Ukraine

[Haykakan]

Re: Ukraine

All of those expences you mentioned are investments that pay off big time. Investments like that are what build nations and what i wish was being done everywhere and is badly needed almost everywhere. The money invested in this way will come back to you 100 fold in time. Yes China is doing things in a smart way and i hope it will continue to be smart for it is poised to be one of the leaders of this world and good leadership on a world scale has been badly lacking.

No doubt Russia's involvement in Ukraine was more justified than the West's, but however you want to look at it, economically it will be an expensive acquisition:
3 billion dollars for a bridge to create an actual land connection between Russia and Crimea
2 billion dollars a year that Ukraine paid just to keep Crimea afloat, Russia already wrote the first $400 million check the very first day
billions is the total transformation in legal system, political system, currency, banks, etc
the issue of all water. electricty, and other key infrastructure coming through Ukraine
and much more

I think China's air space situation is still very much justified, and more of a western created "controversy", considering its still a fraction of that of Japans and more importantly an issue regarding its own borders. China though assertive on issues regarding its own sovereignty, does a good job of not creating unneeded alliances and enemies.

[lampron]

Re: Ukraine

SARKISIAN BACKS CRIMEAN REFERENDUM IN PHONE CALL WITH PUTIN

Wednesday, March 19th, 2014



But Sarkisian's latest phone call is likely to draw negative reactions
from Europe and the United States as it places Armenia squarely on
the Russian side of the equation.

Sarkisian like all Armenian leaders has done nothing for the majority poor but this phone call was correct
NATO must be told of its hypocrisy in bombing Yugoslavia in support of Kosovo but opposing self determination in Crimea and Karabakh

[Mher]

Re: Ukraine

All of those expences you mentioned are investments that pay off big time. Investments like that are what build nations and what i wish was being done everywhere and is badly needed almost everywhere. The money invested in this way will come back to you 100 fold in time. Yes China is doing things in a smart way and i hope it will continue to be smart for it is poised to be one of the leaders of this world and good leadership on a world scale has been badly lacking.

we'll see how things develop. But I have a feeling both sides will gently abandon their respective pet projects, EU with Ukraine and Russia with Crimea.

Sarkisian like all Armenian leaders has done nothing for the majority poor but this phone call was correct
NATO must be told of its hypocrisy in bombing Yugoslavia in support of Kosovo but opposing self determination in Crimea and Karabakh

agreed on both ends. It's politics as usual. But Russia has much more of a right to get involve with its own population than the West did with a random E.European ethnicity.

[Artashes]

Re: Ukraine

Personally, I think Crimea is going to get emmediate & large financial & physical attention from Russia.
Relatively small and concise piece of real estate . And extremely well positioned geopolitically.
We will see, but I think the Crimean population is going to be grinning from ear to ear for the coming boom.
Russia is going to race to tie this up and bring infrastructure to efficient utilization.
The west handed Russia a golden opportunity and they are going to take full advantage FAST IMO.
We'll see.

[TomServo]

Re: Ukraine

Useful primer on Ukraine: http://reconsideringrussia.org/2014/...at-is-ukraine/

[lampron]

Re: Ukraine

Useful primer on Ukraine: http://reconsideringrussia.org/2014/...at-is-ukraine/

According to Kiev’s Research & Branding Group, almost 50% of Ukrainians have relatives in Russia. 28% have close relatives living just across the Russian border. 60% indicated that they do not regard Russia as a foreign country. As the historian Stephen F. Cohen wrote, of all the ex-Soviet states, Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus “are the most intricately and intimately linked–by geography, history, language, religion, marriage, economics, energy pipelines, and security.

sounds correct

The Crimean Tatars are a Turkic Muslim people who were deported from the peninsula en masse by Joseph Stalin in 1944 to Soviet Central Asia. Only since glasnost have they been able to return. Since this time, they have formed their own parliament, the Mejlis, as a means of securing their ethnic rights.

The Crimean tatars were engaged in slave trading for hundreds of years (not mentioned)

Also significant numbers of Armenians lived in Crimea until 1475 (not mentioned)

[Haykakan]

Re: Ukraine

I see a possibility here of this whole situation backfiring on the west. Perhaps even to the point where the whole Ukraine ends up back in Russian sphere. Russian influence with things like common history, language, culture, families..is very strong throughout most of Ukraine minus very small parts in the west and this is why Russia will prevail in this region one way or another. USA and the west could be seeing their Stalingrad here like Hitler did in WW2. For those who do not get the reference-i am referring to major turning points in history with Stalingrad as the turning point of WW2 and Ukraine could be the turning point in the tug of war between the east and the west.

[Haykakan]

Re: Ukraine

The rulers of nations have personalities and human characteristics that express themselves in the way they rule. The new government took power by force thus it will look at force as the way to solve things since it worked before. You can see the willingness to use violence in many ways but it transcends into all other aspects of rule. Here is a good example of them threatening Armenia already
UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTRY THREATENS WORSENING RELATIONS WITH ARMENIA

YEREVAN, March 21. / ARKA /. Armenia's recognition of Moscow's
annexation of the Crimea will have negative consequences for the
Ukrainian-Armenian relations, deputy foreign minister Daniel Lubkivskyy
said in Kiev, UNIAN news agency reports.

In a telephone conversation on March 19, Armenian and Russian
presidents, Serzh Sargsyan and Vladimir Putin, said the referendum
in Crimea in which about 96 percent of eligible citizens voted
to split from Ukraine, was another example of people's rights to
self-determination through free expression of will.

Lubkivskyy said Armenian ambassador to Ukraine was twice invited to
the ministry of foreign affairs to be conveyed Ukraine's concerns. He
said appropriate instructions were given also to Ukrainian embassy
in Armenia.

He said a note of protest was handed to the Armenian ambassador in
which Kiev demands clarification on Yerevan's official position. He
said official Kiev would ask Armenia to "inform officially and publicly
that it does not recognize the annexation of the Crimea."

He said if Armenia's response is interpreted as unfriendly, it would
have negative consequences for bilateral relations.

In response to a question whether Kiev may break off diplomatic
relations with Armenia Lubkivskyy said: "Negative consequences have a
wide range that will be applied after we receive the official position
of the Armenian side."-0-

- See more at:

http://arka.am/en/news/politics/ukrainian_foreign_ministry_threatens_worsening_relations_with_armenia/#sthash.as27GdOj.dpuf

[lampron]

Re: Ukraine

In response to a question whether Kiev may break off diplomatic
relations with Armenia Lubkivskyy said: "Negative consequences have a
wide range that will be applied after we receive the official position
of the Armenian side."-0-

- See more at:
http://arka.am/en/news/politics/ukra....as27GdOj.dpuf

But this Ukrainian government came to power after the previous government was overthrown - making it less than completely legal

It is not clear if this government has the support of Ukrainians from all regions

It has received complete support from the US and EU but its decisions may not reflect the will of a significant number of Ukrainians

In fact quite a few mainland Ukrainians may well agree with the decision to hold a referendum in Crimea

[Mher]

Re: Ukraine

EU offers Ukraine $15 billion, but help hinges on IMF deal

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/05/us-eu-ukraine-support-idUSBREA240V020140305