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Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

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  • Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

    PLEASE READ IN ADVANCE TO TRY TO KEEP THIS THREAD CLEAN & ON-TOPIC:

    Guidelines


    1. The purpose of this thread is to concisely list data/information on Pan-Turanism & Pan-Turkism ("P-T"). Armenians that are not aware of the dangers, whether they are journalists, scholars, politicians, or common folk, can then be given the link to quickly learn about existing facts, data, and scholarship.

    2. The fewer discussions about the posts - the better.* Simply try to list facts & evidence relating to P-T. If you have questions about a post, take it up with the person posting in a private e-mail. The fewer discussions about the evidence presented here, the easier it will be to maintain the thread as a readable database so everyone can get a comprehensive understanding of P-T. (You can always discuss the information here in another thread.)

    3. Turkey & Azerbaijan are the main nerve-centers of P-T - though others exist outside of their boundaries. Why is this database being made? P-T poses a real and existential threat to the survival of Armenia and Armenians.

    4. Invite all people affected by PT to share their information on this particular thread: Georgians, Russians, Iranians, Chinese, etc. The more know about the danger of PT and provide evidence and facts of PT's dangers, the safer people are from it.

    * There is a thread for discussing Pan-Turkism - as opposed to documenting it here: http://forum.hyeclub.com/showthread....-(Pan-Turkism)
    Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 03:02 PM.
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  • #2
    Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

    General Definition: Pan-Turkism.

    Pan-Turkism ("P-T") is a political movement started more than 100 years ago aiming to unite the various 'Turkic peoples' into a modern political super-state. "Turkic" is more commonly a linguistic term, not an ethnic or "racial" one, though the proponents of P-T try to blur that distinction for political gain and have devised many dubious and inconsistent narratives regarding their ethnic origins (and the origins of other groups). P-T often relies on the use of propaganda and states as its goal: 'The aim of all Turks is to unite with the Turkic borders.' P-T is a form of Turkish imperial ambition. The "Young Turks" who carried pan-Turkist ideologies as their guiding principle and are accused of the Armenian Genocide, Greek genocide and Assyrian Genocide. [fn 1.] [fn 2.] (The Young Turks are also accused of being members of other ethno-religious groups.) P-T still exists today, with cells in Turkey, Azerbaijan, Europe, the USA, and Iran. P-T often destroys or assumes dominion over the culture, language, and historical record of outside ethnic and linguistic groups it attempts to dominate. Russia, China, Armenia and Iran, generally perceive Panturkism as a new form of Turkish imperial ambition and pretext for ethnic cleansing, and a tool for creating instability in regions where it is introduced. Turkey has become a major business partner to many Central Asian Turkic states, and has attempted to spread the P-T ideology there. Similarly, Azerbaijan, the USA, and Israel have attempted to promote P-T on Iran's Northern border with Armenia.
    _________________

    Useful Links:

    Online study showing Pan-Turkist groups have been exaggerating the number of Turkic speakers and giving false statistics.
    http://azargoshnasp.net/Pasokhbehani...nipulation.htm

    Questioning PT online claims (promoting Pan-Turkism under the guise of “human rights”):
    http://www.kavehfarrokh.com/articles...n-turk-claims/

    C I A 'world factbook' deliberately omits ethnic composition of people in Azerbaijan.
    https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...k/geos/aj.html

    PT in Iran Main Index:
    http://www.kavehfarrokh.com/articles/pan-turanism/

    PT in Iran (Sports Stadiums Used to Promote PT):
    http://www.kavehfarrokh.com/news/ant...b-gulf”/

    Pan Turanianism Takes Aim at Azerbaijan (2 accounts - both useful):
    http://www.rozanehmagazine.com/NoveD...zariINDEX.HTML
    http://iranpoliticsclub.net/library/...ism1/index.htm


    _________________
    Footnotes:

    [fn 1.] See Jacob M. Landau. Pan-Turkism: From Irredentism to Cooperation. India University Press, 1995. 2nd Edition. p. 45: "Pan-Turkism's historic chance arrived shortly before and during First World War, when it was adopted a guiding principle of state policy by an influental group among the Young Turks"

    [fn 2.] See Robert F. Melson, "The Armenian Genocide" in Kevin Reilly (Editor), Stephen Kaufman (Editor), Angela Bodino (Editor) "Racism: A Global Reader (Sources and Studies in World History)", M.E. Sharpe (January 2003). pg 278: "Concluding that their liberal experiment had been a failure, CUP leaders turned to Pan-Turkism, a xenophobic and chauvinistic brand of nationalism that sought to create a new empire based on Islam and Turkish ethnicity." ..."It was in this context of revolutionary and ideological transformation and war that the fateful decision to destroy the Armenians was taken.


    (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
    Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 04:40 PM.
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    • #3
      Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

      Activist from the Republic of Azerbaijani claims "Armenians are Christian-Turks"



      Kurds = "Mountain Turks"

      Compare: In an attempt to deny their existence, the Turkish government categorized Kurds as "Mountain Turks" until 1991. ("During the 1930s and 1940s, the government had disguised the presence of the Kurds statistically by categorizing them as 'Mountain Turks.' " ... "[T]he Republic of Turkey, the government has sought to diminish the significance of ethnic, linguistic, and religious distinctions.") http://countrystudies.us/turkey/26.htm

      (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
      Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 04:21 PM.
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      • #4
        Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

        Pan-Turkists Often Attempt to Misappropriate Persian Poetry By Pretending the Authors Were Turkish.

        Common P-T Argument:

        The reason that many Turkish poets composed their poems in Persian comes from the fact that Turkish language has difficulties with the Arabic script and poetry."Aruz Meter" (وزن العروض) is unsuited for the particular structure of Turkish language.

        Answer:

        For thousands of years, the common and most widely used language of Iranians has been Persian (not Turkic) and that is why poetry and other works were written in Persian. Persian writers wrote in Persian, it's as simple as that. Turkic people largely lived as nomads - not sedentary scholars. And Persians predate any Turkic influence in Iran by thousands of years. To be credible, evidence of original Turkish poetry and writing must come from the original Turkish lands (the Altai Mountains) - not from the places it is claimed they subsequently migrated to. And the evidentiary burden would be on the individuals that attempt to historically revise the ethnicity of writers to show solid and credible evidence.

        Notes:

        See Politicization of the background of Nizami Ganjavi: Attempted de-Iranization of a historical Iranian figure by the USSR (a lengthy study of Panturkic lies about Iranian poets). http://azargoshnasp.net/Pasokhbehani...ticization.htm

        (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
        Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 03:28 PM.
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        • #5
          Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

          Grey Wolf Hand (PT symbol) and Activists With Maps Showing Destruction of Armenia: The white line on the Azerbaijan flag signifies *reuniting* the province of Iranian-Azerbaijan with the fictitiously named *country* called "The Republic of Azerbaijan" so that Armenia is surrounded on 3 of its borders by Pan-Tukists - Iran was the only country that did not blockade Armenia during the NK war and Iran refused The Republic of Azerbaijan a corridor for attacking Armenia.



          The Agenda of Pan-Turkism is Clear: To Distort Reality & to Effectuate the Takeover of Land. (Note: The Caspian Sea is called the "Khazar" Sea.)


          (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
          Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 03:28 PM.
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          • #6
            Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

            What is the difference between a Turkic-Azeri and an Iranian-Azari? How did they become "Turkic"?

            Armenians need to know about Ahmad Kasravi.

            Ahmad Kasravi (29 September 1890 - March 11, 1946) (Persian: احمد کسروی), was the most notable Iranian-Azari linguist and historian. Kasravi is known for his solid and award-winning research on the ancient Azari language and origin of the Azerbaijani people. He showed that the ancient Azari language was an offshoot of the Pahlavi (Persian) language. Kasravi warned that that Pan-Turkism was attempting to overtake the Iranian-Azari people and to instill a false sense of Turkic identity. Citizens from the Republic of Azerbaijan and Iranian-Azaris are not necessarily the same thing. It is critical for Armenians to understand this (other posts will explain the social engineering that took place to "Turkify" the "Republic of Azerbaijan" which is now being attempted on Iran's Northern border in the province of Iranian-Azerbaijan. Quickly read about Kasravi below:

            http://ahmadkasravi-iranhistory.blogspot.com/




            Other prominent scholars are in agreement, but the Pan-Turkists want to recraft a pure Turkic identity, simply from Iranian peasants learning Turkic language. In the Republic of Azerbaijan - they have redoubled this Turkification through other means (the excerpt below is only about Iranian-Azaris):

            According to the scholar of historical geography, Xavier de Planhol: “Azeri material culture, a result of this multi-secular symbiosis, is thus a subtle combination of indigenous elements and nomadic contributions…. It is a Turkish language learned and spoken by Iranian peasants.” [See De Planhol, X. (2005) “Lands of Iran” in Encyclopaedia Iranica.]

            According to Dr. Richard Frye: "The Turkish speakers of Azerbaijan (q.v.) are mainly descended from the earlier Iranian speakers, several pockets of whom still exist in the region." [See Harvard Univ. Prof., R. N. Frye: Encyclopaedia Iranica, May 2, 2006.]

            According to Olivier Roy: "The mass of the Oghuz Turkic tribes who crossed the Amu Darya towards the west left the Iranian plateau, which remained Persian, and established themselves more to the west, in Anatolia. Here they divided into Ottomans, who were Sunni and settled, and Turkmens, who were nomads and in part Shiite (or, rather, Alevi). The latter were to keep the name “Turkmen” for a long time: from the 13th century onwards they “Turkised” the Iranian populations of Azerbaijan (who spoke west Iranian languages such as Tat, which is still found in residual forms), thus creating a new identity based on Shiism and the use of Turkish. These are the people today known as Azeris." [See Olivier Roy, “The new Central Asia”, I.B. Tauris, 2007 p. 7.]
            (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
            Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 09:13 PM.
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            • #7
              Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

              Hungarians Complain of Pan-Turanism


              (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
              Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 03:29 PM.
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              • #8
                Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

                Turkey's connection with Turkic groups in China:

                Saturday, 11 July 2009

                Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan who reacted to Israel at Davos in an unconventional manner, declared incidents in Xinjiang-Uighur region of China "was almost genocide".

                Yesterday Turkish Ministry of Foreign Affairs released a statement that, "Turkey has no intention to intervene China's internal affairs" and added that, "correlative efforts will continue to take forward developing relations between China and Turkey."

                Ministry of Foreign Affairs also added that Uighurs form a "strong bridge of friendship" between Turkey and China.

                But after that statement Erdogan told journalists at the G8 summit in L'Aquila, Italy "I used the word of wildness in my statement in Turkey and I am standing for this word because there is no any word to describe the killing and wounding of hundreds of people, it was almost genocide."
                He added that "we have difficulty in understanding how China's leadership can remain a spectator in the face of these events."

                Turkey Minister of Industry Nihat Ergun also reacted to the developments in Xinjiang-Uighur region of China by saying, "Organizing protests is not enough for reaction, we should react goods of that country too. We should take into consideration humanitarian values of that country."

                After these recent events, a contrast and contradiction occurred among statements of Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Erdogan and Ministry of Industry.
                All these events occurred at a time of which Turkey is trying to strengthen its relations with china.

                President Abdullah Gul visited China in June, accompanied by 120 businessmen to strengthen trade links. The total trade volume between Turkey and China reached more than $ 17 billion.

                By Burhan Dogus Ayparlar (JTW)

                http://www.turkishweekly.net/news/83...ocide-39-.html
                Մեկ Ազգ, Մեկ Մշակույթ
                ---
                "Western Assimilation is the greatest threat to the Armenian nation since the Armenian Genocide."

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                • #9
                  Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

                  WEBSITES & ORGANIZATIONS PUSHING THE PAN-TURKIST AGENDA ("Reply with Quote" & Add to this Info.)

                  The Pan Turkists have political organizations spread throughout the world trying to push their agenda - see links below & remove asterisk "*" when putting it into your browser (done on purpose to prevent direct link):

                  http://w*ww.politikcity.de/forum/s%F...baidschan.html
                  http://w*ww.turkiran.com/english.htm
                  http://w*ww.youtube.com/user/ADAPPIran
                  http://w*ww.southaz.blogspot.com/

                  (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
                  Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 05:55 PM.
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                  • #10
                    Re: Pan-Turanism / Pan-Turkism Database

                    IMPORTANCE OF PERSIAN HISTORY TO ARMENIAN RIGHTS

                    Much of Armenia's Land Claims & Concrete Evidence of its Claims Are Supported by Thousands of Years of Ties To Ancient Persian Empires - Up Until 200 Years Ago Armenia Was a Kingdom within the Larger Persian Empire and a Protected People. After Armenia Was Removed From the Persian Sphere of Influence, the Armenian Genocide and Loss of Most of Armenian Land Occurred: Territorial Disputes between Armenia and Azerbaijan/Turkey Now Are a Result of Ongoing Turkification and Alteration of Not Only Armenian History But Also Persian History.


                    (If you want to add to this post, just click "Reply with Quote" & keep adding without discussing; see Post #1 for guidelines and reasons. Feel welcome to copy this notice to keep subsequent additions on-point.)
                    Last edited by Persopolis; 03-29-2011, 05:53 PM.
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