Politics in Hayastan

[Mher]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I don't know what they are doing at this point with the constitutional reform, because with all the amendments made, it only makes their grip on power weaker, and would make the opposition stronger, because it lessens the grip of power of oligarchs in their little fiefdoms. So in principal its a good step towards better rule of law, and should be looked as a move done with good intentions. But I don't necessarily have enough faith in intention or competence of the ruling authorities to believe that. I also don't see why this is necessary at this particular moment if the only concern is the well being of the country, considering there is a regional economic crisis, that we are on the brink of war, that we just entered a major economic block, that the dynamics in Iran are changing, all meaning there's a lot of work to do, and a lot of better ways time, energy, and funds could be spent. On the other hand I definitely have zero faith in the opposition, who just sound like total idiots in their opposition of everything. So at this point i really don't know how to feel about it, which leaves me passively supporting it considering there's no real reason to oppose it.

[Haykakan]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I don't know what they are doing at this point with the constitutional reform, because with all the amendments made, it only makes their grip on power weaker, and would make the opposition stronger, because it lessens the grip of power of oligarchs in their little fiefdoms. So in principal its a good step towards better rule of law, and should be looked as a move done with good intentions. But I don't necessarily have enough faith in intention or competence of the ruling authorities to believe that. I also don't see why this is necessary at this particular moment if the only concern is the well being of the country, considering there is a regional economic crisis, that we are on the brink of war, that we just entered a major economic block, that the dynamics in Iran are changing, all meaning there's a lot of work to do, and a lot of better ways time, energy, and funds could be spent. On the other hand I definitely have zero faith in the opposition, who just sound like total idiots in their opposition of everything. So at this point i really don't know how to feel about it, which leaves me passively supporting it considering there's no real reason to oppose it.

The new form is more easily manipulated. This is the reason why the oligarchs are ok with it. The problem I see is that it can be manipulated easier now by powers far greater then the olis. Perhaps that is the plan all along and it will be much easier to get through o lets say a new peace deal that is not popular at home. With the current system you can clearly point your finger and say sonso is responsible.. With the new system assigning blame and responsibility will be smoke and mirrors. For those of you who wanted a more western style government well that is exactly what you are getting along with everything else that comes with it. If you thought corruption was bad in Armenia in the past you better hang on...o and don't forget about unsustainable debt that accompanies it all.

[Shant03]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I don't know what they are doing at this point with the constitutional reform, because with all the amendments made, it only makes their grip on power weaker, and would make the opposition stronger, because it lessens the grip of power of oligarchs in their little fiefdoms. So in principal its a good step towards better rule of law, and should be looked as a move done with good intentions. But I don't necessarily have enough faith in intention or competence of the ruling authorities to believe that. I also don't see why this is necessary at this particular moment if the only concern is the well being of the country, considering there is a regional economic crisis, that we are on the brink of war, that we just entered a major economic block, that the dynamics in Iran are changing, all meaning there's a lot of work to do, and a lot of better ways time, energy, and funds could be spent. On the other hand I definitely have zero faith in the opposition, who just sound like total idiots in their opposition of everything. So at this point i really don't know how to feel about it, which leaves me passively supporting it considering there's no real reason to oppose it.

x2

Literally put my thoughts into a well written paragraph.

[Artsakh]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I don't know what they are doing at this point with the constitutional reform, because with all the amendments made, it only makes their grip on power weaker, and would make the opposition stronger, because it lessens the grip of power of oligarchs in their little fiefdoms. So in principal its a good step towards better rule of law, and should be looked as a move done with good intentions. But I don't necessarily have enough faith in intention or competence of the ruling authorities to believe that. I also don't see why this is necessary at this particular moment if the only concern is the well being of the country, considering there is a regional economic crisis, that we are on the brink of war, that we just entered a major economic block, that the dynamics in Iran are changing, all meaning there's a lot of work to do, and a lot of better ways time, energy, and funds could be spent. On the other hand I definitely have zero faith in the opposition, who just sound like total idiots in their opposition of everything. So at this point i really don't know how to feel about it, which leaves me passively supporting it considering there's no real reason to oppose it.

Nice way of putting things, completely agree.

[HyeSocialist]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

The new form is more easily manipulated. This is the reason why the oligarchs are ok with it. The problem I see is that it can be manipulated easier now by powers far greater then the olis. Perhaps that is the plan all along and it will be much easier to get through o lets say a new peace deal that is not popular at home. With the current system you can clearly point your finger and say sonso is responsible.. With the new system assigning blame and responsibility will be smoke and mirrors. For those of you who wanted a more western style government well that is exactly what you are getting along with everything else that comes with it. If you thought corruption was bad in Armenia in the past you better hang on...o and don't forget about unsustainable debt that accompanies it all.

That does not make sense. Any force that wants to gain power previously could have just supported a presidential candidate and have executive power. This way they have to have more votes and more politicians to gain any kind of power, and even then the government can be dissolved.

I think they're just trying to appease the EU for more loans after the make f-up pulling out of the DCFTA in favor for the EEU.

[Haykakan]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

That does not make sense. Any force that wants to gain power previously could have just supported a presidential candidate and have executive power. This way they have to have more votes and more politicians to gain any kind of power, and even then the government can be dissolved.

I think they're just trying to appease the EU for more loans after the make f-up pulling out of the DCFTA in favor for the EEU.

They may indeed be trying to appease the EU but that does not change the fact that the new model is easier to corrupt. Think of it this way..when power is centralized and you go to the boss and try to corrupt him..if he says no then you either have to overthrow him(tough to do) or you are done. In the new form you can go to one guy if he says no you go to another until you get what you want. This is the reason democracies are notorious for corruption.

[Zeytun]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Well any system can be corrupt, but we should mention some things, the new constitution will put in place a full proportional electoral system, so eventually the Armenian parties should develop, form alliances and new parties should emerge ( Hopefully one day we can have clear parties, like conservatives, liberals, socialists, communists, left, right pro-Russia pro-EU etc...) For example, Can anyone tell me the difference between the values and ideas of the republican party and those of prosperous Armenia.
On paper the new constitution is a good move towards the development of the Armenian political system. Maybe on the short term it will be used by sargsyan (I don't see how that is wrong, its the oppositions failures that keep those guys in place, now they want to demonstrate against the new constitution: I cant understand any opposition in the world that is a against full proportional electoral system, and a bigger role for the parliament).

[Zeytun]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

""Armenia hopes to start talks on new agreement with European Union before the end of 2015,"" Nalbandian
So Probably after the constitution referendum, this also might indicate the link between the referendum and the EU.

[UrMistake]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Spot on to all of your . You all made good points and good indications . Lets hope for the best , i dont like how the opposition in armenia is carrying people for revolution and stuff since in the last elections they managed to do 0 work.

[Zeytun]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I Found an interesting post on the Constitutional referendum

https://www.opendemocracy.net/can-europe-make-it/ingar-solty-davit-stepanyan/post-democracy-in-armenia-how-new-constitution-will-d

I copied the interesting points:

-The proposed constitution does not stipulate that the state will take the necessary measures to realise its citizens’ rights to housing, or to provide social security for the elderly, the unemployed, those with disabilities, or those who suffer the death of a breadwinner. Furthermore, while these are irrevocable rights under the current constitution, I note that a citizen’s right to a fair wage no less than the minimum wage, and alongside the right to free healthcare, will henceforth be regulated by law.

-The proposed draft does not include current constitutional provisions stipulating that the realisation of a property right must not cause damage to the environment or violate other people’s rights and lawful interests, those of the public or the state. Nor does it include provisions on the human right to live in a healthy and favorable environment. Moreover, state officials will be exonerated from liability for hiding or refusing to disclose information on the environment. Taking into consideration the large volume of mining in Armenia, it is easy to imagine the consequences of these changes in the near future.

-In my view we should always be skeptical with regard to “reforms” from above, and question the political motivations behind them. From historical experience we know that democratization has never just been granted from above, from the powers-that-be.
Instead democratization has essentially always been the result of struggles from below which lead either to a new leadership or to processes of defensive democratization.

-In full proportional representation systems with strong parliaments, new parties can start by forming a strong minority opposition in parliament organically linked to extra-parliamentary social movements, such as the 2013 protests against public transit fare hikes or the 2015 “No to Robbery” protests against electricity price increases in Armenia – movements which are supported by some opposition parties using the parliament as a rostrum.
-My understanding is that the draft contains some intentional gaps, and some issues have been left ambiguous ( He is probably referring to The 2nd round of election to make sure a majority is elected).

-So, with regard to the real-concrete changes of the content of the Armenian Constitution, let me say that when I looked at the draft of the new constitution and compared it to the old one.Its main content does not seem to be simply a tool which would allow Sargsyan to remain in power after his second term. What appears to be crucial is that the draft of the new constitution wants to do away with the key remaining social-democratic elements of the Armenian Constitution, which limit the total power of capital. This includes Article 32 which still guarantees workers’ rights, Article 34 which guarantees housing and a certain standard of living as a social right, and Article 38 which guarantees free public healthcare as a social right. These Articles of the current constitution still envision and effectively necessitate non-market solutions when these rights are supposed to be realized.

By contrast, Article 85 of the draft of the new constitution now makes “the right to protection of health” as well as “the right to a dignifying existence” for “every person in need and every elderly person” dependent on “accordance with law”. In other words, universal constitutional economic and social rights are no longer unconditional, but they are essentially turned from democratic “must-haves” into (social-) liberal “nice-to-haves”, depending on whether state revenue from taxes in a private capitalist economy, as well as parliamentary majorities, allow for their realization.

However, in my view, the anti-working class and anti-democratic content of the new constitution goes even further than that. This can be seen, first of all, in how it allows for the restriction of the right to strike.

With regard to the de-politicization of the Armenian economy you have mentioned, one thing strikes me as crucial - the key formulation is the first defining sentence of Article 86 on the ‘Main Objectives of State Policy’ which now defines the state’s role in the economy no longer as “contribut(ing) to the employment of the population and the improvement of working conditions,” but rather as “improv(ing) the business environment and promot(ing) entrepreneurship.”

And all the other following tasks are formulated in terms of verbs such as “support” and “promote.” In other words, the state’s role in the economy is no longer supposed - yes, no longer allowed - to be proactive in terms of redistribution policies, let alone in terms of nationalizations and socializations of the commanding heights of the economy.

In other words, the draft of the new constitution rules out the kind of policies which enable a democratic state to guarantee economic and social rights through public employment, public investment and public welfare provisioning.

-Furthermore, under the new constitution, it seems that it would be totally legal to shift all remaining public and “free” Commons (in primary, secondary and higher education, public health-care provisioning, public pensions, social insurance etc.) into the for-profit private sector. In Article 60 of the new constitution on the ‘Right to Property’, property rights are supposed to be enhanced.

The new constitutionalism thus creates a situation in which parliamentary elections based on universal suffrage still take place and the illusion of popular sovereignty is upheld, while in reality parliaments have been essentially dis-empowered in the material issues that really matters.

-This is not just my opinion. Everything points to the west having dictated the constitutional changes as a counterbalance to Armenia’s membership of the Eurasian Economic Union (EEU). If the draft is adopted, Armenia’s system of government is going to differ from those of the other countries in the EEU, and it is going to be harder for Russia to control it.

It is no coincidence that it was after his meeting with Putin on September 3, 2013, that Sargsyan spoke about the changes for the first time. That was the meeting during which he was pushed to join the EEU. The changes are a compromise with the west, but regardless of that, Sargsyan and the RPA inserted provisions in the draft that are intended to protect their narrow group interests.

The saddest part of this story is that Armenian society has not yet found a way to protect its interests and effectively participate in this process. This society, which is straining under its post-soviet burden, is caught in the middle of its past, and rapidly spreading consumerism. But there is one contradiction which attracts my attention - (as unfortunate as it may be) if the draft is adopted, the actual situation in Armenia will be formalized, and people will lose their hope for justice which, even though it was non-existent in reality, was nonetheless written down in the current constitution. And now intellectuals capable of critical thinking can only ponder upon what can be done when a nation, having lost its vision of justice, rises up.