Shar/comana/komana Armenians

[bell-the-cat]

More Armenian Molokans - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demos_Shakarian

[Gavur]

Abstracts of UCLA Kars/Ani conference

SATURDAY, NOVEMBER 10th 2001
Armenians and Molokans: Karakala, 1870s-1920
Joyce Keosababian Bivin, Jerusalem

The Armenians living in Karakala were in daily contact with Russian Molokans
living in nearby villages. A group of these Armenians adopted the Molokan's religious beliefs and
customs. The community that was thus created survived the impending persecution by immigrating to the United States where it still exists, primarily in Southern California..

This paper focuses on part of the Armenian population of Karakala during the period of the 1870s to 1920. With the help of personal letters (written in Armenian from 1898 to 1922, and in Russian until as late as 1954), especially the correspondence between the members of the Keosababian and Perumian families who remained in Karakala and the Kars region and members of their families who immigrated to the United States, some progress can be made in sketching this unique community's history. Oral testimonies, a few autobiographies, and the writings of Russian Molokans supplement the information gleaned from personal correspondence.

A brief history of the Russian Molokans describes their expulsion by the Russian tsar to the Kars region, their unique form of worship, and their observance of biblical dietary laws and five biblical feasts. Of special significance is the influence of two young prophets on the Russian and Armenian Molokan communities.

The geographic location of Kars is discussed to determine which of three locations in Turkey is the Armenian Karakala. An old photograph of the Armenian Karakala provides a glimpse of the village and its inhabitants.

Exactly!
And your point was???

[bell-the-cat]

Exactly!
And your point was???

To indicate that your first assertion that there were no Armenian Molokans was wrong. And to indicate that your second assertion, that they were actualy Armenian Protestants, was also wrong. Just because you would "simply classify" them as Protestants doesn't actually make them Protestants (and if you believe your classification then the same must also be true for the ethnic Russian Molokans).

[Gavur]

Fine as long as my clarafacation is noted where as Russian molokans came to live in Armenia and apparently converted some Armenians into a brand of Protestanism they were still distinct culturul differences between Russian and Armenian molokans.

[dele]

Nothing Is Valuable As Human Being's Life... Human Life Is Not Only Mathematical Numbers... What Made Us To Think About Human Beings Mathematically Is Our Real Enemy...

[Gavur]

True!
In every one of us a world
and in every world there is one of us.

[dele]

14 of 15 female Armenian were massacrated at that days

There was an Armenian village called Farasha(byTurkish alphabet Faraşa). Its name is now Çamlıca. It is Kayseri-Yahyalı's village. In the days of Armenian massacrate 15 female Armenian refuged to an Circassian village. They stayed in the village that night. Turkish bandits followed them. They threatened the villagers. They didn't want to give them to bandits. Armenians were taken to the village's square by force. Except only one of them they were taken to a hill called Çatal(read as Chatal). The bandits killed all the Armenians unfortunately. As a shame Circassians could not defend their guests. The only Armenian who escaped accepted to get married one of the villagers and became a Muslim.
I blame my people because they should have protected their guests. In old days their fathers died for their guests.
I blame everybody who blamed Armenians because of their religion.
I blame blood drinker bandits of course.
I blame who made our guy-Armenians "gavurs".
The people told me that Armenians and Circassians had a good relation in that area also at bad days.
Today there is no Armenian there.
The old Armenian village is nearly 40 km to the Circassian village. Today there is a Turkish village instead.

[dele]

What about the Armenians who left in Turkey?

A few stories
1)
A baby left behind the exiling Armenians in a village called Karahalka(Kayseri-Pınarbaşı's village). It is a Circassian village. The baby was hidden into wool by Circassians. He escaped. He was adopted by the family. He grew up as an Circassian. Today He acceps that himself as a Circassian...

2)
A girl was hidden and by a villager in a village called Yukarı Beyçayır (Kayseri-Pınarbaşı's village). He refused to give her back to the exilers because most of them were being killed randomly. Later they got married. Today her son is one of the most famous barrister of Turkey...

3)
While the first exile the Armenians stayed in Circassian villages as guests up to spring because it was winter...

4)
I remember a person called Dik (xxxx) Bekir who is Armenian and who were alive in 1980s in Hadjin(Saimbeyli). He has sons and daughters as I know. They are alive because his father (or him) accepted to be a Muslim....

[bell-the-cat]

Thanks for the above two posts Dele. Coincidentally I was passing through the Kayseri area a week ago, and was remembering your earlier postings.

[dele]

Do you know about Hadjin -nails?
They were the best nails ever made in Turkey. We have used them many times. We've took off them many times but they are hard and can be used many times.
Our Circassians say "They are hard enough to pass through iron."
I think they are a value of Armenians and the rest nails should be collected and should be put in Armenian museums. You can find them in our village. I found a few and took photos of them.



Used Hadjin nails( it is a door)