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Geert Wilders

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  • #1

    Geert Wilders

    Those of you who don't know, Geert Wilders is a Dutch politician who is known for his anti-Islam views and tough stance on Muslim immigrants in Holland. Here we can discuss what people think of him and his ideas:



    Amsterdam court rules for Geert Wilders’ trial to go ahead
    March 30, 2011 - 17:34 AMT 12:34 GMT
    PanARMENIAN.Net - The trial of Dutch political leader Geert Wilders on charges of inciting hatred against Muslims is to go ahead, an Amsterdam court has ruled.

    Mr Wilders, whose Freedom Party props up the government, had argued the court could not try the case as the alleged offences took place in The Hague.

    He insists his remarks on Islam were part of a legitimate political debate.

    An original trial was halted last October after claims of bias by Mr Wilders against the judges were upheld.

    Mr Wilders has described Islam as "fascist", comparing the Koran to Hitler's Mein Kampf.

    In his ruling on Wednesday, Judge Marcel van Oosten said the court would pursue the charges against him for the comparisons he had made with Nazism, according to Dutch media.

    But he dropped a complaint referring to Mr Wilders' statement: "I've had enough of Islam in the Netherlands - ban that fascist book."

    The judge said that an Amsterdam court was well within its right to judge the case as the alleged offences had "also been committed within the jurisdiction of Amsterdam".

    The trial was adjourned until 13 April, when three experts on Islam and the Middle East will be called to give evidence, BBC News reported.
    Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
    ---
    "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Geert Wilders

    He fails to understand that so long as Europe continues to disregard its Christian, and pre-Englightenment heritage, they will continue to go down the shi*ter. But I suspect he may be an agent of influence for israel or some other source that wants to create tensions among Europeans and Muslim immigrants.
    For the first time in more than 600 years, Armenia is free and independent, and we are therefore obligated
    to place our national interests ahead of our personal gains or aspirations.



    http://www.armenianhighland.com/main.html

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Geert Wilders

      Originally posted by Armanen View Post
      He fails to understand that so long as Europe continues to disregard its Christian, and pre-Englightenment heritage, they will continue to go down the shi*ter. But I suspect he may be an agent of influence for israel or some other source that wants to create tensions among Europeans and Muslim immigrants.
      Well he does have questionable ties to Israel, but he has often times called for the return of Judeo-Christian values to Holland - even though Christian, to my knowledge he's not very religious (possibly passive Atheist).

      Here's a speech he made regarding Islam, tells a lot about his views:

      Muslims Debate asked Mr. Geert Wilders why he became anti-Islam and what is his message to the Muslims?

      Geert Wilders:

      I first visited an Islamic country in 1982. I was 18 years old and had traveled with a Dutch friend from Eilat in Israel to the Egyptian Red Sea resort of Sharm-el-Sheikh.

      We were two almost penniless backpacking students. We slept on the beaches and found hospitality with Egyptians, who spontaneously invited us to tea. I clearly recall my very first impression of Egypt: I was overwhelmed by the kindness, friendliness and helpfulness of its people.
      I also remember my second strong impression of Egypt: It struck me how frightened these friendly and kind people were.

      While we were in Sharm el-Sheikh, President Mubarak happened to visit the place.

      I remember the fear which suddenly engulfed the town when it was announced that Mubarak was coming on an unexpected visit; I can still see the cavalcade of black cars on the day of his visit and feel the almost physical awareness of fear, like a cold chill on that very hot day in Summer.

      It was a weird experience; Mubarak is not considered the worst of the Islamic tyrants and yet, the fear of the ordinary Egyptians for their leader could be felt even by me. I wonder how Saudis feel when their King is in town, how Libyans feel when Gaddafi announces his coming, how Iraqis must have felt when Saddam Hussein was near. A few years later, I read in the Koran how the 7th century Arabs felt in the presence of Muhammad, who, as several verses describe, “cast terror into their hearts” (suras 8:12, 8:60, 33:26, 59:12).

      From Sharm el-Sheikh, my friend and I went to Cairo. It was poor and incredibly dirty. My friend and I were amazed that such a poor and filthy place could be a neighbor of Israel, which was so clean. The explanation of the Arabs, with whom we discussed their poverty, was that they were not in any way to blame for this affliction: They said they were the victims of a global conspiracy of “imperialists” and “Zionists”, aimed at keeping Muslims poor and subservient. I found that explanation unconvincing. My instinct told me it had something to do with the different cultures of Israel and Egypt.

      I made a mistake in Cairo. We had almost no money and I was thirsty. One could buy a glass of water at public water collectors. It did not look clean, but I drank it. I got a terrible diarrhea. I went to a hostel where one could rent a spot on the floor for two dollars a day. There I lay for several days, a heap of misery in a crowded, stinking room, with ten other guys. Once Egypt had been the most advanced civilization on earth. Why had it not progressed along with the rest of the world?

      In the late 1890s, Winston Churchill was a soldier and a war correspondent in British India (contemporary Pakistan) and the Sudan. Churchill was a perceptive young man, whose months in Pakistan and the Sudan allowed him to grasp with amazing clarity what the problem is with Islam and “the curses it lays on its votaries.

      “Besides the fanatical frenzy, …, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy,” he wrote. “The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist where the followers of the Prophet rule or live. … The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to a sole man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. … Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities – but the influence of the religion paralyzes the social development of those who follow it.” And Churchill concluded: “No stronger retrograde force exists in the world.”

      There are people who say that I hate Muslims. I do not hate Muslims. It saddens me how Islam has robbed them of their dignity.What Islam does to Muslims is visible in the way they treat their daughters. On March 11, 2002, fifteen Saudi schoolgirls died as they attempted to flee from their school in the holy city of Mecca. A fire had set the building ablaze. The girls ran to the school gates but these were locked. The keys were in the possession of a male guard, who refused to open the gates because the girls were not wearing the correct Islamic dress imposed on women by Saudi law: face veils and overgarments.

      The “indecently” dressed girls frantically tried to save their young lives. The Saudi police beat them back into the burning building. Officers of the Mutaween, the “Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice,” as the Police are known in Saudi Arabia, also beat passers-by and firemen who tried to help the girls. “It is sinful to approach them,” the policemen warned bystanders. It is not only sinful, it is also a criminal offence.

      Girls are not valued highly in Islam; the Koran says that the birth of a daughter makes a father’s “face darken and he is filled with gloom” (sura 43:17). Nevertheless, the incident at the Mecca school drew angry reactions. Islam is inhumane; but Muslims are humans, hence capable of Love – that powerful force which Muhammad despised. Humanity prevailed in the Meccan fathers who were incensed over the deaths of their daughters; it also prevailed in the firemen who confronted the Mutaween when the latter were beating the girls back inside, and in the journalists of the Saudi paper which, for the first time in Saudi history, criticized the much feared and powerful “Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice.”

      However, Muslim protests against Islamic inhumanity are rare. Most Muslims, even in Western countries, visit mosques and listen to shocking Koranic verses and to repulsive sermons without revolting against them.

      I am an agnosticus myself. But Christians and xxxs hold that God created man in His image. They believe that by observing themselves, as free and rational beings capable of love, they can come to know Him. They can even reason with Him, as the xxxs have done throughout their history. The Koran, on the contrary, states that “Nothing can be compared with Allah” (sura 16:74, 42:11). He has absolutely nothing in common with us. It is preposterous to suppose that Allah created man in his image. The biblical concept that God is our father is not found in Islam. There is no personal relationship between man and Allah, either. The purpose of Islam is the total submission of oneself and others to the unknowable Allah, whom we must serve through total obedience to Muhammad as leader of the Islamic state (suras 3:31, 4:80, 24:62, 48:10, 57:28). And history has taught us that Muhammad was not at all a prophet of love and compassion, but a mass murderer, a tyrant and a pedophile. Muslims could not have a more deplorable role model.

      Without individual freedom, it is not surprising that the notion of man as a responsible agent is not much developed in Islam. Muslims tend to be very fatalistic. Perhaps – let us certainly hope so – only a few radicals take the Koranic admonition to wage jihad on the unbelievers seriously. Nevertheless, most Muslims never raise their voice against the radicals. This is the “fearful fatalistic apathy” Churchill referred to.

      The author Aldous Huxley, who lived in North Africa in the 1920s, made the following observation: “About the immediate causes of things – precisely how they happen – they seem to feel not the slightest interest. Indeed, it is not even admitted that there are such things as immediate causes: God is directly responsible for everything. ‘Do you think it will rain?’ you ask pointing to menacing clouds overhead. ‘If God wills,’ is the answer. You pass the native hospital. ‘Are the doctors good?’ ‘In our country,’ the Arab gravely replies, in the tone of Solomon, ‘we say that doctors are of no avail. If Allah wills that a man die, he will die. If not, he will recover.’ All of which is profoundly true, so true, indeed, that is not worth saying. To the Arab, however, it seems the last word in human wisdom. ... They have relapsed – all except those who are educated according to Western methods – into pre-scientific fatalism, with its attendant incuriosity and apathy.”

      Islam deprives Muslims of their freedom. That is a shame, because free people are capable of great things, as history has shown. The Arab, Turkish, Iranian, Indian, Indonesian peoples have tremendous potential. It they were not captives of Islam, if they could liberate themselves from the yoke of Islam, if they would cease to take Muhammad as a role model and if they got rid of the evil Koran, they would be able to achieve great things which would benefit not only them but the entire world.

      As a Dutch, a European and a Western politician, my responsibility is primarily to the Dutch people, to the Europeans and the West. However, since the liberation of the Muslims from Islam, will benefit all of us, I wholeheartedly support Muslims who love freedom. My message to them is clear: “Fatalism is no option; ‘Inch’ Allah’ is a curse; Submission is a disgrace.

      Free yourselves. It is up to you.

      Geert Wilders
      Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
      ---
      "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Geert Wilders

        I agree with some of his points, there is more fatalism among Muslims, than Christians or joos. However, he treats Islam as if it were a monolithic religion. Just as judaism and Christianity have many denominations so does Islam, although we only really hear about shia and sunni. It would be like a Muslim politican attacking all of Christianity because of the views and actions of American evangelicals, who IMHO do not practice real Christianity. Just picture how radically different our Church is in comparison to an American evangelical church.

        Anyway, not sure if you have read up on Sufism, but that is a form of Islam that I think many Westerners can tolerate and even accept.
        For the first time in more than 600 years, Armenia is free and independent, and we are therefore obligated
        to place our national interests ahead of our personal gains or aspirations.



        http://www.armenianhighland.com/main.html

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Geert Wilders

          I watched Fitna, the film he made, years back and while I don't remember much from it, I do remembering finding it filled with propaganda.
          Azerbaboon: 9.000 Google hits and counting!

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Geert Wilders

            Originally posted by Federate View Post
            I watched Fitna, the film he made, years back and while I don't remember much from it, I do remembering finding it filled with propaganda.
            Well, he basically just quoted excerpts from the Qoran and showed clips of some speeches made by Muslim clerics. It was film made to "shock" its audience.

            Let me remind you, this guy is under 24/7 protection, he lives in undisclosed locations, and his family is also kept safe. The number of people who want to kill him is immense, plus the fact that there is a Fatwa against him. I think though one thing that he did well is breaking the "political correctness" wall that so often prevents people from speaking their mind about issues, and thus trying to stick to politically correct sentiments.
            Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
            ---
            "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Geert Wilders

              Originally posted by Mos View Post
              Well, he basically just quoted excerpts from the Qoran and showed clips of some speeches made by Muslim clerics. It was film made to "shock" its audience.

              Let me remind you, this guy is under 24/7 protection, he lives in undisclosed locations, and his family is also kept safe. The number of people who want to kill him is immense, plus the fact that there is a Fatwa against him. I think though one thing that he did well is breaking the "political correctness" wall that so often prevents people from speaking their mind about issues, and thus trying to stick to politically correct sentiments.

              I agree. Whether Geert is an agent or his feelings are genuine, he has reminded the peoples of Western Europe that it is ok to speak your mind, especially if you are not even an elected official. Political correctness is a principle of communism.
              For the first time in more than 600 years, Armenia is free and independent, and we are therefore obligated
              to place our national interests ahead of our personal gains or aspirations.



              http://www.armenianhighland.com/main.html

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Geert Wilders

                Originally posted by Armanen View Post
                I agree. Whether Geert is an agent or his feelings are genuine, he has reminded the peoples of Western Europe that it is ok to speak your mind, especially if you are not even an elected official. Political correctness is a principle of communism.
                and it's a pity that he has to stand in trial for his remarks. Apparently you can be prosecuted if you don't say the "politically correct" thing in Holland.
                Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
                ---
                "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Geert Wilders

                  The netherlands is probably the most decadent nation in Western Europe.
                  For the first time in more than 600 years, Armenia is free and independent, and we are therefore obligated
                  to place our national interests ahead of our personal gains or aspirations.



                  http://www.armenianhighland.com/main.html

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Geert Wilders

                    Interview of Wilders:
                    Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
                    ---
                    "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."

                    Comment

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