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  • #11
    Re: history

    Just watched the whole thing. The cats it was stated are a ancient and unique breed. Many have two different collored eyes. The biggest thing that makes this cat unique is its desire to swim, most cats hate the water. They said the cats with the same collored eyes were worth much more then the ones with two different collored eyes.He also said that it is against the law to export this cat.
    I was very impressed by the work done by this group. The quality of the vid was good and the narrorator was excellent.This is a very sad story of what armenians have lost and it was told very well. I never knew how beutifull van was untill i saw this video and some of the churches which to this day stand are amazing examples of armenian culture and skill. I assume the cat in your avatar is a van cat. I can only hope that i will one day see this beutifull land of my ancesters in person.
    Hayastan or Bust.

    Comment


    • #12
      Re: history

      Mr. Baliozian, I have read all your posts on this thread and I am left somewhat confused. There are many things you have said that I agree with but at the same time I have my doubts about your other statements.

      It is well known that Governments hardly ever look after the peoples demands unless there is an advantage. They do not want us to think so they keep our minds occupied with entertainments and lack of proper public education while giving us only the information that they see fit. This is an old Roman technique (If not all the way back to Egyptians). However this can work both ways. Can you imagine what can happen if every action of a Gov is to be questioned by common man. There has to be a certain amount of control by Authorities to maintain a balance in the civilization and to keep the wheels turning.
      With that said I truly believe that Greed and Prejudice is the root cause of our failures (Evil if you will)…..but how can we be human and not feel greed or prejudice?? The answer is we cannot, but we could control it as humanity gains maturity.

      However you are right when you say we know about our enemy more than ourselves, in my case this might be true but in my heart I know what it is to be an Armenian without any political, organizational, or foreign influence. In fact I reject many such organizations when I see their heart is not in the right place, maybe this is why I am a loner and I carry my own struggle against a vast enemy with no hope of any measurable success…..but to give up?? It is not in my Armenian blood.

      You seem to suggest that Armenians are doomed as a race but you yourself stated that one thing History has shown us is that nothing remains the same and anything can happen. I say nothing is in black and white sir and the faith of no nation is chiseled on some ancient rock.

      You suggest why help an enemy who wants to hang himself. I say by handing them the rope I want to make sure that they will be successful…in the honor of the victims of AG who cry from their graves for justice. I feel it as my responsibility to do something about it, not just for God or Country…but for honor, decency, and respect of our Grandparents.

      You also said that Between a Turkish friend and an Armenian enemy you would choose a Turkish friend. I know what you mean by that and I know many Turks helped Armenians escape but was this because they cared for the Armenians or was it that they could not live with themselves if they didn’t do something about it? It doesn’t matter, I truly appreciated and this is one of the reasons I don’t think “a good Turk is a dead Turk”
      But…………..Mr. Baliozian, I could not do that. If I cannot make the Armenian my friend then I am on my own. Maybe one day a Turk and I will salute to our friendship but that will not come easily for me. Respect is earned, not given. To befriend a Turk in today’s geopolitics and with this criminal Turkish Governments position in the world, that sir would not be proper for me as much as he/she might be an OK guy/gal. This does not mean I won’t talk to them in a civilized manner though.

      I will end this with a joke.

      I quote you here:

      “Even as they dig us deeper into the hole, they speechify about the light at the end of the tunnel.”

      The only thing they forget to tell us is that the light at the end of the Tunnel, is actually a freight train with its lights on coming right at you….no brakes.
      B0zkurt Hunter

      Comment


      • #13
        Re: history

        Hey bell the cat i did my part and was expecting you to do yours. Where is the story you were going to share with us.
        Hayastan or Bust.

        Comment


        • #14
          Re: history

          Well bell the xxxxx cat went into hiding i guess. My bet is the monument in that vid was made to remember the armenian martyrs and the turcks just turned the story around saying it was for the turcks who were killed by the armenians. It amazes me how these turcks come into our forums talkin xxxx but in actuality are xxxxxs at heart. I am not seeing really any hopefull sighns from these people at all. Even the ones who have the brains to questions the state approved version of history lack the balls to do the right thing. A professor i very much respected and learned a lot from tried hard to establish dialogue between our peoples and he brought some turckish professors of history to detroits armenian community center so that we could establish dialogue. This was loong ago but i am not sure how much good this is going to bring. As i said before it is up to turckey to solve this issue and it does involve recognition and restotution. Since non of these two things seems likely to happen i can only forsee another tragic war in the future where either armenia will strike turckey when it is weak or the turck will try to finish the genocide it started if russia for whatever reason allows it. The wounds of the armenian survivors are way too deep to forget and the hatred only rises with every act of turckish denial. I hope i am wrong and no more bloodshed is needed but i get no hope from the turcks visiting our forums.
          Hayastan or Bust.

          Comment


          • #15
            Re: history

            Originally posted by Haykakan View Post
            Well bell the xxxxx cat went into hiding i guess. My bet is the monument in that vid was made to remember the armenian martyrs and the turcks just turned the story around saying it was for the turcks who were killed by the armenians. It amazes me how these turcks come into our forums talkin xxxx but in actuality are xxxxxs at heart. I am not seeing really any hopefull sighns from these people at all. Even the ones who have the brains to questions the state approved version of history lack the balls to do the right thing. A professor i very much respected and learned a lot from tried hard to establish dialogue between our peoples and he brought some turckish professors of history to detroits armenian community center so that we could establish dialogue. This was loong ago but i am not sure how much good this is going to bring. As i said before it is up to turckey to solve this issue and it does involve recognition and restotution. Since non of these two things seems likely to happen i can only forsee another tragic war in the future where either armenia will strike turckey when it is weak or the turck will try to finish the genocide it started if russia for whatever reason allows it. The wounds of the armenian survivors are way too deep to forget and the hatred only rises with every act of turckish denial. I hope i am wrong and no more bloodshed is needed but i get no hope from the turcks visiting our forums.
            Sorry to say that you're spot on Haykakan, can you really see turkey being in a state so weakened that Armenia could strike? Not really, unless Russia reels them in, disjoints them from the West and then, turkey being turkey, they push down the pan-turan road in Central Asia and the Russian Bear gives them a powerful back-slap, actually I would love to see that, recover Kars, Van, Bitlis and the rest.
            Sardarabad,1918.

            Comment


            • #16
              Re: history

              Sunday, March 1, 2009
              ***********************************************
              TRUE STORIES
              ************************************************** **************
              Once upon a time I had a friend who was nice to everyone, made no enemies, was invariably generous in his assessment of others, popular with both men and women. And yet, he died friendless. This is not a judgment on my part but a confession on his. He was an Armenian writer.
              *
              Not to love but to pretend to love. Not to believe but to pretend to believe. Not to know but to pretend to know. The world is full of them.
              *
              Should one be tolerant of intolerance?
              *
              Communism has been defined as state capitalism, and capitalism as socialism for Wall Street CEOs.
              *
              The search for reason leads to insanity.
              *
              The most comfortable seating position will give you back pain.
              *
              There is a slave in every conformist, a revolutionary in every dissenter, an atheist in every believer, a believer in every atheist, and a Turk in every Armenian.
              *
              Your truth is bound to be someone else's lie.
              *
              The worst nightmare for an exemplary man or a role model would be coming face to face with his double.
              *
              No one can be as ignorant as the man with all the answers.
              *
              All pro-establishment assertions boil down to the motto “I'm alright Jack!”
              #
              Monday, March 2, 2009
              ***********************************************
              SOLVING PROBLEMS
              ***********************************************
              Solving problems is easy. What's hard is implementing the solutions. Consider the present global financial crisis that enriched a few at the expense of impoverishing many.
              It seems to me the solution is as clear as daylight and as simple as getting a refund for a defective or unsatisfactory item. In legal parlance: either restitution of funds acquired by the few or a jail term. If this solution is rejected on legal grounds, then all I can say is there is something wrong with the law and it should be rectified and enforced retroactively.
              When a doctor kills instead of curing, he cannot plead not guilty by reason of incompetence. Incompetence should not be rewarded but punished. Why should not the same principle apply to economists and financiers whose responsibility it is to take care of the welfare or economic health of the nation?
              It goes without saying that law-makers will never agree to pass a law that may expose their own incompetence or corruption or status as co-conspirators with Wall Street CEOs.
              But let the world solve its problems. Let's take care of our own first.
              How to solve our own problems?
              Easy! De-Ottomanize, de-Stalinize, and de-tribalize.
              What could be easier?
              What's hard is convincing our men at the top that, very much like their counterparts in Washington and Wall Street, they are not la crème de la crème but la crème de la scum.
              #
              Tuesday, March 3, 2009
              ***********************************************
              AN ALIEN CULTURE
              ***********************************************
              During the war in Vietnam Americans were accused of genocide by a number of learned observers, among them Jean-Paul Sartre (see his ON GENOCIDE).
              In his GHOST TRAIN TO THE EASTERN STAR (New York, 2008), Paul Theroux writes that whenever he identified himself as an American in Vietnam, he met with smiles and friendliness -- “no moralizing, no frowns, no scolding. Almost all the Vietnamese I met were like this – not backward-looking and vindictive scolds muttering, 'Never forget!' but compassionate souls, getting on with their lives, hopeful and humane.”
              Elsewhere: “Travel in Vietnam for an American was a lesson in humility. They had lost two million civilians and a million soldiers, and we had lost more than 58,000 men and women. They did not talk about it on a personal level, at least not in a blaming way. It was not you, they said, it was your government...Blaming and complaining and looking for pity are regarded as weak traits in Vietnamese culture, revenge is wasteful. They won the war against us because they were tenacious, united, and resourceful, and that was also how they were building their economy.”
              While in Tokyo, a Japanese writer tells him: “We admired MacArthur – we still do. He's like a father figure.”
              #
              Wednesday, March 4, 2009
              ***********************************************
              NOT ALL QUESTIONS HAVE ANSWERS
              ***********************************************
              Unlike most of my fellow countrymen, I was born a total ignoramus, and even after a lifetime of study and reflection, my area of ignorance is so vast that what I know might as well be a grain of sand on a beach that stretches from here to the horizon.
              *
              I learn something every day, which may suggest I have spoken as an ignoramus so many times that you would be a fool to take me seriously.
              *
              Who could be more ignorant that a man with all the answers? And who could be more prone to error that he who asserts infallibility?
              *
              Einstein said the universe is comprehensible but after decades of hard thinking he failed to explain it.
              *
              Heidegger said so far no philosopher has been successful in answering the question, why things exist?
              *
              We like to say people have the government they deserve. But I suggest no one guilty of petty larceny deserves to fry.
              *
              If the future of our nation is more important than the past, and if we have a better chance to resolve our differences as friends rather than as enemies, why should we not call Turks our brothers?
              #

              http://baliozian.blogspot.com/

              Comment


              • #17
                Re: history

                Originally posted by arabaliozian View Post
                Sunday, March 1, 2009
                ***********************************************
                TRUE STORIES
                ************************************************** **************
                Once upon a time I had a friend who was nice to everyone, made no enemies, was invariably generous in his assessment of others, popular with both men and women. And yet, he died friendless. This is not a judgment on my part but a confession on his. He was an Armenian writer.
                *
                Not to love but to pretend to love. Not to believe but to pretend to believe. Not to know but to pretend to know. The world is full of them.
                *
                Should one be tolerant of intolerance?
                *
                Communism has been defined as state capitalism, and capitalism as socialism for Wall Street CEOs.
                *
                The search for reason leads to insanity.
                *
                The most comfortable seating position will give you back pain.
                *
                There is a slave in every conformist, a revolutionary in every dissenter, an atheist in every believer, a believer in every atheist, and a Turk in every Armenian.
                *
                Your truth is bound to be someone else's lie.
                *
                The worst nightmare for an exemplary man or a role model would be coming face to face with his double.
                *
                No one can be as ignorant as the man with all the answers.
                *
                All pro-establishment assertions boil down to the motto “I'm alright Jack!”
                #
                Monday, March 2, 2009
                ***********************************************
                SOLVING PROBLEMS
                ***********************************************
                Solving problems is easy. What's hard is implementing the solutions. Consider the present global financial crisis that enriched a few at the expense of impoverishing many.
                It seems to me the solution is as clear as daylight and as simple as getting a refund for a defective or unsatisfactory item. In legal parlance: either restitution of funds acquired by the few or a jail term. If this solution is rejected on legal grounds, then all I can say is there is something wrong with the law and it should be rectified and enforced retroactively.
                When a doctor kills instead of curing, he cannot plead not guilty by reason of incompetence. Incompetence should not be rewarded but punished. Why should not the same principle apply to economists and financiers whose responsibility it is to take care of the welfare or economic health of the nation?
                It goes without saying that law-makers will never agree to pass a law that may expose their own incompetence or corruption or status as co-conspirators with Wall Street CEOs.
                But let the world solve its problems. Let's take care of our own first.
                How to solve our own problems?
                Easy! De-Ottomanize, de-Stalinize, and de-tribalize.
                What could be easier?
                What's hard is convincing our men at the top that, very much like their counterparts in Washington and Wall Street, they are not la crème de la crème but la crème de la scum.
                #
                Tuesday, March 3, 2009
                ***********************************************
                AN ALIEN CULTURE
                ***********************************************
                During the war in Vietnam Americans were accused of genocide by a number of learned observers, among them Jean-Paul Sartre (see his ON GENOCIDE).
                In his GHOST TRAIN TO THE EASTERN STAR (New York, 2008), Paul Theroux writes that whenever he identified himself as an American in Vietnam, he met with smiles and friendliness -- “no moralizing, no frowns, no scolding. Almost all the Vietnamese I met were like this – not backward-looking and vindictive scolds muttering, 'Never forget!' but compassionate souls, getting on with their lives, hopeful and humane.”
                Elsewhere: “Travel in Vietnam for an American was a lesson in humility. They had lost two million civilians and a million soldiers, and we had lost more than 58,000 men and women. They did not talk about it on a personal level, at least not in a blaming way. It was not you, they said, it was your government...Blaming and complaining and looking for pity are regarded as weak traits in Vietnamese culture, revenge is wasteful. They won the war against us because they were tenacious, united, and resourceful, and that was also how they were building their economy.”
                While in Tokyo, a Japanese writer tells him: “We admired MacArthur – we still do. He's like a father figure.”
                #
                Wednesday, March 4, 2009
                ***********************************************
                NOT ALL QUESTIONS HAVE ANSWERS
                ***********************************************
                Unlike most of my fellow countrymen, I was born a total ignoramus, and even after a lifetime of study and reflection, my area of ignorance is so vast that what I know might as well be a grain of sand on a beach that stretches from here to the horizon.
                *
                I learn something every day, which may suggest I have spoken as an ignoramus so many times that you would be a fool to take me seriously.
                *
                Who could be more ignorant that a man with all the answers? And who could be more prone to error that he who asserts infallibility?
                *
                Einstein said the universe is comprehensible but after decades of hard thinking he failed to explain it.
                *
                Heidegger said so far no philosopher has been successful in answering the question, why things exist?
                *
                We like to say people have the government they deserve. But I suggest no one guilty of petty larceny deserves to fry.
                *
                If the future of our nation is more important than the past, and if we have a better chance to resolve our differences as friends rather than as enemies, why should we not call Turks our brothers?
                #

                http://baliozian.blogspot.com/

                Mr. Baliozian. You say many have accused Americans of Genocide in Vietnam and that Vietnamese themselves do not blame the American people but put the fault on the US government.
                That is a fallacy. There is no doubt that US bombers were responsible for terrible deaths in Vietnam and the US GI’s did some terrible things beyond the code of honor but to categorize this into a Genocide would not only be incorrect but it demeans the definition of Genocide which you do not seem to be aware of. Mr. Baliozian I am very surprised that you do not know this but a Genocide is always committed by the STATE (Government) against its own citizens. I suggest you look up the correct definition.
                The Vietnamese were not leaving under the laws and protection of the US government, furthermore there was no land lost to the invading forces who were not planning on occupying and conquering the Vietnamese lands. No doubt many were massacred but that does not qualify as Genocide like Darfur....... and incidentally just yesterday the International Criminal Court issued an arrest warrant for Omar al-Bashir, the president of Sudan, on charges of war crimes and crimes against humanity in connection with the Darfur conflict. Would this not be a step in the right direction for the remaining victims and humanity in whole? Sure, it cannot bring the dead back but this does set a precedent for the future and makes it legal in a sense that “IT DID HAPPEN” which later on can be used for compensation and return of any lost land.


                I see you have advanced your proposed relations with Turks from friends to brothers. Well Sir, it is very hard to make friends let alone brothers with an enemy who wants to kill you.

                Below is a typical confession I squeeze out of Ultra-Nationalist Turks (granted this guy is not as seasoned as others I come across and a bit confused). Please explain how we can become brothers.

                <<<<<<<<<If it is really a genocide

                SO WHAT ! ! ! Ottoman xxxish generals and the army generally occured with generally region Kurds does make Turks to be responsible ?

                Also I am the 4. generation, am I responsible for that no!!.. Turkey and Ottoman Empire are not same thing.>>>>>>>>>>>

                Do you see the problem Mr. Baliozian?
                B0zkurt Hunter

                Comment


                • #18
                  Re: history

                  Genocide needs to be a planned state sponspored massacre to either wholly or partially destroy an ethnic group, race or political thought, while Vietnam is indeed terrible in the sheer extent of the US massacres, its not Genocide as there were no official plans for the extermination of the Vietnamese, there were most likely people with Genocidal intentions, but it was not the official intention, so no not Genocide

                  For instance, I can say that the US dropping nukes on Japan can constitute as Genocide, for that matter on Afghanistan too, its cruel, there were crimes against humanity, but its not Genocide

                  Nazi Germany, Ottoman Turkey, US Backed Guatemala, Darfur, Cambodia, these are all proper examples of modern Genocide
                  ¡Tierra y Libertad!

                  Zapata

                  Comment


                  • #19
                    Re: history

                    Thursday, March 5, 2009
                    ***********************************************
                    REFLECTIONS
                    ***********************************************
                    When I was a total ignoramus, I always assumed I knew more than the average Joe I happened to be dealing with. Now it's the other way around: I always assume to know less.
                    *
                    You can tell how ignorant a man is by how hard he tries to make you think he knows better.
                    *
                    The most ungodly people are those who speak in His name, and the most dangerous dupes are those who believe them.
                    *
                    I reject the notion that to be a good Armenian means to be a bundle of prejudices and nurse an unsettled score. Which amounts to saying, to be a good Armenian means to be a bad human being.
                    *
                    What's uppermost in the mind of a successful writer is to live up to his reputation. Which is why as a marginal scribbler and a total failure I find my status both liberating and stimulating.
                    *
                    It is written: “No one can be as dangerous as the man who has nothing to lose.”
                    *
                    The greatest challenge a country faces is not electing great leaders but leaders who are the least threat to its welfare. As for our unelected bosses, bishops, and benefactors: they might as well be our Bermuda Triangle.
                    *
                    Our ghazetajis operate on the assumption that the average Armenian reader prefers to read about little successes (no matter how imaginary) than colossal failures (no matter how real). Never underestimate the cunning of idiots.
                    *
                    Prejudice allows a man to tailor his questions to fit his answers.
                    *
                    If you don't know, pretend to know. Few people will have the time and appetite to get into a useless argument with a worthless phony. At least, that has been my experience.
                    #
                    Friday, March 6, 2009
                    ***********************************************
                    MOSAIC
                    ***********************************************
                    Truth as a mosaic of lies -- like a pleasing design made of worthless pieces of glass or stone.
                    *
                    God as a point of reference or God as a means to expose our failings and imperfections, yes. But God as a license to do this, that, and the other – I say that's damn close to confusing God with the Devil.
                    *
                    What could be more absurd than to say, what I believe is true, what you believe is a lie. And yet...
                    *
                    Let us teach ourselves to question everything, beginning with our own judgment.
                    *
                    To say that ideas acquire legitimacy only when they serve our interests is to undermine the legitimacy of all ideas.
                    *
                    What follows is a true story. It happened last year in a Greyhound bus in Canada. A passenger stabs another passenger – a totally unprovoked attack -- and beheads him. When arrested and tried, he pleads not guilty by reason of insanity. God made him do it, he explains.
                    I suggest the following definition of man: a creature who cannot tell God from the Devil.
                    *
                    If repetition is a crime, who is the victim? If repetition is a transgression, where is the harm?
                    #
                    Saturday, March 7, 2009
                    ***********************************************
                    QUESTION
                    ***********************************************
                    Win an argument and lose a friend.
                    It has happened to me more than once.
                    Some of my worst enemies today are former friends; and they have become enemies because of a minor disagreement on an irrelevant topic.
                    But perhaps they were never friends, and what they lost was much more than an argument.
                    We are a confused bunch. No doubt about that.
                    We are confused because we have been shaped by alien, tyrannical, and unjust laws – laws that viewed dissent as a capital offense, and desire for self-determination (i.e. freedom), that most human of all desires, as a crime against humanity or the integrity of the empire.
                    When contradicted we feel threatened. There are even those among us (I call them skinheads) who see verbal abuse as a legitimate form of counter-argument.
                    We will be born again as human beings on the day we learn to have a friendly disagreement.
                    Remember my friends:
                    free speech is a fundamental human right,
                    dissent is not treason,
                    a political party that places its own agenda above the solidarity and welfare of the nation is not democratic but tyrannical,
                    and our political leaders are not bosses or representatives of god on earth but public servants.
                    Because I say these things, am I then your enemy?
                    #

                    Comment


                    • #20
                      Re: history

                      Originally posted by Eddo211 View Post
                      Mr. Baliozian. You say many have accused Americans of Genocide in Vietnam and that Vietnamese themselves do not blame the American people but put the fault on the US government.
                      That is a fallacy. There is no doubt that US bombers were responsible for terrible deaths in Vietnam and the US GI’s did some terrible things beyond the code of honor but to categorize this into a Genocide would not only be incorrect but it demeans the definition of Genocide which you do not seem to be aware of. Mr. Baliozian I am very surprised that you do not know this but a Genocide is always committed by the STATE (Government) against its own citizens. I suggest you look up the correct definition.
                      The Vietnamese were not leaving under the laws and protection of the US government, furthermore there was no land lost to the invading forces who were not planning on occupying and conquering the Vietnamese lands. No doubt many were massacred but that does not qualify as Genocide like Darfur....... and incidentally just yesterday the International Criminal Court issued an arrest warrant for Omar al-Bashir, the president of Sudan, on charges of war crimes and crimes against humanity in connection with the Darfur conflict. Would this not be a step in the right direction for the remaining victims and humanity in whole? Sure, it cannot bring the dead back but this does set a precedent for the future and makes it legal in a sense that “IT DID HAPPEN” which later on can be used for compensation and return of any lost land.


                      I see you have advanced your proposed relations with Turks from friends to brothers. Well Sir, it is very hard to make friends let alone brothers with an enemy who wants to kill you.

                      Below is a typical confession I squeeze out of Ultra-Nationalist Turks (granted this guy is not as seasoned as others I come across and a bit confused). Please explain how we can become brothers.

                      <<<<<<<<<If it is really a genocide

                      SO WHAT ! ! ! Ottoman xxxish generals and the army generally occured with generally region Kurds does make Turks to be responsible ?

                      Also I am the 4. generation, am I responsible for that no!!.. Turkey and Ottoman Empire are not same thing.>>>>>>>>>>>

                      Do you see the problem Mr. Baliozian?

                      whether or not what the yanks did to vietnam is genocide is not up to me or you to decide. i was simply quoting Sartre...you are free to agree or disagree. i have no objection and no answer for you.
                      the meaning or definition of genocide can be found in any dictionary. so that too is beyond our choice.

                      Comment

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