Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Chubs]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Armenian Army

Damn, those Shilkas look a bit outdated. I wonder if Russia has a modernization program for Shilkas...We could use it


Check out this chart: http://atlas.media.mit.edu/explore/t...all/show/2012/

At the very bottom right, you can see an olive rectangle. Thats Armenia's weapons exports.
http://atlas.media.mit.edu/explore/t...rus/show/2012/ Here, you can see the aviation sector's exports to Russia are valued at almost 20 million dollars. What are we exporting to them? Drones?


Here is Azerbaijan's exports...It would be a shame if some of their pipelines were destroyed

http://atlas.media.mit.edu/explore/tree_map/hs/export/aze/all/show/2012/

If Azerbaijans military spending is inflated, I think we might know where most of the countries money is going...Its all going up Aliyev's nose

[Spetsnaz]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Azerbaijan says will face Russian soldiers in Karabakh in case of war
Ali Hasanov, Azerbaijan's deputy prime minister.
March 01, 2013, Friday/ 16:41:00

The Azerbaijani government has stated that if Baku chooses to settle the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict via wide-scale military operations, it will face Russian soldiers rather than Armenian, its neighboring country which currently controls occupied Azerbaijani territories.

“President Ilham Aliyev has always promised a military solution to the [Nagorno-Karabakh] conflict and he still has the issue on the agenda. The option of a military solution is always on the table, but the most important thing is how this kind of operation will be carried out. We need to become much stronger so that if we become involved in combat in Nagorno-Karabakh we can stand up to Russian troops, because that is who we will have to face. Did Armenia occupy our territories? Do you think Armenia's power is sufficient for that?” asked Ali Hasanov, Azerbaijan's deputy prime minister, in a press conference held with a group of Turkish reporters in the capital city of Baku.

Recalling his home city, which is also in the occupied territories of Azerbaijan, Hasanov said the occupation was accomplished with the military support of Russia. “I saw Russian soldiers get out of tanks and celebrate their victory with champagne.”

Russia is considered the dominant power in the region, seeking to preserve its influence over its former republics and, in particular, the South Caucasus. Since the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russia has attempted to manipulate the region through protracted conflicts, including Nagorno-Karabakh, a territorial conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenia that still remains unsettled.

Azerbaijan lost 20 percent of its territories as a result of the bloody war over Nagorno-Karabakh in the early 1990s, prompting Turkey to close its border with neighboring Armenia in a sign of solidarity with its ally Azerbaijan. Turkey's isolation of Armenia has subsequently pushed Armenia toward Russia.

Moscow and Yerevan signed a mutual security agreement and Russia is known to be backing Armenia militarily, as its only ally in the region.

While Azerbaijan is developing in economic terms and translating its economic might into military muscle, Russia continues to pursue its policy of domination over Armenia through its notorious economic leverage.

According to diplomatic sources, following the government change in Georgia, a neighboring country that also acts as a buffer zone between Armenia and Russia and as a transit country to deliver Caspian energy resources to Europe, Baku became concerned, as newly elected Georgian Prime Minister Bidzina Ivanishvili is reported to be closer to Russia rather than the Western powers President Mikhail Saakashvili is known to be close to.

Moreover, Baku is very concerned about Iran's position in the region, as Tehran is easing the blockade of Armenia by lending a helping hand to Yerevan. Azerbaijan keeps Armenia out of regional projects as part of its policy to keep Yerevan under economic blockade in a bid to push its adversary abandon its intransigent position over the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict.

“If Tehran breaks its ties with Armenia, Yerevan will die of hunger,” Hasanov said to Today's Zaman.

Commenting on the Turkish-Armenian rapprochement process that is currently deadlocked, Hasanov expressed Baku's pleasure with the Turkish position in the region. Noting Turkish support for Azerbaijan, especially in the solution of the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, Hasanov recalled the speech of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan in which he said Turkey will never open its borders with Armenia until the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict is settled.

According to Ferhad Memmedov, chief of Baku-based Center for Strategic Research (SAM) under the office of the Azerbaijani president, Turkey is not expected put the idea of opening its borders with Armenia into play in a bid to defuse the pressure of Armenians across the world as they plan to mark the 100th anniversary of the 1915 mass killings in two years.

Memmedov argues that opening the borders with Armenia will not push the strong Armenian lobby to abandon their cause seeking recognition of the so-called genocide and instead will bury the chance for Armenians to make any concessions in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict.

While Baku is not optimistic for the peace talks held under the auspices of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) Minsk Group between Armenia and Azerbaijan for nearly two decades, neither does it want to abandon the negotiations.

Hasanov complained about the structure of the Minsk Group, which he said has not functioned properly for 20 years. According to Hasanov, a change in the format used by the mediators could keep the conflicting sides busy for another 20 years, similar to the Palestinian and Kashmir problems.

Hasanov said it is impossible to include any of the Turkic republics among the three co-chairs of the 15-member Minsk Group since decisions in the mediating group are taken based on consensus. He also criticized the fact that no Muslim nation is co-chairing the group and that all of them are Christian nations. “On the one hand, we are criticizing the Minsk Group, but on the other hand, we don't leave it,” Hasanov added.

Hasanov believes the US holds the key to the solution of the Nagorno-Karabakh: “If the US wants to find the solution to this problem, it should sit down with Russia and solve it. If it cannot do it, then it should take Armenia out of Russia's orbit.”

Hasanov claimed that Washington does not want to damage ties with Russia and won't do what it has done in Georgia. He was referring to steadfast US support for Georgia during the 2008 war with Russia.

Criticizing the international community for remaining silent on Armenia, Hasanov said Armenia, occupying 20 percent of Azerbaijani territory, also has territorial claims in Georgia and Turkey.

Hasanov claimed that Armenians are training terror groups and dispatching them to conflict zones in occupied territories, adding that they are also growing and selling drugs. “The entire international community is aware of this fact.”

http://www.todayszaman.com/news-308523-azerbaijan-says-will-face-russian-soldiers-in-karabakh-in-case-of-war.html

[Spetsnaz]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Armenian Military Simulates Attack On Azerbaijan's Oil
October 17, 2012 - 4:35pm, by Joshua Kucera


Armenia is capable of attacking Azerbaijan's oil facilities in case of a war, and that it just finished military exercises practicing that scenario. a top Armenian general has said, speaking to a press conference at the conclusion of the exercises:

“We simulated strikes against both army units and military facilities of the probable enemy and … economic facilities that influence, in one way or another, the military capacity of its armed forces,” said Major-General Artak Davtian, head of the operational department at the Armenian army’s General Staff.

“There would be no strikes on the civilian population, we are not planning or playing out such a war scenario,” he told journalists. “We do not plan any strikes on cities. Our targets are military and economic facilities that are essential to a particular state.”

“In particular, I can stress that we modeled several strikes on oil and gas infrastructures, energy carriers that would affect the economy,” Davtian added in a clear reference to oil-rich Azerbaijan.

The exercises took place from October 1-13. According to Radio Azatutyun:

The two-week “strategic” exercises, which drew to a close at the weekend, took place in undisclosed locations in Armenia and Nagorno-Karabakh in a mostly “command-and-staff” format. According to the Armenian military, they involved over 40,000 troops and thousands of pieces of military hardware. The participating personnel included a record-high number of army reservists.

Azerbaijan, naturally, responded quickly. Spokesman for Azerbaijan’s Defense Ministry, Colonel Eldar Sabiroglu:

"Firstly, Azerbaijan’s oil and gas fields are being used jointly with the biggest states and companies. Secondly, Azerbaijan is able to protect its oil and gas fields, all measures needed for missile defense are in the focus of attention.

The enemy should understand that the new missile systems of Azerbaijani Armed Forces can strike any strategic facility of Armenia. Azerbaijan’s development, achievements and increase of defense expenditures have pushed Armenia into desperate situation. Therefore, making such statement, they are trying to reduce the protests of the Armenian people. This is the main aim of the threat."

Davtyan was apparently referring to new missiles unveiled by Armenia last year, upgraded Scuds and Tochka U, which have a range of 300 km, in theory covering much of Azerbaijan.

So they could attack Azerbaijan's oil infrastructure -- but would they? Analysts in Baku tend to downplay the prospect of Armenia's widening a potential war over the disputed province of Nagorno Karabakh to include Azerbaijan proper. I asked Anar Valiyev, a good Azerbaijan analyst, about these most recent statements, and he chalked them up to domestic political posturing. He said that after the opening of the airport in Stepanakaert/Khankendi are both examples of this.

Still, Armenia would have less to lose than Azerbaijan by widening the war, so it wouldn't be surprising.

In related news, the newsletter IMINT and Analysis, which uses open-source satellite imagery to analyze air defense systems and other military developments around the world, notes in its newest edition that Armenia has in the last two years deployed more advanced S-300 air defense systems to within seven kilometers of the de facto border between Armenia and Karabakh. That will allow the systems to cover Karabakh, the newsletter (subscription only) writes:

Deployment of the mobile S-300PS batteries in Syunik province places the entire Nagorno-Karabakh region under the protection of Armenia’s air defense network. Furthermore, the S-300PS enjoys mobility that the S-300PT does not, enabling rapid relocation when required. As such, either S-300PS complex represents a possible occupant for the S-300P complex constructed near Stepanakert in Nagorno-Karabakh, supplementing or replacing extant 2K11 or S-125 batteries in the region. The siting of the S-300PS batteries permits target track assignment from either the Yerevan-based 64N6 battle management radar or a Nagorno- Karabakh-based 36D6 EW radar. Furthermore, the current siting of the S-300PS batteries closes a pre-existing air defense gap, allowing Armenia to deny air travel into the Azeri province of Nakhchivan.

Is that enough to tip the balance of forces into Armenia's favor? We'll probably only find out if the worst comes to pass there.

http://www.eurasianet.org/node/66061

[Federate]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Armenian Army

[gokorik]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Agreed, goggles are important, but Id see that as a secondary priority. As not all AOs are going to be filled with dust and debris...What I think we will be seeing ,especially in a renewed war..is volunteer battalions. Similar to the Ukrainian ones...just not filled with nutty fascists...Perhaps we could be seeing a Dashnak battalion, or something along those lines.
Knee pads are pretty cheap, even American ones. 20-25 dollars a pair. Even cheaper if bought from Russia or China. Around 100 thousand pairs of the aforementioned price would only cost about 2.5 million dollars. That could be included in the maintenance sub-budget for the military. Helmets are extremely important as well..We are already seeing more and more Russian helmets with regular units. I dont think Ive seen a soviet era tin pot on an Armenian soldier for a while now...Looks like Russo-Georgian war era helmets we seem to be getting, but I cant properly ID em. Our own helmets? Who knows. I also heard about a proposal made to the government, that suggests the investment in and the creation of a military manufacturing sector. IT would create tons of jobs, new service rifles, equipment, uniforms. We would become less dependent on free Russian-Soviet stuff. Can't seem to remember where I saw it..

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?...tary+knee+pads
Here a link to a wholesale site. I know Chinese goods have a reputation for being junk but they have gotten their act together in the last five to ten years, and given the simplicity in manufacturing kneepads I'm sure a decent supplier is out there. The pricing might be confusing, but the number on the right is for buying the minimum required amount. The number on the left is for buying the maximum they can produce in a month, I think. It shouldn't be more than $200,000 for 50,000 pairs($4 each on an order of 50,000). The only issue would be not knowing how many to get in which sizes.

I'd have to have to disagree with you on the goggles thing but lets just agree to disagree...

I hope Armenia starts producing as much as is physically and financially possible. The issue is usually money. With enough money all the equipment, tooling and education needed can be acquired to produce complex products and systems. There just isn't enough money available for everything the military should have. They have the necessities to fight but not the extras that might make the difference between life or death or being comfortable or uncomfortable.

[HyeFighter2]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

The number 12 is what is declared by the government. We all know what the government declares is probably the exact opposite of the truth in regards to quantity of military equipment, but I am speculating. Again what I'm saying about the t-55's is a speculation but I really doubt we throw anything useful away and I've seen many videos during the war of T-55's. A lot of them.

About the T-80. This post is three years old.



The T-80 in the picture is a BV variant. Also the list of arms shipped from Moldova to us a year ago showed the 9M112 Kobra on it. Unless were operating T-64's as well why would we buy it.
The International Institute for Strategic Studies report for 2010 mentions Armenia possessing 20 T-80's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Army
Scroll down to the vehicle list.

where u read about Kobra? Moldova has no T80 or T64 so they cant have that 9m112

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Army chief discusses Armenian-Greek military collaboration

12:33, 04.09.2014
Region: World News, Armenia
Theme: Politics



Chief of the Armenian Armed Forces General Staff, Colonel General Yuri Khachaturov, paid an official visit to Greece, from Monday to Wednesday.

Within the framework of his trip, Khachaturov met separately with General Mikhail Kostarakos, Chief of the Hellenic National Defence General Staff, and Ms. Fofi Gennimata, Alternet Minister of National Defence of Greece.

The interlocutors discussed bilateral military cooperation and regional security issues, and gave a high assessment to the present-day level and development dynamics of Armenian-Greek military collaboration.

Along the lines of his stay, Colonel General Yuri Khachaturov also visited the infantry school of the Hellenic Land Forces, and laid a wreath to the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.

Armenia News - NEWS.am

http://news.am/eng/news/227129.html

[burjuin]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Armenian Army

[Chubs]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?...tary+knee+pads
Here a link to a wholesale site. I know Chinese goods have a reputation for being junk but they have gotten their act together in the last five to ten years, and given the simplicity in manufacturing kneepads I'm sure a decent supplier is out there. The pricing might be confusing, but the number on the right is for buying the minimum required amount. The number on the left is for buying the maximum they can produce in a month, I think. It shouldn't be more than $200,000 for 50,000 pairs($4 each on an order of 50,000). The only issue would be not knowing how many to get in which sizes.

I'd have to have to disagree with you on the goggles thing but lets just agree to disagree...

I hope Armenia starts producing as much as is physically and financially possible. The issue is usually money. With enough money all the equipment, tooling and education needed can be acquired to produce complex products and systems. There just isn't enough money available for everything the military should have. They have the necessities to fight but not the extras that might make the difference between life or death or being comfortable or uncomfortable.

Thats dirt cheap, holy crap. And we also have to remember some guys might only wear one, for the knee that they tend to rest on...More for reserve That is insanely cheap. You can buy them in bulk and then forget about it
It seems as if the soldiers are wearing one of three helmest. Ssh-60, 6B26/6b7, or the Ssh-68, I would personally like to see the Soviet helmets abolished, and we are seeing that. More and more troops are wearing Russian and NATO (PASGT) helmets. Based off the parades, I know Armenia has bought Russian helmets in bulk...but we are yet to see them in full use on the line of contact. Hey, perhaps it might save a soldiers life in the next incursion attempt?