Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Politicizing the Armenian Genocide and making it anything but a memorial/remembrance for a grim event in our history is outrageous. We fight for Genocide recognition, not curbing freedom of speech.

We fight for Genocide recognition because it will have political implications. It is naïve to think otherwise.

[Artsakh]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Politicizing the Armenian Genocide and making it anything but a memorial/remembrance for a grim event in our history is outrageous. We fight for Genocide recognition, not curbing freedom of speech.

The world doesn't work that way. There's no place for truth or justice in geopolitics, it's all about might makes right. Instead, let's focus on the just act that Russia took, and praise her for it. Because no matter what motive may exist behind it, the act itself is just, and the right thing to do, it serves our interests, and that's all we need to worry about.

Listen to this:

http://lratvakan.am/?p=49197&l=am/rusnery+hishecin+haykakan+gorcony+rusastanum+kqnarkvi+hayeri+cexaspanutyuny+gxtely+qreakanacnelu+orinagicy+audio

Zhirinovsky talking about helping Armenians liberate lands from Turkey, Passing anti-denial laws in Russia… all positive things, but putting it in a negative light. Yes, we must call Russia out on past wrongs, but in this instance everything is in our favor, and we’re pointing a finger to Russia. It really puts their logic, reasoning and overall credibility and into question, when Russia in fact is saying and doing all the right things.

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

"in this instance everything is in our favor, and we’re pointing a finger to Russia. It really puts their logic, reasoning and overall credibility and into question, when Russia in fact is saying and doing all the right things. "
It is called brainwashing. The west has fed the people of the world a steady diet of BS for decades and this is the result. In addition to this there are paid spies and saboteurs whose job is to propagate the same BS. I wonder where the western liberal values were when the terrorists they created, supplied, armed, trained, let loos on the civilians of Syria started committing genocide? The brainwashing is so extensive and effective that as you can clearly see...many of our fellow Armenians are actively supporting our own killers instead of the only force that has kept us protected.

[HyeSocialist]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

"in this instance everything is in our favor, and we’re pointing a finger to Russia. It really puts their logic, reasoning and overall credibility and into question, when Russia in fact is saying and doing all the right things. "
It is called brainwashing. The west has fed the people of the world a steady diet of BS for decades and this is the result. In addition to this there are paid spies and saboteurs whose job is to propagate the same BS. I wonder where the western liberal values were when the terrorists they created, supplied, armed, trained, let loos on the civilians of Syria started committing genocide? The brainwashing is so extensive and effective that as you can clearly see...many of our fellow Armenians are actively supporting our own killers instead of the only force that has kept us protected.

Hopar Tigo, our people's Uncle Tom. Thinking a good Armenian is a good subject of the Russian Empire.

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Hopar Tigo, our people's Uncle Tom. Thinking a good Armenian is a good subject of the Russian Empire.

No it is about interests. Armenia and Russia share many important interests. It is that simple. We do not share all interests and I have many times in this forum stated that it is not in Russia's interest to have a strong independent Armenia. I have no illusions about anything but you and many others do.

[HyeSocialist]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Shifting Ground in Azerbaijan-Armenia Confrontation

A public debate held by IWPR’s Armenia office heard how political turbulence drives periodic upsurges in fighting along the border with Azerbaijan, and examined the evolving geopolitical environment of the Nagorny Karabakh dispute.

Although there are frequent shooting incidents on the “line of control” surrounding Karabakh and across the Azerbaijani-Armenian state border, any more intense period of fighting necessarily raises fears of escalation, even a return to the full-scale conflict of the early 1990s. Each side blames the other for breaking the 1994 ceasefire that effectively froze the conflict without resolving it.

There were spikes in violence in July-August 2014 and again in January 2015. Renewed fighting in September this years was taken particularly seriously in Armenia because of allegations that the Azerbaijanis were using heavier weapons than usual – artillery, rockets and heavy mortars. Armenian officials said their forces responded using similar weapons. (See our story Armenia-Azerbaijan: More Skirmishing, Bigger Guns.)

Speakers at a debate which IWPR hosted in Yerevan on October 2 tried to unpick the reasons for the heightened levels of violence, and the possible implications. The debate was broadcast live on Armenia’s A1 television channel.

Joining the debate via a video link from London, Thomas de Waal, a leading expert and writer on the Caucasus with the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, warned of the continuing risk of “war by accident”.

He noted that Azerbaijan was heading for hard times because of plummeting price of oil – its major export – while Armenia’s president Serzh Sargsyan was drawing close to the end of his second and final term in office. With that as the context, he said, “the number one task for the authorities in Yerevan and Baku is to hold onto power. There’s a danger that both have an interest in playing the Karabakh card, and that introduces an element of unpredictability.”

Manvel Sargsyan, director of the Armenian Centre for National and International Studies, said that progress on negotiations depended on Azerbaijan, but that he believed the country would only do so when it decided other options – building up its military and creating tension on the front lines – were not going to work.

De Waal agreed that the status quo – with the Armenians exerting de facto control over Nagorny Karabakh and adjoining districts – did not favour Azerbaijan and would not encourage it to adopt a more conciliatory attitude. But that did not mean Azerbaijan was tilting towards war.

“Large-scale military operations remain a huge risk to the regime Azerbaijan. It isn’t clear how that would end. I don’t think they have sufficient military capacity to start a war,” he said. “Nor is it clear how Russia would react in a situation like that.”

Russia’s regional intentions, in light of its actions in Ukraine and now Syria, naturally loomed large in the discussion.

Moscow is a historical ally of Armenia and continues to be that country’s major security and economic partner. But it also sells high-tech weaponry to Azerbaijan, an oil-rich country with far more spending power than Armenia.

Russia is at the same time one of the three co-chairs (with France and the United States) of the Minsk Group, the OSCE body that oversees the Karabakh talks process. Despite the obligation of diplomatic neutrality that this imposes, the Russians have recently caused a stir by offering – unilaterally – to send a peacekeeping force to patrol the Karabakh front lines.

While this proposal is still up in the air, some Armenian commentators are worried about the implications, especially since Azerbaijan now seems amenable to the idea after previous refusals to countenance it.

“People understand perfectly well that if a third country has troops in the [front-line] zone, they are pursuing a specific policy line,” Sargsyan. “They aren’t there to separate [the sides], but to take regional matters into their own hands and dictate terms…. Especially since the argument will be that they are entering territory that is internationally recognised as part of Azerbaijan, and under its auspices.”

The third speaker, Agasi Yenokyan, who is director of the Armenian Centre for Political and International Studies, said that President Sargsyan had “effectively agreed” to a peacekeeping force. As for Azerbaijan, Yenokyan suspected it might be hoping to exploit the peacekeeping presence to “bite off a chunk of Karabakh” in the knowledge that the Russian troops would not stay long.

“We see how Russia has frozen the conflict in Donbass and is launching a major expansion in Syria, and potentially the South Caucasus, too,” he said. “Russian might therefore send in a limited peacekeeping force, which wouldn’t cost it a great deal but would bring immense political dividends.”

Sargsyan said recent developments had demonstrated that the Armenian government had adopted a new, more proactive stance to military operations, which might force Russia to abandon or rethink any plans to deploy in the region.

Another point on which the speakers agreed was that Western interest in the South Caucasus, including engagement in the Minsk Group process, was diminishing. This was not helped by the fact that the West was now at odds with Moscow.

“In the context of the Ukrainian conflict, we can see how countries are divided on how to achieve the objective. It’s the same with Karabakh – there is little mutual trust even though everyone wants to achieve peace,” De Waal said.

De Waal said the general contours of a peace deal were already apparent, but required mutual compromises.

“Unfortunately, we can see that the international community isn’t currently prepared to assume responsibility of Karabakh, and no one trusts Russia enough to hand it that responsibility,” he said. “Sadly, I fear that the situation will get worse. But the West is not yet paying enough attention to this.”

https://iwpr.net/global-voices/shifting-ground-azerbaijan-armenia

[Mher]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

How about the eu saying you cant deny genocide of jews but it is ok to deny genocide of Armenians? How about time and again USA presidents promising to recognize the genocide while taking our money then repeatedly stabbing us in the back? How about.....o never mind I bet publications like Lragir and spies like Vrej1915 have you so brainwashed that you think Putin slept with your mama.

just because you find an example of something else that is wrong, doesn't make the initial case of wrongdoing any less egregious. Not that morality even matters in politics, but i don't understand why you feel the need to rush to defend mother russia like its your country or bring up shortcomings of others.

[armnuke]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

who is vrej1915 and how is he a spy? hahahaha

[Azad]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

feel the need to rush to defend mother russia like its your country

For now our interest lines with that of Russia till the best alternative option. As you stated "Not that morality even matters in politics".

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

just because you find an example of something else that is wrong, doesn't make the initial case of wrongdoing any less egregious. Not that morality even matters in politics, but i don't understand why you feel the need to rush to defend mother russia like its your country or bring up shortcomings of others.

Because today Armenia cannot take care of herself and Russia is the only power which is capable and interested of keeping her around. This is why if you care for Armenia you must care for Russia. It is something most people (especially the young ones) do not understand. I feel sorry for the young of this day for they are brought up in a world of illusions and propaganda the likes of which Joseph Stalin even could not have dreamed of. If you do not see reality for what it really is then you are bound to harm yourself.
Vrej1915 is not one person. This username is being used by multiple people who are very active in driving a wedge between Armenians and Russia. Much of the event happening around us are preplanned by our enemies. The downing of this Russian bomber, the downing of the Russian passenger jet, the downing of the Malaysian passenger jet, the killing of Armenian family....all of these things are very much connected and are not accidents nor random acts of violence. People like Vrej1915 are here to redirect the blame or these events, to make bad situations worst, to drive us away from the only security guarantee we have.