China executes 9 Uighurs

[Pedro Xaramillo]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

Ahh, so it is a case of kill one and it's called "murder", kill millions, occupy other people's countries, despoil and destroy the global environment, and it is called "a few issues".

Yes exactly what my opinion is on Turkey, kill one Turk and it's murder, kill 1.5 Million "Raya" and it's relocation, thanks for summing up the Turks .

So tell us Bell about this fangled Genocide China committed, I would love to hear.

Now Jos...do you know the articles of the Turkish penal code, even showing support for Armenians, Kurds, etc. can get you arrested, and people who commit murder against Armenians get to pose next to the Turkish flag, amazing init.

I want to know where you get your evidence for Mao killing more than Hitler or Stalin, sources please, or it's a load of rubbish

[Pedro Xaramillo]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

And what I find distateful is your selective sympathy. A country without the rule of law has just executed 9 people. Guilty or not, we'll never really know because of the lack of transparency in their legal system. At least acknowledge that first before your warped preoccupation with Turkey gets the better of you.

Without the rule of law...transparent legal system, do you see the contradiction?

My warped preoccupation with Turkey is due more to my "warped preoccupation" with civil rights for Armenians, Kurds, Arabs, Greeks and Assyrians, you know the indigenous people your country killed off man, woman and child?

Of course that's not Genocide, but a bunch of Uighurs who butcher Chinese civilians in an uprising and subsequently get executed is.

Some basic maths : 1.5 Million > an 100 or so people

[KanadaHye]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

You have no idea what your talking about bambino. China was the mother of all dictatorships. Mao Zedong was a ruthless dictator responsible for deaths of millions of people, even more than Hitler and Stalin. The “Great Leap Forward” and the later “Cultural Revolution” killed millions, and many died in numerous rural and urban purges. Mass starvation alone killed 20 to 40 million people because of Mao's forced labour.

Hold on here.... he didn't intentionally kill millions of people, they starved to death because there were too many damn mouths to feed and the famine was mostly due to droughts and floods. Of course, much like any leader whose bright ideas become a failure, they never want to admit it and instead keep digging themselves in a bigger hole trying to cover up their mistakes and pretend like everything is going fine.

[Jos]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

I want to know where you get your evidence for Mao killing more than Hitler or Stalin, sources please, or it's a load of rubbish

There are many books and academic studies about Mao. A good one is Mao: The Unknown Story by Jung Changand Jon Halliday. Here's a critique of it:

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/1018/p13s02-bogn.html

Here's a quote from the article:

There is little else that could explain his tranquility in the face of the suffering triggered by his policies. Jung and Halliday estimate that he (Mao) caused the deaths of 70 million Chinese.

"There are 2.7 billion people in the world," he once calculated at a world summit with other Communist leaders. "One-third could be lost; or a little more, it could be half ... I say that, taking the extreme situation half dies, half lives, but imperialism would be razed to the ground and the whole world would become socialist."

[Jos]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

Hold on here.... he didn't intentionally kill millions of people, they starved to death because there were too many damn mouths to feed and the famine was mostly due to droughts and floods. Of course, much like any leader whose bright ideas become a failure, they never want to admit it and instead keep digging themselves in a bigger hole trying to cover up their mistakes and pretend like everything is going fine.

Mao's determination to push his country toward industrialization forcing farmers off their land directly contributed to mass starvation.

Chinese government figures show that by 1960, the average Chinese was eating about 1,500 calories a day - a diet equivalent to that of slave-laborers at Auschwitz.

Yet while his people starved, Mao feasted on specialty foods, responding to stories of peasant suffering with statements like: "Having only tree leaves to eat? So be it." and " 'Oh, peasants' lives are so hard' - the end of the world! I have never thought so."

[KanadaHye]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

Mao's determination to push his country toward industrialization forcing farmers off their land directly contributed to mass starvation.

It's a long read but it gives you an opposite view of what you hear from western writers. There were definitely millions that died as a result of famine but the 70 million is exaggerated .

http://parisar.wordpress.com/2006/09...-leap-forward/

Here is a snippet from the conclusion:

The approach of modern writers to the Great Leap Forward is absurdly one-sided. They are unable to grasp the relationship between its failures and successes. They can only grasp that serious problems occurred during the years 1959-1961. They cannot grasp that the work that was done in these years also laid the groundwork for the continuing overall success of Chinese socialism in improving the lives of its people. They fail to seriously consider evidence that indicates that most of the deaths that occurred in the Great Leap Forward were due to natural disasters not policy errors. Besides, the deaths that occurred in the Great Leap Forward have to be set against the Chinese people’s success in preventing many other deaths throughout the Maoist period. Improvements in life expectancy saved the lives of many millions.

We must also consider what would have happened if there had been no Leap and no adoption of the policies of self-reliance once the breach with the Soviet Union occurred. China was too poor to allow its agricultural and industrial development to stagnate simply because the Soviets were refusing to help. This is not an argument that things might not have been done better. Perhaps with better planning, less over-optimism and more care some deaths might have been avoided. This is a difficult question. It is hard to pass judgement what others did in difficult circumstances many years ago.

[Jos]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

It's a long read but it gives you an opposite view of what you hear from western writers. There were definitely millions that died as a result of famine but the 70 million is exaggerated .

http://parisar.wordpress.com/2006/09...-leap-forward/

Here is a snippet from the conclusion:

The approach of modern writers to the Great Leap Forward is absurdly one-sided. They are unable to grasp the relationship between its failures and successes. They can only grasp that serious problems occurred during the years 1959-1961. They cannot grasp that the work that was done in these years also laid the groundwork for the continuing overall success of Chinese socialism in improving the lives of its people. They fail to seriously consider evidence that indicates that most of the deaths that occurred in the Great Leap Forward were due to natural disasters not policy errors. Besides, the deaths that occurred in the Great Leap Forward have to be set against the Chinese people’s success in preventing many other deaths throughout the Maoist period. Improvements in life expectancy saved the lives of many millions.

We must also consider what would have happened if there had been no Leap and no adoption of the policies of self-reliance once the breach with the Soviet Union occurred. China was too poor to allow its agricultural and industrial development to stagnate simply because the Soviets were refusing to help. This is not an argument that things might not have been done better. Perhaps with better planning, less over-optimism and more care some deaths might have been avoided. This is a difficult question. It is hard to pass judgement what others did in difficult circumstances many years ago.

The exact loss would be impossible to work out due to poor record keeping but without a shadow of a doubt Mao's actions and decisions directly resulted in millions of unnecessary deaths.

I wouldn't also give too much credibility to that Marxist source of yours, read the 'About' tab, it says "this blog is dedicated to radical students politics and movements.we think our education system is a byproduct of our socio-economic and political system.so student community can not remain aloof from wider political concerns and students movement is a inseparable part of broader struggle to make the world better......." ohh please....

[KanadaHye]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

The exact loss would be impossible to work out due to poor record keeping but without a shadow of a doubt Mao's actions and decisions directly resulted in millions of unnecessary deaths.

I wouldn't also give too much credibility to that Marxist source of yours, read the 'About' tab, it says "this blog is dedicated to radical students politics and movements.we think our education system is a byproduct of our socio-economic and political system.so student community can not remain aloof from wider political concerns and students movement is a inseparable part of broader struggle to make the world better......." ohh please....

I wouldn't give too much credibility in a number like 70 million deaths due to his policies. The death rate due to natural causes in China must already be an astronomical number... to tie that in with the number of deaths due to famine is like someone pulling a rabbit out of their ass.

[Pedro Xaramillo]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

Yes Jos, we can't trust "evil" Marxists, let's rather trust Capitalists like Vindela, Pinochet, Nixon and Bush, all class act good people, not like us filthy commies, the kind of men the "good" xxxkurtlar support no?
Gladio ftw?

[Jos]

Re: China executes 9 Uighurs

Yes Jos, we can't trust "evil" Marxists, let's rather trust Capitalists like Vindela, Pinochet, Nixon and Bush, all class act good people, not like us filthy commies, the kind of men the "good" xxxkurtlar support no?
Gladio ftw?

Don't be too quick to jump to conclusions Pedro, I also own a Che Guevarra t-shirt .... viva la revolucion