notes and comments

[arabaliozian]

Re: elegy

deleting

[arabaliozian]

Re: elegy

My posts were not emotional. In fact, they were clearer then ever and you haven't answered them properly yet.



I was about to say the same to you.

you are right.
i am wrong.
please forgive me.
now then, can we move on?

[arabaliozian]

Re: elegy

He names a long list of Armenian, Western and Persian scholors. Why is it that hard for your ego to recant your own propaganda as you promised? Mr. Nourizadeh is a well-known and serious writer translator and an Iranian intellectual. Do you think he'd be that gullible to put his reputation at risk and reproduce some myth for the Iranian reader on their own History to swallow up? If you pay attention to his rhetoric, you'll certainly notice that it's been written by a non-Armenian, someone who is not trying to add any 'parabanutyun' on the bravery of the Armenain nation...

i know nothing about your Iranian historian.
But i knew the Mekhitarist historian who had no reason to deceive or mislead me. and i am more than willing to rate your historian above mine provided you give me some proof.

[Sako]

Re: elegy

you are right.
i am wrong.
please forgive me.
now then, can we move on?

Sure, I've been wanting to move on for a long time ! The question now is, what direction are you going to be moving in?

[Anoush]

Re: elegy

I only attack when others attack me, J. Bell has been giving plenty of bad talks and bad time to everyone who doesn't think like him for months and the result? He's still here giving us his baloney. You guys must really like him (j/k) !

I also agree.

[Lucin]

Re: elegy

In short, you're using the same tactic that ara is using to find credibility for his own source, namely, the apparent interests (or lack thereof) of the particular scholar publishing their take on historical events. So apparently, the authors of the two sources are more similar than we think because apparently, each side is putting their own ethnicity in a not so boastful light when talking about the Battle of Avarayr. Now, if I'm to take either of your advices concerning your own sources, I become doubtful of, and paradoxically more open to hearing out each source.

Yes, I did so to make him see how he is taking the same path of propaganda he's complaining about and discarding. That's why I said previously: In an objective light, you favour one propaganda over another one and then deliver it to the reader as 'the' truth… so based on your own deductions; can we conclude that you're charlatan too?

Nevertheless there's one side who is closer to 'the' truth based on a more credible, logical evidence provided. The Armenian mkhitarist is totally denying that such a battle ever occurred labelling it as a myth and calling the Mamikonians as Chinese while the Iranian author is speaking in an almost neutral rhetoric mentioning the glorious victory of the Persian army, would we normally see such a rhetoric coming from an Armenian?

i know nothing about your Iranian historian.
But i knew the Mekhitarist historian who had no reason to deceive or mislead me. and i am more than willing to rate your historian above mine provided you give me some proof.

And I know nothing about your Mkhitarist historian. I'm more than willing to rate your Mkhitarist historian above mine provided you give me proof. Quote him properly and say how he proves and comes to such a conclusion? Based on what solid evidence? I suspect you've never bothered to discover that…

[KanadaHye]

Re: elegy

Yes, I did so to make him see how he is taking the same path of propaganda he's complaining about and discarding. That's why I said previously: In an objective light, you favour one propaganda over another one and then deliver it to the reader as 'the' truth… so based on your own deductions; can we conclude that you're charlatan too?

Nevertheless there's one side who is closer to 'the' truth based on a more credible, logical evidence provided. The Armenian mkhitarist is totally denying that such a battle ever occurred labelling it as a myth and calling the Mamikonians as Chinese while the Iranian author is speaking in an almost neutral rhetoric mentioning the glorious victory of the Persian army, would we normally see such a rhetoric coming from an Armenian?



And I know nothing about your Mkhitarist historian. I'm more than willing to rate your Mkhitarist historian above mine provided you give me proof. Quote him properly and say how he proves and comes to such a conclusion? Based on what solid evidence? I suspect you've never bothered to discover that…

In love and war the winner is always right and the loser is always wrong... it doesn't matter who was in the right. The truth is only seen in the view of the 3rd person

[hrai]

Re: elegy

This is partially true. If we had to dismiss everything and every historian as such, then inch kmna?

Lucin, you're very level-headed and very bright

I'm sure you do the same as I do which is to not dismiss anything until you're able to look at alternative perspectives and then use your own judgement on the "evidence" in front of you.

Unfortunately in this situation I doubt that any relevant Persian material will come to light. As you rightly said, why would the King of Kings advertise his victorious battle in a war he lost.

We have to learn to live with these irritations, they come and go, like mosquitos really.....

[Lucin]

Re: elegy

In love and war the winner is always right and the loser is always wrong... it doesn't matter who was in the right.

Who's the winner in love and who's the loser?

The truth is only seen in the view of the 3rd person

This is a dangerous statement and I'm not in agreement with you.

[arabaliozian]

Re: elegy

Tuesday, July 14, 2009
*****************************************
PROJECTIONS & CONJECTURES
************************************************** ****
Armenians bore the hell out of me –
their stiff-necked dogmatism,
their addiction to brag,
their pathological preference for comfortable lies
and their phobia of painful truths;
their endless internecine conflicts,
their deep insecurities which find expression
in loud-mouth (borodakhos) arrogance...
Relax! I am not talking about you, gentle reader.
I am talking about myself when young.
I have no doubt whatever in my mind that,
unlike me, you are a noble specimen of humanity
and butter wouldn't melt in your mouth,
or anywhere else for that matter.
*
A nation that has been lied to consistently
will be inclined to believe only liars.
*
You cannot speak in praise of capitalism
in a communist country and vice versa.
It is a risky business
discussing democracy with fascists;
and nothing can be as hard
as trying to reason with dupes of propaganda.
What could be more subversive
than a lecture on atheism in a cathedral,
or a speech on human rights in an Armenian community center?
*
I don't study history in order to enhance my self-esteem.
I study history to understand my fellow men and myself.
Anyone who studies history for any other purpose
is doomed to understand nothing.
*
Armenianism is an “ism” like any other ism.
It should be carefully analyzed and not adopted as a belief system.
*
More blood has been shed in the name of patriotism
than any other ideology or religion.
If patriotism means loyalty to one's nation
and disloyalty to the rest of mankind,
I want no part of it.
“My country, right or wrong!”
should also stand for “My country, rich or poor,”
and “My country, in peace or war.”
A true patriot living in self-imposed exile is an oxymoron
(with emphasis on the last two syllables);
and a warlike patriot who is unwilling to kill and die
speaks with a forked tongue.
#