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A Turk's eloquent call for Genocide recognition

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  • #31
    Originally posted by sadi
    Why you are omitting the points of "the polish,algerian,chinese,africans,or caucasian peoples.... You suppose that the only people massacred are Armenians in the history!
    All I have to say is that if you are using the fact other people besides the Armenians have been massacred as your best defense on why the Armenian Genocide never happened/shouldn't be recognized, well then I congratulate you on having one of the more creative excuses in this denial campaign. Of course it makes even less sense than the already absurd official Turkish position, but at least you're trying to think of things. Next time somebody tells me the Holocaust happened, I think I'll just refute them saying "Algerian,Chinese" people were massacred, therefore you are incorrect! Uhh or something, no I don't even understand that.

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    • #32
      Exactly.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by shasa
        You miss a point:
        The point that we like to talk about turks doesn't mean that we like to talk with turks. Recognize the genocide or get lost!
        The PM Erdoğan has proposed to create an international commission of historians.Then,he said Turkey would face up with whatever outcome.But,Armenia has denied this proposal which has backed by Annan,Bush,and Britain.

        By dictating us,it is impossiple for us to accept anything.But,if the genocide is an open realty,why you have denied it.Erdoğan could have brought Turkey to the end of the road!You say that it is an accepted fact by all the world.Ok,form a commitee...only a lone Turkey cannot defend his case!And it will be forced to accept genocide easily .... At least,you will have your strongest card unless Turkey accepts the outcome.At least,you can mention the outcome of an international commitee of international historians ...

        You and i know very well that diaspora has not agreed and will never agree... But,international community will start to think why....

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        • #34
          Originally posted by sadi
          The PM Erdoğan has proposed to create an international commission of historians.Then,he said Turkey would face up with whatever outcome.But,Armenia has denied this proposal which has backed by Annan,Bush,and Britain.

          By dictating us,it is impossiple for us to accept anything.But,if the genocide is an open realty,why you have denied it.Erdoğan could have brought Turkey to the end of the road!You say that it is an accepted fact by all the world.Ok,form a commitee...only a lone Turkey cannot defend his case!And it will be forced to accept genocide easily .... At least,you will have your strongest card unless Turkey accepts the outcome.At least,you can mention the outcome of an international commitee of international historians ...

          You and i know very well that diaspora has not agreed and will never agree... But,international community will start to think why....
          There is no need to form a comitee since Armenian genocide is a reality. And there is nothing to talk about this reality except to recognise this reality. Don't come to these forums and try to argue with us whether it was a genocide unless you recognise it. We are totally satisfied with international documents including Britian and France that proove the genocide and we don't want to listen your shi*s. Again as I said before recognise the genocide or get lost!
          See Mount Ararat from Yerevan...

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          • #35
            You are the first Sasha escaping from a comitee which will surely sanction a realty!

            You are trying to make us accept this reality by force of dictation.Is this more efective than the outcome of a commission? To expect us something with dictation is only naiveness or someting else(!).You are choosing this impossible way!

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            • #36
              Turkish Ploy To Make Armenia Look Bad

              Originally posted by sadi
              The PM Erdoğan has proposed to create an international commission of historians.Then,he said Turkey would face up with whatever outcome.But,Armenia has denied this proposal which has backed by Annan,Bush,and Britain.
              This is lovely. I love how you follow your government's line so well. They got together and brainstormed, now what can we do to make it look like we are willing to discuss the Armenian Genocide without actually having to do it, and this letter was what they came up with. Bush, who we already know to be a Turkish bootlicker, of course praised this, just like he praised TARC since it was a way to dodge the actual issues at hand, which is the need for recognition. I never heard anything about Annan supporting the letter, but who knows maybe he did. They would because that was exactly the plan of the Turkish government, say something that sounds really good that signified nothing. Sure they can call for dialogue, and then make Armenia look bad on the world stage for not being so happy about it, but THINK ABOUT IT:
              *This is the Turkish government that just adopted a law code making talking about the Armenian Genocide ILLEGAL.
              *This is the Turkish government who's own justice minister called any Turk who doesn't accept the government's view and thinks that view needs to be re-evaluated TRAITORS whom he wishes he could personally prosecute himself for just that- reevaluting the government's view on what happened in 1915.

              These two instances that happened in the past week alone are just some of many instances where the Turkish government that wants "dialogue" with Armenia shows its true feelings. Armenia didn't jump at the opportunity to discuss the issue with Erdogan because look at what his government is up to! If its illegal to even mention a genocide occured in Turkey, what good is it having dialogue with that government over the very issue? Clearly the Turkish government is in no mood to budge from its official stance (which I do believe just about EVERYONE, including people in Turkey, agrees is an underestimation of what happened to the Armenians), so what good would starting a "dialogue" do? It'd only try to pressure Armenia to abandon the subject of the genocide, as if the blockade wasn't enough. It's all a ploy to make Armenia look bad to the outside world who doesn't understand the situation as deeply. They see "Armenia accuses Turkey, Turkey offers to have dialogue, Armenia rejects Turkish offer, poor Turkey" and often miss reading between the lines, which includes the Turkish government's repression of genocide scholars and their stalwart inability to acknowledge anything happened to the Armenians at all. If they saw that side of the story, I think everyone would understand why Armenia isn't jumping at the chance to have dialogue on this issue with Turkey, and why frankly Erdogan's letter really didn't make a big splash on the world stage at all. I barely read anything about it (except in Bush's speach that called 1915 a "Great Calamity", something far more than Erdogan would say), and I do think the world saw through this Turkish ploy to feign interest in dialogue with Armenia, while at the same time it closes down symposiums on the very subject. Only the most naive people (or those blinded by Turkish nationalism) fail to see this.
              Starting a dialogue with a government that flatly denies anything except migration, disease, and "civil war" killed the Armenians, by no fault of the Turks, only serves to make it LOOK like something is getting done, when we all know such a "dialogue" is ultimtely unacceptable to not just Armenia but history itself, and will get nowhere. At that point we'd be right back where we started, with nothing recognized and more time wasted.
              Last edited by IAmMadAtAC; 06-02-2005, 09:18 AM.

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              • #37
                when do i get my red star? 100 posts?
                errrr let me tell you something... this Altan guy is a jew sucker (i dont hate anybody including jews but they got the media by the balls)... he writes to be different so you should not take him seriously.. but the thing he wrote was touchy.... wish you all my best

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Otto
                  when do i get my red star? 100 posts?
                  errrr let me tell you something... this Altan guy is a jew sucker (i dont hate anybody including jews but they got the media by the balls)... he writes to be different so you should not take him seriously.. but the thing he wrote was touchy.... wish you all my best
                  Why do you - like so many Turks - inist on attacking the messenger? Does the message really cause you that much pain?

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                  • #39
                    who cares. Everyones constant bickering is starting to piss me off.

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                    • #40
                      Mr winoman, attacking you was not my intention. What Altan wrote was nice but i just dont belive he is sincere.

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