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10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

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  • #11
    Let Us Unite & Defeat The Unfair Protocol

    If the Armenian-Turkish Protocols (in their current format) are signed by Tuesday, October 13, 2009, it would forever alter the course of the Armenian history. It would forever be a day of defeat and misery. This is THE TEST of the Armenian people... However we phrase it, internal mistakes are curable, but fiascos in international politics are permanent. -Aroutin Hartounian

    At 5:00 pm, on Sunday, September 27, 2009 join Unified Young Armenians, Armenian Revolutionary Federation, Social Democrat Hunchakian Party, and Armenian Democrat Liberal Ramgavar Party in protesting the proposed Armenian-Turkish Protocols. Let's make sure our children don't remember October 13, 2009 as the Black Tuesday of the Armenian Nation's history!!!

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    • #12
      Re: Let Us Unite & Defeat The Unfair Protocol

      Oh hell i can double post to then

      Thats just silly how could it possibly alter the course of history? We do not possess western Armenia and we will not possess it anytime soon so what would be so black about it? The permanent part really makes me laughf, the german russian allience in the begining of WW2 was permanent right? I mean it was a paper that was sighned and everything right? The serves treaty is permanent right? Like a bunch of important people got togather and like wrote something right? It is the strong who determine what document is valid and which is not, the documents themselves have no power unless they are enforced by the strong. Armenia will not get nor should it expect justice untill it is strong enoughf to get it itself. Open borders will strengthen Armenia which is what we should be worried about instead of stupid documents which have no effect on anything anyways. The only black part of history these people will be reading about later is how they took a rare oppertunity to do something good for Armenia and trashed it along with our nations and peoples future. The protocals can be changed and fine tuned before sighning so what you see now may not be exactly what you get but seriously people when do you honestly think Armenia will be able to end its isolation if it does not take advantage of this rare oppertunity which mentions absolutely nothing about kharabagh!
      Hayastan or Bust.

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      • #13
        Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols



        How ridiculous would it be to strengthen Armenia through the establishment of friendly relations with Turkey, with that strength being later used against our newfound "friends".

        It is true that we do not possess Western Armenia for the moment, but you should know that it is our historical right. When Armenia accepts these bogus protocols (and it seems it will) which as you know include the recognition of the borders and the establishment of a commission "examining historical issues" as the protocols put it, we are simply putting aside all the centuries of struggles that we've had against Turkey. We are literally giving up. What is the point of having an organized diaspora with schools, community centers, and so on if this is how it's going to end?

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        • #14
          Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

          Originally posted by Davo88 View Post


          How ridiculous would it be to strengthen Armenia through the establishment of friendly relations with Turkey, with that strength being later used against our newfound "friends".

          It is true that we do not possess Western Armenia for the moment, but you should know that it is our historical right. When Armenia accepts these bogus protocols (and it seems it will) which as you know include the recognition of the borders and the establishment of a commission "examining historical issues" as the protocols put it, we are simply putting aside all the centuries of struggles that we've had against Turkey. We are literally giving up. What is the point of having an organized diaspora with schools, community centers, and so on if this is how it's going to end?
          My friend asked me, “Do you know the translation of the word; protocol”?. I said, “արձանագրություն”. No, he answered, it’s a ղազագիր:

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          • #15
            Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

            All this started with the first football match.
            When the Turks demanded to put out the eternal flame at tsisternakspert and removal of the Ararat sign from the players uniforms.

            The Turks were testing the temperature of the water.
            Our "politicians" did not see anything in it despite the protestations from the public.

            Again our leadership keep telling us there is nothing sinister in the protocol despite the public protestations.

            Makes you sick.
            Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
            Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
            Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

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            • #16
              Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

              Originally posted by Davo88 View Post


              How ridiculous would it be to strengthen Armenia through the establishment of friendly relations with Turkey, with that strength being later used against our newfound "friends".

              It is true that we do not possess Western Armenia for the moment, but you should know that it is our historical right. When Armenia accepts these bogus protocols (and it seems it will) which as you know include the recognition of the borders and the establishment of a commission "examining historical issues" as the protocols put it, we are simply putting aside all the centuries of struggles that we've had against Turkey. We are literally giving up. What is the point of having an organized diaspora with schools, community centers, and so on if this is how it's going to end?
              Depressing isn't it.
              "Nobody can give you freedom. Nobody can give you equality or justice or anything. If you're a man, you take it." ~Malcolm X

              Comment


              • #17
                Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

                Originally posted by Davo88 View Post


                How ridiculous would it be to strengthen Armenia through the establishment of friendly relations with Turkey, with that strength being later used against our newfound "friends".

                It is true that we do not possess Western Armenia for the moment, but you should know that it is our historical right. When Armenia accepts these bogus protocols (and it seems it will) which as you know include the recognition of the borders and the establishment of a commission "examining historical issues" as the protocols put it, we are simply putting aside all the centuries of struggles that we've had against Turkey. We are literally giving up. What is the point of having an organized diaspora with schools, community centers, and so on if this is how it's going to end?
                Lets see what centuries of struggle have gotten us um-uh-hmm...Historic rights are meaningless if there is no power to back them up no matter how valid the these rights may be. Our goal must be to strengthen Hayastan by any means neccesery because it is the only guerenteer of the future of our people. The point of a organised diaspora is to maintain the armenian heritage and culture and to help Armenia by building a personal relationship with her. Nothing is "going to end". This doom and gloom attitude is very short sighted and uncalled for. The opening of borders not only strengthens Armenia economically and ends its isolation but also leads to the resolution of the kharabagh issue in our favor without more blood being spilled. Armenia gives up nothing at all in this deal and gains peace, economic progress, kharabagh and open borders. Many people here are like parrots repeating the same thing over and over again without thinking about what it means. Sure no preconditions would be better but Armenia cannot afford to make this a deal killer, it needs open borders to grow.
                Hayastan or Bust.

                Comment


                • #18
                  Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

                  Originally posted by Haykakan View Post

                  Many people here are like parrots repeating the same thing over and over again without thinking about what it means.
                  When I read your post thats exactly what I thought.

                  You are full of sh..t.
                  Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
                  Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
                  Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

                  Comment


                  • #19
                    Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

                    Haykakan,

                    Historic rights are indeed meaningless if you are willing to give them up so easily. Anyway, this sort of bogus pragmatism won’t get us very far as a nation. It is a shame that our leaders share your opinion. If you think that through the protocols Karabagh will be recognized you are mistaken, it is wishful thinking. Unfortunately, there is nothing pro-Armenian about the current protocols (unless they agree to a more favourable version). Whether you like it or not, through the protocols, Turkey and the West are effectively solving the centuries long “Armenian problem” for good.

                    I don’t know if you’ve watched these, but you should take a look.

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc8v_o5Bxuw (Part 1)
                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElIx0BaZdvs (Part 2)

                    Comment


                    • #20
                      Re: 10 Major Concerns Regarding Armenia-Turkey Protocols

                      Originally posted by Davo88 View Post
                      Haykakan,

                      Historic rights are indeed meaningless if you are willing to give them up so easily. Anyway, this sort of bogus pragmatism won’t get us very far as a nation. It is a shame that our leaders share your opinion. If you think that through the protocols Karabagh will be recognized you are mistaken, it is wishful thinking. Unfortunately, there is nothing pro-Armenian about the current protocols (unless they agree to a more favourable version). Whether you like it or not, through the protocols, Turkey and the West are effectively solving the centuries long “Armenian problem” for good.

                      I don’t know if you’ve watched these, but you should take a look.

                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc8v_o5Bxuw (Part 1)
                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElIx0BaZdvs (Part 2)

                      Give them up so easily you say? It has been a century and instead of the mighty rightious diaspora along with its awsome powers delivering justice to the armenian people we are having to accept unfair protocals just so the country can survive. You keep forgetting that this and most other major decisions are not made by Armenia but by the big powers interested in the region. No rational leader would ignore their wishes because this would lead to suicide for the country. If Russia and America are telling you open the border or else then what the hell do you expect the armenian leader to do exactly? These powers don't care about us getting justice yet many here think genocide recognition by one will bring us salvation or something. It is time for the diaspora to reevaluate its priorities because its tactics have failed miserably and along with the goals they all need to be changed for the good of the armenian people and nation.
                      Hayastan or Bust.

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