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Originally posted by David-X
Threatening? Who threatened what and when and where? I'd like to hear your answer.
Originally posted by David-X
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Threatening? Who threatened what and when and where? I'd like to hear your answer.
you pray too much you know.. but ok.
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When did Armenia make a claim about land return? I'm very interested in finding out what exactly you or david call a threat. I need a statement that officialy proves Armenia threatening Turkey.Originally posted by realityShowComment
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Listen buddy, how many historians discussed the Holocaust to see whether or not it took place?Originally posted by realityShowprove
v., proved, proved or prov·en (prū'vən), prov·ing, proves.
v.tr.
1. To establish the truth or validity of by presentation of argument or evidence.
2. Law. To establish the authenticity of (a will).
3. To determine the quality of by testing; try out.
4. Mathematics.
a. To demonstrate the validity of (a hypothesis or proposition).
b. To verify (the result of a calculation).
5. Printing. To make a sample impression of (type).
6. Archaic. To find out or learn (something) through experience.
v.intr.
To be shown to be such; turn out: a theory that proved impractical in practice.
So according to this definition, could you please tell me where, when, by whom, how it was proven????
And could you please tell me why Armenian historians didn't want to discuss this matter with Turkish historians; when they came to Turkey as guests of a Turkish college and gave a conference about AG?? There may be two reasons I think:
1. They don't have enough knowledge, evidence and courage to do that
2. They don't want this matter is solved (because their MASTERs don't want a reliable and peaceful Turkey)
There are certain things that don't necessary need "discussion" in order to be proven... When it comes to the Armenian Genocide, there are enough evidence, photos, testimonies, survivior stories, eyewitness accounts, newspaper articles, U.S./British archives, etc. that only a blind retard would still want a "discussion". This is like asking for a discussion to prove the World War II ever took place.. cause the evidence isn't good enough.
ps I don't think there was a need to post the dictionary definition of the word prove.
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Isn't this enough?
INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF GENOCIDE SCHOLARS
President
Israel Charny (Israel)
First Vice-President
Gregory H. Stanton (USA)
Second Vice-President
Linda Melvern (UK)
Secretary-Treasurer
Steven Jacobs (USA)
June 13, 2005
Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan
TC Easbakanlik
Bakanlikir
Ankara, Turkey
FAX: 90 312 417 0476
Dear Prime Minister Erdogan:
We are writing you this open letter in response to your call for an “impartial study by historians” concerning the fate of the Armenian people in the Ottoman Empire during World War I.
We represent the major body of scholars who study genocide in North America and Europe. We are concerned that in calling for an impartial study of the Armenian Genocide you may not be fully aware of the extent of the scholarly and intellectual record on the Armenian Genocide and how this event conforms to the definition of the United Nations Genocide Convention. We want to underscore that it is not just Armenians who are affirming the Armenian Genocide but it is the overwhelming opinion of scholars who study genocide: hundreds of independent scholars, who have no affiliations with governments, and whose work spans many countries and nationalities and the course of decades. The scholarly evidence reveals the following:
On April 24, 1915, under cover of World War I, the Young Turk government of the Ottoman Empire began a systematic genocide of its Armenian citizens – an unarmed Christian minority population. More than a million Armenians were exterminated through direct killing, starvation, torture, and forced death marches. The rest of the Armenian population fled into permanent exile. Thus an ancient civilization was expunged from its homeland of 2,500 years.
The Armenian Genocide was the most well-known human rights issue of its time and was reported regularly in newspapers across the United States and Europe. The Armenian Genocide is abundantly documented by thousands of official records of the United States and nations around the world including Turkey’s wartime allies Germany, Austria and Hungary, by Ottoman court-martial records, by eyewitness accounts of missionaries and diplomats, by the testimony of survivors, and by decades of historical scholarship.
The Armenian Genocide is corroborated by the international scholarly, legal, and human rights community:
1) Polish jurist Raphael Lemkin, when he coined the term genocide in 1944, cited the Turkish extermination of the Armenians and the Nazi extermination of the Jews as defining examples of what he meant by genocide.
2) The killings of the Armenians is genocide as defined by the 1948 United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.
3) In 1997 the International Association of Genocide Scholars, an organization of the world’s foremost experts on genocide, unanimously passed a formal resolution affirming the Armenian Genocide.
4) 126 leading scholars of the Holocaust including Elie Wiesel and Yehuda Bauer placed a statement in the New York Times in June 2000 declaring the “incontestable fact of the Armenian Genocide” and urging western democracies to acknowledge it.
5) The Institute on the Holocaust and Genocide (Jerusalem), and the Institute for the Study of Genocide (NYC) have affirmed the historical fact of the Armenian Genocide.
6) Leading texts in the international law of genocide such as William A. Schabas’s Genocide in International Law (Cambridge University Press, 2000) cite the Armenian Genocide as a precursor to the Holocaust and as a precedent for the law on crimes against humanity.
We note that there may be differing interpretations of genocide—how and why the Armenian Genocide happened, but to deny its factual and moral reality as genocide is not to engage in scholarship but in propaganda and efforts to absolve the perpetrator, blame the victims, and erase the ethical meaning of this history.
We would also note that scholars who advise your government and who are affiliated in other ways with your state-controlled institutions are not impartial. Such so-called “scholars” work to serve the agenda of historical and moral obfuscation when they advise you and the Turkish Parliament on how to deny the Armenian Genocide. In preventing a conference on the Armenian Genocide from taking place at Bogacizi University in Istanbul on May 25, your government revealed its aversion to academic and intellectual freedom—a fundamental condition of democratic society.
We believe that it is clearly in the interest of the Turkish people and their future as a proud and equal participants in international, democratic discourse to acknowledge the responsibility of a previous government for the genocide of the Armenian people, just as the German government and people have done in the case of the Holocaust.Comment
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The reason why dialouge seems to be futile is that people only believe what they want to believe. You can show them all the proof and resources in the world but it wouldn't matter very much. It's a cultural thing as well.Originally posted by HayerMiacekGeneral Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”Comment
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Isn't this enough?
International Affirmation of the Armenian Genocide
Public Petitions
Statement by 126 Holocaust Scholars, Holders of Academic Chairs, and Directors of Holocaust Research and Studies Centers
March 7, 2000
View image of the petition appeared in New York Times, June 9, 2000.
126 HOLOCAUST SCHOLARS AFFIRM THE INCONTESTABLE FACT OF THE ARMENIAN GENOCIDE AND URGE WESTERN DEMOCRACIES TO OFFICIALLY RECOGNIZE IT
At the Thirtieth Anniversary of the Scholar's Conference on the Holocaust and the Churches Convening at St. Joseph University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, March 3-7, 2000, one hundred twenty-six Holocaust Scholars, holders of Academic Chairs and Directors of Holocaust Research and Studies Centers, participants of the Conference, signed a statement affirming that the World War I Armenian Genocide is an incontestable historical fact and accordingly urge the governments of Western democracies to likewise recognize it as such. The petitioners, among whom is Nobel Laureate for Peace Elie Wiesel, who was the keynote speaker at the conference, also asked the Western Democracies to urge the Government and Parliament of Turkey to finally come to terms with a dark chapter of Ottoman-Turkish history and to recognize the Armenian Genocide. This would provide an invaluable impetus to the process of the democratization of Turkey.
Below is a partial list of the signatories:
Prof. Yehuda Bauer
Distinguished Professor
Hebrew University
Director, The International Institute of Holocaust Research
Yad Vashem, Jerusalem
Prof. Israel Charny, Director
Institute of the Holocaust and Genocide, Jerusalem
Professor at the Hebrew University,
Editor-in-Chief of The Encyclopedia of Genocide
Prof. Ward Churchill
Ethnic Studies
The University of Colorado, Boulder
Prof. Stephen Feinstein, Director
Center for Holocaust and Genocide Studies
University of Minnesota
Prof. Saul Friedman, Director
Holocaust and Jewish Studies
Youngston State University, Ohio
Prof. Edward Gaffney
Valparaiso University Law School
Prof. Zev Garber
Los Angeles Valley College
Prof. Dorota Glowacka
University of King's Collage
Halifax, Nova Scotia
Dr. Irving Greenberg, President
Jewish Life Network
Prof. Herbert Hirsch
Virginia Commonwealth University
Prof. Irving L. Horowitz
Hannah Arendt Distinguished Professor
Rutgers University, NJ
Rabbi Dr. Steve Jacobs
Temple Sinai Shalom
Huntsville, Alabama
Associate Editor of The Encyclopedia of Genocide
Prof. Steven Katz
Distinguish Professor
Director, Center for Judaic Studies
Boston University
Prof. Richard Libowitz
Temple University
Dr. Marcia Littell
Stockton College
Exec. Director, Scholars' Conference
On the Holocaust and the Churches
Franklin Littell
Emeritus Professor
Temple University
Prof. Hubert G. Locke
Washington University
Co-founder of the Annual Scholar's Conference
On the Holocaust and the Churches
Dr. Elizabeth Maxwell
Executive Director of the International Scholarly
Conference on the Holocaust, London, England
Prof. Erik Markusen
Southwest State University, MN
Prof. Saul Mendlowitz
Dag Hammerskjold Distinguished Professor
of International Law
Rutgers University
Prof. Jack Needle, Director
Center for Holocaust Studies
Brookdale Community College
Lincroft, NJ
Dr. Philip Rosen, Director
Holocaust Education Center of the Delaware Valley
Prof. Alan S, Rosenbaum
Dept. of Philosophy
Cleveland State University
William L. Shulman, President
Association of Holocaust Organizations City University of New York
Prof. Samuel Totten
The University of Arkansas
Assoc. Editor of The Encyclopedia of Genocide
Prof. Elie Wiesel
Andrew W. Mellon Professor in the Humanities
Boston University
Founding Chairman of the United States
Holocaust Memorial Council
Nobel Laureate for Peace
There in NO single Armenian last name there!Comment
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You Turks say that this should be left to historians to discuss, well there you go, virtually all Genocide Scholars (see that I am mentioning only Genocide scholars and not fake historians like McCarthy, Lewy, Lewis ect..) affirm the Armenian Genocide. So what else do you want????
Israel Charny, the president of the International Association of Genocide Scholars was at NYC on April 23 and spoke at the Armenian church, his exact words were:
"We won the intellectual battle, now it is time to win the other one"
"There absolutely no doubt that the AG happened"
Chuck Schummer, a Jewish-American senator from NY also called it the "Armenian Holocaust"
What more do you want Turks?Comment
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"We won the intellectual battle, now it is time to win the other one"
"There absolutely no doubt that the AG happened"
I looooove this statement!Thanks for posting it."All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)Comment
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Wauwwwwwww.Very modern response from you.I want to applaud you.Originally posted by HayerMiacek
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This made your day didn't it? Now go tell all your Turkish friends how violent and hateful we areOriginally posted by RUDOWauwwwwwww.Very modern response from you.I want to applaud you.
Go on, hurry upComment
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