gor blimey

[womble]

On another forum that I was reading, someone wrote that the spoken Western Armenian suffix "gor" is similar to the spoken Eastern Armenian use of "a". I know how "gor" is used (to indicate the continuous [as opposed to simple] present tense) but I am not familiar with the Eastern Armenian use of "a" that the poster mentioned. Can anyone explain this to me?
Also, can "gor" be used with the past imperfect tense, for example to distinguish "I was walking" from "I used to walk"?

[Armenian]

On another forum that I was reading, someone wrote that the spoken Western Armenian suffix "gor" is similar to the spoken Eastern Armenian use of "a". I know how "gor" is used (to indicate the continuous [as opposed to simple] present tense) but I am not familiar with the Eastern Armenian use of "a" that the poster mentioned. Can anyone explain this to me? Also, can "gor" be used with the past imperfect tense, for example to distinguish "I was walking" from "I used to walk"?

The "a" (ա) in Eastern Armenian that person referred to is the "e" (է) in Western Armenian.

Example:

He is a soldier

Eastern Arm - Նա զինվորա (transliteration - na zinvora)

Western Arm - Ան զինվոր է (transliteration - an zinvor e, as in the "e" in elephant)

Note however that unlike in Western Armenian in Eastern Armenian one can properly use both, a (ա) and e (է).

There is no "gor" (կոր) in proper Western Armenian. The suffix in question is borrowed from the Turkish continuous present tense "yor" and used in Armenian street slang. In western Armenian, continuous present tense does not exist. It was lost during the transition from grabar (Classical Armenian) to ashkharabar (Armenian Vernacular). The lose of the suffix is the reason why in Western Armenian slang the Turkish "yor" is borrowed. The continuous present tense in Eastern Armenian is um (ում).

Some examples:

I am walking:

Eastern - Ես քայլում եմ (Transliteration - Yes qaylum em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

I walk:

Eastern - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes qayl em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

[Anonymouse]

Very lucid post.

[Siamanto]

There is no "gor" (կոր) in proper Western Armenian. The suffix in question is borrowed from the Turkish continuous present tense "yor" and used in Armenian street slang.
.... The lose of the suffix is the reason why in Western Armenian slang the Turkish "yor" is borrowed.

The "gor" was borrowed because the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses. More on it:

1. "Gor" is used to fill a shortcoming of the Armenian language where the continuous forms of verb tenses do not exist - i.e. I am going, I was going etc. By the way, other languages - i.e. the French - lack the continuous form.

2. "Gor" seems to be a *urkish influence; in fact, the *urkish suffix "yor" is equivalent to the Armenian "gor"

3. "Gor" is only used in spoken Armenian and is not considered proper Armenian

4. I was puzzled when I heard Armenians from Aleppo, Syria use "eh" instead. For instance, instead of "gou kam gor," they say "Gou kameh." I don't know if all Armenians from Syria, use the same suffix to form the continuous form???

5. It is possible to avoid using it - at least in most cases, if not all; but, it requires some effort and it's not always straightforward. I wonder how the continuous form is expressed in Eastern Armenian?


Note: I have chosen to auto censor the words "*urk," "*urkish" or *urkic" because it is commonly perceived as unpleasant and offending, evokes unpleasant emotions and imagery and is pregnant with immoral and evil connotations







The continuous present tense in Eastern Armenian is um (ում).
Some examples:

I am walking:

Eastern - Ես քայլում եմ (Transliteration - Yes qaylum em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

I walk:

Eastern - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes qayl em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

The "ում" has nothing to do with the continuous aspect/form; you're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax.)
By the way, the sole fact that the same expression ( i.e. grammatical form) is translated in one case as "I am walking" (continuous grammatical form) and the other as "I walk" (another grammatical form) clearly shows your confusion of "grammatical forms" and "subjective appreciation of the semantics of a grammatical form." :)

Two more details:
1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."
2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present. You definitely need some Armemian Grammar Lessons. (http://www.armeniapedia.org/index.php?title=Armenian_Lessons)

I think that instead of misinforming others, ridiculing yourself and disfiguring the Armenian Language, you should spend more time learning it?????
Honestly, aren't you ashamed to constantly display your ignorance and misinform others????






In western Armenian, continuous present tense does not exist. It was lost during the transition from grabar (Classical Armenian) to ashkharabar (Armenian Vernacular).

LOL Krapar??? You hardly know Ashkharapar! :)

[Sip]

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

[Armenian]

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

It's not improper, it's considered to be dialectal (barbarayin). There are several main dialects in existence in Armenia today. You see it used in official documents, television reporting, poems, etc. The problem with our language is it's numerous dialects. There should be 'one' official dialect and it should be enforced by the authorities at all times. Thus far, attitudes towards the language is very laxed, to the detriment of the language.

[Lucin]

The "gor" was borrowed because the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses.



LOL, the continuous form does not exist in all tenses in Armenian??? It does exist, at least in the past ( I'm not sure about the present) Here are some examples:

գրում էի/ քայլում էի/ նայում էի / կարդում էի եւ այլն:



Two more details:
1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."

The verb (its infinitive) is "քայլել" so it must be "քայլեմ" and not "քալեմ".


2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present.




The conditional as well as future simple: Նամակը գրե՞լ ես: Չէ, գիշերը կը գրեմ: "կը" in here has a future meaning clearly and not conditional. In order to make it conditional, there should be an 'if clause';եթէ հանդիպենք, կը գրեմ:

[Siamanto]

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

He thinks that "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" is Armenian, and confuses syntax and semantics....Did you expect him to focus on - or appreciate - such linguistic "subtleties???"

[Siamanto]

LOL, the continuous form does not exist in all tenses in Armenian??? It does exist, at least in the past ( I'm not sure about the present) Here are some examples:

գրում էի/ քայլում էի/ նայում էի / կարդում էի եւ այլն:

No, the continuous form/aspect does not exist in Armenian, regardless of the tense. We had the same conversation before and you failed to provide a single reference where it is said that the continuous form/aspect exists in Askharapar. You failed to provide such a reference because the continuous form/aspect is missing in Armenian. To repeat myself:
You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax.)






1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."

The verb (its infinitive) is "քայլել" so it must be "քայլեմ" and not "քալեմ".

No, it is "Ես կը քալեմ" is Western Armenian. Please be wise - and courteous - enough to double check before you display your ignorance with such confidence, and take the risk of misinforming others. If you're too lazy to consult a reference, then it suffices to google! :)







2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present.

The conditional as well as future simple: Նամակը գրե՞լ ես: Չէ, գիշերը կը գրեմ: "կը" in here has a future meaning clearly and not conditional. In order to make it conditional, there should be an 'if clause';եթէ հանդիպենք, կը գրեմ:

First of all, the conditional mode does not require an if condition; you are confusing the conditional mode and the conditional sentence. It is a mode, just like the subjunctive, to express the disposition of the subject (of the verb.)
Most of all, the future, in Eastern Armenian, is "քալելու եմ."

[Armenian]

The obsessive psychobabbling he/she strikes again!!! :laugh:

I'll go find some pills to throw at it...

Do you people see what I have to go through here?

[Lucin]

No, the continuous form/aspect does not exist in Armenian, regardless of the tense. We had the same conversation before and you failed to provide a single reference where it is said that the continuous form/aspect exists in Askharapar.

You said the continuous form is missing in all tenses whereas it is not missing in all tenses, even according to your given reference. Check it out once again.



No, it is "Ես կը քալեմ" is Western Armenian. Please be wise - and courteous - enough to double check before you display your ignorance with such confidence, and take the risk of misinforming others. If you're too lazy to consult a reference, then it suffices to google! :)


First of all, I just noticed the word "western" and that you were referring to the Western Armenian ( I wouldn't say a word about the Western Dialect since I'm not familiar with it), second of all, LOL, what's it got to do with 'courtesy'??





First of all, the conditional mode does not require an if condition; you are confusing the conditional mode and the conditional sentence. It is a mode, just like the subjunctive, to express the disposition of the subject (of the verb.)


Yes, but you hadn't specified that you were talking about the mode.



Most of all, the future, in Eastern Armenian, is "քալելու եմ."

LOL, What??? "Քալելու եմ" in Eastern Armenian??? No, it is "Քայլելու եմ". And don't you think you've got to practice what you preach?? And not display ignorance with such confidence?? :)

[Siamanto]

No, the continuous form/aspect does not exist in Armenian, regardless of the tense. We had the same conversation before and you failed to provide a single reference where it is said that the continuous form/aspect exists in Askharapar.

You said the continuous form is missing in all tenses whereas it is not missing in all tenses, even according to your given reference. Check it out once again.

I have checked, why don't you quote what you think is the continuous form/aspect - i.e. a syntactic construct, not a semantic usage?









No, it is "Ես կը քալեմ" is Western Armenian. Please be wise - and courteous - enough to double check before you display your ignorance with such confidence, and take the risk of misinforming others. If you're too lazy to consult a reference, then it suffices to google!

First of all, I just noticed the word "western" and that you were referring to the Western Armenian ( I wouldn't say a word about the Western Dialect since I'm not familiar with it), second of all, LOL, what's it got to do with 'courtesy'??

First of all, maybe you should read a bit more carefully, before you "pull the trigger???"
Second of all, in Eastern Armenian, it is "Ես կքայլեմ," not "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" - two errors!!! :)
Third of all, failing to make enough effort to consult a reference while being pompously pretentious can be considered as a lack of courtesy.









First of all, the conditional mode does not require an if condition; you are confusing the conditional mode and the conditional sentence. It is a mode, just like the subjunctive, to express the disposition of the subject (of the verb.)

Yes, but you hadn't specified that you were talking about the mode.

LOL Nice one! I see that you kept your "sense of humor?????" When verb syntax is in question, do you think that the focus would be the conditional mode or the conditional sentence?








Most of all, the future, in Eastern Armenian, is "քալելու եմ."

LOL, What??? "Քալելու եմ" in Eastern Armenian??? No, it is "Քայլելու եմ".

Yes! Thanks for the correction. I can't type in Armenian, so I cut and paste - it's error prone.







And don't you think you've got to practice what you preach?? And not display ignorance with such confidence??
I certainly practice what I preach! The focus was not the "յ" - i.e. the spelling of "Քալել/Քայլել," it was the conditional mode vs. the future tense. Can't you stay focused??? :)

[Siamanto]

Լուսին ջան, կարոտում էի քեզ: Ինչպես՞ ես: Վերջերս շատ չես երեվում այս քայկում, հուսամ ամենինչ լաւ է քո հետ: Համենայն դեպս, այս «Սիամանթո» կոչվաձի հետ վիճելը ամբողչովին անիմաստ բան է: Ինչպես բոլորս տեսնումենք նրա վերաբերմունքից, ակնհայտ է որ նա լուրջ հոգեկան հիվանդութիւն կամ խանգարում ունի: Մի խոսքով - առի ցեխին քար չ'գցենք:
Just curious, does it make you feel better to delete a previously posted message to immediately repost it at the end? The psychologist in me is a bit intrigued and amused.

[Armenian]

Լուսին ջան, կարոտում էի քեզ: Ինչպես՞ ես: Վերջերս շատ չես երեվում այս քայկում, հուսամ ամենինչ լաւ է քո հետ: Համենայն դեպս, այս «Սիամանթո» կոչվաձի հետ վիճելը ամբողչովին անիմաստ բան է: Ինչպես բոլորս տեսնումենք նրա վերաբերմունքից, ակնհայտ է որ նա լուրջ հոգեկան հիվանդութիւն կամ խանգարում ունի: Մի խոսքով - առի ցեխին քար չ'գցենք:

[womble]

The "a" (ա) in Eastern Armenian that person referred to is the "e" (է) in Western Armenian.

Example:

He is a soldier

Eastern Arm - Նա զինվորա (transliteration - na zinvora)

Western Arm - Ան զինվոր է (transliteration - an zinvor e, as in the "e" in elephant)

Thanks, Armenian.

[Lucin]

I have checked, why don't you quote what you think is the continuous form/aspect - i.e. a syntactic construct, not a semantic usage?



So, now you are doing some modifications on what you had said previously and rephrasing it the way it pleases you. Nice try! :) Let me quote you what you had said previously, again and answer it:


the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses.

You may agree that what is referred to as continuous 'form' is not a mode ( unlike conditional or subjunctive or indicative) but it may be considered a form which is being represented by tenses – past, present, future- the present does not exist as a separate tense- the future exists in my opinion but didn't find anything on the given site- the past definitely exists:

Section 148:
Նա գնացել է տուն:
He went home.
Ես աշխատում էի պարտեզում:
I was working in the garden.
Դուք լսեցիք իմ ընկերոջ ձայնը:
You heard my friend's voice.






First of all, maybe you should read a bit more carefully, before you "pull the trigger???"
Second of all, in Eastern Armenian, it is "Ես կքայլեմ," not "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" - two errors!!! :)


LOL, first of all, it is not "Ես կքայլեմ," in Eastern Armenian, it is "Ես կը քայլեմ " - 'ք' is a consonant so we definitely need a 'ը' and then a space, second of all when have I said "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" ?? :confused: Two errors, right? :)


Third of all, failing to make enough effort to consult a reference while being pompously pretentious can be considered as a lack of courtesy.

So? You made a similar error Siamanto, right above. What is the problem? May I remind you as well to read/ check carefully before you pull the trigger?? Again no relevance to a "pretentious" attitude.






Yes! Thanks for the correction. I can't type in Armenian, so I cut and paste - it's error prone.

It is understandable. We are all error prone.





I certainly practice what I preach! The focus was not the "յ" - i.e. the spelling of "Քալել/Քայլել," it was the conditional mode vs. the future tense. Can't you stay focused??? :)


I am certainly focused but the error you made as "little" as it may sound to you, it leads to confusion as clearly it is a switch to Western Armenian where you guys say: Քալելու եմ.

******



The following is probably another mistake in this site: for both I listened and I was listening it suggests only լսում էի in Armenian, while one should be; լսեցի/ I listened and the other լսում էի/ I was listening:

Section 151
The past imperfective tense shows an action that happened in the past. It is formed by means of the present participle and personal forms of the auxiliary verb of the past tense.
Singular Plural
1. լսում էի I listened/was listening 1. լսում էինք we listened/were listening 2. լսում էիր you listened 2. լսում էիք you listened 3. լսում էր he listened 3. լսում էին they listened
1. գնում էի I went/was going 1. գնում էինք we went/were going 2. գնում էիր you went 2. գնում էիք you went 3. գնում էր he went 3. գնում էին they went

[zourna]

I think it's too late now to furthur dispute on the matter. Whomble already chose to reference Armenian.

But am still confused... :)

[Lucin]

Լուսին ջան, կարոտում էի քեզ: Ինչպես՞ ես: Վերջերս շատ չես երեվում այս քայկում, հուսամ ամենինչ լաւ է քո հետ:


«Լա՜ւ» : Չէ բայց անտանելի ցուրտ էր էս տարի էստեղ, ուժեղ մրսել եմ, մատս էլ «կոտրել» եմ: Ուղղակի տրամադրութիւն էլ չունէի…
Շնորհակալ եմ ուշադրութիւնիցդ:;)




But am still confused... :)

Confused about which part??

[zourna]

ուշադրութիւնիցդ

Wow! I think anything goes as far as the terminal displays it as Armenian type.

Get well soon by the way, Lucin :)

[Siamanto]

I have checked, why don't you quote what you think is the continuous form/aspect - i.e. a syntactic construct, not a semantic usage?

So, now you are doing some modifications on what you had said previously and rephrasing it the way it pleases you. Nice try! Let me quote you what you had said previously, again and answer it:

the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses


LOL Are you simply confused or trying to confuse the situation? How is it different from what I repeated many times i.e.
"You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax?)"

I see that your focusing - and/or reading - skills did not improve??? :)s







You may agree that what is referred to as continuous 'form' is not a mode ( unlike conditional or subjunctive or indicative) but it may be considered a form which is being represented by tenses – past, present, future- the present does not exist as a separate tense- the future exists in my opinion but didn't find anything on the given site- the past definitely exists:

Section 148:

Նա գնացել է տուն:
He went home.
Ես աշխատում էի պարտեզում:
I was working in the garden.
Դուք լսեցիք իմ ընկերոջ ձայնը:
You heard my friend's voice.


First of all, where does it say that "աշխատում էի" is the continuous form/aspect? ""աշխատում էի" is the "past imperfective." I think that you're totally confused; " I was working" is just an approximate translation based on semantics.
Second of all, the continuous form is an aspect and has nothing to do with a tense. Again, I think that you're just confusing different grammatical concepts.
Most of all, the Section 148 that you have quoted clearly confirms what I suspect i.e.
"You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax?)"









First of all, maybe you should read a bit more carefully, before you "pull the trigger???"
Second of all, in Eastern Armenian, it is "Ես կքայլեմ," not "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" - two errors!!!

LOL, first of all, it is not "Ես կքայլեմ," in Eastern Armenian, it is "Ես կը քայլեմ " - 'ք' is a consonant so we definitely need a 'ը' and then a space, second of all when have I said "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" ?? Two errors, right?

LOL Are you rewriting the Armenian Grammar as it fits you? The following suggests that the a consonant does not require an "a 'ը' and then a space."

[b]Section 166
...

1. գնամ գնանք կգնամ I will go կգնանք we will go 2. գնաս գնաք կգնաս you - - կգնաք you - - 3. գնա գնան կգնա he - - կգնան they - -

Also, though the existence of a Web document may not be enough to verify, but it gives an indication. Please produce a single Web document where "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" - or "Ես կ'քայլեմ" - is considered as Armenian. However, you will find documents with "Ես կքայլեմ."

For the record: The second error is the space between "քայլ" and "եմ."







Third of all, failing to make enough effort to consult a reference while being pompously pretentious can be considered as a lack of courtesy.

So? You made a similar error Siamanto, right above. What is the problem? May I remind you as well to read/ check carefully before you pull the trigger?? Again no relevance to a "pretentious" attitude.

The situation is not the same: I have explained that it was a typo; furthermore, the focus was the mode of the verb, not the spelling.
I'm sorry to say that you constantly make nonsensical statements that could be easily verified and avoided!







Yes! Thanks for the correction. I can't type in Armenian, so I cut and paste - it's error prone.

It is understandable. We are all error prone.

The difference is that I have the honesty to admit my errors; while you ad infiitum complicate and confuse the situation, as if you were unable of Intellectual Integrity???
Whatever explains your unwillingness - or incapacity - to face the facts, it results in a waste of time.









I certainly practice what I preach! The focus was not the "յ" - i.e. the spelling of "Քալել/Քայլել," it was the conditional mode vs. the future tense. Can't you stay focused???

I am certainly focused but the error you made as "little" as it may sound to you, it leads to confusion as clearly it is a switch to Western Armenian where you guys say: Քալելու եմ.

LOL So limiting oneself to what does not matter in the context while ignoring what is being debated is "focusing???" I like your "sense of humor!" Also, how does it "lead to confusion as clearly it is a switch to Western Armenian where [it is] Քալելու եմ???"







The following is probably another mistake in this site: for both I listened and I was listening it suggests only լսում էի in Armenian, while one should be; լսեցի/ I listened and the other լսում էի/ I was listening:

Section 151

The past imperfective tense shows an action that happened in the past. It is formed by means of the present participle and personal forms of the auxiliary verb of the past tense.
Singular Plural
1. լսում էի I listened/was listening 1. լսում էինք we listened/were listening 2. լսում էիր you listened 2. լսում էիք you listened 3. լսում էր he listened 3. լսում էին they listened
1. գնում էի I went/was going 1. գնում էինք we went/were going 2. գնում էիր you went 2. գնում էիք you went 3. գնում էր he went 3. գնում էին they went


Where is the "mistake?" I really suggest that you give a chance to the idea of checking and reading carefully!

Section 151 covers the Past imperfective i.e. "լսում էի." The Past perfect tense i.e. "լսեցի" is covered is Section 161.
I'm sorry but the difference is basic in any grammar!

[Lucin]

LOL Are you simply confused or trying to confuse the situation? How is it different from what I repeated many times i.e.
"You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax?)"

I see that your focusing - and/or reading - skills did not improve??? :)s




First of all, where does it say that "աշխատում էի" is the continuous form/aspect? ""աշխատում էի" is the "past imperfective."
Second of all, the continuous form is an aspect and has nothing to do with a tense. Again, I think that you're just confusing different grammatical concepts.
Most of all, the Section 148 that you have quoted clearly confirms what I suspect i.e.
[b]"You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax?)"


Not only you are obviously making assumptions but also confusing yourself and complicating this matter.

To repeat myself; the continuous aspect does not exist in all tenses in Armenian but it does exist in the past tense. The aspect is simply our perspective on the time/ duration that an action/event occurs, now it could be continuous ( past or present) like the given example ( "աշխատում էի").
Գրում էի/ Գրեցի -- Գրում էիր /Գրեցիր ...the difference between the two is simply a difference of aspect which indicates our perspective on the duration of the event. ( The act of writing or working- for instance- is a temporary ( or permanant) state but in progress in the past, and this is its aspect)
So the past continuous aspect exists in Armenian.

I suggest you use your own logic and knowledge of Armenian language instead of relying solely on a single web document which has apparantly some shortcomings.

I think that you're totally confused; " I was working" is just an approximate translation based on semantics....

What did you expect? Translations, in general, are more or less, all about 'approximation'. Though the issue here is 'not' exactly the translation but I don't see how else you want to translate that?




LOL Are you rewriting the Armenian Grammar as it fits you? The following suggests that the a consonant does not require an "a 'ը' and then a space."

LOL, what?? I neither rewrite the Armenian Grammar nor invent anything. It is a very basic rule in (Eastern) Armenian Grammar. This is another mistake in this site.
( The newspaper I just checked confirms that. A few examples found there: Տեղի կունենայ / Կը նկատւի )





Also, though the existence of a Web document may not be enough to verify, but it gives an indication. Please produce a single Web document where "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" - or "Ես կ'քայլեմ" - is considered as Armenian. However, you will find documents with "Ես կքայլեմ."



Is this your way of staying "focused"?? When have I said the above is "correct" in Armenian??? I suggest you read more carefully.


For the record: The second error is the space between "քայլ" and "եմ."


No, there shouldn't be a space. (And I haven't said otherwise.)





The situation is not the same: I have explained that it was a typo; furthermore, the focus was the mode of the verb, not the spelling.
I'm sorry to say that you constantly make nonsensical statements that could be easily verified and avoided!



The difference is that I have the honesty to admit my errors; while you ad infiitum complicate and confuse the situation, as if you were unable of Intellectual Integrity???
Whatever explains your unwillingness - or incapacity - to face the facts, it results in a waste of time.


I have not said otherwise ( on my mistake). But the 'difference' would be if you put aside your - sometimes- judgmental, self-righteous attitude, then your perception may as well change.




LOL So limiting oneself to what does not matter in the context while ignoring what is being debated is "focusing???" I like your "sense of humor!" Also, how does it "lead to confusion as clearly it is a switch to Western Armenian where [it is] Քալելու եմ???"



How?? Are you serious?? Wasn't it you who said "Քալելու եմ" is Western Armenian?




Where is the "mistake?" I really suggest that you give a chance to the idea of checking and reading carefully!

Section 151 covers the Past imperfective i.e. "լսում էի." The Past perfect tense i.e. "լսեցի" is covered is Section 161.
I'm sorry but the difference is basic in any grammar!


"Լսում էի" means exclusively "I was listening" not "I listened". As for "I was working", they had apparently suggested in section 148, "աշխատում էի".






Get well soon by the way, Lucin

I'm fine, thanks. I'm not a Jhud after all... :)

[Armenian]

«Լա՜ւ» : Չէ բայց անտանելի ցուրտ էր էս տարի էստեղ, ուժեղ մրսել եմ, մատս էլ «կոտրել» եմ: Ուղղակի տրամադրութիւն էլ չունէի…
Շնորհակալ եմ ուշադրութիւնիցդ:;)

Այո քույրիկ, լսել եմ որ այդ շրջանները այս տարի շատ ցուրտ էր: Ասում են Հայաստանում էլ սոսկալի ցուրտ եր այս տարի: Բայց մատըդ ինչպես՞ ես կոտորել, ընկար՞: Համենայն դեպս անցաձ լինի: Եւ տեսնում եմ որ տրամադրութիւնդ արդեն լաւացել է: Ուրախ եմ որ մեր հետ ես նորից: Եւ տեսնում եմ որ ցեխին դեռ քար ես գցում: Իմիջայլոց, երբ ես Womble-ին գրումէի Հայկական գրականության մասին փորձումէի բաժանել նշված բարերն որպեսզի նա կարողանա բարի կառուցւացքը տեսնել: Բայց մի խոսքով լաւ չստացէց. նաեւ ասեմ որ Հայերենս այդքան ել լաւ չէ, դժբախտաբար: Հայերեն կրթութիւն երբեք չեմ ստացել. «ինքնուս» եմ: Կուցէ, նրա համար առիթից օգտվելով միշդ քեզ հետ Հայերենով եմ զրուցում:

[Armenian]

I think this website would be able to help Armenians from the Middle East to better understand how to properly construct sentences in Armenian :laugh: http://www.voiceofvan.net/html/hayerene_djisht_khosink.html

[Lucin]

Իմիջայլոց, երբ ես Womble-ին գրումէի Հայկական գրականության մասին փորձումէի բաժանել նշված բարերն որպեսզի նա կարողանա բարի կառուցւացքը տեսնել: Բայց մի խոսքով լաւ չստացէց. նաեւ ասեմ որ Հայերենս այդքան ել լաւ չէ, դժբախտաբար: Հայերեն կրթութիւն երբեք չեմ ստացել. «ինքնուս» եմ: Կուցէ, նրա համար առիթից օգտվելով միշդ քեզ հետ Հայերենով եմ զրուցում:



Իսկապէ՞ս: Չէի կարողանալ ասել դա... ինչքան որ խոսացելենք, նկատելեմ որ բառապաշարդ լայն է (նաեւ նկատել եմ երկու բառբառներով ես խոսում) բայց Հայերէնի ուղղագրութիւնը, յատկապէս Մաշտոցեանը, մի քիչ դժւար է ու մանրակրկիտ: Համենայնդէպս, անձամբ, տասներկու տարի հայկական դպրոց եմ յաճախել , շաբաթական մոտ 2-3 ժամ հայերէն ու կրօն ենք սովորել, դրանով հանդերց, տեսնում ե՞ս էլը Պարսկահաւերս ինչպէ՞ս ենք խոսում: (չէ կը ներես, երգում ենք:) )

Կուցէ, նրա համար առիթից օգտվելով միշդ քեզ հետ Հայերենով եմ զրուցում:
Ոչ թէ յաճոյք եմ ստանում որ հետս Հայերէն ես խոսում (ու լաւ փորձ է ինձ համար քանի որ լաւ Հայերէն խոսող շուրջս չկայ,) այլ նայեւ անձին աւելի մոտ եմ զգում: :)


I think this website would be able to help Armenians from the Middle East to better understand how to properly construct sentences in Armenian :laugh: http://www.voiceofvan.net/html/hayerene_djisht_khosink.html

Ինչու՞ ես ծիծաղում: Սրանով ես մի քիչ Արեւմտահայերէն կը սովորեմ: :p

[Siamanto]

Not only you are obviously making assumptions but also confusing yourself and complicating this matter.

To repeat myself; the continuous aspect does not exist in all tenses in Armenian but it does exist in the past tense. The aspect is simply our perspective on the time/ duration that an action/event occurs, now it could be continuous ( past or present) like the given example ( "աշխատում էի").
Գրում էի/ Գրեցի -- Գրում էիր /Գրեցիր ...the difference between the two is simply a difference of aspect which indicates our perspective on the duration of the event. ( The act of writing or working- for instance- is a temporary ( or permanant) state but in progress in the past, and this is its aspect)
So the past continuous aspect exists in Armenian.

I suggest you use your own logic and knowledge of Armenian language instead of relying solely on a single web document which has apparantly some shortcomings.



What did you expect? Translations, in general, are more or less, all about 'approximation'. Though the issue here is 'not' exactly the translation but I don't see how else you want to translate that?




LOL, what?? I neither rewrite the Armenian Grammar nor invent anything. It is a very basic rule in (Eastern) Armenian Grammar. This is another mistake in this site.
( The newspaper I just checked confirms that. A few examples found there: Տեղի կունենայ / Կը նկատւի )








Is this your way of staying "focused"?? When have I said the above is "correct" in Armenian??? I suggest you read more carefully.





No, there shouldn't be a space. (And I haven't said otherwise.)







I have not said otherwise ( on my mistake). But the 'difference' would be if you put aside your - sometimes- judgmental, self-righteous attitude, then your perception may as well change.






How?? Are you serious?? Wasn't it you who said "Քալելու եմ" is Western Armenian?






"Լսում էի" means exclusively "I was listening" not "I listened". As for "I was working", they had apparently suggested in section 148, "աշխատում էի".







I'm fine, thanks. I'm not a Jhud after all... :)



Unfortunately, I'm out of "time to be wasted," so let's meet again later...much later...when you'll get an adequate understanding of semantics, syntax, grammatical concepts...and of course, some notion of logic may also help in discussions of this nature. :)

[Lucin]

Unfortunately, I'm out of "time to be wasted," so let's meet again later...much later...when you'll get an adequate understanding of semantics, syntax, grammatical concepts...and of course, some notion of logic may also help in discussions of this nature. :)


I agree. Provided that, in the meantime, you go and improve your miserable understanding/ knowledge of Armenian Grammar and Language in general..
Good luck! :)