Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

[Haykakan]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

well not all liberals are globalists and not everything about globalism is bad either. You are making too many unsubstantiated generalizations.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

well not all liberals are globalists and not everything about globalism is bad either. You are making too many unsubstantiated generalizations.

That's a B.S. statement

"The 20th century started perilously for liberalism. The First World War proved a major challenge for liberal democracies, although they ultimately defeated the dictatorial states of the Central Powers. The war precipitated the collapse of older forms of government, including empires and dynastic states. The number of republics in Europe reached 13 by the end of the war, as compared with only three at the start of the war in 1914"

So much for Liberals for peace eh? Yeah, Armenians got screwed in that deal.


"In a natural state of affairs, liberals argued, humans were driven by the instincts of survival and self-preservation, and the only way to escape from such a dangerous existence was to form a common and supreme power capable of arbitrating between competing human desires. This power could be formed in the framework of a civil society that allows individuals to make a voluntary social contract with the sovereign authority, transferring their natural rights to that authority in return for the protection of life, liberty, and property."

That's right, they own our natural rights to survival and self-preservation. But hey, they won't kill us or steal stuff from us as long as we give up our rights and instincts to survive.

[SevSpitak]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

No, I call liberal ideas liberal garbage. Socialism is about giving everyone a fair chance at life, not giving them a free ride.

That's fine, I'm not knocking what little any of us inside or outside the country can do, but the most important thing any of us can do is never forget who we are and being proud of our heritage. Liberalism doesn't recognize culture, it aims to remove identity from the person. Why would globalists want to recognize the Armenian Genocide when their goal is to eliminate culture and identity? They wouldn't, they wish to erase it from the history books so future generations won't know who is in control of their corrupt institutions.

I second this.

I'm not too fond of liberals, but the source of evil in all this is capitalism. This is the perfect illustration of what capitalism is. They call this image propaganda but it's the truth and we all know it.



Capitalism has all the flaws (and more) of communism (or socialism), except its negative effects are injected while we're asleep. And liberalism? Well, all I can say is, it sprouts idiots like this:



Sorry if that's rude. It's my point of view, and if it's too impolite, I'll remove it.

[Haykakan]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Sev your outlook on capitolism is very much like my own. As for liberalism the very notion that everyone should have a fair shot at life is itself a liberal idea which brought down monarchy. I am not a liberal nor a conservative but i value the good that comes from both sides and point out the bad things to.

[SevSpitak]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Sev your outlook on capitolism is very much like my own. As for liberalism the very notion that everyone should have a fair shot at life is itself a liberal idea which brought down monarchy. I am not a liberal nor a conservative but i value the good that comes from both sides and point out the bad things to.

Yeah, I like to take the good from everything, too, and not associate myself with an ideology put together by some guy somewhere on the planet (I have a brain of my own so I can think on my own), but I have to admit, I tend to lean on the conservative side more, if I were to choose between Liberal and Conservative.

I like my culture, and I hate it when people judge me for being a nationalist. If there were no Armenian nationalists, we wouldn't have a country right now. 'Culture is invented by man and is unimportant' is not in my book. If we're going to say that, then why not "family is also a concept created by man. Who cares if she's your sister, look at rabbits, they don't care!" (in the end, this is where liberalism leads imo). But no matter how we put it, conservative, liberalism, communism, socialism, etc. are all doomed to fail if the people running it aren't honest, left-sided people. All systems are put together because a certain somebody thought "this is the most righteous system," including liberalism. There's good in it all, but like I said, it takes the right people to rule, and I don't think a human can do that. That's why Christians wait for Jesus.

[Haykakan]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Well i love hearing this "(I have a brain of my own so I can think on my own), ". I also love hearing that you place great importance on culture as do i. The part we differ is when it comes to religion i think. Armenian culture long precedes chritianity, as a matter of fact our glory days were long before its invention. I think people are quick to credit religion for things it does not deserve credit for and they also tend to downplay its negative effects on society. Having the right rulers is more important then the system they rule in (that is my opinion) and there are plenty of examples where good rulers have done a excellent job so i would have to disagree and say that atleast some people can indeed do this.

[SevSpitak]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

As for liberalism the very notion that everyone should have a fair shot at life is itself a liberal idea which brought down monarchy.

Well, I think that that is the goal of all systems: give a fair shot at life to all. It's a liberal ideology, maybe, but I don't think a heavy conservative would disagree with that. I think it's more common sense than liberal. The only modern system, imo, that doesn't agree with that common sense is capitalism. Capitalism says, "the one who can sacrifice an entire life to gain 5 minutes of pleasure, will have 5 minutes of pleasure."

[SevSpitak]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Well i love hearing this "(I have a brain of my own so I can think on my own), ". I also love hearing that you place great importance on culture as do i. The part we differ is when it comes to religion i think. Armenian culture long precedes chritianity, as a matter of fact our glory days were long before its invention. I think people are quick to credit religion for things it does not deserve credit for and they also tend to downplay its negative effects on society. Having the right rulers is more important then the system they rule in (that is my opinion) and there are plenty of examples where good rulers have done a excellent job so i would have to disagree and say that atleast some people can indeed do this.

Well, we might have different opinions on religion, but we might have a different definition of religion as well. I think empires used religion as an excuse for war much like countries use oil as an excuse today. I think blaming the Bible or the Koran, or whatever, for all the past wars is as intelligent as blaming oil for current wars, when in reality, the true thing to blame are the people, not the objects. There is not a single passage in the Bible that tells to kill infidels. It actually says the opposite on numerous occasions. If you actually read the Bible objectively without taking a decision in advance, especially Jesus' parts, you'll see that it's nothing more than a moral book to teach people how to respect others. Whether you believe it or not is entirely up to you, and I find is irrelevant to this subject. An atheist can read the Bible and appreciate its moral principles.

Also, I can't argue much against the fact that there might have been good rulers in the past, but it is of no importance to me right now because it wasn't a stable rule. If there was ONE system that offered true peace until the end of humanity, then that's what I'd call 'a good rule.' That's why I'm saying that so far, the only person (fictional or real, it's up to you) who can bring such a ruling system is Jesus (or someone who has the same personality as Jesus, and who can pass on that personality to the next ruler).

[SevSpitak]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Isn't this thread about the recognition of the Armenian genocide by USA? XD

Here's my opinion:
I don't care if the United States recognizes the genocide formally or not this year (though I'd be overjoyed if it was ). I believe they already have recognized it. Didn't you notice that not a single person refused to call it a genocide? All of them said it was a genocide, but that now is not the time. That's enough for me. They acknowledge my family's tragic past. The rest is all politics, and sooner or later, it will be recognized, and we can now firmly say that Turkey is the one imposing politics on history.

[Haykakan]

Re: Recognition of Armenian Genocide by USA

Well, I think that that is the goal of all systems: give a fair shot at life to all. It's a liberal ideology, maybe, but I don't think a heavy conservative would disagree with that. I think it's more common sense than liberal. The only modern system, imo, that doesn't agree with that common sense is capitalism. Capitalism says, "the one who can sacrifice an entire life to gain 5 minutes of pleasure, will have 5 minutes of pleasure."

The thing is that sure today the conservatives agree but they did not agree of their free will. They were forced to agree because not doing so would destroy them. Conservatives are or were against desegragation, the right for people to vote, separation of church and state, the right of women to vote, civil rights,.... i think you get my point. I think we need to look at things in a historical perspective to get a better idea of what they really stand for. Things like personal and financial responcibility are examples of conservatism i do like so as you said earlier there is good and bad in everything. The problem i have with capitolism is that it values capitol more then humanity. Such a system cannot provide humanity the things it needs to grow and thrive. Humanity cannot be measured in terms of money, doing this cheapens us and life itself and that is exactly whats happening today. Btw i think we drifted off topic here a bit.