Historicity of the Jewish Holocaust

[loseyourname]

Originally posted by dusken Ok. You are hoping to uncover, in an Armenian forum void of historians in the 21st century, what the unwritten motivations and thoughts of certain individuals were 60 years ago. Good luck. And you never said anything about what you were hoping to occur. Reread your first post. You instigated and it happened. These are the natural reactions.

It's cool. I didn't say you can't post about it. I'm sure a discussion of gassing is relevant; it just isn't the main point.

Also, it's not like I'm hoping to uncover any truth. If the case hasn't been proven either way in the public forum, it isn't going to be proven either way here, though I'm sure people will come in from both camps claiming that they can prove one way or the other. Personally, I don't really care whether or not it happened. It won't alter my world-view either way. I just want to see what people have to say.

[dusken]

Locked? By who? It was started by a mod.

[loseyourname]

Originally posted by Darorinag Also, I am surprised that this thread is going quite well, so far, at least. I hope it wouldn't get locked.

I think we can keep it to a discussion of facts. Since no one here, presumably, has any vested interest in either side of the debate, and no one here is Jewish, there shouldn't be any problems, as long as you and Fadix don't start going at each other's throats when he comes in. I think I'll go back and remove Seapahn's post.

[Anonymouse]

Originally posted by dusken As a fan of logic you should know why you should not have said that.

Also, I do not think anyone has mentioned that, in all of these camps, as far as I know, there were homosexuals and P.O.W.'s from Russia and France. The proposed deaths of the Jews are in addition to those of the other populations and in the large camps, the rate at which they were killed and disposed of is mathematically impossible. It takes a long time to burn a body. And it would take 24 hours to kill a human being in a gas chamber designed to fumigate clothing.

I agree you cannot not prove the Holocaust did not happen. Loser should have been more careful. The onus lies upon the accusers.

[Darorinag]

Originally posted by dusken Locked? By who? It was started by a mod.

He said he would lock the thread if it got out of hand.

If the case hasn't been proven either way in the public forum, it isn't going to be proven either way here

Who says it hasn't been proven either way in the public forum? It has been proven, period. Just check out the revisionist forum. The proofs there are immense. Germar Rudolf has also disqualified Robert Van Pelt's "findings." It IS proof. But exterminationists do not consider it proof. That doesn't mean the "proofs" presented by exterminationists are being rejected because they're the opposing view. On the contrary. They have been debunked using CORRECT scientific findings, and historical and graphical verification of photos.

though I'm sure people will come in from both camps claiming that they can prove one way or the other.

They can't prove ANY of their claims. Their claims are based on "givens" that this and that happened. It's called "begging the question." Example: "There is proof that the holocaust happened because it happened." They're unable to debate with revisionists. They have not been able to say ONE thing to disprove Rufolf's findings.

[Darorinag]

Originally posted by loseyourname I think we can keep it to a discussion of facts. Since no one here, presumably, has any vested interest in either side of the debate, and no one here is Jewish, there shouldn't be any problems, as long as you and Fadix don't start going at each other's throats when he comes in. I think I'll go back and remove Seapahn's post.

Thanks, loseyourname.

So far, so good. I've got no need to or interest in calling anyone names.

[loseyourname]

Originally posted by Anonymouse I agree you cannot not prove the Holocaust did not happen. Loser should have been more careful. The onus lies upon the accusers.

Ideally, that would be the case. But it's already been settled publicly, so unfortunately, it lies on the revisionists to prove that it didn't happen.

There is nothing logically inconsistent about what I said. Disproving the existence of gas chambers and showing that the number of Jews killed couldn't have been as high as claimed does little to disestablish a planned extermination.

[Darorinag]

Originally posted by loseyourname Ideally, that would be the case. But it's already been settled publicly, so unfortunately, it lies on the revisionists to prove that it didn't happen.

There is nothing logically inconsistent about what I said. Disproving the existence of gas chambers and showing that the number of Jews killed couldn't have been as high as claimed does little to disestablish a planned extermination.

Loseyourname, planning for an extermination doesn't mean it happened. I think we're talking about 2 different things.

Moreover, if there were a planned extermination, one would think they did act on it, no? Well, where's the proof? They had what, more than 4 years to do it. So where's the evidence?

[loseyourname]

Originally posted by Darorinag Who says it hasn't been proven either way in the public forum? It has been proven, period. Just check out the revisionist forum. The proofs there are immense. Germar Rudolf has also disqualified Robert Van Pelt's "findings." It IS proof. But exterminationists do not consider it proof. That doesn't mean the "proofs" presented by exterminationists are being rejected because they're the opposing view. On the contrary. They have been debunked using CORRECT scientific findings, and historical and graphical verification of photos.

We'll see. If that is indeed the case, then that fact will have to come to light eventually. History has shown that truth, in particular scientifically established truth, can only be suppressed so long.

[loseyourname]

Okay, this is kind of degrading into a chatroom. I'll check out your links, and wait to see what Fadix has to say (I am assuming he'll have something to say).