Armenian-Azeri encounter

[lampron]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

Many may be 1+1=2?
That may be.... but I have never heard this version in Artsakh.

Buy the way historically inexact.
This city did not exist untill the fall of the Khamsayi Melikutyuns, and incorporation of Hayotz Arevelitz Koghmank in Tzarist Russia.
A small garrison town of Perso/Tatars was first established near Shahpulagh (Tigranakert) by the muslims, to be rased to the f=ground by the Meliks of Jrapert and Khatchen.
Then re erased next season... just to be switshed by Shushi, when the Melik of Varanta betrayed his kin for selfish blindeness...
There were armenian villages islamised in the lowlands, like Maralian Sarov, Sorov, ...yet untill 1988... but certainly not Akna/Aghdam, since that town did not exist untill russian arrival, and was developed in soviet times.
During soviet times, some Armenians did live there.
Once the mufti was also from Martuni, playing mufti just to have the fun of bigamy....

No, they referred to times a long way before, before Russia arrived in the Caucasus. Aghdam, in some form, maybe under a different name existed and maybe it was only a village
According to an Armenian from Gandzak (Kirovabad) who escaped in 1988, quite a few of the 100,000 Armenians in the city were on their way to assimilating into Azeri culture

Your evaluations are those of a terk. The genocide(s) of the gd dmd seljerks left few of us alive. The following murders, slaughters, and genocide(s) by the competing autojerks and persion scum left even fewer.
You portray an overwhelmed and tortured peoples as "weak".
Your perceptions are terkish. Your perceptions are disgusting.

We have to face the reality, even if we may not like it.
Tortured people rise up and revolt!

A neutral observer may ask:
Turks and Azeris will expand conquer and massacre. What are you doing about it?

[Artashes]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

No, they referred to times a long way before, before Russia arrived in the Caucasus. Aghdam, in some form, maybe under a different name existed and maybe it was only a village
According to an Armenian from Gandzak (Kirovabad) who escaped in 1988, quite a few of the 100,000 Armenians in the city were on their way to assimilating into Azeri culture




We have to face the reality, even if we may not like it.
Tortured people rise up and revolt!

A neutral observer may ask:
Turks and Azeris will expand conquer and massacre. What are you doing about it?

--- tortured people rise up and revolt ---
An absurd comment. You have never been around people who have been traumatized by torture. That's utterly absurd. Also heartless.
Your opinion is completely devoid of understanding but not surprising as you express a clear terkish perception.
You sound like a thoroughly terkifide Armenian . You know your Armenian, but you support the terk and their view.
To the murderers, you bequeath strength and justification with the ignorance of a terk.
To the tortured in their traumatized state you accuse them of being weak and rail against them for not revolting.
Pure terk reasoning, pure absurdity.
You are not fit to be around those in need.
Your words and comprehension do not belong to humanity, but to terks.

[lampron]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

--- tortured people rise up and revolt ---
An absurd comment. You have never been around people who have been traumatized by torture. That's utterly absurd. Also heartless.
Your opinion is completely devoid of understanding but not surprising as you express a clear terkish perception.
You sound like a thoroughly terkifide Armenian . You know your Armenian, but you support the terk and their view.
To the murderers, you bequeath strength and justification with the ignorance of a terk.
To the tortured in their traumatized state you accuse them of being weak and rail against them for not revolting.
Pure terk reasoning, pure absurdity.
You are not fit to be around those in need.
Your words and comprehension do not belong to humanity, but to terks.

Hundreds of years after the Seljuk attack on Armenia, European visitors in the early 19th century recorded an Armenian majority on territories around Lake Van
You have to look at Armenians through the eyes of successful nations - Americans, Russians, Italians, Iranians...then you will see things differently
"Tortured" as in oppressed. Oppressed masses are expected to rise up . If they do not, it means they can't organize themselves, or they have no faith in themselves, or maybe they prefer collaboration
If there is evil in the world (not just among ottoman conquerors) it is obvious that it is necessary to resist that evil

I do not know who is your source. A taxi driver?
Historical facts are no way near your quote.
There was no such town or village before the XVIII century there.
Unless you are referring to times before middle ages, where all the lowland was Armenian inhabitaded??

Your quote about Gantzak is even more questionable.
Gantzak was not Baku or Sumgait, where there was no turkification either, rather full and deep sovietisation, russification. A phenomena even present in Yerevan at the fall of the CCCP. Brightest example of that kind of avatar being Nalbantov.

But Ganzak was Artsakh, was Armenia. The city is located at the footsteps of the Artsakh/Mrav chain, immediately neighboring Armenian villages , more than 50 still purely Armenian in 1988-89. The Armenian sector of the town was distinct from the turkish sector, separated by the river and the bridges. In 1988 there were even random self defense units formed in Gandzak, as was the case in 1904-07, or 1917-20, to defend the city.
Unfortunately, it was decided in HHSh circles of Yerevan that their defense was too difficult to organise, and self defense was very unorganised and served only to insure less losses during the pogroms and deportation.

But the people of Northern Artsakh were certainly not as alienated as the burgeoisia of Baku (I mean Armenian) or some in Yerevan.

The source in Stepanakert: Locals (extended family) who lived there for several generations who shared the "local wisdom"
Whether Aghdam ( or other villages ), it is known that over the centuries Armenian settlements in Lower Karabakh converted to Islam and became Tatars (Azeris)

The source on Gandzak/Kirovabad: A Kirovabad Armenian who escaped Azerbaijan and found work at a Russian university
He stated that apart from Russification, in Kirovabad there was also Azerification

The majority of Azerbaijani Armenians went to Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, USA....not to Armenia. It tells you that politically/culturally maybe they were not very Armenia-orientated

[Artashes]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

Hundreds of years after the Seljuk attack on Armenia, European visitors in the early 19th century recorded an Armenian majority on territories around Lake Van
You have to look at Armenians through the eyes of successful nations - Americans, Russians, Italians, Iranians...then you will see things differently
"Tortured" as in oppressed. Oppressed masses are expected to rise up . If they do not, it means they can't organize themselves, or they have no faith in themselves, or maybe they prefer collaboration
If there is evil in the world (not just among ottoman conquerors) it is obvious that it is necessary to resist that evil



The source in Stepanakert: Locals (extended family) who lived there for several generations who shared the "local wisdom"
Whether Aghdam ( or other villages ), it is known that over the centuries Armenian settlements in Lower Karabakh converted to Islam and became Tatars (Azeris)

The source on Gandzak/Kirovabad: A Kirovabad Armenian who escaped Azerbaijan and found work at a Russian university
He stated that apart from Russification, in Kirovabad there was also Azerification

The majority of Azerbaijani Armenians went to Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, USA....not to Armenia. It tells you that politically/culturally maybe they were not very Armenia-orientated

(1) "the source" ... Armenian who (ESCAPED)
(2) It tells you ... (maybe)
More of your twisted terk perspective.
When the Armenians "ESCAPED!!!!" 1915 or baku or ... , they often tried to go to the safest and potentially economically viable place. That wouldn't be Hayastan at those many (MANY!!!) times. But your disgusting terk perspective can only see one demension, (the) belittlment of Armenians and conversely, the grandizment of the hominoid you call terk and friend.
Point "2" doesn't make the point you fraudulently (terkishly) attempt to portray. Not at all.
People who find themselves in a position where they (NEED!!!) to *** ESCAPE *** are in extreme turmoil to say the least. But your disgusting terk conniving interprets that situation as "not very Armenian oriented".
Your conclusion like the terk conclusion that no genocide took place is (1) a lie, ((2) pervertedly sick and 3,4,5,etc.
Your a fkn moron for saying such things to an Armenian or any Armenian or anyone else.
You elivate the murderous terk and marginalize the victim.
Your a terk propagandist, a terk sympathizer, and a terk apologist.
But your not and honest man, or a decent man.

[lampron]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

(1) "the source" ... Armenian who (ESCAPED)
(2) It tells you ... (maybe)
More of your twisted terk perspective.
When the Armenians "ESCAPED!!!!" 1915 or baku or ... , they often tried to go to the safest and potentially economically viable place. That wouldn't be Hayastan at those many (MANY!!!) times. But your disgusting terk perspective can only see one demension, (the) belittlment of Armenians and conversely, the grandizment of the hominoid you call terk and friend.
Point "2" doesn't make the point you fraudulently (terkishly) attempt to portray. Not at all.
People who find themselves in a position where they (NEED!!!) to *** ESCAPE *** are in extreme turmoil to say the least. But your disgusting terk conniving interprets that situation as "not very Armenian oriented".
Your conclusion like the terk conclusion that no genocide took place is (1) a lie, ((2) pervertedly sick and 3,4,5,etc.
Your a fkn moron for saying such things to an Armenian or any Armenian or anyone else.
You elivate the murderous terk and marginalize the victim.
Your a terk propagandist, a terk sympathizer, and a terk apologist.
But your not and honest man, or a decent man.

Get your stinking ass out of this thread!
You have ZERO knowledge, ZERO IQ, but score 100% on posting garbage every time.
Move it! Go stink some place else!

[Artashes]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

(1) "the source" ... Armenian who (ESCAPED)
(2) It tells you ... (maybe)
More of your twisted terk perspective.
When the Armenians "ESCAPED!!!!" 1915 or baku or ... , they often tried to go to the safest and potentially economically viable place. That wouldn't be Hayastan at those many (MANY!!!) times. But your disgusting terk perspective can only see one demension, (the) belittlment of Armenians and conversely, the grandizment of the hominoid you call terk and friend.
Point "2" doesn't make the point you fraudulently (terkishly) attempt to portray. Not at all.
People who find themselves in a position where they (NEED!!!) to *** ESCAPE *** are in extreme turmoil to say the least. But your disgusting terk conniving interprets that situation as "not very Armenian oriented".
Your conclusion like the terk conclusion that no genocide took place is (1) a lie, ((2) pervertedly sick and 3,4,5,etc.
Your a fkn moron for saying such things to an Armenian or any Armenian or anyone else.
You elivate the murderous terk and marginalize the victim.
Your a terk propagandist, a terk sympathizer, and a terk apologist.
But your not and honest man, or a decent man.

Get your stinking ass out of this thread!
You have ZERO knowledge, ZERO IQ, but score 100% on posting garbage every time.
Move it! Go stink some place else!

It is you that post garbage. It is you that shows zero knowledge. It is you that post terk propaganda,lies, and heartless ignorance.
Your pathetic excuse for terk barbarity guised as an argument, expose your lack of honesty or decency befitting a human being with a heart. You have expressed nothing but the obvious terk inhumanity and your sympathy for the hominoid you call terk and friend.
Your a lier and a disgrace to the truth that real humans strive for.
Your a coward hiding behind the hominoid terks lies and propaganda.
Your terk conniving won't stop the truth.your last response belies the terk pseudo intellect for what it is ... hominoid terk drivel.
Your a pathetic excuse for a man, but a classic example of a hominoid terk.

[Artashes]

Re: Armenian-Azeri encounter

i can pull one story from my ass and it will be better than this one !!

This ones for our terk sympathizer.

[Vrej1915]

Ադրբեջանում այնպիսի մեծ ատելություն և հայատյացություն է քարոզվել, որ շրջադարձ անելը ջանքեր է պահանջելու և քաղաքական կամք. Արմեն Աշոտյան

• 09.10.17



Ակնհայտ է մեկ բան՝ Ադրբեջանի ներկայիս իշխանությունը տրամադրված չէ խաղաղության, երկարաժամկետ առումով այնպիսի մեծ ատելություն և հայատյացություն է քարոզվել հասարակության ներսում, որ շրջադարձ անելը ջանքեր է պահանջելու և քաղաքական կամք: «Արմենիա» հեռուստաընկերության «Ռ-էվոլյուցիա» հաղորդման եթերում ասել է ԱԺ արտաքին հարաբերությունների մշտական հանձնաժողովի նախագահ, Հայաստանի Հանրապետական կուսակցության փոխնախագահ Արմեն Աշոտյանը՝ անդրադառնալով Եվրանեսթ խորհրդարանական վեհաժողովի նիստին մասնակցելու նպատակով իր Բաքու այցին։

«Մենք կարողացանք ճիշտ տեղեկատվական քաղաքականություն ապահովել, որ մեր լրատվամիջոցները և տեղեկատվությունը չմնա Ադրբեջանի մամուլի հույսին, որը հաճախ խեղաթյուրում և աղավաղում է փաստերը: Մեր այնտեղ լինելը շարունակությունն էր խորհրդարանական դիվանագիտության, որովհետև բազմաթիվ հայկական պատվիրակություններ եղել էին Բաքվում, անգամ գնալուց առաջ մենք խորհրդակցում էինք, հարցուփորձ էինք անում այնտեղ աշխատած մեր պատգամավորներից»,-պատմել է Արմեն Աշոտյանը:

Նրա խոսքով՝ այն կեցվածքը, այն ասելիքը, այն խոսելիքը, այն շարժուձևը, այն արժանապատվությունը, որ հայկական պատվիրակությունն ուներ, նախ և առաջ հայկական բանակի և հայ զինվորի շնորհիվ է:

«Մենք շահեկան տարբերություն ունենք Ադրբեջանի համեմատ, որովհետև մեր հասարակության ներսում չկա այլատյացության, ադրբեջանական էթնոսի հանդեպ ատելության այնպիսի մակարդակ, որ կար Ադրբեջանում: Չեմ կարող ասել, որ դա համատարած էր, որովհետև մեզ շատ ինտենսիվ հսկում էին: Ադրբեջանցիները նաև հյուրընկալ էին, սա էլ պետք է փաստել, սակայն միաժամանակ պետք է շեշտել, որ կար պետական մակարդակով տարվող հայատյացության քաղաքականություն»,-տեղեկացրել է ՀՀԿ փոխնախագահը:

Նա կենցաղային օրինակներով փաստել է, որ եթե անգամ ոմանց մեջ չկար ատելություն, ապա կար վախ հայերի հետ շփվելուց:

«Խնդրում էինք մեզ նկարել, շատերը, որ մեզ ուղեկցում էին, վախենում էին, խուսափում էին, շատ հաճախ ասում էին՝ կներեք, չենք կարող կամ, օրինակ՝ Մանեն, մեզնից մի պահ առաջ է անցել, տղամարդիկ դուռ չէին բացում, տարրական բան է, էթնոսի հետ կապ չունի, բայց ակնհայտորեն վախ կար: Լինում էր նաև, որ վարորդներ էին փոխվում, այն վարորդը, որ մեզ առավոտյան բարևում էր, կեսօրից հետո չէր աշխատում, մեզ չէր սպասարկում: Տարրական, պրիմիտիվ բաներ են, որ ցույց են տալիս, որ գոնե վախ կա մեզ հետ շփվելուց»:

Արմեն Աշոտյանի դիտարկմամբ՝ այդ հասարակության տրամադրությունները ձևավորվել են 15-16 տարի շարունակ, «հակահայկական պետական կրոնով»: Ըստ նրա՝ ամենակարևոր բանը, որ ինքն իր համար հետևություն է արել՝ որպես քաղաքական գործիչ և քաղաքացի, այն է, որ մեր խաղաղասիրական հռետորաբանությունը պետք է անպայման զուգակցված լինի մարտունակության բարձրացմամբ, սա ակնհայտ է:

«Մեր խաղաղասիրությունը, հասարակության մեջ այդ ատելության բացակայությունը, ճիշտ է, նորմալ է, որովհետև չի կարելի թունավորել քո հասարակությանը։ Բայց միաժամանակ մենք պետք է մոբիլիզացված ազգ լինենք գիտակցության մակարդակով, ոչ միայն պրոպագանդայի, որ բոլորի գլխում դրված լինի: Մենք գիտակցված, արժանապատիվ քաղաքացիական կեցվածք պետք է ունենանք ոչ թե հոտային, այլ անհատական մակարդակով»,-ասել է ԱԺ արտաքին հարաբերությունների մշտական հանձնաժողովի նախագահը:

Նրա գնահատմամբ՝ կոնֆլիկտի երկարաժամկետ լինելը մեզնից չէ կախված, գերտերությունների շահերից չի կախված, կախված է նրանից, որ Ադրբեջանի գործող ղեկավարությունը ցանկություն չունի, տարբեր պատճառներով, գնալ խաղաղության, գնալ համակեցության: Սա ակնհայտ, հերթական անգամ ապացուցված ճշմարտություն է:



Զանի Հարոյան