money and no place to stay. Zepyur Kasbarian, a student and Armenian language teacher, took him in.

- Zepyur, what were you accused of?

- As a conspirator since they found all those items of Monte's in my apartment.

- How did Monte act during the trial?

- Always in good spirits. He spoke at length. I wasn't the one on trial. It was Monte they were after. My name was mentioned only in passing.

- How long were you in jail?

- Exactly one year. It's now been ten years since my release. But I've suffered more during these past ten years than during the one I spent in jail. I never expected to be barred from freely moving about in Paris all that time. I'm under virtual house arrest. I haven't seen Monte since then, but I'm glad to have helped out such a good and great man. I'm proud to have done what I did – no regrets. Unfortunately, I didn't have the chance to ask him how the police knew he was staying at my place.

- In other words, were the police tipped-off to the fact he was there?

- Of course they knew. How else did they take him into custody at 11 A.M? Later that day they came to my apartment and showed me a photo of Monte from one of the newspapers. They asked if I knew who the person was and I said, yes, he's Monte Melkonian. Then they showed me a photo of Monte while staying at my apartment and I said, No, I don't know this person. Neither did I know who my interrogator was nor why he was asking all these questions.

Much later, in his book Self-Criticism , Monte writes, “There are several reasons why they were able to capture me. First, they knew my whereabouts because I testified. It occurred at a time when I didn't have many resources at my disposal and was vulnerable. I also made the huge blunder of using the telephone carelessly. In the end it was this crucial error in judgment that did me in.”


Monte spent a total of three days at Zepyur's apartment and on the fourth he was taken into custody while in the Zever Cafe. Zepyur's husband, Varoujan Mehrap, took this writer to the cafe where he met Fake Claude, a waiter there for over forty years, who was an eyewitness to Monte's arrest and vividly remembers that day:


“It happened on a Friday morning at 10:30. They were both drinking coffee. We later learned that one was a terrorist, the other a journalist. I don't know if someone betrayed them but the police knew exactly where to find them. There were fifteen undercover agents scattered around the place, reading, drinking, etc. Suddenly, they all pounced on Monte. They drew their guns and handcuffed the guy and took him away. Afterwards, the police showed us some I.D. and told us all was OK.”- Said Fake Claude.

- Did they offer any resistance?

- No. They were jumped by fifteen police. They had no chance.

- Has anything similar happened here?

- No, and I've worked here since 1958.

- What's your opinion of the guy they arrested?

- I don't know the man.

- Do you know he's considered a national hero in Armenia?

- Really? What a surprise. Good for him. He did me no harm.

- Don't you find it strange that the French police arrested someone who's considered a national hero in another country?

- Nowadays so much happens that I'm not really surprised.


The 14th Tribunal of the Paris Court of Justice sentenced Monte Melkonian to six years imprisonment and Zepyur Kasbarian to two years.

After the trial, in 1986, Monte wrote the following letter addressed to the Armenian community:

“ I have not petitioned the court for a review of the harsh sentence given to me. I haven't pursued such a course of action because there's no country or court that has the right to judge our struggle nor those who wage it. Secondly, I've tasted the farce that passes as “French justice”. Thirdly, a review of my case will not change anything. My sentencing resulted from a political decision. We will resolve the issues we face elsewhere and not in the halls of a judicial system that seems fit to censure us.”

Hay Baykar, 1986



Monte's French Defense Counsel consisted of two lawyers – Henri Loglegh and Francoise Segh.

In 1997 Henri Loglegh was the President of France's Human Rights Defense League. Below are excerpts of an interview from 1997.

“Monte Melkonian was able to totally defend his national-patriotic position. He explained the reasons why he fought. His guiding principle in the struggle was top avoid civilian casualities at all costs. I'll always remember how he stressed this point during the trial and how he comported himself in a dignified manner”, said Henri Loglegh.

- But weren't you defending a terrorist...?

- My defense was based on the opinion that he was not a terrorist but someone involved in a struggle. As an activist, his primary focus was how to advance the struggle and not on how to plan senstaional acts that would result in innocent deaths. This position of his should have been lauded. In any event, at the core of my defense was the argument that Monte wasn't a terrorist (as currently defined).

- Given his character, wasn't he more peaceful than...?

- Yes, in my article I refer to him as a peace-loving terrorist.

- What effect did Monte's speech have during the trial?

- The efect was that there was no doubt that we were dealing with a unique kind of terrorist. It wasn't the usual speech of your average terrorist. I've defended a number of Armenians who have been entangled in unjustifiable acts. Monte was different. The impression he conveyed to the court was of a strong-willed and brave man. He was brave not only due to the struggle he waged on behalf of his people but also because he fought against all those whose foolish actions clouded the correct perception of Armenia's freedom. I don't particularly take a hard line regarding those who resort to unacceptable means and weapons in their struggle. But I respect those who have the courage to refuse to employ those methods. Monte was one of those people.

- You say that Monte was a peace-loving terrorist. When did you start to feel that, in prison?

- Yes, when we had our conversations there. We had a problem, though. His French was poor and so was my English. In the end, we overcame this.

- Do you think Monte benefitted from his time in jail?

- Usually people in prison wind-up viewing their life from afar and have a chance to evaluate their past actions. This is especially the case for active people like Monte who fill their time in prison with much self-analysis. I believe this is what happened in Monte's case.

- When and how did you hear about his death?

- I remember it well. At the time I was in a cafe in the 18 th district of Paris. An Armenian activist who had been in jail and whom I had defended in another matter came to see me there. When he asked, “Do you know Monte Melkonian has been killed?”, I felt sad.

- Do you know he's a national hero in Armenia?

- Yes, I've heard this many times.

- Don't you think this fact proves your description of him as a peace-loving terrorist?

- He was a man who deeply loved his country and a brave and wise warrior. I find it only natural that he assumed such responsibilities after Armenia's independence. Given the many difficulties that Armenia has overcome (that I'm aware of), such a man should be a hero.


Below are excerpts of an interview with Monte's other lawyer, Francoise Segh.

Francoise Segh – Monte bore the internal political responsibility of a movement engaged in ruthless actions against Turkish targets, mostly outside France. He was a special case. I've had dealings with lesser combattants during other trials. These were peoplewho merely carried out certain acts. Monte was able to ideologically analyze the struggle and his responsibility in it. Despite his young age I felt I was dealing with someone with a deep political understanding of his people's history, their liberation movement and the various forms of armed struggle. This made him stand apart.

- Thus you won't be surprised to learn that someone like him has become a national hero?

It doesn't surprise me due to certain political and historical reasons. Today, Armenians have their lands and people like Melkonian can be included in that land's history. He went to prison a young man and was still young when he got out. But there's no doubt he matured while inside. He read voraciously, put his thoughts down in writing and sharpened his ideological faculties. He was a man who gave meaning to his life and stayed true to his principles till the very end. He left a lasting impression.


“From November 28, 1985 till February 5, 1989 I was imprisoned by the French authorities. The conditions in prison were pretty bad. Not only were the food, sanitary and medical conditions poor, especially in Fresnes prison, but on top of this the government devised numerous other repressive measures. I spent two months in an isolation cell, my correspondence with the outside was closely monitored and I was subjected to other arbitrary punishments. Only one person outside my family was allowed to visit. My cell was searched practically daily and turned upside-down. During one stretch they confiscated my writings. They would often conduct humiliating body searches. I couldn't receive newspapers although French law expressly guaranteed my right to do so. Some of the guards took special pleasure in mistreating me and neglected my health needs. Prison authorities would use the flimsiest of pretexts to place me in a cold and dirty cell, often without any toilet facilities for extended periods.”

Excerpted from Monte Melkonian's, Self-Criticism, 1990

While in prison Monte wrote to his brother Markar:

“Every person should spend at least on month in jail. Every judge should spend one year in prison to better understand the consequences of his actions.”

In February 1989 he was released from prison and deported to Yemen.

In 1990 Monte Melkonian arrived in Armenia.

Edik Baghdasaryan
Interviews conducted June 1997, Paris