Muammar Gaddafi and Libyan crisis

[retro]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

Gaddafi's grip on power and mandate to govern Libya, at this point is very questionable. Since large parts of the country have broken away. Even if Gaddafi's warlords somehow manage to secure the region around Tripoli. Gaddafi is reportedly no longer in control of the countries oil assets.

What is more, Gaddafi's regime no longer has any meaningful international support and the net is closing in politically. Under the basis that the West recognizes Libya's rebel break away democratic government. Then the West can obviously move to further isolate and weaken Gaddafi's centre of power in Tripoli.

The rebels in the East are reported being lead by the former Libyan Justice Minister Mustafa Abdel Jalil and it's my understanding that they aren't Anarcho-Islamists. But rather a Western allied, pro-democratic, rebel faction.

Lockerbie bombing

"Libya's former justice minister has told a Swedish newspaper that Colonel Gaddafi personally ordered the Lockerbie bombing. Mustafa

Abdel-Jalil told Expressen he had proof the Libyan leader was behind the bombing of Pan AM flight 103, which killed 270 people in 1988."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...tland-12552587

[Federate]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

The rebels in the East are reported being lead by the former Libyan Justice Minister Mustafa Abdel Jalil and it's my understanding that they aren't Anarcho-Islamists. But rather a Western allied, pro-democratic, rebel faction.

I don't know what's worse, Anarcho-Islamists or "Western allied, pro-democratic" rebels. What hypocracy that the so-called "Justice" Minister is now leading the fight when for years the man's idea of justice was quashing of dissent and serving Ghazafi.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

Talking about hypocrisy....

CBC News has learned that the Gadhafi regime tried to withdraw a substantial amount of money from several Canadian financial institutions and Harper took steps to ensure that didn't happen, the CBC's Hannah Thibedeau reported.

"There was a concern that if the government didn't act tonight, the money would have been withdrawn by the morning," she said.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/canada-impo...64832-903.html

A good question is posed on this news page about our great transparent "democracies"

So why are the Canadian Banks not held to account when they allow money laundering for Libya.....It seems that as long as he was in power it was ok to take the illegally acquired cash....So much for the 10,000 dollar figure we are so often quoted. Or the know your customer rules.... The real question is how much money is in the Canadian banks and how is it that the Canadian government knows about this money. I thought wrongly I suppose that the govenrment was not in the business of knowing what money is in every single bank account in Canada. So again if the know this information as they appear too, then why did they allow this regime to bank in Canada....I guess it is because the rules only actually apply to some people.....

[retro]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

KanadaHye

Canada isn't Switzerland and Western governments aren't exactly powerless. If they tell the banksters, not to wire money into Libya, then guess what they are going to do. The banksters aren't going risk being fined for breaching international sanctions and the last thing that they want is knock on the door from a team of government auditors.

About £1bn of assets held by Muammer Gaddafi and five members of his family have been frozen by the British government as the UK joins European Union states in taking concerted action against the Libyan leader.

After an announcement on Sunday by George Osborne that he was freezing assets held in Britain by leading members of the Gaddafi family, Treasury officials indicated the £1bn ($1.6bn) ) figure could grow as they investigate the holdings of Libya’s leader and his sons.

The officials have cautioned against guessing the value of the Gaddafi family’s assets in the UK because some are owned by the Libyan Investment Authority, a sovereign wealth fund, rather than the ruling household.

What has happened?

George Osborne, chancellor, has moved to freeze the UK-held assets of Colonel Gaddafi and five members of his family following a UN security council resolution imposing sanctions on the Libyan dictator.

What exactly does that mean?

The compliance officers of all UK banks and financial institutions will receive a notice from the Treasury asking them to carry out due diligence to identify any Gaddafi assets that they hold. Their list of names to check will include people and organisations acting on behalf of the Gaddafi household, which means all Libyan companies or funds are under intense scrutiny.

What if a UK bank chooses not to comply?

They would face hefty fines and criminal charges if Gaddafi money was then traced back to them. It is incumbent on the banks to find this cash if it is there.


Is the search likely to be successful?

Treasury officials appear confident, although it will be a highly complex trawl through the British financial system. As Steven Philippsohn, an asset recovery specialist at City law firm PCB Litigation, says: “This won’t be an account at Barclays in the name M Gaddafi.”

Some estimates suggest the family’s British fortune could exceed £10bn


http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/0b31a390-4...#axzz1FIIPLPAP

[retro]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

I don't know what's worse, Anarcho-Islamists or "Western allied, pro-democratic" rebels. What hypocracy that the so-called "Justice" Minister is now leading the fight when for years the man's idea of justice was quashing of dissent and serving Ghazafi.

Whilst the West loves to peddle it's own brand of (sugar coated poison). Authoritarian government always results in inequity and systemic corruption. A lot of Muslim countries have large, young, repressed, unemployed populations. So it's hardly suprising, that their would some kind of a popular movement, demanding greater accountability and "democratic reforms".

[KanadaHye]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

KanadaHye

Canada isn't Switzerland and Western governments aren't exactly powerless. If they tell the banksters, not to wire money into Libya, then guess what they are going to do. The banksters aren't going risk being fined for breaching international sanctions and the last thing that they want is knock on the door from a team of government auditors.

All these "democratic" countries were doing business with Gaddafi and the bankers were using his money while Gaddafi was keeping the Libyans poor (well, they had enough to live on which is still better off than some people in democratic countries). That's good for bankers and Capitalists since they like large amounts of money to be kept in banks so they can create businesses by lending against these piles of money collected from dictators. So having dictators in power over these resource rich countries isn't the problem. The problem is Gaddafi was getting in the way of achieving some sort of goal that the U.S. and its allies have for that area of the world. I suspect that there is a safe stockpile of oil and that the disruption won't affect the ability of governments to operate or else they wouldn't risk all these North African and Middle Eastern countries to be simultaneously crippled. In the meantime they can put a premium price tag on oil and pass the buck onto us.

[retro]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

KanadaHye

Banksters aren't somehow mysteriously endemic to the West and money has no national loyalties (especially the Banksters).

The Saudis have already ramped up production. However EU nations have 90 day, strategic petroleum reserves and all sort of excisable emergency contacts.

Whilst Gaddafi was never going to cowardly bolt for the door like Ben Ali did in Tunisia. His pride is costing Libya very dear indeed and lets face, by going nuts; he's has largely brought this situation upon himself.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

That's true, however the West encourages indebtedness where people in the East are rather thrifty or cheap or whatever you want to call it. The Chinese and Indians don't know what the word debt means until they settle in Western countries.

The age trends are opposite... where the baby boomers are nearing retirement in North America and the average age is rather old, the average age in Muslim countries is in the mid 20's. So it only makes sense for corporations wanting to exploit this trend, however I don't think the education level in countries like Libya are up to par. It's not like India where people are highly educated. You can't just take the work that was being done by foreigners in Libya and hand it over to Libyans.

[Armanen]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

That's true, however the West encourages indebtedness where people in the East are rather thrifty or cheap or whatever you want to call it. The Chinese and Indians don't know what the word debt means until they settle in Western countries.

The age trends are opposite... where the baby boomers are nearing retirement in North America and the average age is rather old, the average age in Muslim countries is in the mid 20's. So it only makes sense for corporations wanting to exploit this trend, however I don't think the education level in countries like Libya are up to par. It's not like India where people are highly educated. You can't just take the work that was being done by foreigners in Libya and hand it over to Libyans.

India has over a billion people, majority are poor and uneducated. But I get your point nonetheless.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Two Libyan fighter pilots defect, fly to Malta

India has over a billion people, majority are poor and uneducated. But I get your point nonetheless.

Even if only 30-40% of India is educated, that's still more people than all of North America. Even if only 30% of India is able to afford a car, that's still a larger market than all of North America so the possibilities of profit for corporations is huge.

Libya is a giant wasteland with oil fields with a small population and there isn't a huge prospect for agriculture. I'm sure there are some other mining and mineral deposits which can be exploited with the proper investment but unless there is an import of brains, it's not going to be the flourishing metropolis that the west sells to the Libyans.