Politics in Hayastan

[lampron]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Not forgetting that Turkey has highly developed and competitively priced agricultural products. Turkish businessmen have been exporting to many countries around the world, starting from Europe and have the potential to undercut prices from countries like Greece and Bulgaria and of course harm the Armenian exports too

[Hakob]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Not forgetting that Turkey has highly developed and competitively priced agricultural products. Turkish businessmen have been exporting to many countries around the world, starting from Europe and have the potential to undercut prices from countries like Greece and Bulgaria and of course harm the Armenian exports too

I have to remind you that turkey has maintained a full economic blockade and sanctions (just like western sanctions, which are partial, against Russia) against Armenia since 24-25 years, so it's pointless to compare turkish economic dealings with others to our issue.
When a country exports something to other country, it is done with mutual trade quotas and applicable taxes and balances.
But this case is a thievery and backstabbing our farmers and whole nation by a small group of you know who. This is like some traitor opening the gate of your castle to enemy. Like importing and spreading poison from enemy in your family, killing or getting your farmers to emigrate out to Russia.
I can go on and on of howdamaging this is.
And the tomatoes are not the only items. There is a long line of consumer goods and food products illegally imported without paying taxes.
We can go and compare any field in economy, healthcare, education, social wellbeing of 1970's Armenia and today and you will see that only fraction is left today, 40 years later.
Not that the communist system was worth a sh I t. But because the corruption has been going on on a scale unimaginable by people of the highest levels in country.
The blockade of Armenia seems only effective in justifying miserable economic conditions, but never been a roadblock for some on getting rich.
In the Spirit of justice and our struggle, some figures in Armenia deserve to be lined up against a wall and shot. Not elected in parliament over and over.

[lampron]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I have to remind you that turkey has maintained a full economic blockade and sanctions (just like western sanctions, which are partial, against Russia) against Armenia since 24-25 years, so it's pointless to compare turkish economic dealings with others to our issue.
.

Turkey has made huge investments in its agricultural sector
If there was no blockade, no sanctions, free trade could still kill Armenian agriculture because of much lower prices from Turkey
You are saying because of the blockade, goods are being smuggled in with no import duty, hitting Armenian growers

[Azad]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I have to remind you that turkey has maintained a full economic blockade and sanctions (just like western sanctions, which are partial, against Russia) against Armenia since 24-25 years, so it's pointless to compare turkish economic dealings with others to our issue.
When a country exports something to other country, it is done with mutual trade quotas and applicable taxes and balances.
But this case is a thievery and backstabbing our farmers and whole nation by a small group of you know who. This is like some traitor opening the gate of your castle to enemy. Like importing and spreading poison from enemy in your family, killing or getting your farmers to emigrate out to Russia.

Isn't it contradictory your perspective? With close borders and some illegal or unwanted tomatoes that is "killing farmers".
What will happen if the borders are open? What do we have to export to turkey for "mutual trade quotas"?
I believe our best markets are CIS for export. We should be looking East. The West is over-rated looking for slaves to sustain their lifestyle.
Also, sanctions could have a positive reverse effect. A good example is Russia and Wheat. From being wheat importers Russia today is the world largest wheat exporter due to sanctions.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/russia-is-now-top-wheat-exporter-proving-sanctions-wont-work-2016-09-23

[Hakob]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Isn't it contradictory your perspective? With close borders and some illegal or unwanted tomatoes that is "killing farmers".
What will happen if the borders are open? What do we have to export to turkey for "mutual trade quotas"?
I believe our best markets are CIS for export. We should be looking East. The West is over-rated looking for slaves to sustain their lifestyle.
Also, sanctions could have a positive reverse effect. A good example is Russia and Wheat. From being wheat importers Russia today is the world largest wheat exporter due to sanctions.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/rus...ork-2016-09-23

Azad, I am not arguing against blockade. My point is that because of Turkish blockade our farmers should have been doing much better. But they are miserable because some corrupt oligarkhs are circumventing the blockade and bringing in illegal products.
Those are much worse then legal importing because taxes and laws are skipped. So those products actually sell cheaper and do more harm than an open borders.
If imported legally (does not matter from what country) government laws apply. Collected import taxes can be used to help develop your own industry and compete.
When legal, the surplus imports or negative balance can be addressed in society/government and measures taken.
But like this? Armenia has 6+++ bln deficits in last 10-15 years and rising fast. Government has no accountability to where that money went. I guarantee military cost could not be more than a fraction of that. This debt is there while at the background every major asset in country having been sold by government and also around a billion dollars a year remittances by relatives working abroad.
That is why I say it has been an insane amount of corruption permitted in Armenia.
Very large sector in economy in in shadows.
Government is in shadows.

[Azad]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Agree with you on the overall perspective Hakob. The rest, I wouldn't comment on what I am not familiar with the details and ways of corruption.

[Azad]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

Very good audio interview and documentary on corruption and the people that exposed the Panama papers.
They mention many times azerbaijan in the interview. Should listen the audio story.

https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-04-21/disrupting-kleptocrats-playbook-one-investigative-report-time

[Azad]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

^^^ You should at least listen @ 21:50 .. It is about azerbaijan ^^^

[DieHard69]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I had a quick glance and find this party talking about human values and European values and membership.
Nothing about our national values or nation building.
If someone says this government is bad because compare to European values... For me is a meaningless, populist and externally driven ideology, never potent enough to turn the stones to build our country.


I need a party that will say "this is what future Armenia will be for all ARMENIANS and this is what needs to be done". Clear and loud.
European values are maybe the best around, but they don't cut in our neighborhood.
There can be only one value and goal for any nation. Not like a quilt that everybody sews a piece of patch on it, specially copying anything that looks good.

I agree with you, but my biggest interest in them, yes they want a European model, but if we can get some of these guys in some higher tier positions they can really help out our corruption problem.

[Hakob]

Re: Politics in Hayastan

I agree with you, but my biggest interest in them, yes they want a European model, but if we can get some of these guys in some higher tier positions they can really help out our corruption problem.

100%.
Just have to keep them not to loose focus and not to start damaging ideological imports.