Current Condition of Armenia

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

I still dont see who you mean?



I do notpray for bricks .. I pray for my Nation....

You can pray for TajMahal as well it is your busness....

Go up a few posts and you'll see. Your nation-state exists, more or less, because of Russian intervention in the 19th century. It is secure from any possible turkish attack today because of Russia, and it is supplied with cheap gas and weaponry because of the Kremlin and Russian elites favorable opinion of Armenia, and their strategic foresight.

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Not as much.



That will not happen with Turkey. Russia uses that scare tac to increase their control of the Armenian Republic. Azerbaijan is a problem that we can solve but not allowed.

What will not happen with turkey?

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Dashnaks might not like the Russian takeover of much of Armenia's strategic business and there has been thinly veiled criticism of Russia for this (seriously, which nationalist would approve of this?) but they recognise the importance Russia plays in Armenia's survival and are pro-Russian. Anyone who thinks otherwise has not been up to date with the organisation for the last decade. It was in Kocharyan's pro-Russian coalition for 10 years, opposes Western-approved Levonakan ANC, praised the renewal of the Russian base lease (this alone is already testament of their realism in relation to Russia) and when Azerbaijan was sold S-300s, Dashnaks recognised this as "Russia's right".

Yes, and they would realize even more the role Russia plays in Armenia and the wider region if they were ever to come to power. It would be political as well as national suicide if the ARF were to cast of Russian influence or attempt to do so.

[Mukuch]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Dashnaks might not like the Russian takeover of much of Armenia's strategic business and there has been thinly veiled criticism of Russia for this (seriously, which nationalist would approve of this?) but they recognise the importance Russia plays in Armenia's survival and are pro-Russian. Anyone who thinks otherwise has not been up to date with the organisation for the last decade. It was in Kocharyan's pro-Russian coalition for 10 years, opposes Western-approved Levonakan ANC, praised the renewal of the Russian base lease (this alone is already testament of their realism in relation to Russia) and when Azerbaijan was sold S-300s, Dashnaks recognised this as "Russia's right".

Wouldnt argue with any of this .... but declaring that Armenia existes just thanks to Russia is admiting our national inability for suverenity. Armenia depends of Russia becaus it is weak. Stronger we are less we need Russia. And just an idiot (or a person without any national identity) would pray for a foraighn state...

[Mukuch]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Go up a few posts and you'll see. Your nation-state exists, more or less, because of Russian intervention in the 19th century. It is secure from any possible turkish attack today because of Russia, and it is supplied with cheap gas and weaponry because of the Kremlin and Russian elites favorable opinion of Armenia, and their strategic foresight.

I have been there; still do not see...So what exactly russia did in 19 century? And what about 20th century? Armenia lost its independence becaus of Russia. Russian Bolsheviks gaiv away to turks Kars , to Azerbajan Karabakh and Nakhichevan. Lenin was an closest alie of Kemal and suplying him with arms. If not Bolshevik Russia probably turkish republic wouldnt exist. ithinks turks must be much more thankfull to russia...

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Wouldnt argue with any of this .... but declaring that Armenia existes just thanks to Russia is admiting our national inability for suverenity. Armenia depends of Russia becaus it is weak. Stronger we are less we need Russia. And just an idiot (or a person without any national identity) would pray for a foraighn state...

I can back up all of my statements with historical facts, events, and figures. Can you say the same? Armenia is weak relative to turkey, and will continue to remain so, if it were not for Russian backing Armenia would not be on the map. Do you remember what nation warned turkey against invading Armenia in 1993?

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

I have been there; still do not see...So what exactly russia did in 19 century? And what about 20th century? Armenia lost its independence becaus of Russia. Russian Bolsheviks gaiv away to turks Kars , to Azerbajan Karabakh and Nakhichevan. Lenin was an closest alie of Kemal and suplying him with arms. If not Bolshevik Russia probably turkish republic wouldnt exist. ithinks turks must be much more thankfull to russia...

Then you are blind. I will present you with some readings to do so you can catch up and know the facts as to what Russia did for Armenia and what their role has been in the Caucasus since the 19th century.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Turkmenchay

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-T...8%E2%80%931829)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Turkish_War_(1877%E2%80%931878)#The_Caucasian_Front

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Sarikamish

This last link is very important. The Russians with the aid of Armenians handed the turks a very brutal defeat, one which is still remembered to this day in turkey and is a sort of day of mourning. By the end of 1916 Russia controlled large areas of Western Armenia and had not the Revolution occured in 1917, Armenia would today be much larger and stronger.

Please let us not confuse bolsheviks with Russians. The Slavs of the ussr suffered more than any other people, and it is known that many of the bolsheviks were not even ethnic Russians but rather joos. On top of that the bolsheviks did not enjoy popular support, contrary to their name which means majority, and they were financed by western bankers and interests. Armenia lost its independence because it was weak and was forced to choose between the lesser of two evils, being overrun by the bolsheviks or the turks, the choice was pretty easy. Lenin wrongly thought that he could expand communism into turkey and therefore made nice with ataturd. And to be specific, it was stalin, an ethnic georgian, who redrew the map of the various soviet states and thus it was he who put Artsakh and Nackichevan in the azeri ssr. To dismiss the prior help which Russia had given to Armenia against the turks because of the bolsheviks is illogical and disingenuous.

And I didn't even get into the cultural, scientific/technological, and athletic aspects which Russia and later the ussr (to their credit) brought into Armenia.

[Mukuch]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

I can back up all of my statements with historical facts, events, and figures. Can you say the same? Armenia is weak relative to turkey, and will continue to remain so, if it were not for Russian backing Armenia would not be on the map. Do you remember what nation warned turkey against invading Armenia in 1993?

If you can back up any of you say please do so. On other hand if you not aware of the historical facts I brought up than you simply do not know history of your country (I mean Armenia not Russia I realy do not know who warned and who in 1993. I do not think that turkey would attack Armenia under any circumstances... turkey now days simply is not interested in Armenia that much... it has diferent priorities.

And declaring that Armenia always will be weaker than turkey is simply admiting defeat.

[Tigranakert]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

If you can back up any of you say please do so. On other hand if you not aware of the historical facts I brought up than you simply do not know history of your country (I mean Armenia not Russia I realy do not know who warned and who in 1993. I do not think that turkey would attack Armenia under any circumstances... turkey now days simply is not interested in Armenia that much... it has diferent priorities

Again a stupid Dashnak trying to learn someone politics? If there is one group who made dozens of mistakes regarding politics and Turks, it were the Dashnaks. You show the political immaturity most of the Dashnaks have. It is very dangerous for a country to have such a "revolutionary" group of people who are totally unaware of modern day realpolitik. The Dashnaks in The Netherlands demonstrate every year on 24 april, but if you ask them (and their children) something about Armenian history, modern day politics, Njdeh or Artsakh, they don't know xxxx. First and foremost they are Dashnaks, second they are Armenians. First they serve Dashnaktutyuun, after they serve Armenians.

And wake up, Turks will attack Armenia under any circumstance, if they have the chance. Which means if Russia gives the green light. One of their goals is to destroy the Armenian nation, and this policy continues to this day, led especially now by Azerbaijan which receives immense support of Turkey.

Death or freedom is your slogan, in your case it will be death.

[Armanen]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

If you can back up any of you say please do so. On other hand if you not aware of the historical facts I brought up than you simply do not know history of your country (I mean Armenia not Russia I realy do not know who warned and who in 1993. I do not think that turkey would attack Armenia under any circumstances... turkey now days simply is not interested in Armenia that much... it has diferent priorities

I just provided you with ample reading to do, which you should incorporate into your brain before posting on this topic again.

Russia warned turkey against invading Armenia. The turks were going to use the pretext of the NKR war in order to help the azeri scum and finish their business from 1915.
If turkey were really concerned about other things and wouldn't invade Armenia then why does it keep its border closed? Are you aware that under international law blockades or closing a border by one country against another is considered an act of war?

If given the chance and the right pretext turkey would invade Armenia, to deny this is to deny the nature of turks and their pan-turanist agenda. Now more than ever they have turned back to the Near East and Caucasus since the eu won't have them. Neo-ottomanism is alive and well; it is said the fm of turkey is the mastermind behind this new foreign policy initiative.