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Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

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  • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

    As Vafa Guluzade, former policy advisor to President Heydar Aliev, pointed out, Madrid Principles, if implemented in an agreement, can lead to “fragmentation” of Azerbaijan. He is correct. As things stand, Madrid Principles set out a blueprint for eventual independence of Karabakh and creation of a second Armenian state in South Caucasus. Those elements of the Helsinki Final Act that form the basis of Madrid Principles stipulate that:
    1) Republic of Armenia recognises Azerbaijan’s territorial integrity and forfeits any claims against Azerbaijan Republic, but does not and is not required to recognise Azerbaijani sovereignty over Karabakh.
    2) The International community recognises Azerbaijan’s territorial integrity but does NOT recognise Azerbaijani sovereignty over Karabakh.
    3) Azerbaijan forfeits its right under international law to use force in self-defence against Armenian occupation of Karabakh and other regions.
    4) Armenian security is guaranteed through deployment of international peace-keeping force not just in Karabakh but in all of the territories of Azerbaijan currently under Armenian occupation – Azerbaijan will not be allowed to deploy its own troops in regions such as Agdam or Fizuli.
    5) Azerbaijani sovereignty over Karabakh is de facto and de jure negated by establishment of an interim status for Karabakh, probably under the auspices of OSCE and direct control of that organisation – similar to the interim status offered to Kosovo by UN prior to that region’s declaration of independence.
    6) The final issue of sovereignty over Karabakh will NOT be decided by the warring parties, through negotiations between Baku and Yerevan, but through a referendum to be held at some point in the future – when will this be is irrelevant since legal standards will be upheld indefinitely.
    A recent change in Azerbaijani constitution (adopted through a rigged referendum) has transformed a constitutional requirement for all referendums to be held on national basis – the current text of Azerbaijani constitution requires as few as 40,000 people to demand a referendum on a local issue, for it to be triggered.
    7) Article VIII of HFA (The Right to Self-determination) reads that “…all peoples always have the right, in full freedom, to determine, when and as they wish, their internal and external political status, without external interference, and to pursue as they wish their political, economic, social and cultural development. As such there is absolutely no legal basis to claim that Armenian population of Karabakh cannot demand full independence when the referendum is eventually held.

    It would have been possible to prevent the “independence option” being included into the referendum if the agreement between Azerbaijan and Armenia was to be based on Article I of HFA (Sovereignty). Azerbaijan could have then legally challenged any independence demands, since Article I require the agreement of a state for its frontiers to be changed. But as Article I is not included in the Madrid Principles there is no legal recourse for Azerbaijan – there is nothing in the three elements of Madrid Principles which would prevent Karabakh Armenians demanding independence through a referendum in accordance with Article VIII (Self-determination). As stated above, the principle of territorial integrity (Article IV) does not apply to relations within member-states of OSCE, but only to relation between such states.

    The importance of Article I and the issue of sovereignty become even more apparent when comparing Madrid Principles with other legal documents and agreements based on Helsinki Final Act. For instance, both the Dayton Accords and the Armenian- Turkish Protocols are based explicitly on Article I (Sovereignty).

    The question to the Aliev administration is this - why have they agreed to a legal framework that explicitly challenges Azerbaijani sovereignty over Karabakh and removes the final status issue from its traditional place as subject to bilateral negotiations between Baku and Yerevan? Azerbaijan was invaded by Armenia and our territories are occupied by that foreign power. Independence of Karabakh was not the demand when the conflict flared up in 1988 – the original demand was annexation of Karabakh by Armenia. The right to self determination was articulated only after the collapse of Soviet Union as a means to legitimise the aggression perpetrated by the Republic of Armenia. Azerbaijan always insisted that the status of Karabakh should be settled through negotiations between the governments of two warring states. To remove that precondition is to play a dangerous game with the future of Azerbaijani statehood – one that is immaterial without sovereignty over Karabakh.

    The paradox of Madrid Principles is that they are opposed most forcefully by Armenians, whilst many in Azerbaijan are euphoric in their delusions about the nature of the legal principle of territorial integrity.

    Comment


    • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

      This explains why Armenia doesn't just claim Artsakh and chooses to let it be a independent second armenian state. I never understood this untill i read these articles. Thank you for posting them.
      Hayastan or Bust.

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      • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

        Originally posted by ArmeniaR View Post
        From what are these numbers (856) on the bmps and tanks...? Its the 856th bmp from Armenian army or the number is something else?
        This is simply a tactical number.

        Comment


        • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

          So, basically, the Madrid principles stipulate that if we give Azerbaijan virtually all the liberated territories surrounding NKR (keeping a corridor to us), then Azerbaijan, by its own promises, is forced to sign a non-aggression pact. Then we exclude the possibility of a war.

          Then, after granted an interim status (specifying what "interim" means) for a given period of time, the people of NK will be given a referendum to vote their status by self-determination of the peoples. Since no provisions were agreed to avoid such referendum to allow the people of NK to formally secede de-jure from Azerbaijan's UN recognized sovereignty, it can be said, that NKR will, by decision of its own people, become an fully independent state within the borders it had as an autonomous oblast in the USSR + a corridor linking in to Armenia. And Azerbaijan cannot do nothing about it, since it got their pledges to "restore territorial integrity"...they have it, of course it is a very hard thing for Armenia and NKR to do, but it was given to them, HOWEVER such territorial integrity has, does and will NOT include NK.

          Am I excluding anything?
          -------------------------

          Well, this is certainly a very interesting document, and even more interesting because it is written by an Azeri. After reading it I just thought to myself, "What are we waiting for then?". Here we have an Azerbaijani saying that the document their government and population so effusively agree on, are basically, legally and without any troubles, giving the right to the people of NK to become an independent country in a given future. Doesn't it sound too good to be true?

          This gave me a lot to think about. Thanks a lot Tigranakert, this was a priceless article.

          Comment


          • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

            Photos of the Armenian Air Force for the last fifteen years:










            Last edited by burjuin; 07-07-2010, 07:23 PM.

            Comment


            • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

              Originally posted by ashot24 View Post
              So, basically, the Madrid principles stipulate that if we give Azerbaijan virtually all the liberated territories surrounding NKR (keeping a corridor to us), then Azerbaijan, by its own promises, is forced to sign a non-aggression pact. Then we exclude the possibility of a war.

              Then, after granted an interim status (specifying what "interim" means) for a given period of time, the people of NK will be given a referendum to vote their status by self-determination of the peoples. Since no provisions were agreed to avoid such referendum to allow the people of NK to formally secede de-jure from Azerbaijan's UN recognized sovereignty, it can be said, that NKR will, by decision of its own people, become an fully independent state within the borders it had as an autonomous oblast in the USSR + a corridor linking in to Armenia. And Azerbaijan cannot do nothing about it, since it got their pledges to "restore territorial integrity"...they have it, of course it is a very hard thing for Armenia and NKR to do, but it was given to them, HOWEVER such territorial integrity has, does and will NOT include NK.

              Am I excluding anything?
              -------------------------

              Well, this is certainly a very interesting document, and even more interesting because it is written by an Azeri. After reading it I just thought to myself, "What are we waiting for then?". Here we have an Azerbaijani saying that the document their government and population so effusively agree on, are basically, legally and without any troubles, giving the right to the people of NK to become an independent country in a given future. Doesn't it sound too good to be true?

              This gave me a lot to think about. Thanks a lot Tigranakert, this was a priceless article.
              If such you say its true and all of it its total crap il explain the reason:
              1)First they are Turks that Genocided us they try and continue genocidal acts.
              2)There government are liers to there own people and internationaly not relayabel,they are propaganda machines of anti-armenians.
              3)In the given time when NK gives up land or forces azeris will immediately use it to exterminate any future of its inhabitants,may it be killings or destruction, imprisonment.
              4)Azeris will move million of population out of nowhere to NK claiming to be there own lands even if there been none of them.
              5)Azeris have already formed something called mayor and people of NK enlisting people that supposed to be war immigrants..so UN will allow them to vote cause turks and azeris will push for such a lie clearly they are propaganda.

              So for the above reasons if its supported by UN or not we gonna loose by principles that are manipulated and they will give manipulated results.
              Even when the time will come to vote the azeris will have more votes than the actual artsaxi population of 150.000 people.
              Last edited by UrMistake; 07-07-2010, 07:33 PM.

              Comment


              • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

                Originally posted by burjuin View Post
                Photos of the Armenian Air Force for the last fifteen years:

                Comment


                • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan










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                  • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan







                    Comment


                    • Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

                      I found this video with really nice music ..i think is artsaxi troops hope more of them from where they came..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7WCe...os=YY0lmX1PdCI

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