Protest

[Reincarnated Am]

Armenians have slandered Turkish people on all of the World and damaging our honour

Honour??? what honour??????? when honour???? where honour???? and how honour????? you have a very dark history don't you read history????

[Anti-Armenian]

-

Come in Turkey.After see you.
OK?
hııııııııım
öhü öhü öhü!
xxxx You Daron MALAKİAN and Shavo Doddjian,Serj Tankian,John Dolmayan
xxxx you System of A down


hahahahah
muhahahahaha
I am a Turk.
De hadiiiiiiiiiiiii
Come on everybody

Anti-Armenian in Turkeyyyyyyy.........

[Hovik]

Anti, this is where the adults talk - like adults. Take your immaturity somewhere else.

[abian]

Then Russia, England and France forced armenians to fight against non christians in Anatolia. When men were fighting in Ottoman army, they killed women and babies. When the army turned back to stop the massacre, they ran back to mountains leaving their own villages alone. Seeing that their women had been killed by Armenian gangs, soldiers of Ottoman army attacked to Armenian villages for revenge. Ottoman state was very veek and could not control them. ... Then Ottoman government decided to move Armenians to another part of the country. .

The trouble with revising history is having to support revisions with facts. Forced deportation of an ethnic minority accompanied by massacres is the definition of genocide. You've actually admitted to it. The Turkish state had the army, the police, the railroads, the bureaucracy. Turkish Armenians had nothing of the kind. Employing the state resources to clean out an ethnic minority is genocide. What you are saying is that the Turkish state was justified in carrying out the genocide. There is no justification for genocide, there is no set of circumstances whatsoever which justifies exturpation of an entire ethnic group. It is a crime against humanity. If a state army turns against ethnic minorities and deports and massacres them - it's a crime against humanity, regardless of whether they thought they were justified or not. A proper response of a civilized state in response to a reported crime or crimes is to collect evidence and try the individuals responsible, not ethnically cleanse an entire ethnic group. What you are saying is that there was no due process of law, there was no proof of crimes committed, no identification of responsible individuals. You just say that because the Turkish Army and government thought (incorrectly as evidence shows) that some Armenians killed Muslims, they massacred and deported Armenians en masse. Well, that's pretty much a definition of a genocide.

[imported_Hellektor]

Me: Atwa you stole my car!
You: no i didnt.
Me: Stop liar (denialist) you stole it !
You: no i dint, lets go police station, i give a full accout of what was i doing at the time that u say your car is stolen.
Me: Stop talking useless xxxx denialist monster. Admit (recognize) your guilt!
(generation passes, i brainwash my kids that u stole my car, they grew with hatred of you)
My grandchildren: Atwa admit your guilt, you stole my granfathers car !
You: I will never accept something i didnt !!!
Mygrand children 100% sure of what I did brainwashed them, turns into hatred-driven, traumatized dudes who think thay they were victimized !!

If you tell a lie 100 times, You, yourself also, start to think whether it was real, let alone other people.

I have posted the following in another thread, I paste it here since it fits this revisionist Turk's predictable garbage and will save me some valuable time:
"One thing Turks don't want to understand is that Armenians according to all historic facts, maps, monuments (being destroyed until this very day), etc. were living in the region Turks so willingly avoid calling by it's real name: Armenia. Then the Turks came and after centuries of tyranny and abuse, decided to eliminate the indigenous people, the Armenians, to realize their sick dream of pan-Turkism.
To reiterate the whole thing:
Armenians were living in their homeland for thousands of years then the Turks came and removed them (whether they served them soft drinks and barbecue or drank their blood and barbecued them in the desert is another question), now the Armenians do not live in their homeland anymore. By any definition, this means GENOCIDE."

But Armenians do.
Because they afraid that the truth will come out.

From the same post:
"If it's hurting the Turks, they may call it ediconeg if they please, by presenting events upside down, the truth does not change. "

Armeians are grieving today, because after living 500 years in the ottoman empire, they betrayed for nothing, and they need to "raionalize" this betrayel not to feel guilty.

From the same post again:
"Another thing that's been repeated ad nauseam, is the self-righteous nauseating rubbish that "Turks and Armenians lived like brothers for centuries and suddenly the Armenians revolted and got punished for their acts of treason". I'm stupefied by this illogical "reasoning" and the sad reality that the Turk hasn't evolved in the past thousand years. Have you ever reflected for a moment that you were NOT WELCOME and that you were INVADERS and that the "subjects" LOATHED YOU right from the moment you arrived UNINVITED and razed everything to cinders, burned thousands of priceless manuscripts, killed and raped every living thing in sight and that for a thousand years....

In his "Risale" (report) presented to sultan Murad IV in 1631-1632, among others Koçi Bey writes:

"In the beginning 40 to 50 akce was imposed on each household as "avaris". Today 240 akce per capita as "cizye", another 300 per household as "avaris" and an akce for every sheep as sheep tax is being imposed...How can the "raya" tolerate such oppression..."

"Devsirme", the collecting and conversion of Christians, mainly for janissary purposes, that went on from 15th to 17th centuries, expressed itself as legitimized oppression. According to Selaniki the Turkish annals writer: "The rulers of the time were ruthless in recruiting children... Like wolves attacking sheep, they mercilessly assaulted the "raya" in the land."

There's endless evidence that the Ottoman tyranny was not as "tolerant" and "friendly" as Turks want us to believe. One needs to research this abysmally cruel period that halted the normal cultural, social, economic, etc. development of Armenians. Just think of all the poets, writers, intellectuals and politicians that were arrested on 24 April 1915 and brutally murdered soon afterwards."

atwa,
How many Armenians died on the relocation process?

In yet another post I write:
"And I want to warn everyone not to fall in the trap of the numbers game. It's not about how many people died. It's about the irrefutable fact that Armenians lived in Armenia for thousands of years, then the Turks invaded their homeland and from day one they brought nothing but death and destruction."

So you see that Turks always regurgitate the same revisionist crap and do not use their brains for a moment to see things from an objective angle. By the way someone in this forum has already pointed out this seeing-things-from-a-single-angle Turkish disease.

Thos who moved USA thinks his all relatives killed, most probably this "killed relative" is leaving in some other country. The relative in some other country thinks that relatives that moved to USA were also killed by monster the Turks.
So, now we are actually talking with zombies, all whom Armenians assume dead! Because they grew up from ground, in their newe countries

By the above quote I want to emphasize the insolent tone of the Turks that gives away their intolerant and hateful character acquired through brainwash or innate to Turkish nature.

What happened in WWI was a e revolt (that is a war) by Armenians, and the Ottoman Governments self-defence measures (relocation) since it cannot declare war on its own people.

Finally yet pasting from another of my posts:
"Only what doesn't make sense is how come the armed to the teeth Armenian rebels did not rebel against their butchers and walked like sheep to roast in the desert."

[human]

I have posted the following in another thread, I paste it here since it fits this revisionist Turk's predictable garbage and will save me some valuable time:
"One thing Turks don't want to understand is that Armenians according to all historic facts, maps, monuments (being destroyed until this very day), etc. were living in the region Turks so willingly avoid calling by it's real name: Armenia. Then the Turks came and after centuries of tyranny and abuse, decided to eliminate the indigenous people, the Armenians, to realize their sick dream of pan-Turkism.
To reiterate the whole thing:
Armenians were living in their homeland for thousands of years then the Turks came and removed them (whether they served them soft drinks and barbecue or drank their blood and barbecued them in the desert is another question), now the Armenians do not live in their homeland anymore. By any definition, this means GENOCIDE."


From the same post:
"If it's hurting the Turks, they may call it ediconeg if they please, by presenting events upside down, the truth does not change. "


From the same post again:
"Another thing that's been repeated ad nauseam, is the self-righteous nauseating rubbish that "Turks and Armenians lived like brothers for centuries and suddenly the Armenians revolted and got punished for their acts of treason". I'm stupefied by this illogical "reasoning" and the sad reality that the Turk hasn't evolved in the past thousand years. Have you ever reflected for a moment that you were NOT WELCOME and that you were INVADERS and that the "subjects" LOATHED YOU right from the moment you arrived UNINVITED and razed everything to cinders, burned thousands of priceless manuscripts, killed and raped every living thing in sight and that for a thousand years....

In his "Risale" (report) presented to sultan Murad IV in 1631-1632, among others Koçi Bey writes:

"In the beginning 40 to 50 akce was imposed on each household as "avaris". Today 240 akce per capita as "cizye", another 300 per household as "avaris" and an akce for every sheep as sheep tax is being imposed...How can the "raya" tolerate such oppression..."

"Devsirme", the collecting and conversion of Christians, mainly for janissary purposes, that went on from 15th to 17th centuries, expressed itself as legitimized oppression. According to Selaniki the Turkish annals writer: "The rulers of the time were ruthless in recruiting children... Like wolves attacking sheep, they mercilessly assaulted the "raya" in the land."

There's endless evidence that the Ottoman tyranny was not as "tolerant" and "friendly" as Turks want us to believe. One needs to research this abysmally cruel period that halted the normal cultural, social, economic, etc. development of Armenians. Just think of all the poets, writers, intellectuals and politicians that were arrested on 24 April 1915 and brutally murdered soon afterwards."


In yet another post I write:
"And I want to warn everyone not to fall in the trap of the numbers game. It's not about how many people died. It's about the irrefutable fact that Armenians lived in Armenia for thousands of years, then the Turks invaded their homeland and from day one they brought nothing but death and destruction."

So you see that Turks always regurgitate the same revisionist crap and do not use their brains for a moment to see things from an objective angle. By the way someone in this forum has already pointed out this seeing-things-from-a-single-angle Turkish disease.


By the above quote I want to emphasize the insolent tone of the Turks that gives away their intolerant and hateful character acquired through brainwash or innate to Turkish nature.


Finally yet pasting from another of my posts:
"Only what doesn't make sense is how come the armed to the teeth Armenian rebels did not rebel against their butchers and walked like sheep to roast in the desert."

You say there was no country called azerbaijan before 1918. This does not mean that azeris had been living there before that time. You say turks has invaded Armenia and the real name of that place is Armenia. I think first, some Kurds and Armenians like you must come together and decide whether this land is Armenia or Kurdistan because both maps are matching each other at least 80%. By the way we can go on ruling this land like we have been doing since 10th century

This is the nature of human kind. You can see several samples of invasion. What about Ireland? What about invasion of Amerika by white men? What about several invasions happened in the past. What about invasion of Iraq by USA? What about Palestine? And so on...

[Tongue]

You say there was no country called azerbaijan before 1918. This does not mean that azeris had been living there before that time. You say turks has invaded Armenia and the real name of that place is Armenia. I think first, some Kurds and Armenians like you must come together and decide whether this land is Armenia or Kurdistan because both maps are matching each other at least 80%. By the way we can go on ruling this land like we have been doing since 10th century

Don't compare our case to Kurds. Armenians owned those lands, they used to live in those lands and they once paid from those lands before your nationalistic government decided to remove them from their homes to the desert. Those lands now, legally, belong to their descendants. Also, where was Kurdistan when the region was called Ancient Armenia?

[imported_Hellektor]

It's all about being human...

Before I answer your questions let me just tell you what we Armenians are trying to achieve by such forums.
We want the world to know about the terrible genocide we suffered in the hands of your ancestors and we are sincerely hoping to win your hearts as well, in order that you also face your history and start to become a part of civilized humanity and shake off the "barbarian Turk" definition that also hurts you but you don't want to admit it. (At least this is what I believe, because I try to convince myself that Turks are human after all.)
We know the truth of what happened to our people and all the painful events in our history, because of the geographic situation of Armenia and the (possibly not so good trait of) reluctance of Armenians regarding territorial expansion and invasion of others.
Throughout millennia Assyrians, Persians (I'm an Iranian Armenian and proud of both cultures), Romans, Greeks, Arabs, Seljuk to Ottoman Turks (and all the gang in between), Russian Czarist and Bolshevik empires have invaded Armenia and our not so lucky circumstances have made unbelievable survivors of us.
What you are doing in Armenian forums however, does not make sense.
You are regurgitating the official views of your denialist government. I really do not understand how on earth you believe that you can change the views of Armenians towards their historic reality which is reflected in all aspects of our culture. The reason I am often sarcastic is the fact that I'm sick of hearing the same clichés repeated by Turks who don't, for a moment, want to see things from a different angle. Otherwise, I have no enmity towards you and in a better world we might have even been best friends.
Trust me, in almost all our songs, dances, paintings, poems, novels, historic records, etc. the pain caused by the Turks and the Kurds is reflected, and all that has not started in 1915. For instance, Raffi, the founder of modern Armenian novel genre died in 1888, before the Hamidian genocide took place and before the Dashnaktsoutioun party was founded. And he has a lot to tell us about the crimes the Kurds and the Turks were perpetrating against Armenians. Now in your response:

You say there was no country called azerbaijan before 1918. This does not mean that azeris had been living there before that time.

"This does not mean that azeris had been living there before that time" Indeed!! Slip of the tongue or a mistake? Doesn't really matter.
A nation called Azeri has NEVER existed throughout history. They too have based their history on lies, and revisionist thugs like Zia Bunyatov are the main culprits. He rewrote the history of the region by changing the word Armenian to Albanian where possible and deleted it were not possible.
Azari is the term used by Arab historians to designate the language of the indigenous people of the region north-west of Iran, which was then a dialect of Pahlavi Persian. This term was later applied to the language of by then Turkified people of the real Azarbaijan in order to separate it from the Ottoman Turkish. I even remember as a kid, Turkish speaking Iranians didn't like to be called Turks so they called themselves Azaris.
The now "Azeri" "nation" are in fact tribes brought together under the denomination of a nation by the bolsheviks to satisfy the Turks who had invaded the Caucasus in early 20th century. I'll explain the circumstances in more detail if you would like me to.
It's ironic that the origin of the word Azarbaijan is traced back to the language family (Indo-European) the Turks always refer to as a proof of the "non"-ethnicity of the people of the real Azarbaijan. After Alexander's victory over Darius III and the fall of the Achemenide empire, Iran came under the Seleucid rule soon after Alexander's death. However, a satrap named Atropat (Atropates) established an independent state in the northwest region of Iran (known as Median Iran) which from then on was called Aturpayegan or Aturpadegan (in Old Persian or Parthian) after him. After some 23 centuries, the region is still called Atrpatakan in Armenian as opposed to Adrbeijan which is used to designate the bogus state north of the region.

I include this fragment of a map I have assembled in Photoshop, drawn in 1870's by a German cartographer called Kiepert. You can see the whole map (you have to assemble the pieces though) on www.euratlas.com
Sadly, I had to really reduce the size and the quality of the map to attach it, but I have uploaded a larger file to the gallery.

As you can see, Armenia figures on this map where it should be, as a matter of fact it was always there even in maps done in the Ottoman tyranny. As you can see clearly, only the western part of today's Turkey is called Anadoly (Anatolia), and I'm seriously offended when I hear the term Eastern Anatolia, so if you have some decency you'll avoid it. It's just rubbish and a post-Genocide invention and another proof that a very bad thing did happen.
By the way, you can see clearly that a country called Azerbaijan north of Arax river DOES NOT EXIST. Aderbeijan is referred to the north-western part of Iran where it has always been, as you can see. Armenia is limited in the east by Kur (Koorosh) river, and by Arax in the south-east. On the right side of Kur to the north you can see Shirwan which was called Aghvank (Albania, I suspect some deliberate intention in using this term, real Albanians being Muslims and Balkan...) before the Arab invasion. This makes not only Artsakh and Nakhijevan historic and legitimate parts of Armenia, but as you can see the whole liberated region "Azeris" claim as "occupied Azeri territory! (look who's talking)", and some, are also inside Armenia. This makes "Azerbaijan" the real occupier, whose bogus existence is founded on other people's land.

You say turks has invaded Armenia and the real name of that place is Armenia. I think first, some Kurds and Armenians like you must come together and decide whether this land is Armenia or Kurdistan because both maps are matching each other at least 80%.

You say it's called Armenia! "...You say turks has invaded Armenia..."
It is sad indeed that Kurds, after having caused us so much pain, on one side pretend to regret their evil deeds, on the other side claim Armenian territory. Anyway, a state called Kurdistan has never existed in history and you do not worry about this matter.

By the way we can go on ruling this land like we have been doing since 10th century

"...we can go on ruling this land... " Another slip of the tongue or are you doubting your invincibility?
Unfortunately, this confirms what we think of Turks, i.e. they still haven't evolved in the last thousand years. And still I have to disappoint you. As I wrote earlier we have seen them all come and go. And since not only you don't learn from history, you don't even want to accept it, you'll go sooner than you think. Without the hundreds of billions of American dollars wasted on the Sick Man of Europe, it would have died a thousand deaths by now. It's just a matter of time, America is nothing in terms of duration and expansion compared to the Romans and it's dependent on oil. How are they going to use all the phallic symbols of power -tanks, missiles, fighter planes, aircraft carriers, etc. they so proudly parade to hide the fact that America is just a paper tiger? All that will be just tas de ferraille as the French so beautifully put it.

This is the nature of human kind. You can see several samples of invasion. What about Ireland? What about invasion of Amerika by white men? What about several invasions happened in the past. What about invasion of Iraq by USA? What about Palestine? And so on...

"...This is the nature of human kind..." Human kind... You start philosophizing and then you ruin everything by uttering some idiotic rhetorical questions! Turkish destructive nature, or what?
What about them? This by no means puts you off the hook, worse, they all have either addressed the issues or they are disgraced in the eyes of humanity. You cannot justify genocide by pointing fingers at others. Just read it yourself: "What about Ireland? What about invasion of Amerika", it really sounds pathetic and stupid. I honestly don't think you are this stupid, only you have put your head in the sand and you don't want to hear and see the truth.

Here's the link to the map fragment:

http://www.armeniangenocide.com/photos/showphoto.php/photo/83

[imported_Hellektor]

Insolent Ignorance Part One

You do not need to win our hearts because I have not met a Turkish citizen who hates Armenians yet. We have nothing wrong about you. Maybe there are some fanatics which have been created by yourselves as a resistance to what you have been saying.

You "have not met a Turkish citizen who hates Armenians", then check the Genocide pictures thread and pray tell, the "Turkish citizen"s who did these despicable atrocities that words are unable to describe, and no beast would ever do to it’s own kind or to any other species, did it out of love?

I believe peacefull people of Anatolia is a part of civilized humanity. We need to think on the meaning of civilization. For the last 2 centuries, all the deaths and pains have been coming from western emperialist countries directly or indirectly. If the civilization is what Europe and USA has been doing, be sure that I am not belonged to that kind of bloody civilization.

I don't believe the "peacefull people of Anatolia" have anything to do with the current occupiers of the region. By the way, as I have already told you, by Anatolia I understand the region west of Armenia.
Check these historic maps to see what I mean.

Philippe de La Rue: Asia Minor 1652 (Section)

Kiepert: Asian Turkey 1872 (Section)

Regarding imperialists: I have already expressed my views of the American Empire.
"America is nothing in terms of duration and expansion compared to the Romans and it's dependent on oil. How are they going to use all the phallic symbols of power -tanks, missiles, fighter planes, aircraft carriers, etc. they so proudly parade to hide the fact that America is just a paper tiger? All that will be just tas de ferraille as the French so beautifully put it." Still, what would you do without them, aren’t you aware of your dependence on the filthiest of all these imperialists The USA, Britain and Israel?

To hell with all past and present empires

If you do not change your views, why shall I change mines? You have your rights, I have my rigths. You do not want to discuss, you only want to have us accept. First convince, then let us believe. If you have the right to be sarcastic, I also have the right to be sarcastic. The cliches??? What about your cliches? Standart sentences? You are also really paranoiac. You think every nations have been fighting against you, invaded your country. First ancient nations, then ottomans and kurds, then soviet russians and then azeris.

It's up to you whether you want to face your history, "You have your rights". But then you have to answer me what you are doing in Armenian forums. What is your purpose? What are you trying to achieve?
Besides, don’t misunderstand or misinterpret me. By mentioning the invaders I was pointing out to the fact that we have seen them all come and go and you are no exception. History is a continuum and it will only end when human beings cease to exist.
And what gave you the idea that I ever considered “Azeris” as a nation? I have dealt with this subject in an earlier reply so let’s skip this for the time being.

"Standart sentences?" If you read all my posts then you'll see that they aren't that standard after all.

You contradict yourself in two consecutive paragraphs and want me to believe that you are a balanced person"???"

I. You smear civilizations and empires:
"all the deaths and pains have been coming from western emperialist countries directly or indirectly. If the civilization is what Europe and USA has been doing, be sure that I am not belonged to that kind of bloody civilization"

II. then you defend them:
"You think every nations have been fighting against you, invaded your country. First ancient nations, then ottomans and kurds, then soviet russians"

And I don't " think every nations have been fighting against" us, " invaded" our "country". They have and I have explained why:
"because of the geographic situation of Armenia and the...reluctance of Armenians regarding territorial expansion and invasion of others."
Your unawareness of the Armenian history doesn't turn the millennia long invasions into paranoia.

It might be better for you to have good relations with your neighbouring nations in stead of running after an old and sick dream.

I put the above quotation to you, because it's your government who has imposed a decade (and some) long embargo on Armenia and is still "running after an old and sick dream" called Pan-Turkism.

I really do not worry about anything (Look I am also sarcastic)

Good for you! (There, you even got a smiley out of me)

You said you are sometimes sarcastic. I am also sometimes sarcastic.

Anatolian nation including Eastern Anatolia is the only one on earth who could have never been ruled as a colony and who won the first and single battle against the emperialists.

"Anatolian nation including Eastern Anatolia is the only one" is the utmost fascist statement coming from you till now and you reveal your true Pan-Turkist Genocidal colors. There is no such thing as "Anatolian nation" and many different nations used to live in Asia Minor who suffered the Genocidal policy of your intolerant species.
These days we see a lot of Kyrgyz and Uzbek faces on TV. Your ancestors came from this part of the world and the fact that the majority of today's Turks don't look anything like these, is the strongest proof of your centuries long rape, stealing of women and children (for harems, janissary or to abuse as slaves among other things) and forced turkification. I haven't seen your face but if you don't look like the Uzbeks and Turkmens then the chances are that your blood is for a major part Armenian/Greek/Assyrian/Kurdish/Balkan/Arab. This is the greatest proof of the systematic annihilation and forced assimilation of the indigenous peoples of Asia Minor by your forefathers.
I have explained a couple of times that I find the bogus phrase "Eastern Anatolia" extremely offensive. The two maps I mention above will tell you why. I'll post more maps and relevant pictures in the future.
If you really are a decent, civilized and peaceful person you'll avoid it in the future because it confirms two things among others:
I. That the Armenian Genocide did happen. If no genocide ever happened then why has your fascist state changed the name of Armenia into "Eastern Anatolia" after the rise of Pan-Turkism, and why are they destroying Armenian monuments?

II. That you support the Genocide and don't give a damn about the pain suffered by Armenians, therefore confirming our negative view of Turks.

The pejorative statement “The Sick Man of Europe“ is given to your state who “could have never been ruled as a colony” as a result of heavy debts owed by the Ottomans to the western countries and it implied that the Ottoman Tyranny was practically a colony of the west. And don’t feel too special, if there’s a great nation that “could have never been ruled as a colony” then that’s the Iranians! Never having a much deeper significance in terms of duration, since the concept Iranian exists for at least 2600 years compared to the Ottoman Invasion in 1299 (Armenia falling under their barbaric rule in 1512). And if your revisionist government teaches you that you won a “single battle against the emperialists” then their brainwash system is really efficient, because the rest of the world considers you the losers!

If anyone can dream that we will give a single dust of this land, including eastern anatolia, I am sorry that I can only offer him to see a psychiatrist.

Not a "single dust of" the land you're occupying belongs to you. A thief that breaks into someone's house, rapes and murders the inhabitants and tortures the survivors and then throws them out, can according to no laws known in the universe "dream" of being the owner of that house.
You won’t give, we will take. As I said earlier:
"you'll go sooner than you think. Without the hundreds of billions of American dollars wasted on the Sick Man of Europe, it would have died a thousand deaths by now. It's just a matter of time".

Now, I am a peacefull person and I will continue to be optimistic to Armenians and other nations on this earth. I am a person who dedicated himself to human rights, civilization and democracy. But if anyone tries to take my nation's freedom,

Your "nation's freedom" has long been taken by your rulers.

then he can see how a barbarian human can be and what he can do. You are dealing with a nation who always had its own and free states unlike you.

You show your true colors again and you confirm our views that Turks don't care about being called barbarians, otherwise they would face their history and would shake off the negativity. By the way, you are not a nation because your "nation" is founded on Genocide and lies.

[imported_Hellektor]

Insolent Ignorance Part Two

Your ignorance of the Armenian history should not cause you throw excrement at one of the great ancient civilizations, if you consider yourself civilized. Armenia has lost it's independence after the Mamluks destroyed the last Armenian kingdom of Cilicia in the 14th century, but for most of the time during the past three thousand years or so, Armenia "always had its own and free states unlike you". To see the relativity of Always read the explanation of Never some paragraphs earlier.

Below you can see the rulers of Armenia:
WARNING: take care not to explode from envy!

Rulers of Armenia up to 1375

Kings of Urartu
ARAMU the first known king of Urartu (in modern Armenia).
SARDURIS I
ISHPUINIS 825-810 BC.
MENUAS 810-785 BC.
ARGISHTIS I 785
SARDURIS II 763
RUSAS I 734
ARGISHTIS II 714
RUSAS II 685
SARDURIS III 645
ERIMENAS 635-629 BC
SARDURIS IV 629

Ervandian or Orontid Dynasty in Armenia

ERVAND (ORONTES) I, c. 401-c. 344 B.C.
ERVAND (ORONTES) II, c. 344-331
MITHRANES, 331-before 317
ERVAND (ORONTES) III, before 317-c. 260
SAMUS, c. 260
XERXES, after 228-c. 212
ERVAND (ORONTES) IV, c. 212-c. 200

Artashesian or Artaxiad Dynasty

ARTASHES (ARTAXIAS) I, 188-c. 165?
ARTAWAZD (ARTAVAZD) I
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) I
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) II, 95-55
ARTAWAZD (ARTAVAZD) II, 55-34
ALEXANDER HELIOS. Not member of dynasty
ARTASHES II, c. 30-20
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) III, 20-8/6
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) IV, 8-5
ARTAWAZD (ARTAVAZD) III, 5-2
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) IV and ERATO, 2 B.C.-A.D. 1?
ARIOBARZANES, A.D. 2-4. Not member of dynasty
ARTAWAZD (ARTAVAZD) IV, 4-6
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) V and ERATO, c. 6-14

Arsacids in Armenia

VONONES, 12-c.15
ORODES, c.15-c.18
ZENO/ARTASHES OF PONTUS, c.18-34. Not member of dynasty
ARSHAK I, 34-c.35
MITHRIDATES OF IBERIA, c.35-37, 42-51. Not member of dynasty
RHADAMISTES OF IBERIA, 51-54? Not member of dynasty
TRDAT (TIRIDATES) I, 53-c.60
TIGRAN (TIGRANES) VI, c.60-c.61/62. Not member of dynasty
TRDAT (TIRIDATES) I, c.62/66-c.75
SANATRUK, 75-110?
AXIDARES, 110-113?
PARTHAMASIRIS, 113-115?
VAGHARSH (VOLOGASES) I, 117-138/140
AURELIUS PACORUS, 161-163?
SOHAEMUS, 164-185, with interruptions. Not member of dynasty
VAGHARSH (VOLOGASES) II, c.180-191
XOSROV I, c.191-216/217?
TRDAT (TIRIDATES) II, c.216/217-252
HORMIZD-ARDASHIR, Sasanian, 252-c.272. Not member of dynasty
NARSEH, Sasanian, c.273-293. Not member of dynasty
XOSROV II, 279/280-287
TRDAT (TIRIDATES) III, 287-298
TRDAT (TIRIDATES) IV, the Great, 298/99-c.330
XOSROV III Kotak, c.330-338
TIRAN, c.338/39-350
ARSHAK II, 350-c.364/367
PAP, 367-c.374
VARAZDAT, 374-378
ARSHAK III AND VAGHARSHAK, Pap's sons. c.378-c.389
XOSROV IV, in Eastern Armenia. 384-389
VRAMSHAPUH, replacing brother XOSROV IV, 389/401-417
XOSROV IV, 417-418
SHAPUH, Sasanian. Son of shah Yazdgird I, 418-422. Not member of dynasty
ARTASHES/ARDASHIR, SON OF VRAMSHAPUH, 422-428

Marzpans

VASAK I OF SIWNIK' C. 442-451
[SAHAK II BAGRATUNI, INSURGENT MARZPAN] 482-483
VAHAN MAMIKONEAN, AUTONOMOUS MARZPAN 485-505/510
VARD MAMIKONEAN, AUTONOMOUS MARZPAN 505/10-509/514
MZHEZH (MEZEZIUS) I GNUNI 518-548
PHILIP SIWNI 574-576
MUSHEGH II MAMIKONEAN 591 ?
VARAZ-TIROTS' II BAGRATUNI 628 - AFTER 631

Presiding Princes of Armenia

MZHEZH (MEZEZIUS) II GNUNI, COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF OF THE IMPERIAL TROOPS, 628-635
DAVID SAHARHUNI, CUROPALATE 635-638
THEODORE RHSHTUNI, HIGH CONSTABLE AND PATRICIAN, 638-C.645
VARAZ-TIROTS' II BAGRATUNI, CUROPALATE, 645
THEODORE RHSHTUNI, HIGH CONSTABLE
for the Emperor, 645-653
for the Caliph, 653/4-655
MUSHEGH II MAMIKONEAN, MASTER OF THE HORSE for the Emperor. Passes to the Caliph, 654
HAMAZASP II MAMIKONEAN,
for the Caliph, 655-657
CUROPALATE for the Emperor, 657-658
GREGORY I MAMIKONEAN, for the Caliph, 662-684/85
ASHOT II BAGRATUNI, for the Caliph, 686-689/90
NERSEH KAMSARAKAN, CUROPALATE for the Emperor, 689/90-691
SMBAT VI BAGRATUNI, PATRICIAN for the Emperor, 691-697
for the Caliph, 697-700
CUROPALATE for the Emperor, 700-711
ASHOT III BAGRATUNI, for the Caliph, 732-748
GREGORY II MAMIKONEAN, for the Caliph, 748-750
[MUSHEGH MAMIKONEAN, HEAD OF THE INSURGENT PRINCES] C.750
SAHAK VII BAGRATUNI
HIGH CONSTABLE for the Caliph, 755-761
SMBAT VII BAGRATUNI
HIGH CONSTABLE for the Caliph, 761-772
TACHAT ANDZEWATS'I, for the Caliph, 780-782/785
ASHOT IV BAGRATUNI, for the Caliph, 806-826
SMBAT VIII BAGRATUNI
HIGH CONSTABLE for the Caliph, 826-855
BAGARAT II BAGRATUNI OF TARON, PRINCE OF PRINCES, for the Caliph, 830-852
ASHOT V BAGRATUNI
HIGH CONSTABLE, 856
PRINCE OF PRINCES for the Caliph, 862-885
ASHOT I BAGRATUNI OF TARON
CUROPALATE for the Emperor, 877-878

Kings of Armenia

(BAGRATID DYNASTY)
ASHOT I (V) the Great, 885-890
SMBAT I (IX) the Martyr (son), 890-914
ASHOT II (VI) the Iron (son), King of Kings, 914-928
ABAS I (brother), 928-952
ASHOT III (VII) the Merciful (son), 952-977
SMBAT II (X) the Conqueror (son), 977-989
GAGIK I (brother), 989-1020
HOVHANNES [JOHN]-SMBAT III (XI) (son), 1020-1040
ASHOT IV (VIII) the Valiant (brother), 1021-1039
GAGIK II (son), 1042-1045
[cedes Armenia to the Empire], dies c. 1079

Kings of Kars

(BAGRATID DYNASTY)
MUSHEGH (son of ABAS I of Armenia), 962-984
ABAS I (son), 984-1029
GAGIK-ABAS II (son), 1029-1064, d. 1080
[cedes Kars to the Empire]

Kings of Lorhi and Aghbania

(BAGRATID DYNASTY)
GURGEN I (son) of Ashot III of Armenia), 982-989
DAVID ANHOGHIN [the Landless] (son), 989-1046/48
GURGEN II-Kiwrike (son), 1046-1081/89
[Lorhi annexed by the Saljuqs]

Kings of Vaspurakan

(ARTSRUNID DYNASTY)
XACH'IK-GAGIK, 908-936/37
DERENIK-ASHOT (son), 936/37-953
ABUSAHL-HAMAZASP (brother), 953-972
ASHOT-SAHAK (son), 972-983
GURGEN-XACH'IK (brother), 983-1003
SENEK'ERIM-HOVHANNES [JOHN] (brother), 1003-1021, d. 1027
[cedes Vaspurakan to the Empire] (son)

Kings of Siwnik'
A. Line of Siwnik'
SMBAT II, 963-c. 998
VASAK VI (son), c. 998-1019
SMBAT III (cousin and nephew), 1019-?
GREGORY V (brother), ?-c. 1091

B. Line of Gardman-Aghbania
HOVHANNES [JOHN]-SENEK'ERIM (adopted son of Gregory V), c. 1091-1105
GREGORY VI (son), 1105-1166

Kings of Kakhetia
A.
KWIRIKE III the Great, 1010-1029
B.
BAGRATID DYNASTY
GAGIK of Lorhi (son of David Anhoghin and nephew of KWIRIKE III), 1029-1058
AGHSART'AN I (son), 1058-1084
KWIRIKE IV (son), 1084-1102
AGHSART'AN II (nephew), 1102-1105 [Kakhetia annexed by Georgia]

Princes and Kings of Cilician Armenia

A. RUBENID DYNASTY

RUBEN I, 1080-1095
CONSTANTINE I (son), 1095-1099
THEODORE I (son), 1100-1129
LEWON (LEO) I (brother), 1129-1138, d. 1141
[Cilicia occupied by the Byzantines, 1138-1145]
THEODORE II (son), 1145-1169
RUBEN II (son), 1169-1170
MLEH (uncle), 1170-1175
RUBEN III (nephew), 1175-1186
LEWON (LEO) II (I) the Great (brother), 1186-1198/99; King of Armenia, 1198/99-1219
ISABEL (daughter), 1219-1222
PHILIP OF ANTIOCH (consort), 1222-1225

B. HET'UMID DYNASTY

HET'UM I of Lambron (second consort of ISABEL), 1226-1269, d. 1270
LEWON (LEO) III (II) (son), 1269-1289
HET'UM II (son), 1289-1293, 1294-1296, 1299-1305, d. 1308
THEODORE III (I) (brother), 1293-1294, d. 1299
SMBAT (brother), 1296-1298
CONSTANTINE II (I) (brother), 1298-1299
LEWON (LEO) IV (III) (son of THEODORE III), 1305-1308
OSHIN (son of LEO III), 1308-1320
LEWON (LEO) V (IV) (son), 1320-1341

C. LUSIGNAN DYNASTY

GUY I de LUSIGNAN (cousin of LEO V), 1342-1344; Regent: John de Lusignan (brother), 1342
CONSTANTINE III (II) (outsider), 1344-1363
CONSTANTINE IV (III) (cousin), 1365-1373
PETER de LUSIGNAN, King of Cyprus, invited, 1368-1369
LEO VI (V) de LUSIGNAN (GUY'S nephew), 1373-1375
[Mamluk conquest of Cilician Armenia]

With this hysteria, it is impossible for you to convince people on earth that there was a genocide. Ok I can hear you saying that there are 15 states who had already recognized this genocide.

The hysteria I hear and see on Turkish media, and all of it out of the fear of facing your history, shows that you're only projecting and it's you who should "see a psychiatrist" and you are not hearing me “saying that there are 15 states who had already recognized this genocide”, I know and all the world who cares knows it happened. Official recognition is a positive and humane development; but recognition or no recognition, the irrefutable fact of the Armenian Genocide remains unchanged.

Let's play a game. You, write the names of the countries who recognized genocide, then I will tell the common historical and present wishes of these countries. There are some bosses on earth and some dogs of these bosses. Please write down names of these 15 countries.Then I will tell who the bosses are and who the dogs are.

I will not play your game. As I have said time and again, the reality of the Armenian Genocide is irrefutable, whether countries recognize it or not, but since your petrified heart and brainwashed soul have already dictated you that you "would recognize, if there were a genocide, but there was no genocide" then I ask you again: what are you doing in this forum?
Considering all that’s said I kind of pity you…