Murder of Vahe Avetyan

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Concerning Israel:
This state is all but friendly to us.
They commit war crimes, genocides, etc... no matter.
They arm our enemies, deny the Genocide, etc...
It's not a moral judgment I am stating.
But as a small state submerged by enemies, with an existential threat, and nation/state/religion discrepencies, of course they are comparable to us.
We would only gain, by trying to achieve what they did... (once again, forget about moral here)

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Vrej everything you talk about happens in America only on a much larger scale with far worst consequesnces. The bar fight - Iraq war the thuggs-Rummsfeld, cheyney, wolfowitz..... the thug boss-Bush the victims-hundreds of thousends ofdead people, many hundrsds of thousends wounded people, loss of infastructure... I think you get my point by now. Btw did u know that Obama can order hits now on anyone for any reason at anytime in any country without even consulting anyone. This guy makes Nemts Rubo look like a sexually abused quire boy. People often loose sight of the big picture when watching the news.

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Vrej everything you talk about happens in America only on a much larger scale with far worst consequesnces. The bar fight - Iraq war the thuggs-Rummsfeld, cheyney, wolfowitz..... the thug boss-Bush the victims-hundreds of thousends ofdead people, many hundrsds of thousends wounded people, loss of infastructure... I think you get my point by now. Btw did u know that Obama can order hits now on anyone for any reason at anytime in any country without even consulting anyone. This guy makes Nemts Rubo look like a sexually abused quire boy. People often loose sight of the big picture when watching the news.

No Haykakan,
If Obama has the right to wrap up a city like Damascus or Moscow without asking anything to anybody, this has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Can Obama kill a guy, a US citizen, before cameras, in the middle of DC, without critics? While NBC broadcasts the news???

If Serjik had the right to bomb Baku or Ankara, or a town called Kuala Lumpur (no harms to guys living there, never been there ), without consulting anybody, I would say, it would be bad for us, as a state, since in my opinion this is disfunction of a state, but yet, even if he would have killed 2000 guys there, it would be much an other story, and I would not cry fool on it...
Do you see the difference?
If tomorrow, God forbid, we loose hundred of lives in a miscalculated, or interest guided foreign policy or military campain, you would be right, but as far as I know, the nephew of Rumspheld did not mob killed an innocent in the middle of town, filmed and reported, and yet UNPUNISHED... do you see the difference??

Of course there is mafia, there are robberies, killings, drug addicts, family murders, dishonesty, prostitutes, etc... in Armenia, just as there are in any country. But this kind of Impunity due to blatant merger between ill-educated mobsters and state apparatus is not that common as you say.
Anyway, even if it was far worst elsewhere, we as a Nation do not need, nor can afford it.

Not talking about will only perpetuate the phenomenon.

Serjik will never act willingly, since he is part of the same system, same mobster culture. (I do not need to mention his behavior for decades now..)

He will only, if he feels the heet...., and not talking about is not the way to do it.
Everybody in Yerevan, people who hate Levon and HHSh, are astonished and shocked.
The middle class officer corps is humiliated (this is not the reason that must distinguish this case, still it counts).

Justice must be forced, for us, as Nation, as part of the state-building, etc... moral, etc... but more so (and hence the link to this topic), because morale of the officers is an essential part of our army's combat readiness.
The act of the officer threatening to blow up that mobster nest called Sbantakar, is a sign that tells a lot, to anybody willing to see the reality, and not thru rose glasses....

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I know it is hard to believe but yes Obama now has the right to kill anyone anywhere and this does mean killing US citizens in the middle of DC (or anywhere else) with everyone watching. As a matter of fact he has already assassinated a few US citizens and some teenage girls are on his hitlist to and yeh they are US citizens as well. It all started with the patiot act and has evolved into some neonazi executive privilage making Obama judge jury and executioner. Democracynow.com has a good segment about how a young judge tried to stand up to this by declaring the patriot act unconstitutional but she was being pressured heavily by the administration to change her mind and you sure as hell didnt hear about this stuff on CNN. I am not saying what goes on in Hayastan or America is ok but when you start comparing USA and Irael to Armenia you are infact comparing the godfather to one of the little rescals. Sure the gangster lifestyle is bad and needs to be condemed and changed but under the kind of government system we and many others have it will simply evolve into a more sophisticated and much deadlier form like the ones in the USA and Israel. I agree that this is off topic and these posts should be moved to another section.

No Haykakan,
If Obama has the right to wrap up a city like Damascus or Moscow without asking anything to anybody, this has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Can Obama kill a guy, a US citizen, before cameras, in the middle of DC, without critics? While NBC broadcasts the news???

If Serjik had the right to bomb Baku or Ankara, or a town called Kuala Lumpur (no harms to guys living there, never been there ), without consulting anybody, I would say, it would be bad for us, as a state, since in my opinion this is disfunction of a state, but yet, even if he would have killed 2000 guys there, it would be much an other story, and I would not cry fool on it...
Do you see the difference?
If tomorrow, God forbid, we loose hundred of lives in a miscalculated, or interest guided foreign policy or military campain, you would be right, but as far as I know, the nephew of Rumspheld did not mob killed an innocent in the middle of town, filmed and reported, and yet UNPUNISHED... do you see the difference??

Of course there is mafia, there are robberies, killings, drug addicts, family murders, dishonesty, prostitutes, etc... in Armenia, just as there are in any country. But this kind of Impunity due to blatant merger between ill-educated mobsters and state apparatus is not that common as you say.
Anyway, even if it was far worst elsewhere, we as a Nation do not need, nor can afford it.

Not talking about will only perpetuate the phenomenon.

Serjik will never act willingly, since he is part of the same system, same mobster culture. (I do not need to mention his behavior for decades now..)

He will only, if he feels the heet...., and not talking about is not the way to do it.
Everybody in Yerevan, people who hate Levon and HHSh, are astonished and shocked.
The middle class officer corps is humiliated (this is not the reason that must distinguish this case, still it counts).

Justice must be forced, for us, as Nation, as part of the state-building, etc... moral, etc... but more so (and hence the link to this topic), because morale of the officers is an essential part of our army's combat readiness.
The act of the officer threatening to blow up that mobster nest called Sbantakar, is a sign that tells a lot, to anybody willing to see the reality, and not thru rose glasses....

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I know it is hard to believe but yes Obama now has the right to kill anyone anywhere and this does mean killing US citizens in the middle of DC (or anywhere else) with everyone watching. As a matter of fact he has already assassinated a few US citizens and some teenage girls are on his hitlist to and yeh they are US citizens as well. It all started with the patiot act and has evolved into some neonazi executive privilage making Obama judge jury and executioner. Democracynow.com has a good segment about how a young judge tried to stand up to this by declaring the patriot act unconstitutional but she was being pressured heavily by the administration to change her mind and you sure as hell didnt hear about this stuff on CNN. I am not saying what goes on in Hayastan or America is ok but when you start comparing USA and Irael to Armenia you are infact comparing the godfather to one of the little rescals. Sure the gangster lifestyle is bad and needs to be condemed and changed but under the kind of government system we and many others have it will simply evolve into a more sophisticated and much deadlier form like the ones in the USA and Israel. I agree that this is off topic and these posts should be moved to another section.

I do not live in the US, and have no idea who Obama killed or raped?? But never heard of.
What I do know, is that a US president was nearly toppled because Monica ate his cigar, an other was toppled because he listened by tape recorders what the opposition was doing, etc... (In yerevan, these are considered 'good points'!)

I know that in Israel, they tried their president because he 'raped' or harassed a secretary... (imagine, in Armenia no one would stay in office )
On these days, all Israeli nation was in shock, and mobilised, because 2 guys (french israelis), killed by a car accident a young girl, and then fled to France. (In Armenia, they do not have to hide, the jeep owner may even ask compensation for the bumper that was damaged...)
They as a Nation stood together, and forced France to try those 2...
Because even one life of an Israeli is sacred to them.

In a countries like the UK , a minister was toppled, because he misbehaved in civil life, with crimes no body would have noticed in Yerevan.
In Germany a minister was fired, because he received a loan free of charge, a 'gift' of less than 100000 �...
In Sweden a president or PM was fired, because she used his job Credit Card to buy a pair of shoo....

Now, of course I do not compare all these well established and functioning states with us.
I do not ask to fire the President, because he gambles a couple of Million dollars in a Monaco Casino, and leaves as guaranty the president of the National Assembly etc... all these are normal for 'us'...

But yet, there are limits that should and will be respected.
An Armenian's life is the most sacred thing, and must be accepted as such.
The people will force the regime to accept this, if not, it will be the regime's fault, if ever there will be a revolt.

The guys protesting today are not the usual HHSh people.
Most are the best, resilient citizens, who would go to defend the bordes, much before mobilisation is declared.
As an officer, Vahe's murder is a blatant insult to the honor of the army.
The IMPUNITY that seems to be applied once again (since Nemetz the Turk seems to go with Serjik to Kiyev, for the finals of Eurofoot, wich in no way concerns us...), will end up badly for everyone.

Of course the HHsh, and the other scum will try to exploit the occasion.
Why not? They make a fuss of nothing, so when there is a real ground to revolt, of course they will jump on.

But who's fault is it?
I think it is the regime's fault.
Serjik must once in his life behave as a President, jail at least for 15 years all the bustards having participated to the gang murder (and not let them out a couple of years later, with a tiket to Dubai, where they will live in luxury hotels, and work as pimps, supervising Nemets the Turk's "buisness"), and at least kik out Nemets the Turk from his party, parliament, and why not, jail him a couple of years, for trafic of influence...

Once an example would be made, a lot of things would come to their place....

If not, I can not blame the officers willing to bomb the Hnatzakar in Yerevan and Sevan....
And if the regime does not punish Nemets, then it should not blame the public for what it will have to face..

[Mos]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Concerning Israel:
This state is all but friendly to us.

Not true. They sold over a billion dollars worth of weapons to Azerbaijan, cooperate with Azeri Intelligence, and in all are hand in hand with Azerbaijan in many sectors. Israel is a very much hostile country to us, our much better and closer friend is Iran

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Not true. They sold over a billion dollars worth of weapons to Azerbaijan, cooperate with Azeri Intelligence, and in all are hand in hand with Azerbaijan in many sectors. Israel is a very much hostile country to us, our much better and closer friend is Iran

Mos,
Did I say the contrary?

[Mos]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Mos,
Did I say the contrary?

Sorry aper, I misread your sentence.

[Vrej1915]

Re: Murder of Vahe Avetyan

Guys, let me put something clear once for all.
Taking example, or being inspired by an other states model, in no way does mean, that I have sympathy, or preach good relations with it.
From purely selfish, state interests point of view, I want the best examples applied elsewhere for my people, for my state.
If there were good examples, working well in Turkey, I would definitely wish to copy those models, or adapt them to us....
Would that mean i am pro-Turkish???

Come on!
Stop reacting epidermically each time you hear the name of a state you dislike, love or hate...


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Just for info, to avoid receiving personal messages of protest or questioning....
Apart from mine, there is only one country on earth that I love (love is by definition a non rational feeling, not based on interest or rational calculations): it is Italy.
And there is only one country that I hate. No need to mention... Because we are a rare case, where the existence of one is synonimous to the end of the other..., there is not enough space under the blue earth, in Asia Minor....
I do not even hate 'azarbaitchan', since i do not consider it to be a long term, lasting phenomenon...

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Sorry aper, I misread your sentence.

No harm