how do you write the word "guest"...

[xBaron Dants]

Hmm, I don't see what new vocabulary has to do with spelling...

It is retarded in the sense of old-fashioned. What's the use of spelling a word with a y when the y is either not even pronounced, or pronounced as a h, to give just one example? Reminds me of English: half the letters used in most words are completely useless. It's just this traditional thing that people want to hang on to, even though it's completely outdated, not to mention that it complicates things unnecessarily.

Plus, I was talking about Eastern Armenian. I follow East, because it's a lot more logical to the way I speak, and I don't see how this is creating a (political) gap between Easterners and Westerners. Western Armenian is taught to this day in Armenia. Nothing shows that Armenia is trying to eradicate that variety or degrade it. These are just myths made up by the diaspora who clearly either have their own agendas or have no idea what they're talking about. If it were true then school kids in Armenia wouldn't be reading Baronian and Varoujan in the original, or older Eastern writers like Tumanian and Isahakian.

About spelling and new vocabulary: while I have a certain interest in linguistics, I am definitely not a linguist, therefore the explanation I provide here may be blurry, and I am not equipped to give you a concise example either. Here is a simple one though:

The word ser (love). The verb is "sirel". Why is it not "serel"? Because "ser" is written with an "e" (7th letter), and not a "yech" (5th letter). The link between the root word, and the new word is therefore clear. While right now, nobody thinks twice before saying "sirel" instead of "serel", because the changes are new, things may not be as simple down the road, when the whole system used to create new words from root words is long forgotten. I don't know if you understand that, but you'll admit that I'm right 50 years from now ...unless I get around to bringing the changes so many intellectuals want to bring.

Who said anything about a political gap? Why insinuate that people have "secret agendas"? The difference in spelling created a gap between diasporans and Hayastantsis because the texts of one became more difficult for the other to read. A gap doesn't have to be political in order for it to be important. And this fear of people with "hidden agendas" while they just express an honest opinion is sad... Nobody's attempting to invade anything; don't lose any sleep over it.

[HyeJinx1984]

The only person with a hidden agenda is me.

[xBaron Dants]

The only person with a hidden agenda is me.

You always did strike me as odd.

So what are you hiding?

[HyeJinx1984]

You always did strike me as odd.

So what are you hiding?

You wanna see?

*Rips open his trench coat, shaking his hips around* HEHEHEHEHEEHEHEHHE!!!!! *closes his trench coat and runs off to go terrorize someone else*

[nairi]

Hey Baron, the difference between ser and sirel is one of morphology. Sirel is derived from ser, and as is very common for monosyllabic words in Armenian they "alter" when they're derived. Shun-shner, tun-tan, sut-stel, tiv-tver, kat-ktel etc.

As for sirel, srel is not as easy to pronounce as sirel, esp. over time... Like gir-girer, but girq-grqer.

As for the gap: I believe it's only there if you want it to be, and only we can create it. It is possible to stick to one English spelling system (American, Canadian or British) and understand and read the others. East and West Armenian spelling are not difficult to learn for someone who speaks either one of the varieties fluently.

[HyeJinx1984]

*flashes Nari* *Runs off*

[xBaron Dants]

Hey Baron, the difference between ser and sirel is one of morphology. Sirel is derived from ser, and as is very common for monosyllabic words in Armenian they "alter" when they're derived. Shun-shner, tun-tan, sut-stel, tiv-tver, kat-ktel etc.

As for sirel, srel is not as easy to pronounce as sirel, esp. over time... Like gir-girer, but girq-grqer.

As for the gap: I believe it's only there if you want it to be, and only we can create it. It is possible to stick to one English spelling system (American, Canadian or British) and understand and read the others. East and West Armenian spelling are not difficult to learn for someone who speaks either one of the varieties fluently.

Yes, morphology. Yet there are certain rules that must be applied, and the traditional spelling allows that.

I think that it is not statesmen that should be making such decisions, but linguists. When Hrachya Ajarian, probably one of the brightest Armenians and one of the brightest linguists ever, refused to accept those changes, and signed his name "Hrachya Ajar." in order to avoid writing the "yan" with a "hi" as opposed to a "yech", it was a clear sign that something was wrong. We have a beautiful language, and there was no use to toy around with it.

As for learning both spellings...it DOES become a burden. People must first cope with the different dialect, which is very doable, but when two different spellings are used, it becomes too hard for an Armenian kid in Canada or the USA to differentiate. How will they perform on dictations? Mix them both? It does get too complicated, and for no real reason. Now imagine if both the diaspora and Armenia used the same pronounciations (the Eastern one) and the same spelling (the Western one)...everything would become A LOT simpler, and we as a people, a lot stronger. I can guarantee that under such conditions, the number of Armenians speaking both dialects flently would increase dramatically.

[HyeJinx1984]

As for learning both spellings...it DOES become a burden. People must first cope with the different dialect, which is very doable, but when two different spellings are used, it becomes too hard for an Armenian kid in Canada or the USA to differentiate. How will they perform on dictations? Mix them both? It does get too complicated, and for no real reason. Now imagine if both the diaspora and Armenia used the same pronounciations (the Eastern one) and the same spelling (the Western one)...everything would become A LOT simpler, and we as a people, a lot stronger. I can guarantee that under such conditions, the number of Armenians speaking both dialects flently would increase dramatically.

I can relate to this very well, being a diasporan myself who was raised with Eastern Armenian, but learning western Armenian right now. It is a burden and we WOULD be a stronger people if we picked one. I don't understand why we don't.

[nairi]

I don't think it's possible All languages break into dialects eventually. Such is life...

As for the spelling: there were linguists involved in the changes, although it is true that the change was triggered by politics. You see this everywhere. Just the fact that countries have "standard" languages says enough. Trouble is that linguists will never agree even on one thing. Maybe that's why it's sometimes better to have non-linguists pick out what they think is best. But again, I'm not displeased with Standard Eastern Armenian at all. I find it a lot more logical and easier! than old Armenian.

Btw, I don't think lack of strength is or should be a result of language.

[xBaron Dants]

No no....We shouldn't pick one of the dialects. Both are rich, beautiful, and have huuuuge amounts of literature and culture attached to them. Both dialects should, and will be kept. All I'm saying is that we should have one pronounciation, and one writing.

As for non-linguists making the decisions, I disagree, mais bon, let's just agree to disagree on that.

The language is not THE reason for our lack of unity and strength, but is one of them.