EU-Armenia Relations

[lampron]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

The reason all those nations didn't recognise the elections, including Russian and Iran, is because they don't recognise Karabakh and if they did recognise them that would in turn be recognising Karabakh's government which could be interpreted as very easily as recognising its independence. Which no country is going to do, unless status quo changes somehow.
.

Right. Let's talk about the EUs position.
The EU enthusiastically welcomes elections in Northern Cyprus but apparently they don't plan to recognize it as a separate state

France out of all the EU nations is probably the most pro-Armenian, given our histories which date back to Cilicia, but also to the fact that they have been very forefront in recognising the Armenian Genocide and other Armenian issues.

huh?? by sending aid to nakhichevan but not to karabakh?

I understand you already knew Azerbaijan's President, Heydar Aliyev, before coming here as Ambassador.

A few years ago, when President Aliyev was Head of Parliament for the Autonomous Republic of Nakhchivan, I was involved in helping bring humanitarian aid to the region after the railroad links between mainland Azerbaijan and Nakhchivan were destroyed.

http://azer.com/aiweb/categories/magazine/23_folder/23_articles/23_frenchamb.html

Genocide issue is useful to oppose Turkey's entry to the EU.
What use is genocide recognition without supporting compensation?

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

Right. Let's talk about the EUs position.
The EU enthusiastically welcomes elections in Northern Cyprus but apparently they don't plan to recognize it as a separate state

Show me statement that EU recognised North Cyprus elections.

huh?? by sending aid to nakhichevan but not to karabakh?



http://azer.com/aiweb/categories/mag...frenchamb.html

So we have to cut relations with an country that does business or give money to Azerbaijan? What kind of logic is that? And many countries including European helped Armenia during Spitak Earthquake. And today a large part of our economy depends on Europe.

Genocide issue is useful to oppose Turkey's entry to the EU.
What use is genocide recognition without supporting compensation?

And what would you be saying if Europe didn't recognise genocide, but Iran did? Compensation is not realistic, not even Armenian government is demanding that.

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

We are never going to be politically close with EU, because EU and Russia will always be adversaries and trying to battle each other to gain more battle, I mean political battles no wars. We should try to get closer with them on other levels like law, economy, etc. Europe has so many positive aspect that Armenia can learn and grow, but we can not let us be fooled.

Though EU is getting more and more dependent on Russia gas, and the relations between major EU power such as Germany and France are strong with Russia. Their economic ties are bringing them closer as EU can't afford to be bad with Russia.

Russia is the EU’s third biggest trade partner, with Russian supplies of oil and gas making up a large percentage of Russia’s exports to Europe. The Ongoing cooperation is based on 4 specific policy areas. These “common spaces”, cover economic issues & the environment; Freedom, Security & Justice; External Security; and Research & Education, including cultural aspects.

The EU has in place a programme of financial cooperation that has evolved over time to support the achievement of common objectives.

The EU and Russia co-operate on dealing with a number of challenges, both at international level, as well as in our common neighbourhood. These include climate change, drug and human trafficking, organised crime, counter-terrorism, non-proliferation, the Middle East Peace Process, and Iran.

The EU and Russia concluded a Partnership and Co-operation Agreement in 1994.

Negotiations on a New EU-Russia Agreement were launched at the Khanty-Mansyisk Summit in June 2008. The New Agreement should update and replace the existing Partnership and Cooperation Agreement. It should provide a comprehensive framework for EU-Russia relations, and include substantive, legally binding commitments in all areas of the partnership, including political dialogue, JLS issues, economic cooperation, research, education and culture, as well as solid provisions on trade, investment and energy. The negotiations were started in July 2008, and by the end of 2010, 12 full negotiating rounds will have taken place.

PUTIN-SCHROEDER GAS DEAL TIMED TO GERMAN ELECTIONS

Publication: Eurasia Daily Monitor Volume: 2 Issue: 169September 13, 2005 12:00 AM Age: 6 yrs
By: Vladimir Socor
Ten days ahead of Germany's parliamentary elections, Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder and Russian President Vladimir Putin attended on September 8 in Berlin the signing of a framework agreement to construct a gas pipeline from Russia directly to Germany along the Baltic seabed. The line would bypass the Baltic states and Poland.



The bilateral project is being billed as a major success for Germany and is so understood by most of the German public. However, the project increases Germany's already excessive dependence on Russia for energy; undercuts the European Union's supply-diversification strategy; throws another spoke in the admittedly slow wheels of the EU's common foreign and security policy; and demonstratively ignores the long-standing, publicly expressed concerns of Poland and the Baltic states. These had called for an overland pipeline to connect them with the "old" EU. The seabed pipeline, however, de-couples these countries from the EU gas market, leaving the Baltic states in particular to deal with Gazprom on their own (Die Welt, Neue Zuercher Zeitung, September 9-11).



If implemented, the project would increase Germany's dependence on Russian energy supplies to levels fraught with political risk. Gazprom already accounts for 37% of Germany's gas imports, a figure far exceeding Gazprom's market share in the "old" EU as a whole. Gazprom's market dominance in Germany is scheduled to increase through use of existing pipelines until 2010, at which point the Baltic seabed pipeline is expected to be commissioned with a first-stage capacity of 27 billion cubic meters of gas annually.



Putin's visit and the signing ceremony seemed designed to lift the fortunes of Schroeder's Social-Democrat Party (SPD) in the September 18 elections to the German Bundestag, which the opposition Christian-Democrats (CDU) are expected to win comfortably against the SPD. The signing had originally been scheduled for October; but it was hurriedly brought forward when the SPD began drawing closer to the CDU in pre-election polls, and the Free-Democratic Party (FDP, slated to head the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in an Atlanticist coalition with the CDU) slipped in the polls. The Kremlin now apparently hopes for an indecisive outcome that would force the Christian-Democrats to accept a "grand coalition" government with the SPD, thus complicating a return to Atlanticism in German policy.



Although Putin also met with Christian-Democrat Union (CDU) leader Angela Merkel, that meeting had none of the atmospherics and political impact of the Putin-Schroeder event. Playing on the German public's concerns over energy supplies, Schroeder portrayed the gas project as a direct result of his government's special relations with Russia and of the Schroeder-Putin personal relationship. At their joint news conference, moreover, Schroeder struck a missionary tone when describing the Russian-German relationship: "Few peoples on this Earth have such a clear mission, the mission incumbent on our peoples to help settle global conflicts on our planet through peaceful means. This applies to Europe, but not only to Europe….We can thank our strategic partnership, and I am grateful for my personal relations with the President [Putin]" (Kremlin.ru, September 8).



Schroeder passed up several opportunities at the news conference to address Polish and Baltic concerns over the gas project. Instead, he bluntly argued, "It is my responsibility to look after Germany's interests, and I would advise the opposition not to hinder me in looking after Germany's interests" (Kremlin.ru, September 8). Such language seems to make short shrift not only of EU policies, but also of the EU political culture as developed over decades of advancing from national-interest to common-interest policies. With similar bluntness, Social-Democrat Defense Minister Peter Struck two days later rejected the recent U.S. proposal for NATO troops to join U.S. operations in Afghanistan against the Taliban. Struck retorted, "There is a clear No from us on that." (Sueddeutsche Zeitung, September 11; see EDM, September 8).



Germany's Green Party, junior partner in the coalition government and holder of the foreign affairs portfolio, is not known to have raised serious concerns regarding the seabed pipeline's environmental impact. The bilateral German-Russian deal bypasses the Council of Baltic Sea Countries, an intergovernmental forum of all the countries on the Baltic littoral. Energy cooperation and ecological protection of the Baltic Sea are among the Council's main roles.



During Putin's visit, some of the most influential figures in opposition parties criticized Schroeder for dealing with Moscow behind the back of Poland and the Baltic states, "generating a catastrophic mistrust" toward German intentions (CDU's Wolfgang Schaeuble), "encouraging the re-Sovietization of Russia by forming an Axis with it" (FDP's Sabine Leutheusser-Schnarrenberger), and generally for his uncritical relationship with Putin (Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, September 9-11). Those are also the prevalent editorial views in Germany's mainstream press. However, opposition politicians seem loath to risk the unpopular step of criticizing the gas deal on the eve of parliamentary elections. Even Merkel felt compelled to praise the pipeline project as "good for Germany." The post-election government will have to address the risks of overdependence on Russia and the imperative of diversification of supply.

[lampron]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

Show me statement that EU recognised North Cyprus elections.

You can do your own search. Elections there are always given approval. Here is one example

Statement on the results of the elections in northern part of Cyprus

"The Commission and the European Union are fully committed to support efforts at reaching a settlement of the Cyprus problem, which would be to the benefit of Cyprus and the EU in general. Mr Talat and Mr Christofias had achieved important progress in shaping a settlement that would reunite the island on the basis of a bi-zonal, bi-communal federation. This was highly appreciated by President Barroso.

Now that Mr Eroglu has been elected leader of the Turkish Cypriot community, it is crucial that the settlement talks go on.

http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=MEMO/10/144&format=HTML&aged=1&language=EN&guiLanguage=en

In addition there is diplomatic representation

United States, United Kingdom, France, Germany and Australia have representation offices in Northern Nicosia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Northern_Cyprus

So we have to cut relations with an country that does business or give money to Azerbaijan? What kind of logic is that?

Who says we have to cut relations? I'm saying look at the facts instead of relying on wishful thinking. I think I've given enough examples, but feel free to disregard them!

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

You can do your own search. Elections there are always given approval. Here is one example

Statement on the results of the elections in northern part of Cyprus

"The Commission and the European Union are fully committed to support efforts at reaching a settlement of the Cyprus problem, which would be to the benefit of Cyprus and the EU in general. Mr Talat and Mr Christofias had achieved important progress in shaping a settlement that would reunite the island on the basis of a bi-zonal, bi-communal federation. This was highly appreciated by President Barroso.

Now that Mr Eroglu has been elected leader of the Turkish Cypriot community, it is crucial that the settlement talks go on.

http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleases...guiLanguage=en

I asked you for a specific statement where EU recognises North Cyprus's elections. What you quoted was not an official recognition. I did my search, and I found nothing.

In addition there is diplomatic representation

United States, United Kingdom, France, Germany and Australia have representation offices in Northern Nicosia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign...orthern_Cyprus

Nagorno-Karabakh has representation in France, Germany, Australia, Lebanon, USA, and Russia.

Who says we have to cut relations? I'm saying look at the facts instead of relying on wishful thinking. I think I've given enough examples, but feel free to disregard them!

I'm looking at facts to, and see that the bigger nations play both sides (Armenia & Azerbaijan). Again we continue our political integration with EU, but still hold strategic ties with Russia and warm neighbourly relations with Iran.

[Armanen]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

Though EU is getting more and more dependent on Russia gas, and the relations between major EU power such as Germany and France are strong with Russia. Their economic ties are bringing them closer as EU can't afford to be bad with Russia.

FYI: Vladimir socor is another zionist joo bastard that likes to spread anti-Armenian ideas, mainly because he is a Russophobe and therefore doesn't like the close relations between Armenia and Russia.

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

FYI: Vladimir socor is another zionist joo bastard that likes to spread anti-Armenian ideas, mainly because he is a Russophobe and therefore doesn't like the close relations between Armenia and Russia.

Well I don't know much about Vladimir Socor, but it's established fact that Russia and Europe have close economic ties especially when it comes to gas, and he can't be making the gas deal between Germany and Russia up. That being said, I fail to see how a German and Russian gas deal could be used for anti-Armenian propaganda. Putin has always had close relations with Schroeder also, they were "best buddies".

[lampron]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

I asked you for a specific statement where EU recognises North Cyprus's elections.

what recognition are you looking for, man? if you can't see the vast difference between condemnation of an election (in karabakh) and a statement by the EU reacting favorably to elections (in Northern Cyprus), then you are a more hopeless case than I thought!

Nagorno-Karabakh has representation in France, Germany, Australia, Lebanon, USA, and Russia.
.

AND??? What if NK had representatives in 150 countries ? How many foreign governments have a presence in NK? Yes, NONE!

I am beginning to realize that replying to you is a complete waste of time!

Enjoy your comfortable dream world!

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

what recognition are you looking for, man? if you can't see the vast difference between condemnation of an election (in karabakh) and a statement by the EU reacting favorably to elections (in Northern Cyprus), then you are a more hopeless case than I thought!

Read the sentence you put up more carefully:

Now that Mr Eroglu has been elected leader of the Turkish Cypriot community, it is crucial that the settlement talks go on.

All they are saying is that Mr Eroglu was elected, they didn't comment on the election itself or the opinion on it, just the fact that he was elected.

AND??? What if NK had representatives in 150 countries ? How many foreign governments have a presence in NK? Yes, NONE!

I am beginning to realize that replying to you is a complete waste of time!

Enjoy your comfortable dream world!

And, so what? Having representation doesn't mean recognition, plus the EU is much more concerned about Cyprus issue than Karabakh because Cyprus is EU member, and Turkey wants to get into the EU. Karabakh is a much smaller problem at the world stage.

If it's complete waste of time for you, than stop posting and stop wasting my time as well.

[Mos]

Re: EU-Armenia Relations

Very Good development:

Armenian MP welcomes European Parliament call on Karabakh

April 07, 2011 | 20:40

YEREVAN. - Secretary of the ruling Republican Party’s parliamentary group Eduard Sharmazanov welcomes European Parliament’s call to establish informal contacts with Nagorno-Karabakh.

Sharmazanov stressed that resolution is a result of work carried out by the Armenian diplomats with the European Parliament members, as well as result of MP’s visits to Nagorno-Karabakh.

The European Parliament adopted resolution on Thursday on the review of the European Neighbourhood Policy. In a resolution the parliamentarians call to develop more confidence-building measures and programs, including the launching of new missions and public communication strategies and the consideration of pragmatic initiatives and innovative approaches. European Parliament particularly mentions informal contacts and consultations with the societies and de facto authorities of the breakaway territories, while conserving the EU’s non-recognition policy, in order to support civic culture and community dialogue.