Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules (Everyone Must Read!!!)

1] What you CAN NOT post.

You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this forum to post any material which is:
- abusive
- vulgar
- hateful
- harassing
- personal attacks
- obscene

You also may not:
- post images that are too large (max is 500*500px)
- post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or cited properly.
- post in UPPER CASE, which is considered yelling
- post messages which insult the Armenians, Armenian culture, traditions, etc
- post racist or other intentionally insensitive material that insults or attacks another culture (including Turks)

The Ankap thread is excluded from the strict rules because that place is more relaxed and you can vent and engage in light insults and humor. Notice it's not a blank ticket, but just a place to vent. If you go into the Ankap thread, you enter at your own risk of being clowned on.
What you PROBABLY SHOULD NOT post...
Do not post information that you will regret putting out in public. This site comes up on Google, is cached, and all of that, so be aware of that as you post. Do not ask the staff to go through and delete things that you regret making available on the web for all to see because we will not do it. Think before you post!


2] Use descriptive subject lines & research your post. This means use the SEARCH.

This reduces the chances of double-posting and it also makes it easier for people to see what they do/don't want to read. Using the search function will identify existing threads on the topic so we do not have multiple threads on the same topic.

3] Keep the focus.

Each forum has a focus on a certain topic. Questions outside the scope of a certain forum will either be moved to the appropriate forum, closed, or simply be deleted. Please post your topic in the most appropriate forum. Users that keep doing this will be warned, then banned.

4] Behave as you would in a public location.

This forum is no different than a public place. Behave yourself and act like a decent human being (i.e. be respectful). If you're unable to do so, you're not welcome here and will be made to leave.

5] Respect the authority of moderators/admins.

Public discussions of moderator/admin actions are not allowed on the forum. It is also prohibited to protest moderator actions in titles, avatars, and signatures. If you don't like something that a moderator did, PM or email the moderator and try your best to resolve the problem or difference in private.

6] Promotion of sites or products is not permitted.

Advertisements are not allowed in this venue. No blatant advertising or solicitations of or for business is prohibited.
This includes, but not limited to, personal resumes and links to products or
services with which the poster is affiliated, whether or not a fee is charged
for the product or service. Spamming, in which a user posts the same message repeatedly, is also prohibited.

7] We retain the right to remove any posts and/or Members for any reason, without prior notice.


- PLEASE READ -

Members are welcome to read posts and though we encourage your active participation in the forum, it is not required. If you do participate by posting, however, we expect that on the whole you contribute something to the forum. This means that the bulk of your posts should not be in "fun" threads (e.g. Ankap, Keep & Kill, This or That, etc.). Further, while occasionally it is appropriate to simply voice your agreement or approval, not all of your posts should be of this variety: "LOL Member213!" "I agree."
If it is evident that a member is simply posting for the sake of posting, they will be removed.


8] These Rules & Guidelines may be amended at any time. (last update September 17, 2009)

If you believe an individual is repeatedly breaking the rules, please report to admin/moderator.
See more
See less

Akhtamar- Church of the Holy Cross (Soorp Khach)

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #11
    Joseph's comments

    Numerous questions/ issues that stick out regarding the upcoming event at Aghtamar:

    1) It's a pure Turkish political PR campaign (and a crude one at that) specifically targeting the Armenian genocide recognition campaign.

    2) It's not a church opening, it's a museum opening (The church will seemingly go the route of the Haiga Sophia)

    3) This "museum" will generate Turkish tourism money off of what remained of Armenian culture after the Armenians were exterminated (note: it was only recently admitted by nationalist/state Turkish historians that the church was Armenian in the first place)


    4) The invitations sent out were basically a form letters, no mention of
    security, no mention of discounted flights to/from Ankara, no mention of
    going with other Armenians in groups, no direct flight from Armenia to Turkey for the event etc.

    5) The Istanbul Patriarchate is not really involved in what the Turkish
    government is doing with the structure -- it is an Armenian church in
    Anatolia afterfall.

    6) The Turkish Ministry of Culture changed the name of Akhtamar to Akdamar (white or clean veins in Turkish)

    7) There is no cross on the church and the Ministry of Culture apparently
    "can't find one" or claimed a cross would get "struck by lighting". I am not religious, but not putting a cross on a church in eastern Turkey is a political item.

    8) A week and half notice is very poor planning. People have jobs and
    families.

    9) The entire time alloted to spend at the site is ONE HOUR!!!! (just enough time to snap photos with Mutafian to post to newsites worldwide)

    The impression I get is that the Turkish Ministry of Culture was so
    desperate to get this thing off to deflect the diaspora efforts at Genocide Recognition and to appeal to everyone that they are making genuine steps. I believe the majority of Armenians and other familiar with the issue (besides the McCarthy's of the world) can see right through this.

    They spit in our faces and call it rain.
    General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

    Comment


    • #12
      Prayers, protests at church opening

      By Zerin Elci

      Akdamar - Turks and Armenians celebrated the re-opening of a 10th century Armenian Christian church restored with Turkish state money on Thursday in a ceremony they hope will herald a thaw in long-frozen ties.

      But some Armenians, including the country's top clergyman, spurned the event because the Church of the Holy Cross, on a tiny island in Lake Van in eastern Turkey, is not adorned with a cross and will function as a museum, not as a place of worship.

      Armenians also fear the event may be just a public relations exercise aimed at softening international pressure on Turkey to own up to its role in massacres of their countrymen in 1915.

      Turkey denies claims the massacres amounted to a genocide. Flanked by Turkish flags, Archbishop Mesrob Mutafyan, spiritual head of Turkey's tiny surviving Armenian community, thanked Ankara for the $1,4-million restoration, but asked that Armenians be allowed to pray once a year at the site.

      "Praying at such a historic church, a centre of our faith, would have a positive effect on people's memory," he told about 350 people attending the ceremony. They included representatives of the Armenian government and the worldwide Armenian diaspora.

      Turkish Culture Minister Attila Koc said Ankara would consider the request. He also said he hoped the church would boost tourism to the remote, mountainous region.

      The church, commissioned by an Armenian king and completed in 921, is shaped as a cross, decorated with stone reliefs depicting Biblical scenes and topped by a conical roof. Snow-capped mountains tower above it and the blue lake waters.

      Some Armenians, whispering prayers, placed candles in the church. A few wept with emotion. Officials removed some of the candles, underlining Turkish sensitivities about expressions of religious belief in officially secular buildings.

      Armenia's Patriarch Garegin II boycotted the ceremony because of the decision to make the site a museum.

      "Such actions by the Turkish authorities are directed against the Christian sentiments of the Armenian people and cannot be seen as a positive step on the path to reconciliation of the Armenian and Turkish peoples," the patriarchate said.

      Muslim but secular Turkey, often criticised in the West for its treatment of its Christian minorities, hopes the re-opening of the church will improve its image, especially as the US Congress considers whether to approve a resolution that would recognise the mass killings of Armenians in 1915 as genocide.

      Ankara denies Ottoman Turkish forces committed a systematic genocide and says large numbers of both Christian Armenians and Muslim Turks died in inter-ethnic fighting in that period.

      The church on Akdamar island (Akhtamar to the Armenians) ceased to be a place of worship during World War One, when many of Turkey's ancient Armenian population suffered death or deportation in a tragedy commemorated on April 24 every year.

      The Armenian delegation took 16 hours to reach the site, barely 200 km (120 miles) from Yerevan, because Turkey's border with Armenia is closed and they had to travel via Georgia.

      "It would be very nice if the border were open. If the border stays shut, tourism from Armenia cannot really take off," Armenia's Deputy Culture Minister Gagik Gyurjyan said.

      Some Armenians dismissed the church project as empty PR.

      "(Turkey) is sending a message to the European Union: 'Aren't we civilised, trying to restore good ties with Armenia', while for domestic consumption they tell everyone: 'You do not need to worry, there will be no cross (on the church)," said Armenia's Social Democrat Hunchakian Party in Yerevan. - Reuters


      Additional reporting by Hasmik Mkrtchyan in Yerevan


      Published on the Web by IOL on 2007-03-29 15:38:21
      General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

      Comment


      • #13
        03/28/2007 17:13

        TURKEY
        The Armenian Church of the Holy Cross on lake Van reopened but only as a museum
        Mavi Zambak


        Built in the X century it lies in one of the country’s most beautiful areas, the very site of the Armenian genocide occurred. The journalist Hrant Dink, killed a months ago, had asked for the churches restoration and reopening. For years the ancient frescos had been used for target practice; the sacred building blackened by barbecue smoke for picnics. Armenian religious authorities protest. Patriarch Mesrob II refuses to participate in the ceremony.


        Ankara (AsiaNews) – Tomorrow March 29 the Turkish government will reopen – as a museum – the ancient Armenian Church of the Holy Cross on Akdamar island in the middle of lake Van, on eastern Turkey’s border with Armenia. The date had been moved over 4 times. Tomorrow Turkish authorities will be present at the ceremony, including prime minister Erdogan, but the Armenian spiritual authorities will not be present. In fact the Ankara authorities have denied the use of the building as a Church and has also refused to place a cross at the summit of the dome, as the original Church once had.

        Frescos destroyed and blackened

        Lying in a splendid salt water volcanic lake, this suggestive church is reached by a short 15 minute baost trip. It is one of the most precious examples of Armenian tenth century art in existence, an architectural creation of rare beauty (view the photo album at following address: http://www.pbase.com/dosseman/akdamar ).

        In the past the Turkish journal Milliyet, had denounced the alarming story that the bas relief which decorate the facade of the Holy Cross and depict scenes from the New and Old testament, were being used as target practice. In order to prove the damage caused they published photos illustrating the extent of the bullets destruction. Moreover, on hearing of a hidden treasure present on the island, local residents became "hunters" in search of the presumed riches, committing untold acts of vandalism in the process.

        As if that was not enough, the island, a popular destination for holiday picnic makers, was literally invaded by barbeques some even installed within the church itself, with the tragic consequence that the frescos on the church interior were blackened beyond recognition.

        In 2004 the newspaper Zaman also raised the alarm about the degraded state of Holy Cross Church, despite the fact that it is a tourist location of renowned popularity among visitors from all over the world, above all the Armenian Diaspora. In fact it is widely known that this area – among the most beautiful landscapes in Turkey – is sadly infamous for having been one of the sites of the Armenian genocide of 1915. Today for many Armenians, wherever they may be, Akdamar remains a place dear to their hearts, so much so that many try to visit it before they die. The sight of elderly Armenians falling to their knees in prayer as they set foot on the sacred island is not a rare one.

        A year and a half ago, the Turkish authorities decided to restore this artistic patrimony, a plan to preserve the historic identity of the church was laid out and after 15 months of intense work the restoration– which cost over 2 million euros and was carried out by the Turkish architect of note Zakerya Mildanoglu –has finished.

        But not without controversy.

        The restauration and the Armenian genocide

        Armenian Turkish journalist Hrant Dink – killed in Istanbul on January 19th – wrote an article for the Turkish paper Birgun which was republished by Milliyet the very day of his assassination: “Ten years ago I first appealed to the Van authorities. “Instead of inventing a monster in the lake to attract tourists why don’t you take care of the work of art which lies right under your nose. What need is there to waste your time on stupidities? Van is a veritable treasure from an Artistic point of view. Why do you not act seriously and sit down to ask yourselves: What if we restore the region? – And even if then Armenians did arrive, let them come to visit the birth place of their forefathers, what harm could they possibly do? “ And I even added: “If you need help we are ready. Turkey’s Armenians and those of the Diaspora are ready to volunteer their services, we are at your orders, let this be known! Come let us restore not only the Church but also our disenchanted souls”. Finally after a long wait restoration on Akdamar are completed (…) we are deeply indebted to Cahit Zeydanli for his meticulous work, he consulted experts from Armenia and also with architect Zakarya Mildanoglu, and Armenian from Turkey. They did their best and they have created something splendid. The did great things, but alas then politicians and bureaucrats became involved and the inauguration could not take place. Once the opening was put of from November 4th 2006 for reasons of inclement weather to April the 24th, as explained by Culture Minister Atilla Koc. Reactions were not short in coming. The Armenian Patriarch Mutafyan made known that in the case the inauguration actually happened on April 24th no Armenian should attend. Last week the question even arose in Parliament. CHP (Peoples Republican Party) deputy Erdal Karademir asked if the date of April 24th, the anniversary of the Armenian genocide, was a reflection of the politics of AKP (Justice and Development Party). For its’ part the nationalist press presented the event as “the inauguration of the Van vendetta”. They succeeded in transforming something positive into an error, a farce, a disaster. The government still has not taken up a clear position regarding the Armenian question. It is not concerned with resolving the issue, but in scoring points in a political battle, in basis of their opponents moves. They lack all credibility. The invite Armenian historians to the discussion table but then show no scruples in putting people on trial who have a different view point to the official line on the question. The restore the Armenian Church to attract tourists to the western Anatolia region, at the same time showing no sahme in scoring political points from it”.

        After hypothesising over April 11th, now it has been decioded: tomorrow there will be the opening ceremony with the presence of prime minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, Minister for Culture and Tourism Attila Koc, the Minister for Armenian Culture Hasmik Poghosyan has also been invited. But the problems persist.

        It is well known that the Border between Turkey and Armenia is closed, thus after various attempts to have a conduit opened, or a special airfield made available for the special occasion, so the Armenian authorities could make their way to Van directly from the Armenian capital, following Turkey’s repeated no, the group of Architects, historians and journalists today set out on an arduous 15 hour journey overland through Georgia, when Van lies a few hundred miles from Erivan.

        A museum without a cross or religious ceremonies

        The Armenian Patriarch Karekin Katolikos II has joined Turkish Armenian Patriarch Mesrob II in refusing to attend. Why? This historic Church has been transformed into a museum, a request for a cross to be put in place at the summit of the dome has been refused, there will be no bells and the opening ceremony will be equal to that of any secular museum.

        “Seeing as it is not considered a Church, seeing as no religious celebration will mark this reopening, my presence there is really insignificant”, affirmed Patriarch Mesrob II, adding: “I pleaded with the President and Prime Minister to see that a cross be placed on the dome, I invited them to establish an annual Armenian festival in the area, but I have yet to receive an answer. Therefore my presence there on March 29th really has little sense”.

        And the delicate relationship between the Patriarch and the Turkish authorities do not end here.

        Days ago Mesrob II travelled under heavy police escort following death threats to Iskenderun, in ancient Alessandretta, a maritime city on Turkey’s Mediterranean coast, to celebrate the 225 anniversary of the local Armenian Church. Well, there in that very city which is also home to the Catholic Vicariate to Anatolia, the mayor decided to erect a monument to the Turks killed by French and Armenians during the French occupation of 1918-38.

        The Patriarch, could only comment on this gesture as a further provocation by nationalists to divide the population : “Instead of building a bridge of dialogue between peoples, in this way they heighten tensions, this can only be the work of nationalists”, he sadly commented to journalists.

        Even regarding Hrant Dink’s assassination, nothing clear has so far emerged: “If we still cannot find the true perpetrators of this crime, it means that they are well protected and from on high”, is the Patriarchs embittered response.
        General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

        Comment


        • #14
          Turkey's Shame?

          Aghtamar island and the destruction of Armenian cultural properties in Turkey (more) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPA45FEaUW8
          "All truth passes through three stages:
          First, it is ridiculed;
          Second, it is violently opposed; and
          Third, it is accepted as self-evident."

          Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

          Comment


          • #15
            From: The Independent.


            30 March 2007 08:01

            Turkish restoration of Armenian church leaves no room for apology
            By Ian Herbert in Van, Anatolia, Turkey
            Published: 30 March 2007

            Across a blue salt lake on an island surrounded by snow-capped mountains in eastern Turkey, Armenian Christians were invited yesterday to witness how the Turkish nation has restored one of their most holy sites.

            From the bas-relief etched out of red tufa stone, to the frescoes on the high conical roof, most of the ancient treasures were back on view again at the 1,000-year-old Church of the Holy Cross, on the island of Akdamar in Lake Van, eastern Anatolia. Except for the cross; the same cross which was visible in early sketches of the church and photographed in 1908, just before Armenians were rounded up, never to return, in the city of Van at the beginning of what they describe as their genocide at the hands of the Ottomans.

            The church's restoration had been sold to the world - and specifically to the US, whose House of Representatives is about to consider a resolution labelling the Armenian deaths genocide - as proof that Turkey want to put things right with the Armenians. But, despite the protests of the restoration project's Armenian architect, a cross was ruled out - as is any immediate prospect of this Christian church being consecrated so Armenians might, occasionally at least, pray here again. "The church is reopening as a museum and doesn't need a cross," Yusuf Halacoglu, the head of the Turkish Historical Society, insisted this week. "Around 22,000 Ottoman buildings have had crescents taken off when attacked. Other countries don't give as much attention to that."

            The insensitivity set the tone for yesterday's ceremony which, despite the Turkish posters everywhere declaring Tarihe saygi, kulture saygi ("Respect the history, respect the culture"), was a painful and almost provocative statement of Turkey's national identity. The Armenian architect/bishop Manuel, who started building the church in AD 915, employed Armenian master carvers to create Christian reliefs of Adam and Eve, Noah's flood and David and Goliath. But Turkey has appropriated the holy site in a three-year, $2m (£1m) rebuild and was making no secret of the fact. The Turkish cresent and a giant Ataturk hung from the front of the church where, after a triumphal rendition of the Turkish national anthem, the culture and tourism minister, Atilla Koc, Turkey's most senior government representative, made his address. "We protect the cultural diversity and assets of different cultures," he proclaimed during a speech in which the word "Armenia" was not used once.

            Perhaps it was just as well that only 29 people from Armenia had travelled here - by road, via Georgia, because the Turks would not open the borders to their cars or Van airport to their planes. But those who did make the journey bore witness to the most extraordinary man in the place.

            Patriarch Mesrob Mutafyan believes his people were the victims of genocide - he calls it medzegherm(the great slaughter) - and he would like the Turkish government to say "a simple sorry to my people to ease the tensions". But he was prepared to take the Turks' Akdamar gesture at face value in the hope that Armenians and Turks can live together. "The government ... has courageously completed the restoration project," he said when he clambered to his feet. "It is quite a positive move in Turkish-Armenian relations and I offer my profound thanks." His only request was that the Turks allow the church to become the site of annual pilgrimage, concluding in a Christian ceremony, once a year.

            It remains to be seen whether Turkey's modernising Prime Minister Recep Tayip Erdogan can let that pass. It is an election year and a rising tide of nationalism is being fuelled in large part by the EU's frostiness about Turkish accession. Antagonising those who consider further concessions to the Armenians an "insult to Turkishness" might be politically contentious. It might also explain why Mr Erdogan, a progressive who started the Akdamar project and has also launched a History Commission to investigate the events of 1915, thought it best not to attend yesterday's ceremony.

            So desperate is Mr Erdogan's government to demonstrate its tolerance of Turkey's 70,000 Armenian minority that it took journalists around the country this week. The trip revealed more than the government might have intended: Armenian schools in Istanbul where only the Turkish version of history - ignoring 1915 - is taught; Armenian priests who need metal detectors at their churches because of the threat of extremists; and, at the newspaper offices of the murdered Turkish-Armenian writer Hrant Dink, a stream of abusive emails from nationalists. (Dink's last article communicated his exasperation at the Turks' initial selection of 24 April - the day when Armenians mark the anniversary of the round-up of intellectuals in 1915 - as the day of the Akdamar church reopening. That date was later changed.)

            With the Armenian government unwilling to join Mr Erdogan's History Commission, Patriarch Mutafyan invokes the memory of Levon Ter-Petrossian, Armenia's former president, and his search for common ground. Mr Ter-Petrossian wanted a monument on the countries' border with the inscription, in Armenian and Turkish, of the words "I'm sorry". It was never built.

            The Turkish Foreign Ministry said yesterday that a request by Patriarch Mutayfan that the cross be returned to Akdamar was being referred to the culture ministry. "I'm praying that one day it will be there," another Armenian church leader, George Kazoum, said before the ceremony.

            For now, the Armenians can only take comfort from the crosses which no one can take from them. They were bathed in sunshine yesterday, away from all of the Turkish stage-managed razzmatazz, on gravestones in the Akdamar churchyard which have stood here through 1,000 years of snow, storms, earthquakes and human carnage.

            Comment


            • #16
              Originally posted by steph View Post
              From: The Independent.


              30 March 2007 08:01

              Turkish restoration of Armenian church leaves no room for apology
              By Ian Herbert in Van, Anatolia, Turkey
              Published: 30 March 2007

              Across a blue salt lake on an island surrounded by snow-capped mountains in eastern Turkey, Armenian Christians were invited yesterday to witness how the Turkish nation has restored one of their most holy sites.

              From the bas-relief etched out of red tufa stone, to the frescoes on the high conical roof, most of the ancient treasures were back on view again at the 1,000-year-old Church of the Holy Cross, on the island of Akdamar in Lake Van, eastern Anatolia. Except for the cross; the same cross which was visible in early sketches of the church and photographed in 1908, just before Armenians were rounded up, never to return, in the city of Van at the beginning of what they describe as their genocide at the hands of the Ottomans.

              The church's restoration had been sold to the world - and specifically to the US, whose House of Representatives is about to consider a resolution labelling the Armenian deaths genocide - as proof that Turkey want to put things right with the Armenians. But, despite the protests of the restoration project's Armenian architect, a cross was ruled out - as is any immediate prospect of this Christian church being consecrated so Armenians might, occasionally at least, pray here again. "The church is reopening as a museum and doesn't need a cross," Yusuf Halacoglu, the head of the Turkish Historical Society, insisted this week. "Around 22,000 Ottoman buildings have had crescents taken off when attacked. Other countries don't give as much attention to that."

              The insensitivity set the tone for yesterday's ceremony which, despite the Turkish posters everywhere declaring Tarihe saygi, kulture saygi ("Respect the history, respect the culture"), was a painful and almost provocative statement of Turkey's national identity. The Armenian architect/bishop Manuel, who started building the church in AD 915, employed Armenian master carvers to create Christian reliefs of Adam and Eve, Noah's flood and David and Goliath. But Turkey has appropriated the holy site in a three-year, $2m (£1m) rebuild and was making no secret of the fact. The Turkish cresent and a giant Ataturk hung from the front of the church where, after a triumphal rendition of the Turkish national anthem, the culture and tourism minister, Atilla Koc, Turkey's most senior government representative, made his address. "We protect the cultural diversity and assets of different cultures," he proclaimed during a speech in which the word "Armenia" was not used once.

              Perhaps it was just as well that only 29 people from Armenia had travelled here - by road, via Georgia, because the Turks would not open the borders to their cars or Van airport to their planes. But those who did make the journey bore witness to the most extraordinary man in the place.

              Patriarch Mesrob Mutafyan believes his people were the victims of genocide - he calls it medzegherm(the great slaughter) - and he would like the Turkish government to say "a simple sorry to my people to ease the tensions". But he was prepared to take the Turks' Akdamar gesture at face value in the hope that Armenians and Turks can live together. "The government ... has courageously completed the restoration project," he said when he clambered to his feet. "It is quite a positive move in Turkish-Armenian relations and I offer my profound thanks." His only request was that the Turks allow the church to become the site of annual pilgrimage, concluding in a Christian ceremony, once a year.

              It remains to be seen whether Turkey's modernising Prime Minister Recep Tayip Erdogan can let that pass. It is an election year and a rising tide of nationalism is being fuelled in large part by the EU's frostiness about Turkish accession. Antagonising those who consider further concessions to the Armenians an "insult to Turkishness" might be politically contentious. It might also explain why Mr Erdogan, a progressive who started the Akdamar project and has also launched a History Commission to investigate the events of 1915, thought it best not to attend yesterday's ceremony.

              So desperate is Mr Erdogan's government to demonstrate its tolerance of Turkey's 70,000 Armenian minority that it took journalists around the country this week. The trip revealed more than the government might have intended: Armenian schools in Istanbul where only the Turkish version of history - ignoring 1915 - is taught; Armenian priests who need metal detectors at their churches because of the threat of extremists; and, at the newspaper offices of the murdered Turkish-Armenian writer Hrant Dink, a stream of abusive emails from nationalists. (Dink's last article communicated his exasperation at the Turks' initial selection of 24 April - the day when Armenians mark the anniversary of the round-up of intellectuals in 1915 - as the day of the Akdamar church reopening. That date was later changed.)

              With the Armenian government unwilling to join Mr Erdogan's History Commission, Patriarch Mutafyan invokes the memory of Levon Ter-Petrossian, Armenia's former president, and his search for common ground. Mr Ter-Petrossian wanted a monument on the countries' border with the inscription, in Armenian and Turkish, of the words "I'm sorry". It was never built.

              The Turkish Foreign Ministry said yesterday that a request by Patriarch Mutayfan that the cross be returned to Akdamar was being referred to the culture ministry. "I'm praying that one day it will be there," another Armenian church leader, George Kazoum, said before the ceremony.

              For now, the Armenians can only take comfort from the crosses which no one can take from them. They were bathed in sunshine yesterday, away from all of the Turkish stage-managed razzmatazz, on gravestones in the Akdamar churchyard which have stood here through 1,000 years of snow, storms, earthquakes and human carnage.
              Excellent article
              General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

              Comment


              • #17
                Turkish Daily News
                The so-called Akdamar museum‚
                Friday, March 30, 2007



                Cengiz Çandar


                This is the day of the opening of a "church-museum," which the Minister of
                Cultural Affairs turned into a mess. Whatever the intention was, it looks
                like a "cultural genocide." Today is indeed the day of the opening of the
                Ahtamar Church, which has been just restored, to "tourism," and which is
                expected to attract many tourists to Eastern Anatolia.

                However the Ministry has renamed the 1000-year-old Armenian capital "Ani" as "An‡" (which means "memory" in Turkish), and also removed the cross and the bells from the Ahtamar Church, which it renamed as "Akdamar" (which means "white vein" in Turkish.) This obsession with renaming, the cultural and religious intolerance shown towards the cross and the church bell, might well be perceived in the world as a "cultural genocide"; nobody should be surprised if that turns out to be the case.



                The obsession with renaming:

                The name Akhtamar comes from a myth about the lake Van. It is about the story of a young man, who was looking forward to reunite with his lover, Tamar, who was on the island along with the church in question. The man yelled "Ah, Tamar" while he was drowning. Why in the world we change that name into "Akdamar"?

                What kind of a lack of imagination is that? We have renamed many
                historical areas within Turkey with completely made-up names like
                "Güzelyurt" (Beautiful Home), "Ye?ilyurt" (Green Home), "Ye?ilköy" (Green
                Village), "Gündo›an" (Rising Day). And now, "Ani" turned into "An‡", and
                "Akhtamar" into "Akdamar."

                You restore a historical church and find absurd reasons for not putting a
                cross and a bell onto it? Who will believe that you are secular, or that you
                "respect all faiths," or that you represent "the alliance of civilizations
                against the clash of civilizations."

                What you do is simply "cultural genocide." How come you have the right for
                that? And why?

                Here is an excerpt from a news story published in the weekly Agos on March
                23, and which tells about the letter sent by a group of intellectuals from
                the Istanbul Armenian community to Minister of Culture, Atilla Koç:

                „?Emphasizing that the church on the island is named „Ahtamar Sourp Haç
                Church‰ and that it gets its name from the Sourp Haç festival celebrated on
                the second Sunday of every September, the intellectuals say: ŒThis is an
                important day and an important festival for Armenians. This is also the
                reason for the existence of that church. Therefore, we think it would be
                appropriate to have the name of the church, just like the name of the
                island, to be changed to fit the its religious and historical significance?
                If required, the ownership of the property can be given to the community and
                the operation right to the relative state body. However, if this site will
                also be [serving as] a church, then it needs to be blessed and open to
                prayers'.‰

                Turkish Armenian Patriarch Mesrop II says: „Is it possible to have a
                church without a cross at the top? Furthermore, religious services will not
                be conducted at its opening. If I will not have a role there as a [man of]
                religion, there will not be a point in my going there.‰





                Appear righteous and benefit politically:

                What do you think „our set‰ are trying to do? If you ask me, they would
                like „to appear righteous and benefit politically.‰ And naturally they make
                a mess out of it. The initial plans were for the opening of Ahtamar to take
                place on Apr. 24. A real cunning idea... As it is known to be the
                „Armenian genocide remembrance day in the world,‰ a trump for propaganda
                would have been used on that day.

                Then the date became Apr. 11. According to the ancient Armenian calendar,
                Apr. 11 coincides with Apr. 24. They probably knew this also. They were
                still pursuing another cunning idea. At the end, it was decided that the
                opening of Ahtamar, now „Akdamar,‰ would take place on Mar. 29, as a
                restoration opening of a museum-church, without a cross or a bell.

                What a disgrace. The cross a symbol for the Christian world that
                represents Jesus Christ's suffering for all humanity. Even if Muslims do
                not believe in the cross, and even if there are negative connotations of the
                cross throughout history for Muslims, would it not be necessary to „show
                respect toward everyone's faiths‰ in a secular country in 2007? Would such
                an attitude not glorify a Muslim Culture Minister and his government?

                On one hand, they constantly pronounce Fatih Sultan Mehmet's name, yet on
                the other, they cannot even come near what he has done 550 years ago or his
                tolerance. They have learned nothing from him.



                Hrant Dink foretold it:

                A reminder, just in case you have forgotten, that Hrant Dink was
                treacherously murdered with a shot in the back on Jan. 19. During the time
                of his murder, the last Agos newspaper he prepared, Agos's 564th issue has
                just hit the newsstands. The headline of the newspaper was on Ahtamar and
                so was the editorial, which Hrant wrote and signed as „Agos.‰

                Here's what Hrant Dink wrote in his editorial:

                „The opening of the restored Surp Haç Armenian Church of Ahtamar Island
                has turned into a comedy. It could only be possible to put a right job on a
                wrong course so successfully. The impossible-to-hide hidden motive could not
                be more revealing. A real comedy? A real tragedy? The government hasn't
                still been able to formulate a correct approach to the „Armenian question.‰
                Its real aim is not to solve the problem, but to gain points like a wrestler
                in a contest. How and when it will make the right move and defeat its
                opponent. That's the only concern. This is not earnestness. The state calls
                on Armenian historians to discuss history, but does not shy from trying its
                own intellectuals who have an unorthodox rhetoric on the Armenian genocide.
                It restores an Armenian church in the Southeast, but only thinks, „How can I
                use this for political gains in the world, how can I sell it?‰

                They shot Hrant on the day this article was published. It lost its charm
                in entity. There has been no charm ever since that day. Bad smells come
                from the Hrant Dink murder investigation.

                And today, they replace the cross with the icing on the cake, when they
                open the Ahtamar Sourp Haç Church as „Akdamar.‰ Then the „alleged genocide‰
                and „alliance of civilizations‰ rhetoric will follow.
                General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”

                Comment


                • #18
                  by Gomidas Institute:
                  Akhtamar's story was titled ... Turkey's Shame?

                  Check their clip about it:

                  Comment


                  • #19
                    Some thoughts (from Van)

                    As I skim through this thread (none of those reports are really worth the time to read in depth) my end thought is "what a bunch of bastards". All of them Turks, Armenians, European journalists, the lot.

                    Not one what has actually got the guts or the knowledge to say a word about the fate of the monument that has had the misfortune to be at the center of the unwanted attention of this political "restoration". Go see the page about the restoration on VirtualAni.org.

                    There goes Zaman reprinting all those old lies about the condition of the church, even mentioning the bogus photographs they made (actually stolen from a 1950s book). Lies that that that other bastard, Harut Sassounian, took great pleasure to spread.

                    Most of the journalists were flown in from Ankara (free of charge), herded around like sheep, and flown back the same evening. A bunch of cretins, one and all (not that they need intelligence to write like they do). But still they thought oh-so-highly of themselves.

                    And what about those two skin-head Armenians, Armenian flags hanging provocatively from their jacket pockets - trying to get close to the podium several times, perhaps contemplating some sort of demonstration and then chickening-out.

                    And so Mutafyan is back in everyones good books now that he calls the island by its proper name, and mentions religious ceremonies. Well, sorry to break the good news, but actually anyone could hold religious ceremonies in the church before the restoration, I myself have seen several. Now - thanks to that restoration - all that will probably be forbidden. And maybe a bit of a closer look at Mutafyan's words might be in order. He said that the damage to the chutch was entirely because of "natural reasons". I don't think nature put bullet holes in the reliefs, or decapitated many of the protruding heads, or hacked off the cross on the west facade, or, for that matter, killed the monks on the island in 1915 that resulted in its abandonement.

                    Yet, actually, Mutafyan might be a decent person if he would only resist these urges to poodle to the Turkish authorities. After the ceremony he (and a couple of attendants) climbed high up the hill on the northern side of the island, to contemplate the view and get away from the mob below. He was, rather touchingly, humming to himself as he walked back down.
                    Plenipotentiary meow!

                    Comment


                    • #20
                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      1) It's a pure Turkish political PR campaign (and a crude one at that) specifically targeting the Armenian genocide recognition campaign.
                      Yes - but it is still going to be a succesful one. The targets are not you or me, but politicians (who are seeking excuses rather than facts)

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      2) It's not a church opening, it's a museum opening (The church will seemingly go the route of the Haiga Sophia)
                      It can still be a church and a museum. There is no need to adopt the fundamentalist approach of the Armenian Church who think that historical church monuments are worthless unless they have their priests in them.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      3) This "museum" will generate Turkish tourism money off of what remained of Armenian culture after the Armenians were exterminated (note: it was only recently admitted by nationalist/state Turkish historians that the church was Armenian in the first place)
                      And the alternative?

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      4) The invitations sent out were basically a form letters, no mention of
                      security, no mention of discounted flights to/from Ankara, no mention of
                      going with other Armenians in groups, no direct flight from Armenia to Turkey for the event etc.
                      Most of those there went free of charge.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      5) The Istanbul Patriarchate is not really involved in what the Turkish
                      government is doing with the structure -- it is an Armenian church in
                      Anatolia afterfall.
                      The Armenian Church don't own it.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      6) The Turkish Ministry of Culture changed the name of Akhtamar to Akdamar (white or clean veins in Turkish)
                      Actually, some other Turkish body "Turkified" the name decades ago.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      7) There is no cross on the church and the Ministry of Culture apparently
                      "can't find one" or claimed a cross would get "struck by lighting". I am not religious, but not putting a cross on a church in eastern Turkey is a political item.
                      Maybe the less I say about the cross issue the better!

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      8) A week and half notice is very poor planning. People have jobs and
                      families.
                      I got there - and I paid my own way.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      9) The entire time alloted to spend at the site is ONE HOUR!!!! (just enough time to snap photos with Mutafian to post to newsites worldwide)
                      They were there for about 2.5 hours.

                      Originally posted by Joseph View Post
                      The impression I get is that the Turkish Ministry of Culture was so
                      desperate to get this thing off to deflect the diaspora efforts at Genocide Recognition and to appeal to everyone that they are making genuine steps. I believe the majority of Armenians and other familiar with the issue (besides the McCarthy's of the world) can see right through this.

                      They spit in our faces and call it rain.
                      Again true - but, in reality, what would satisfy the Armenian diaspora?
                      Plenipotentiary meow!

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X