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Armenian Diaspora

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  • #11
    Re: Armenian Diaspora

    The problem here is that you grossly overestimate the power of the armenian diaspora. Think about this for a minute, for the countless millions that the diaspora has thrown away on genocide recognition in the US alone they havent even been able to make that country even utter the "G word"! Don't you think that money could have been better spent on forming connections between the diaspora and armenia, or helping armenia become stronger or hell for anything that produces actual results? I think the diaspora needs to play a constructive role and help in nationbuilding instead of chasing its own tail.
    Hayastan or Bust.

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    • #12
      Re: Armenian Diaspora

      your Quote: "for the countless millions that the diaspora has thrown away on genocide recognition in the US alone they havent even been able to make that country even utter the "G word"! "
      I AGREE WITH YOU 1 MILLION PERSCENT you can't be more right but although to be fair those millions didn't go all in vain because it is making Turkey in a way to talk to Armenia about opening the border those efforts are kind of a card in Armenia's hand against Turkey but you are perfectly right that those millions didn't atchieve what we set to atchieve which is the recognition itself. But be carefull if I were talking about the diaspora and what they are doing now today I would be overestimating alot as I said we are using a very small portion of our potetntial Im looking for ways to use it more and more. Don't worry I have my big share of critisism on the diaspora that if I start now it won't finish if you want we can dicuss it in the nearest future.
      your quote: "Don't you think that money could have been better spent on forming connections between the diaspora and armenia, or helping armenia become stronger or hell for anything that produces actual results?"
      can you elaborate please what you mean about the forming of conneection between Armenia and diaspora?
      but I want to emphesise on the helping Armenia to become stronger actually this is what Im thinking about my AULTIMATE goal is to make Armenia stronger but lets take a step backwards and look at it. How can we make Armenia stronger or to be presise strong to the extend:
      -Make Armenian state buget 10 billion and plus instead of 2 or 2.5
      -Makes foreign counties to contribute more and more money to Armenian buget
      -let Armenians in Armenia not even think about megrating and making Armenian population in Armenia reach 8 mill independant on Diaspora population
      -Armenia and Artsakh on official and unofficial level not even think about giving back lands to Azeris to have the cash and the manpower to populate Artsakh to have a huge defence buget that shuts Aliev up. and even more demand Shahumian and the 300sqKm that are occupied by Azeries.
      -not to weep on Armenian conditions in Georgia to break the hand of the priest or even the minister or politition that lays hands and claims on Armenian monuments in Georgia DEMAND Georgia to give autonomy to Armnians.
      -To have the upper hand in the ngotiations with Tuerkey to impose preconditions on Turkey and let them say we will talk without preconditions.
      -To have upper hand in the information war instead of directing 2 m ovies about Genocide that didn't have huge impact direct 2 every year and even direct movies documentaries about Artsakh Javakhk.
      AND MANY MANY MANY GOALS that will make Armenia and Armenians fullfil their wildest dreams
      Now lets find a way to fulfill these dreams look at Armenia landlock country surrounded with enemy and hostile neigbors imagine our closest neigbor is IRAN well the Armenian saying goes very well here "kheghtvogh [email protected] churin mech otzin al gpattvi" meaning "a drouning person even hugs the snake to save himslef". Wether we like it or not we aprove or not Armenias only way out is its diaspora NO OTHER CHOICE untill we find a way to reach a sea this is the only way out and today the diaspora tragically is using very little of what it can is diaspora helping Armenia hell yeah but this is not enough AT ALL the diaspora MUST BE MOR ORGENISED much stronger to help Armenia pollitically finentially on return Armenia will help th diaspora in organisation and culturee I whish I dream of th day when Armenia will be strong enough to help the diaspora out but Armenia can't do it now wee must strengthen our diaspora to strengthen Armenia and make it a state we all dream of. We must find new solutions new plans new dirction and depth and doing so I tried to come up with the idea I gave to you.Enough of cherity I HATE THIS WORD hey WAKE UP WE ALL ARE OBLIGED TO HLEP ARMENIA WE DON'T CHOSE TO DO SO
      Im not putting diaspora before Armenia hell no th only thing left to us now is that "pour [email protected] hogh" we must keep it above ANY THING ELSE even recognition of Armenian Genocide

      Comment


      • #13
        Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

        Russia holds the most Armenians outside Russia and Armenia, I assume it has a powerful lobby with many rich Armenians. Also pressure can be applied from Armenian government. Do something....

        This status quo is unacceptable and Azeri constantly braking the cease fire and makes commando raids. Any other country, any country would not stand for this killing our soldiers and downing a helicopter.
        B0zkurt Hunter

        Comment


        • #14
          Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

          Originally posted by Eddo211 View Post
          Russia holds the most Armenians outside Russia and Armenia, I assume it has a powerful lobby with many rich Armenians. Also pressure can be applied from Armenian government. Do something....

          This status quo is unacceptable and Azeri constantly braking the cease fire and makes commando raids. Any other country, any country would not stand for this killing our soldiers and downing a helicopter.
          It doesn't have a powerful lobby.

          Why does it have to be only Russia-Armenians lobbying Kremlin? They do enough as it is.

          More importantly what is our Diaspora in the U.S,France,Australia,U.K,Lebanon - anywhere else with a large Armenian population doing? I don't see any lobbying Kremlin they seem to have just diverted all attention on something else. Most fail to understand no country can solve the ARTSAKH problem but the Russians it's as simple as that.

          If they all lobby Moscow from all those locations - maybe we would be in a different situation right now.

          Can you tell me why the status quo is unacceptable? Even if a final agreement was reached on Artsakh do you think azeri will stop shooting and being pests? Downing the helicopter they are just baiting Armenia and want 'Armenia' to do something to give them the reason to launch an attack and they have failed at this so far.


          Artsakh conflict will be resolved by either

          1. Recognition of Artsakh
          2. Recognition of Artsakh and we give back surrounding areas except ( Kelbajar + Lachin)
          3. Another war and Azerbaijan loses more land and begs for another ceasefire - at this point conflict is finished for good
          4. No war - no recognition and just stats quo for another 20 - 30 years which is still acceptable
          Last edited by Gevz; 06-01-2015, 01:06 AM.
          A good turk is a dead turk

          Comment


          • #15
            Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

            Originally posted by Gevz View Post
            More importantly what is our Diaspora in the U.S,France,Australia,U.K,Lebanon - anywhere else with a large Armenian population doing?
            More idiotic statements from none other than our newest member.

            http://www.panorama.am/en/politics/2...zerbaijan-usa/
            http://armenianweekly.com/2015/03/26...r-artsakh-aid/


            http://armenianweekly.com/2015/02/12/nh-blocks-aliyev/
            http://asbarez.com/blog/archives/131318

            What ANCA has achieved and continues to achieve is nothing short of remarkable and really speaks volumes about how passionate and dedicated we are as Armenians. They don't have the budget Turkey or Azerbaijan does, but nearly every week they defeat them diplomatically by executing strategic campaigns which involve sophisticated yet simplistic grassroots door to door objectives. They travel state to state to make sure anything and everything that comes up is defeated and not given the day of light. But i'm sure there are many others just like you who can't comprehend even 1% of what they deal with daily but are quick to criticize their efforts. Once again you have proven your loyalty to the baboons, go on continue your hate speech.
            Last edited by Shant03; 06-01-2015, 11:11 AM.

            Comment


            • #16
              Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

              Originally posted by Shant03 View Post
              More idiotic statements from none other than our newest member.

              http://www.panorama.am/en/politics/2...zerbaijan-usa/
              http://armenianweekly.com/2015/03/26...r-artsakh-aid/


              http://armenianweekly.com/2015/02/12/nh-blocks-aliyev/
              http://asbarez.com/blog/archives/131318

              What ANCA has achieved and continues to achieve is nothing short of remarkable and really speaks volumes about how passionate and dedicated we are as Armenians. They don't have the budget Turkey or Azerbaijan does, but nearly every week they defeat them diplomatically by executing strategic campaigns which involve sophisticated yet simplistic grassroots door to door objectives. They travel state to state to make sure anything and everything that comes up is defeated and not given the day of light. But i'm sure there are many others just like you who can't comprehend even 1% of what they deal with daily but are quick to criticize their efforts. Once again you have proven your loyalty to the baboons, go on continue your hate speech.
              I feel the same pain of mental torture reading his BS.
              He is confusing lobbying with demonstrations.

              .
              Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
              Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
              Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

              Comment


              • #17
                Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

                Originally posted by Shant03 View Post
                More idiotic statements from none other than our newest member.

                http://www.panorama.am/en/politics/2...zerbaijan-usa/
                http://armenianweekly.com/2015/03/26...r-artsakh-aid/


                http://armenianweekly.com/2015/02/12/nh-blocks-aliyev/
                http://asbarez.com/blog/archives/131318

                What ANCA has achieved and continues to achieve is nothing short of remarkable and really speaks volumes about how passionate and dedicated we are as Armenians. They don't have the budget Turkey or Azerbaijan does, but nearly every week they defeat them diplomatically by executing strategic campaigns which involve sophisticated yet simplistic grassroots door to door objectives. They travel state to state to make sure anything and everything that comes up is defeated and not given the day of light. But i'm sure there are many others just like you who can't comprehend even 1% of what they deal with daily but are quick to criticize their efforts. Once again you have proven your loyalty to the baboons, go on continue your hate speech.

                Originally posted by londontsi View Post
                I feel the same pain of mental torture reading his BS.
                He is confusing lobbying with demonstrations.

                .
                The volume of work they do compared to their budget is nothing short of impossible. They operate on a few hundred thousand dollars a year, yet somehow they are the most powerful ethnic lobby in Washington after AIPAC. Even more impressive is the forces they have working against them. Beyond the small budget, the more impressive part is the groups they have working against them: The multibillion dollar lobbying arms of Turkey, Azerbaijan, the oil companies, and up until recently AIPAC/ADL.

                The ability of a small lobby facing such large group to persuade a US government to take a neutral stance on the Karabakh , not to mention aid and investment projects in Armenia, when it has every reason not to is hard to believe if you really think about it.

                Instead of expecting Armenians in countries like France, US, and Argentina to lobby a foreign nation, in addition to the massive amount they do in their countries, the Russian fanboy section should ask themselves why the millions of Russian Armenians are not able to organize to do a fraction as much, when Russia supposedly already has a natural interest in the well being of Armenia. Why the supposed powerful so called Armenians of Russia in important positions like the foreign minister or head of the fantasy "news" RT are so busy supporting mother Russia to do even once percent of what their despised counterparts in the west like the Hovnanian family, or Simonian family, Serj Tankian, Krik Krikorian, Eduardo Eurnekian, or Charles Aznavour have done for Armenia in recent years.

                Of course expecting a child posing as an internet warrior who suddenly feels like an expert after reading a few propaganda sites to use the most basic form of logic would be too much to ask.
                Last edited by Mher; 06-01-2015, 03:13 PM.
                <<եթե զենք էլ չլինի' ես քարերով կկրվեմ>>

                Comment


                • #18
                  Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia &amp; Azerbaijan

                  Originally posted by Shant03 View Post
                  More idiotic statements from none other than our newest member.
                  Originally posted by londontsi View Post
                  I feel the same pain of mental torture reading his BS.
                  He is confusing lobbying with demonstrations.
                  He may not be as idiotic as he sounds first glance.

                  I follow the Armenian news regularly.
                  Of all the utterances of azadamardigs I have never heard anybody suggest we return lands.

                  Yet he says his family members have fought in the war, indeed a member of his family fell on the battlefield yet he has managed sneakily squeeze that returning of lands was part of the solution on more than one occasion.

                  He of course opposes also fighting corruption etc etc.

                  I wonder who is behind that fašade.

                  Originally posted by Gevz View Post
                  I lost a family member in the Artsakh war during liberation of shushi (janasan direction). Both my dad and uncle have fought in the war from the start of the war before it even went full blown in 1989.

                  Illham monkey aliyev knows very well what can happen if he re-starts it what most moron azeris fail to understand is - attacking artsakh and actually successfully liberating it is not a walk in the park and a miscalculation by the baboon can be the end of them for good no more country for them.
                  Originally posted by Gevz View Post
                  From my understanding - the chances of a new war in Artsakh are about 1% IMO.

                  The end result for Artsakh?

                  Armenian Army will be told to leave all areas surrounding Artsakh.
                  Armenia will keep kelbajar/lachin.
                  Artsakh will be given independence or join Armenia as another marz.

                  Do I agree with the above? yes its a good deal for peace. Of course it has to happen in stages - First Recognition of Artsakh.


                  Originally posted by Gevz View Post
                  It doesn't have a powerful lobby.

                  Why does it have to be only Russia-Armenians lobbying Kremlin? They do enough as it is.

                  More importantly what is our Diaspora in the U.S,France,Australia,U.K,Lebanon - anywhere else with a large Armenian population doing? I don't see any lobbying Kremlin they seem to have just diverted all attention on something else. Most fail to understand no country can solve the ARTSAKH problem but the Russians it's as simple as that.

                  If they all lobby Moscow from all those locations - maybe we would be in a different situation right now.

                  Can you tell me why the status quo is unacceptable? Even if a final agreement was reached on Artsakh do you think azeri will stop shooting and being pests? Downing the helicopter they are just baiting Armenia and want 'Armenia' to do something to give them the reason to launch an attack and they have failed at this so far.


                  Artsakh conflict will be resolved by either

                  1. Recognition of Artsakh
                  2. Recognition of Artsakh and we give back surrounding areas except ( Kelbajar + Lachin)
                  3. Another war and Azerbaijan loses more land and begs for another ceasefire - at this point conflict is finished for good
                  4. No war - no recognition and just stats quo for another 20 - 30 years which is still acceptable
                  Last edited by londontsi; 06-01-2015, 01:24 PM.
                  Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
                  Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
                  Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

                  Comment


                  • #19
                    Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia &amp; Azerbaijan

                    Diasporans are indeed generally delusional about their powers. Truth be told most of them won't bother setting foot in Armenia until something like the centennial occurs. Yes here in the USA we face some huge odds and that is why all that money and effort should be used in Armenia instead of waisting it away on lying politicians. Use your resources to build a nation instead of chasing rainbows.
                    Hayastan or Bust.

                    Comment


                    • #20
                      Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia &amp; Azerbaijan

                      Originally posted by londontsi View Post
                      He may not be as idiotic as he sounds first glance.

                      I follow the Armenian news regularly.
                      Of all the utterances of azadamardigs I have never heard anybody suggest we return lands.

                      Yet he says his family members have fought in the war, indeed a member of his family fell on the battlefield yet he has managed sneakily squeeze that returning of lands was part of the solution on more than one occasion.

                      He of course opposes also fighting corruption etc etc.

                      I wonder who is behind that fašade.
                      i wasn't able to handle the mental torture and didn't read most of this garbage to actually see those, good eye for detail. For a few years now there has been an almost identical propaganda campaign on various forums and sites, specially Youtube videos, by Turkic sources posing as hayastancis attempting to create a hayastanci v. spyurk divide. What we may have is a more evolved version of mr helloworld
                      <<եթե զենք էլ չլինի' ես քարերով կկրվեմ>>

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