War in The Middle East

[Palavra]

Re: War in The Middle East

Arab world is not even supporting Hamas.

[robertik1]

Re: War in The Middle East

israel will go in, destroy the few things still left in tact, the 'arab world' will protest but no arab country will do a damn thing and within a few weeks all of this will be forgotten as some "new" development will take the headlines on the idiotbox.

I concur.

[skhara]

Re: War in The Middle East

it won't be easy to invade Gaza by land.
Israel will have many losses but the outcome is unknown.

They are unlikely to really "go in", they are probing. Although I don't know. This looks similar to Lebanon. First they try to force a solution (whatever the hell that is) with airforce wich kills a lot of people but is bound to fail, then they go in on foot. Anyway, they are applying the same exact strategy except against a smaller territory, a weaker opponent, and an opponent that does not get resupplied because of Egyptian treachery.

[Krazy]

Re: War in The Middle East

it won't be easy to invade Gaza by land.
Israel will have many losses but the outcome is unknown.

[yerazhishda]

Re: War in The Middle East

israel will go in, destroy the few things still left in tact, the 'arab world' will protest but no arab country will do a damn thing and within a few weeks all of this will be forgotten as some "new" development will take the headlines on the idiotbox.

You've pretty much summed it up. Isn't this what happens every time Israel initiates force against one of its neighbors...

[Federate]

Re: War in The Middle East

I am watching this closely for the following reason:

Gaza: Nasrallah Hints At Hamas Anti-Tank Capability
January 3, 2009 | 2123 GMT

Hamas militants in Gaza expect to inflict significant losses on advancing Israeli forces, Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah told a crowd numbering in the tens of thousands Jan. 3 in southern Beirut, Lebanon, Hezbollah’s al-Manar TV reported. Nasrallah also alluded to the capability of the Palestinian fighters to destroy Israeli tanks.

http://www.stratfor.com/sitrep/20090103_gaza_nasrallah_hints_hamas_anti_tank_capability

[Armanen]

Re: War in The Middle East

israel will go in, destroy the few things still left in tact, the 'arab world' will protest but no arab country will do a damn thing and within a few weeks all of this will be forgotten as some "new" development will take the headlines on the idiotbox.

[Federate]

Re: War in The Middle East

It has begun.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Israeli ground forces cross border into Gaza


Israeli tanks and troops have launched a ground invasion to reoccupy parts of the northern Gaza strip as the military escalated its assault on the Palestinian enclave in an attempt to curb Hamas rocket attacks on Israel.

With Israel's chief military spokesman warning that the attack would take "many long days", the Israeli Cabinet also authorised the call of thousands more reservists. As Israeli tanks and infantry crossed into northern Gaza reports began to emerge of fighting between Hamas and Israeli troops. The invasion comes after Hamas warned Israeli forces entering Gaza faced a "black destiny" and vowed that they would be defeated.

Palestinian witnesses said a small column of military vehicles moved across the border firing tracer bullets after dark. The Israeli army said the assault is intended to take control of territory in the north of the Gaza strip from where Hamas fires its rockets.

"The objective is to destroy the Hamas terror infrastructure in the area of operations," said a spokeswoman, Major Avital Leibovitch. "We are going to take some of the launch areas used by Hamas."

However, Israel said this is not the start of a reoccupation of Gaza.

Hours earlier, an intense Israeli artillery assault along the border, apparently intended to drive away enemy forces and clear mines or roadside bombs, cleared the way for the incursion.

The ground offensive followed a day of heavy air, sea and artillery bombardment of Gaza that left at least 11 people, including children, dead and dozens wounded when an Israeli missile strike hit a mosque in Beit Lahiya as worshippers were praying inside.

The death toll, as the Israeli assault on Gaza entered its second week, rose to about 450 Palestinians, about one third of them civilians or policemen, with four Israelis killed by Hamas rocket fire.

As diplomatic pressure for a truce gained momentum, the exiled leader of Hamas, Khaled Meshaal, rejected a ceasefire in Gaza until Israel agrees to end its three-year blockade of the territory which has caused economic collapse and widespread hardship.

The latest of more than 700 Israeli aircraft strikes over the past week also killed another senior Hamas official, Abu Zakaria al-Jamal, a leader of its armed wing.

Israeli forces attacked the American school in Gaza, killing a guard. The Israeli military said the school, which has no links to the US government, was being used to store Hamas weapons and to shelter its fighters.

But the continued Israeli assault did not stop Hamas from firing rockets. Fifteen hit Israel yesterday, one of which lightly wounded two people when it hit an eight-storey building in Ashdod. Another rocket struck an empty house in Ashkelon, setting it on fire.

As diplomatic efforts continued to reestablish the ceasefire between Israel and Hamas that collapsed last month, Meshaal said in a televised address that the organisation had been contacted by European and Arab countries about a truce.

Egypt says it has begun exploratory talks with Hamas.

President George Bush said in his weekly radio address that Hamas must take the initiative to end the fighting by halting its rocket fire into Israel.

"Another one-way ceasefire that leads to rocket attacks on Israel is not acceptable," he said. "There must be monitoring mechanisms in place to help ensure the smuggling of weapons to terrorist groups in Gaza comes to an end... I urge all parties to pressure Hamas to turn away from terror and to support legitimate Palestinian leaders working for peace."

But Meshaal said Hamas would not agree to a truce until Israel stops its attacks and lifts the blockade of Gaza.

"Our demand is clear – that aggression should end immediately. The siege must be ended and the crossings must all be opened," he said. "We will not break, we will not surrender or give in to your conditions."

Meshaal also warned that the organisation would fight an Israeli ground assault if it comes.

"We are ready for the challenge: this battle was imposed on us and we are confident we will achieve victory because we have made our preparations," he said.

Meshaal said Hamas will attempt to capture Israeli combatants and hold them prisoner alongside Gilad Shalit, the soldier who was snatched from his armoured vehicle and taken in to Gaza in June 2006. "If you commit a foolish act by raiding Gaza, who knows – we may have a second or a third or a fourth Shalit," Meshaal said.

A ground offensive carries great risks for the Israeli military and the country's political leaders, particularly the defence minister and Labour party leader, Ehud Barak. His support in the polls in the run-up to next month's general election has risen sharply over his handling of the assault on Gaza. But if Israeli military casualties were to rise sharply, or soldiers were to be captured, as Meshaal threatens, public support for the war is likely to ebb away.

Still, Barak and the prime minister, Ehud Olmert, may feel they have little choice but to escalate if the air bombardment continues to fail to stop Hamas rocket fire. The pressure for more action is likely to intensify further if there are more Israeli civilian deaths.

Meanwhile, the head of the Arab league, Amr Moussa, said he was astonished at claims by the Israeli foreign minister, Tzipi Livni, that there is no humanitarian crisis in the densely populated Gaza strip.

"I am greatly surprised by, and I reject, the words of the Israeli foreign minister, who asks: 'Is there a humanitarian crisis? There is no humanitarian crisis in Gaza,'" he said. "This is an astonishing thing, that after more than 450 victims and more than 2,000 injured... then it is said there is no humanitarian crisis.

"There may be those that sympathise with such a remark. This is something we must condemn, and we must say there is a major humanitarian crisis."

The UN said there is growing shortages of basic foodstuffs and fresh water because of damage to the infrastructure. The main power plant has shut down. Fuel for cooking is no longer available.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/03/middleeast-israelandthepalestinians

[Federate]

Re: War in The Middle East

Let me describe to you what these two countries are. Egypt is the most populous Arab nation. Yet it FAILS to do ANYTHING and is an Israeli lapdog that pretends like it disagrees with certain aspects of Israeli politics. Egypt is a direct cause of this nakbah (disaster) as it has blockaded Gaza alongside Israel. Nasrallah called on the millions of Egyptians to hit to the streets to demand Egypt open the border, saying police cannot kill millions (Mubarak has ruled for 30 years with an iron fist and jails, kills, tortures protestors).

About f'n time.
-----------------------------------------
Arab outrage over Gaza carnage targets Egypt


IRO, Egypt – The Israeli bombing campaign in the Gaza Strip has unleashed outrage across the Middle East — but the anger is being vented as much against Egypt as it is at Israel.

Protesters have attacked Egyptian embassies, accusing Cairo of helping Israel's longtime blockade of the territory and even giving a green light for the offensive — a sign of the gulf between an Arab public and some U.S.-allied governments that dislike Gaza's Hamas rulers.

Demonstrators broke into the Egyptian consulate in the Yemeni city of Aden on Tuesday, trashing the interior, throwing computers out windows and burning the Egyptian flag on the roof. More than 500 protesters massed outside Egypt's embassy in Syria, as others did days earlier in Lebanon.

During a demonstration in the Lebanese city of Sidon this week, people chanted slogans denouncing Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak as "a pig" and a "collaborator" with Israel.

Mubarak, whose nation is one of only two Arab states to have peace treaties with Israel, on Tuesday accused his critics of seeking "political profit" from the suffering of Palestinians in Gaza.

His government vehemently denied backing Israel's attack. And the foreign minister, Ahmed Aboul Gheit, announced that Egypt was working with Turkey, which has strong ties with Israel, on an initiative to stop the offensive, restore a truce and open Gaza's borders under international supervision.

Egypt already had angered many Arabs by largely closing its Rafah border crossing into Gaza since the Islamic militants of Hamas violently took over the territory in 2007. Rafah is the sole access to Gaza that does not go through Israel, which has imposed a suffocating economic blockade on the coastal strip.

Embarrassing for Egyptian officials, Mubarak met with Israeli Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni only a day before Israel launched its assault, and the foreign minister — though he urged Israel to show restraint — was photographed smiling and shaking hands with her at a news conference.

Now, with television across the region showing the destruction and death in Gaza, Hamas and the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah — both allies of Syria and Iran — are stoking the anger against Egypt by accusing it of giving an OK to Israel to end Hamas rule in Gaza.

"We do not accept that the attack on Gaza be announced from the heart of Cairo," Mohammed Nazzal, a Hamas senior leader, shouted on Al-Arabiya television Sunday, referring to the Livni visit.

Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah charged that Egypt's government was "taking part in the crime" against Palestinians and called on Egyptians to rise up and force the Rafah crossing open.

The anger could severely damage the key role Egypt has played as a mediator between Hamas on one side and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas and Israel on the other.

Egypt has been in a tough position because of Hamas's control of Gaza.

It worries Hamas rule is boosting Iran's influence in the region and could fuel Islamic militancy on its own soil. And it is under pressure from Israel, Abbas and the U.S. not to make any concessions that would bolster Hamas.

Yet, Egypt's leaders don't want to be seen as fueling a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Egyptian television gave heavy coverage to several truckloads of medical and other supplies that Egypt sent in through Rafah and 36 wounded Palestinians who were brought out to Egyptian hospitals.

But on Tuesday, Mubarak insisted Egypt would not fully open Rafah unless Abbas' Palestinian Authority controls the crossing and European monitors required under a 2005 agreement are present. Otherwise, he said, opening the crossing would "deepen the breach" between Hamas and Abbas, who Egypt's government calls the legitimate leader of the Palestinians.

Aboul Gheit, the foreign minister, initially seemed to blame Hamas for provoking the Israeli offensive, saying soon after it began Saturday that "those who didn't listen" to warnings carry the responsibility.

Such talk put Egypt in the uncomfortable position of echoing the arguments of Israel, which says it acted to halt Hamas rocket attacks on southern Israeli towns. Since then, Egypt has been more vocal in its calls for Israel to stop the bombardment without conditions.

On Tuesday, Aboul Gheit denied that Egypt did not do enough to prevent the Israeli offensive, saying Mubarak warned Livni not to attack Gaza "because it will have repercussions on the region."

But the clamor over Gaza has underlined an increasing divide in the Middle East that pits pro-Western countries like Egypt, Jordan and Saudi Arabia against Syria and Iran and their allied militant groups, Hamas and Hezbollah.

In an unusually vocal criticism for an Egyptian official, Abdullah Kamal, a member of Egypt's ruling party, denounced Hamas on Monday as a pawn of Iran, saying Iran and Syria are trying to make "Iran as the leader of the region through its militias, whether Hezbollah or Hamas."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081230/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_egypt_gaza

[ZORAVAR]

Re: War in The Middle East

Other than the Hezbollah, the entire Arab world is scum. Look at the CIA puppets ruling in Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and Gulf Arab states - 90% of the Arab world. Look at the stupid ragheads in Iraq killing each other instead of uniting against the occupiers. Look at Lebanon choosing to back stab Syria over having shallow relations with Israel and America. Generally speaking, Arabs are spineless cowards, at heart they are whores (cheep ones at that), they are two faced, they are extremely lazy and stupid. Had the Arab world had even an once of self respect the Zionist State would have disappeared long ago. The Gaza Strip and the West Bank, but in particular the Gaza Strip, are massive concentration death camps. The two regions are essentially laboratory test tubes, controlled environments, for anything the Zionist criminal wants to carry out. If for any reason they want to massacre several hundred civilians in one operation like they have done many times in the past all they have to do is have a few of their many-many Palestinian operatives in the controlled environments carry out a "suicide attack" or fire some dinky "Gasam" missile into Israel. A large percentage of Palestinians living in these concentration camps work for their oppressive masters. Palestinians are the slaves of the world most ruthless and blood thirsty nation and other than throwing some pocket change and giving lip service, the Arab world will not do shit to stop it. If there is any glimmer of hope in the region its the Iran backed Hezbollah and by extension the Russian Federation.

I have been in almost every Arab country (including places like Oman and Yemen). I can summerize all of what you said above in one sentence: The Arabs are still living in tribes. Their mentality, behaviour and way of thinking is tribal.