Invitation to Exfo...

[Gunner14]

Please... lets discuss (in civilized manner) about Anatolian area from 1890s to 1920s....

I would like to hear your point of view based on the research you have done... this is an honest invitation.

[exfo]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Please... lets discuss (in civilized manner) about Anatolian area from 1890s to 1920s....

I would like to hear your point of view based on the research you have done... this is an honest invitation.

First, you lose your chance for a civilised discussion. After many insults from you to me, I have no willingness to continue any debate.

Second, I think you did not understand my point. Unlike you I am not sure about the reality, because as I said several times before the reality is being distorted by two sides. If you wouldn't lose your chance for a civilised discussion and we would start it, I know what kind of picture you will draw to me. You will start from the 1895-96 massacres, Hamidian troops, 1915 Van, and then 24 April arrests and killings, and then deportation, taking Armenian men to the military without guns, and then massacres, and then your secret telegrams that proove CUP has a plan for genocide, and then so called Naim Bey memoires, Morhenthau's book, blue book, Istanbul trials at 1919, etc. And you will conclude as there were around 2 million Armenians at 1914 and 150.000 remained at 1920, so Turks made genocide.

Many of them are really correct, but Turks also claim many things which I am sure you know, they claim that most of your evidences for a planned genocide are either fake or war propoganda of ww1 against Ottoman Empire. They have also many other claims as you know. I will not repeat them to start a useless discussion.
The point here is, to get a solution both sides should establish a relation first and discuss the points one by one without distorting history at the internationla arena.

Dont say me that "oh western world support our thesis so probably we are the good guys and you are the bad ones" Your diaspora lobby distort the reality as much as Turkish government. How can we discuss a historical fact when one of the most important scholar of a middle east history, Bernard Lewis is on trial at the court just because he expressed his scientific opinion that do not match with your official history? How can we discuss anything since your diaspora force the governments and even it is a crime to discuss against your thesis at France and Switzerland? How can we discuss anything when you parrot the same "there is nothing to discuss, all the facts are clear, just confess it and get out of here" thing at "your" every post. How can we discuss anything when you (this one is singular you) are full of prejudices and stereotypes about Turks and Islam? How can we discuss anything when you believe that it is free to insult Turks if they dont accept your claims?

I have no willingness to discuss anythin with you Gunner.
The point here is not whether the Armenian genocide was a reality or not. The point is the freedom of speech.
Both sides restrain it. And the difference between you and me is I am ready to critisize the blind propoganda of Turkish government against Armenians and 1915, but you are not ready to critisize anything from you side because of your victim psyhcology and national identity based on this genocide myth.

[Sip]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Unlike you I am not sure about the reality.

We know this very well. You don't have to say it.

I have no willingness to discuss anythin with you Gunner. ... because of your victim psyhcology and national identity based on this genocide myth.

You are not willing to discuss yet you are so willing to call the Genocide facts a "myth". It is quite obvious you cannot discuss these topics because you are simply not equipped to discuss things. You are just here to repeat some rediculous things you have read about how "Armenian identity" is based on this "myth". Other than that, you have not said ANYTHING that is remotely interesting. All you do is spew crap and then you wonder why you are not taken seriously.

This thread was your chance .. you have been begging for "intelligent discussion" but given the chance, the first thing you did is to weasel out of it.

I am sorry to say but Gunner, what did you really expect from making this thread? Just look in the archives of this form and there have been many many many such threads. They all end in the same way with the Turkish trolls simply incapable of bringing forth ANY reasonable "argument".

[Gunner14]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Spurious point....


Anytime you discuss history, it will not be 100% accurate... so we rely on eye witnesses, memoirs, documents, etc...


I lost my chance? Please, you are the one who was making fun of anyone who wanted the genocide recognized by saying things..

"1.5 mllion turks should die?" --- sarcasm perhaps, but you are insulting our intelligence.

or

"maybe we should give turkey back to armenia" - again stupid remark

or

"all armenians are obsessed with turkish issues" - again how can you say something liek this? do you know all armenians?

or

"you have no normal life, your children will have hatred, your diaspora should live differently" -- do you understand how you are crossing lines?

or

"intelectual terror, armenian's comitted genocide in azerbejian"


by saying things the above on an armenian forum, you are inviting insults...


you say you're not sure of "reality" yet you call Dr. Bernard Lewis "the most important historian of middle east
You say you're not certain yet don't hesitate to call it a "myth" if you're not certain why do you call it a myth.

"victim of psyhcology and national identity based on this genocide." i dont refute this.... you have the similar issue regarding USA... doesnt mean 4/15/1915 was a myth.

"Second, I think you did not understand my point. Unlike you I am not sure about the reality, because as I said several times before the reality is being distorted by two sides. If you wouldn't lose your chance for a civilised discussion and we would start it, I know what kind of picture you will draw to me. You will start from the 1895-96 massacres, Hamidian troops, 1915 Van, and then 24 April arrests and killings, and then deportation, taking Armenian men to the military without guns, and then massacres, and then your secret telegrams that proove CUP has a plan for genocide, and then so called Naim Bey memoires, Morhenthau's book, blue book, Istanbul trials at 1919, etc. And you will conclude as there were around 2 million Armenians at 1914 and 150.000 remained at 1920"

I honestly don't want turkey to recgonize the genocide, because its not realistic... but i would like them to speak of the above (waht you stated) and let their citizens decide if it was a genocide or not... but they dont!!! Freedom of speech? Hah --- that is all i want for turkey to establish amreican constitutions first amendment... that's all

You seem more of a psychologist than a historian....

enter the Matrix!

[Kuja]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

What kind of similiarity is there between Armenian's approach towards Turks and that of Turks towards USA,Gunner 14?

[Sip]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Oooo a new user! Wow. Welcome to the forum Kuja.

[Gunner14]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

What kind of similiarity is there between Armenian's approach towards Turks and that of Turks towards USA,Gunner 14?

but,
I can't answer because i'm so blidned with hatred and post traumatic stress, that i am incapable of forming coherent opinions based on what i observe... sorry, i'm blinded by armenian propaganda and everything I say has no merit.

i dont want to talk about modern islam nation or american influence on the world.. i can write a 200 page thesis on it... i rather not

[Kuja]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Oooo a new user! Wow. Welcome to the forum Kuja.

Thanks Sip.That is a warm welcome.I hope it continues

[Kuja]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

but,
I can't answer because i'm so blidned with hatred and post traumatic stress, that i am incapable of forming coherent opinions based on what i observe... sorry, i'm blinded by armenian propaganda and everything I say has no merit.

You would not be able to say such things if you were.
I mean he who has really gotten by hatred cant even mention his devout.

[exfo]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

This thread was your chance .. you have been begging for "intelligent discussion" but given the chance, the first thing you did is to weasel out of it.

Sip, you are turning into a pathetic loser, you just losed your autocontrol about me. I wrote clearly that I dont want to discuss anything with you or Gunner anymore and I dont even reply your provocative posts about me. I dont beg any intelligent discussion, especially with you. Why do you still humiliate yourself? There are many other members here without me. Go and post to them, you can continue to post them about me, but just stop to post me, capish?