gor blimey

[womble]

On another forum that I was reading, someone wrote that the spoken Western Armenian suffix "gor" is similar to the spoken Eastern Armenian use of "a". I know how "gor" is used (to indicate the continuous [as opposed to simple] present tense) but I am not familiar with the Eastern Armenian use of "a" that the poster mentioned. Can anyone explain this to me?
Also, can "gor" be used with the past imperfect tense, for example to distinguish "I was walking" from "I used to walk"?

[Armenian]

Re: gor blimey

On another forum that I was reading, someone wrote that the spoken Western Armenian suffix "gor" is similar to the spoken Eastern Armenian use of "a". I know how "gor" is used (to indicate the continuous [as opposed to simple] present tense) but I am not familiar with the Eastern Armenian use of "a" that the poster mentioned. Can anyone explain this to me? Also, can "gor" be used with the past imperfect tense, for example to distinguish "I was walking" from "I used to walk"?

The "a" (ա) in Eastern Armenian that person referred to is the "e" (է) in Western Armenian.

Example:

He is a soldier

Eastern Arm - Նա զինվորա (transliteration - na zinvora)

Western Arm - Ան զինվոր է (transliteration - an zinvor e, as in the "e" in elephant)

Note however that unlike in Western Armenian in Eastern Armenian one can properly use both, a (ա) and e (է).

There is no "gor" (կոր) in proper Western Armenian. The suffix in question is borrowed from the Turkish continuous present tense "yor" and used in Armenian street slang. In western Armenian, continuous present tense does not exist. It was lost during the transition from grabar (Classical Armenian) to ashkharabar (Armenian Vernacular). The lose of the suffix is the reason why in Western Armenian slang the Turkish "yor" is borrowed. The continuous present tense in Eastern Armenian is um (ում).

Some examples:

I am walking:

Eastern - Ես քայլում եմ (Transliteration - Yes qaylum em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

I walk:

Eastern - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes qayl em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

[Anonymouse]

Re: gor blimey

Very lucid post.

[Siamanto]

Re: gor blimey

There is no "gor" (կոր) in proper Western Armenian. The suffix in question is borrowed from the Turkish continuous present tense "yor" and used in Armenian street slang.
.... The lose of the suffix is the reason why in Western Armenian slang the Turkish "yor" is borrowed.

The "gor" was borrowed because the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses. More on it:

1. "Gor" is used to fill a shortcoming of the Armenian language where the continuous forms of verb tenses do not exist - i.e. I am going, I was going etc. By the way, other languages - i.e. the French - lack the continuous form.

2. "Gor" seems to be a *urkish influence; in fact, the *urkish suffix "yor" is equivalent to the Armenian "gor"

3. "Gor" is only used in spoken Armenian and is not considered proper Armenian

4. I was puzzled when I heard Armenians from Aleppo, Syria use "eh" instead. For instance, instead of "gou kam gor," they say "Gou kameh." I don't know if all Armenians from Syria, use the same suffix to form the continuous form???

5. It is possible to avoid using it - at least in most cases, if not all; but, it requires some effort and it's not always straightforward. I wonder how the continuous form is expressed in Eastern Armenian?


Note: I have chosen to auto censor the words "*urk," "*urkish" or *urkic" because it is commonly perceived as unpleasant and offending, evokes unpleasant emotions and imagery and is pregnant with immoral and evil connotations

The continuous present tense in Eastern Armenian is um (ում).
Some examples:

I am walking:

Eastern - Ես քայլում եմ (Transliteration - Yes qaylum em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

I walk:

Eastern - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes qayl em)

Western - Ես կ'քայլ եմ (Transliteration - Yes k'qayl em)

The "ում" has nothing to do with the continuous aspect/form; you're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax.)
By the way, the sole fact that the same expression ( i.e. grammatical form) is translated in one case as "I am walking" (continuous grammatical form) and the other as "I walk" (another grammatical form) clearly shows your confusion of "grammatical forms" and "subjective appreciation of the semantics of a grammatical form."

Two more details:
1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."
2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present. You definitely need some Armemian Grammar Lessons.

I think that instead of misinforming others, ridiculing yourself and disfiguring the Armenian Language, you should spend more time learning it?????
Honestly, aren't you ashamed to constantly display your ignorance and misinform others????

In western Armenian, continuous present tense does not exist. It was lost during the transition from grabar (Classical Armenian) to ashkharabar (Armenian Vernacular).

LOL Krapar??? You hardly know Ashkharapar!

[Sip]

Re: gor blimey

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

[Armenian]

Re: gor blimey

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

It's not improper, it's considered to be dialectal (barbarayin). There are several main dialects in existence in Armenia today. You see it used in official documents, television reporting, poems, etc. The problem with our language is it's numerous dialects. There should be 'one' official dialect and it should be enforced by the authorities at all times. Thus far, attitudes towards the language is very laxed, to the detriment of the language.

[Lucin]

Re: gor blimey

The "gor" was borrowed because the continuous aspect/form is missing in Armenian - in all tenses.

LOL, the continuous form does not exist in all tenses in Armenian??? It does exist, at least in the past ( I'm not sure about the present) Here are some examples:

գրում էի/ քայլում էի/ նայում էի / կարդում էի եւ այլն:

Two more details:
1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."

The verb (its infinitive) is "քայլել" so it must be "քայլեմ" and not "քալեմ".

2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present.

The conditional as well as future simple: Նամակը գրե՞լ ես: Չէ, գիշերը կը գրեմ: "կը" in here has a future meaning clearly and not conditional. In order to make it conditional, there should be an 'if clause';եթէ հանդիպենք, կը գրեմ:

[Siamanto]

Re: gor blimey

"na zinvor e" is proper (eastern) Armenian. "na zinvora" is not the proper form although many speak that way (as far as I know. I could be wrong).

He thinks that "Ես կ'քայլ եմ" is Armenian, and confuses syntax and semantics....Did you expect him to focus on - or appreciate - such linguistic "subtleties???"

[Siamanto]

Re: gor blimey

LOL, the continuous form does not exist in all tenses in Armenian??? It does exist, at least in the past ( I'm not sure about the present) Here are some examples:

գրում էի/ քայլում էի/ նայում էի / կարդում էի եւ այլն:

No, the continuous form/aspect does not exist in Armenian, regardless of the tense. We had the same conversation before and you failed to provide a single reference where it is said that the continuous form/aspect exists in Askharapar. You failed to provide such a reference because the continuous form/aspect is missing in Armenian. To repeat myself:
You're simply confusing your subjective appreciation of the usage of an expression (i.e. semantics) and well defined grammatical rules (i.e. syntax.)

1- LOL "Ես կ'քայլ եմ???" Is that Western Armenian? It's "Ես կը քալեմ."

The verb (its infinitive) is "քայլել" so it must be "քայլեմ" and not "քալեմ".

No, it is "Ես կը քալեմ" is Western Armenian. Please be wise - and courteous - enough to double check before you display your ignorance with such confidence, and take the risk of misinforming others. If you're too lazy to consult a reference, then it suffices to google!

2- In Eastern Armenian the "կ" indicates the conditional not the present.

The conditional as well as future simple: Նամակը գրե՞լ ես: Չէ, գիշերը կը գրեմ: "կը" in here has a future meaning clearly and not conditional. In order to make it conditional, there should be an 'if clause';եթէ հանդիպենք, կը գրեմ:

First of all, the conditional mode does not require an if condition; you are confusing the conditional mode and the conditional sentence. It is a mode, just like the subjunctive, to express the disposition of the subject (of the verb.)
Most of all, the future, in Eastern Armenian, is "քալելու եմ."

[Armenian]

Re: gor blimey

The obsessive psychobabbling he/she strikes again!!!

I'll go find some pills to throw at it...

Do you people see what I have to go through here?