Does anyone feel like me?

[Mukuch]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

I originally posted that when I saw your comment of professional help. You slipped in the gay part before my post went up. And no, I'm not gay.

Are you?

Perhaps your also a devious snake upset that I am exposing you?

Even if I would be I wouldnt tell you

.... Expose me? I do not live in Glendale. Not even in the same continent. The only one you are exposing is yourself. Your inability of see any thing positive in your own people (if we believe you are an Armenian, what is very doubtful). You are a person who has no roots and does not have minimal idea of Armenian culture and History. You care only about very primitive and superficial things. You are a typical representation of what you hate yourself. You are from there and you belong there. But that has nothing to do with being of Armenian origin. You could be Mexican or Irish but still would be a trash.

[Ideology]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

I originally posted that when I saw your comment of professional help. You slipped in the gay part before my post went up. And no, I'm not gay.

Are you?

Perhaps your also a devious snake upset that I am exposing you?

[Mukuch]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

I knew it was only a matter of time before a covert insult was posted

Is asking about sexual orientation is a covered insult? I think your existence is a covered insult to Armenians.

[Ideology]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

I knew it was only a matter of time before a covert insult was posted

[Mukuch]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

It is hard to find fine Armenians for me. bla bla bla....

Are you a gay?

[Mukuch]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

Living so long in Glendale has ruined my opinion on SoCal Armenians. True, it gets better the further you get away. bla bla bla...

I think you need professional help. We can’t help you. Sorry.

[Ideology]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

Living so long in Glendale has ruined my opinion on SoCal Armenians. True, it gets better the further you get away. But just because Armenians are better out there than Glendale, they still need to acknowledge there personal problems (as a culture).

For example. When 2 adults meet often. Each adult has to be an adult and respect the next mans opinion of him or her. In another words, nobody should be obligated to like the next person over. This problem is throughout the world btw, not just Armenians, but I have seen too much of it in our culture.

Idealy, each man or woman should be likeable, not controlling. So, smart people that I have ran into, and usually happy people as well, make themselves as likeable and easy going as they possibly can. If the relationship moves forward, great. If not, then it needs to be evaluated. But the last thing one should do, like some Armenians are doing, is force you to like them out of fear of rebuke, humilation, or character assassination (though gossiping, ect..). Some Armenians are very unlikeable and yet they thing you are in the wrong for disliking them. These are usually the vicious types who unscupiously are willing to do whatever it takes, wrong or right, to get their way. The problem here lies that they may or may not get there way on the spot, but they make themselves out to be unlikeable. Other "adults" will no longer feel comfortable around another controlling type person. Eventually people of this nature lose everything, including self value, friends, and family which further lowers their self esteem. I have seen this problem accross Los Angeles as a whole, not just Armenians. But I am more concerned about Armenians than the rest of em, at least until we are a functional culture in SoCal.

As far as the quote that Armenians have assimilated in SoCal, since this is a hotspot for fake and devious people, this is partly true. But why not make a higher standard of ourselves so that others follow our lead. Instead, Armenians in So Cal have become the worst of the bunch, under the misconception that it is the right thing to do. This makes me very sad and embarrased. We are taking things in such an extreme that it is ruining our name, or has already ruined it. We need to hit the bottom soon so we can flip our thinking and go on the right path as a whole. SoCal is mainly White American, Mexican, Armenian, and Asian. The White Americans, Mexicans, and Armenians have some of hte most serious cultural problems I have ever seen, and therefore this mix has destroyed the SoCal culture as a whole, and a long time ago. Asians are more to themselves and out of the picture.

I find a solution in a society like this unlikely for the foreseeable future. But as sociological history proves, all have to hit a bottom before it ever gets any better. And being Armenian, our bottom is way too low. How long are we going to sit on rusty nails? How long before it hurts enough for us to stand up?

Seems like a long time before these issues are universally fixed. Ignoring the facts is a bad idea as well. A fair assessment of the situation is a beginning to a brighter future. Good ideas are contagious. My idea of a better future is to first acknowledge the situation and stop denying it. I'm tired of hearing that out of the 150+ countries in the world, Armenians are the best. This is an outragious statement. The sad part of this situation, as well, is the fact that we don't really have any rolemodel type culture that is large enough in SoCal to define the meaning of a functional culture. Crime and hatred is rampid accross SoCal. Although, as sociology may predict, the rest of the country, both small and large towns, discluding Las Vegas, is much more functional than SoCal is. Therefore, it would be a matter of time before the other 90% of the country absorbs and spits out cultural problems in SoCal. Although this will take time. As generations pass, the younger generations adopt a better way. I have already seen these concepts with my own eyes amongst 18 year old Armenians.

One plan of action for everyone would be to look up to happy people. Geniune happy people know somethign the rest of the world doesn't. I have already seen this to have a positive in my own life. Those grumpy, loser looking rabizes should never be looked at as rolemodels, lest the fool desires to ruin any chances of a successful, happy life.

[ArmSurvival]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

Ideology,

In your first post you said that Armenians in SoCal are untrustworthy, devious, etc, and the reason for this was they haven't assimilated into American culture. Then in your last post you said that SoCal's culture is fake and that it is a spiritual slum, and you even made a list of negative characteristics of SoCal culture. So basically, those Armenians you are criticising have already fully assimilated into the local culture.

Plus, your criticism is very generalized, as the vast majority of Armenians I have met do not fit this profile. I don't know a single Beirutsi family that comes close to matching your description, and most of the Hayastanci families don't behave this way, either. Correct me if I'm wrong, but your criticism seems to apply mainly to Glendale Armenians.

Don't misunderstand me though. I think you touch on some important points which need to be confronted. But we shouldn't pretend like most Armenians fit your description, or that Armenians are the only ones who have some of their population behaving this way. We shouldn't put odars on a pedestal, either.

Here is some of what I experienced in the many different places I have lived:
Marijuana is very much used by both men and women. You can even ask a normal looking person on the street and he may direct you in the right direction. I don't know if this is a good or bad thing.

So marijuana is not used by many people in SoCal? Do you live in a parish with monks?

California is one of the few places in the world where you can legally buy marijuana, and its use is widespread. Դեր ին՞չ կ՛ուզես:

[Gavur]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

Hey all. I am an Armenian American who is as Armenian as I am American. I value the idea of acculturation and assimulation into the American lifestyle. But here is what I have felt since a teenager. I am quite embarrassed of the Armenians in Southern California. Many of the men are deceitful, un-honorable, backstabbing, gangsta dressing, chevunistic pig like, woman bashing, con artist, cigerette smoking, having low self esteems (yet covering up for it), badly dressed, uncooperative, drama starting, nuerotic, evil thinking, money worshipping, and have superiority complex.

Now the women are devious, snakish, deceitful, man hating, personality lacking, anti-fun, miserable, hateful, non-flirtatious, power hungry, unhonorable, sneaky, valueless, and spiriteless women.

The dating life between Armenian men and women is almost non existant compared to other races.

The level of trust in groups of Armenians is at least childishly sad.

The immaturity of adult Armenians makes you think they are teenagers stuck in a 30 year old mans body.

The reflection given back to other races in Southern Cali is disgraceful and bad for our diaspora as far as oppurtinities go.

And to top it off, most Armenians are very nuerotic and will do almost anything for the tiniest, weeniest bit of power over another Armenian. While Armenians are going after crumbs, other races are going after mountains of wealth while in complete cooperation of each other.

Armenians burn and betray each other like it's a sport. They only team up when there is a common enemy.

Armenians outside of Southern California talk about how So Cal Armenians eat each other for lunch.

Armenians take pride in being devious. One Armenian name I saw a female have in an Armenian dating site was "Vicious". She was obviously proud of the fact that she was, at least, trying to be vicious. Who in their right mind would respond to an ad like that?

Armenians in So Cal seem to be in a constant state of fear, and mental anguish, yet are unwilling to admit their problems in fear of being ridiculed.

Armenians in So Cal are in heavy denial.

There is a lot of mental abuse going on in most Armenian homes, that is done in such a covert way, noone can prove it. Parents mentally abuse their children as they were once abused, and the children pass that on to their kids.

I never see Armenians genuinly happy for each other. There always is a sense of jealousy.

In this community, the book lover is labeled a nerd, the enthusiastic girl is labeled a xxxxx, the man who dresses like a gentlemen is labeled a p**ssy, the divorced elder woman who desires to get married is labeled a xxxxx or a milf, the less aggressive men are labeled gay, the kind loving girl who is happy in life is also labeled a xxxxx, the personality or character types are demonized for their valueable asset of self expression, and the list goes on.

Brothers don't even trust each other. There is havoc in homes. Children are taught to disassociate with "otars".

God forbid if an Armenian man dates an Asian or Black. As if they are subhuman.

Armenian women are forced to have sexual intercourse with otars due to their fear of being labeled a xxxxx.

Armenian women like black men for their uncanny ability of self expression, which is highly lacking in Armenian men.

We are all taught to be boring, unenthusiastic fools or else we are ridiculed.

Children don't have the oppurtinity to discover themselves.

Hell, I can keep going with this.

To me, the Armenian community in So Cal is a frieking disaster! And we are in constant denial of it as if we are doing good for the community in denying it.

We are taught to be self serving, self serving, or selfish pigs with no personalities or love towards anyone. No culture on earth is spiritually seperated as we are. We try to justify ourselves by pointing at a handful of flaws other cultures have, and yet, ignore the enourmous amount of flaws right here in our own culture!

For heaven's sake. I am Armenian. I have able to see this and speak freely about it, no matter the reprucutions. The only way to fix something is first to acknowledge it, not deny it or cover it up.

I have befriended all races and creeds. Each race has had its own set of problems, but..... nothing, and I mean nothing compared to the problems we have. For a long time, we have denied many of our intercultural problems, and therefore, they were never fixed, and therefore, they are exploding in size and number. This is drowning all Armenians, and giving no hope to the future Armenians.

We need to encourage diversity and practice a bit of brotherly love, and respect for Gods sake. Not put each other down anytime we rise, or express ourselves. And I'm not talking about hatred disguised as love. Real respect towards each other is considered honorable amongst any other race. Respect is respect. We need to remember, we weren't born perfect and we can't put down those who are in their growth process, even if they make mistakes. If we are accepting gay Armenian in the community, then why not just accept all Armenians? Why not only befriend Armenians with an open mind and a clean spirit? They are hard to find, very. I personally only discriminate against those I find to be mean spirited, jealous, and malicious. These are disgusting qualities to have. I personally befriend loving, confident, respectful, easy going, caring, and optimistic people. And I find them to be so often the successful ones!

When and how are we all going to learn these qualities? How many years of torment do we have to bring on our own kind until we realize that this isn't working? How many years of public humiliation while other races are calling us God damn morons because they see these horrible qualities in us? How many times have you overheard them saying how much they hate us? And believe me, they know how vicious Armenians are and wouldn't dare say it near one, so if you have heard it, it's only a tiny percentage of all the hatred they have for us. And NO, its not because they are "hatin" or jealous like many Armenians think! It's because they think we are evil... and in evil there is darkness, and in darkness everyone is blind and falls over their own two feet. This is the biggest problem. Armenians have it all confused. Instead of being proud to be decieftful, vicious, money loving, gangsta, or whatever, we need to be proud of being as honorable as we possibly can be, like much of the rest of the world thinks. Holy sh*t, when are we going to learn? How many times does the criminal have to go to jail, get gang raped, beaten, and betrayed to see that crime doesn't pay? Do you see what I am saying? It's a horrible situation - at least here in SoCal it is.

To be fair, I am prominently talking about SoCal. I have heard the Armenians in Armenia are in much better shape than we are here. And also, I would like to proclaim that I am Armenian. And I am Hayastanci, probably the Armenian type with the most severe of all problems. I have personally faced my demons and confirmed my own problems as I was growing up, and I have done everything and anything to be as honorable of a person as I can be, which cleaned up most of my problems overtime.

The idea is not to be the snake, but to be the sheep, and yet be sharper than the snake (verse in Bible).

There is no honor, no value, and no pride in being a snake. Especially one dressed in sheeps clothing.

Again, this is on behalf of SoCal Armenians. I have seen some beautiful Armenians in Europe and still have to vacation in Armenia. This is from the bottom of my heart. I can forsee further damaging affects on the psyches' of Armenians if this mayham continues. Also, I know that not Armenians are like this. But here is something you have to realize. Even if 20% are as described, that is 1 out of every 5 Armenians! That means if you go into a room full of 50 Armenians, the 10 wandering around screw it up for the rest of us!

To be successful in a culture, the bottom class should be at 3% or lower.

Speaking of class, shame on those who practice evil and yet claim to be high class. Being high class isn't the way you dress or how well you pronouce words you moron, its about honor and value.

And if you are one of the uncofident types. Suck it up and practice the art of honor. Don't let anything turn you into a classless piece of xxxx. Because if you think you have problems now, wait until you fully depreciate in being one of the classless types. It gets much worst.

The one thing I've learned in life is that when one attempts to gain honor, he gains strength. One who attempts to be a danger to others, end up dying in shame and in dishonor, and probably spiritually alone and unhappy.

I hope this is read with an open mind. And please no stupid comments with gangsta talk, profanity, or put downs. If you want to discuss this intellectually, feel free to agree or disagree like an adult would.

Thank you

I think you're being too hard on your self.Expect all from all people, condone none.Do not judge, so yee be not judged.

[Ideology]

Re: Does anyone feel like me?

It is hard to find fine Armenians for me. My standards come from what I have experienced in other cultures. The flawless friendships I've had with many non Armenian friends were priceless. People you can put your guards down with, people who do good deeds for you (for no apparant reason at all), people who believe in honor and respect, people who are disgusted with stupid people and stay away from them. I was highly touched by such friends and suprised to ask why and how this is possible? Some of them barely knew me at first and yet acted like my brothers or sisters. I must clear up that these non Armenian friends were from outside the SoCal area, ranging anywhere from New York to Western Europe. LA.... all and all, I find this joint to be screwed up all around and Armenians are not quite learning what the American, the real American life is all about here. Mix Armenian problems with the sole region of the US (SoCal) that is absolutely fake, and it's a disaster scenario. Again, the 30 or so friends I've had in a multitude of areas were incredible and the girlfriends I had in the meantime... There are no words to explain it. I found out with my first girlfriend that love does really exist and the way it feels is like pure exctacy. It fuels your fire to go conquer the world or work, or go to school, whatever. I can hardly describe how awesome real love is. Again, I never experienced this in SoCal with any Armenian before. Neither have I found friends worthy of being called brothers or sisters. Keep in mind, my world travel opened my eyes to a beautiful world and made SoCal look like a slum. A spiritual slum that is. The first thing I thought of when I got back here was, "People don't know what they are missing out on. They spend too much time being fake and devious, untrustworthy, and therefore never experience what the rest of the world does. They are missing out, and now I will miss out for being here." My standards went way up and out of the rooftop. If I never traveled, and lived for years in other areas, I would not know. A brief 4 week vacation doesn't educate one on how the regional culture is. It takes at least 6-12 months to know what you are actually dealing with. Incredible. One thing I noticed is that as time goes on, people are becoming more aware of the rest of the world. In the present and past, SoCal has been a very sad part of the US culture, and is considered by many outsiders to be, and I quote, the following:

"LA is Totally fake" - from girl at club
"Every state tries to be like LA, and does a great job at it, but when they come to LA, they realize it is nothing like they imagined." - Guy from Ohio who moved to LA
"I heard Armenians are very bad people. Is this true?" - My girlfriend
"California needs to fall off the map when the 10.0 quake hits" Friend and mentor
"SoCal is the black sheep of the US" - Business partner
"That place is horrible" - Armenian girl from SoCal who moved to Armenia and is now happily married to what she called a "Beautiful husband".
"Once I moved there, I moved right back out" - American friend
"LA is the toilet of the Armenian Diaspora" - Quoted from a forum
"This place is horrible" - relative who moved to Armenia
"I went to LA for a month long vacation. I spend $5000. I left 2 weeks later. It has now been a few months, and I am still trying to get over it". - successful woman from New York.

Do you see the problem here? I have 1st class experience being I spent 10 years out of this joint. And yes, I do plan on moving out again.

Here is some of what I experienced in the many different places I have lived:

Lots of trustworthy people.
People are absolutely real and don't even seem to have the capability of fakeness.
Everyone seems happy.
The envirement is very optimistic.
People are not judgemental unless you look like an absolute criminal.
Sex is no big deal. People make love all the time if they are attracted to each other. They also have sex at parties in bedrooms if they find someone they are highly attracted to. The downside to this is that girls usually have many partners before they get married and cheating is not as seriously bad as it is in LA. Also, there is not namecalling to girls who have sex. Everyone minds their own business.
Gossip is about 10% of what you find in LA.
Marijuana is very much used by both men and women. You can even ask a normal looking person on the street and he may direct you in the right direction. I don't know if this is a good or bad thing.
Dating is rampid. Girls and guys go crazy over each other at the clubs.
Cities are usually newer than they are here, being LA is an old city with old buildings, but so was New York.
Lot more opputunity out there.
Everywhere is relaxing with a very mature grade of people.
Segregation is almost non existant. Everyone hangs with everyone. Asians, latins, whites, europeans, no matter.
People are not in intence competition as they are in SoCal.
Money isn't everything, but it helps.
Classier envirements.
Crime is much less than LA.
Criminals are usually men desperate for money, but you couldn't tell they were criminals on the surface. Even they seem like nice guys.
People look innocent and it is very easy to find intellectual people to talk to.
Mind games - non existant.
Trouble makers get their asses beat. Over arrogant, selfish looking people get their asses beat too.
Before long, life is great.
Damn, the list goes on and on.

I think I have to make the move. I tried one last time to make LA work, but its way to pathetic. You can't even tell that people are fake anymore here. We get used to it. You would have to experience a real envirement (99% of the rest of world) to see what I mean.