Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

[Armenian]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Dimmed Hopes - Turkish bid exposes EU rifts

Divisions are becoming ever more apparent as the European Union nears the moment of truth in relations with its biggest and poorest applicant country, which also happens to be Muslim. For EU leaders meeting in Brussels on December 14-15, the question will be how to punish Turkey if it fails to open its ports and airports to traffic from Cyprus. Turkey's promise to do so allowed it to open EU membership talks a year ago. This week, several European commissioners pushed for the consequences to be spelled out in the Commission's progress report on Turkey.

According to officials, they were Markos Kyprianou of Cyprus, Stavros Dimas of Greece and Jacques Barrot of France. Others - like Viviane Reding of Luxembourg, Louis Michel of Belgium and Jan Figel of Slovakia - raised serious concerns about the cost of integrating Turkey and the human rights situation. Turkey's strongest advocates were Peter Mandelson of the UK and Charlie McCreevy of Ireland. Germany's Guenter Verheugen even argued that Turkey should be treated as a special case. That is hardly the official German line, but as a former enlargement commissioner, Mr Verheugen was bitterly disappointed when the Greek Cypriots rejected a UN plan that would have led to the reunification of the island in 2004, just days before Cyprus was welcomed into the EU.

Tough talking

In the end, the president of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso, decided to give diplomacy one more chance, delaying a formal recommendation by five weeks. Why should we act suddenly, like an elephant in a china shop, asked Olli Rehn, the current enlargement commissioner. Instead, Mr Rehn, who is from Finland, asked everyone to back Finnish diplomatic efforts to achieve a breakthrough. Finland holds the rotating EU presidency until the end of the year, but Finnish Foreign Minister Erkki Tuomioja also has a personal stake in the long-running Cyprus dispute. His father Sakari was the UN envoy to the island when fighting between the Greek and Turkish Cypriot communities broke out in 1963.

More than 40 years later, Mr Tuomioja junior puts the chances of a deal at 50/50. But, with key elections next year, the Turkish government has given no indication it will budge on the sensitive issue of Cyprus. Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan acknowledged there could be a "period of stagnation" in ties with the EU, but ruled out the possibility of accession talks collapsing. "It's five minutes to midnight and Turkey is pursuing a risky strategy," says Camiel Eurlings, a Dutch conservative member of the European Parliament who monitors Turkey's progress.

Cyprus holds key

If Ankara does not make a gesture over Cyprus, even Turkey's friends agree there must be consequences. "Turkey must implement its obligation to all EU member states. If it fails to do so, the EU must act," said Britain's Minister for Europe, Geoff Hoon. To preserve the EU's credibility, Britain would probably back a limited freeze on only three or four policy areas in the membership talks - known as chapters - directly linked to transport and trade. Other countries, like Sweden and Italy, argue EU rules must be respected, but would rather focus the debate away from Cyprus and more on the need for Turkey to speed up political reforms.

At the other end of the spectrum, Cyprus is calling for a freeze of all membership talks. It is a view supported by politicians in France, Austria, Germany and the Netherlands, the countries where most people want to keep Turkey out of the EU. In one of the toughest statements so far, French Foreign Minister Philippe Douste-Blazy said the EU should rethink its timetable for Turkey's entry bid if it refuses to comply by December.

Germans divided

In Germany, which will take over the EU presidency in less than two months, the splits go right through the ruling coalition. The Bavarian premier Edmund Stoiber, leader of the conservative Christian Social Union (CSU), called for a total suspension of talks with Turkey, which he said was not a European country anyway. Chancellor Angela Merkel, who heads the main Christian Democratic Union (CDU) conservative party, dismissed Mr Stoiber's comments, but insisted there could not be "business as usual" if Turkey failed to keep its promise to lift restrictions on Cyprus.

In opposition, Ms Merkel advocated a "privileged partnership" for Turkey, like Mr Stoiber. In power, she remains more critical of Turkey than her foreign minister, the Social Democrat Frank-Walter Steinmeier. "Some in Europe want to bring about a failure of Turkish negotiations through their rhetoric," Mr Steinmeier said, "this only strengthens the view in Turkey that they are not welcome in the EU - we need to fight against this impression."

Dream turning sour

EU leaders will have to reach a unanimous decision on Turkey, like on any other important matter. One compromise solution could involve freezing talks on up to ten chapters. But common ground is hard to find. "My biggest fear," says MEP Camiel Eurlings, "is that there won't be unanimity. The difference between the positions of Cyprus and the UK is so huge that quite a big minority of countries could use the split to effectively cripple negotiations or bring them to a halt."

At first, that may not make much difference. Using its rights as an EU member, Cyprus has already been blocking technical talks for weeks. "What we have is already a suspension," says a diplomat close to the negotiations. "We already have a crisis. The atmosphere has never been so bad in any membership talks." For months, EU Enlargement Commissioner Olli Rehn has been warning Turkey of a "train crash".

But the membership train may already be on a dangerous course. If it goes off the tracks in December, MEP Camiel Eurlings fears relations between Turkey and Europe could suffer unpredictable damage. "Does anybody think how difficult it would be to get the train back on track," Mr Eurlings asks, "with a Europe increasingly worried about enlargement and a Turkey which is becoming increasingly nationalistic?"

Story from BBC NEWS:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/europe/6135406.stm

[aray]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Ghosts of Massacred Armenians Could Haunt Turkey’s Chances To Join European Union
By Sherwood Ross

Turkey’s bid to join the European Union could suffer by its refusal to admit the genocide of its Armenian Christian population nearly a century ago.

When European Union leaders meet in Brussels Dec. 14-15, the debate to admit Turkey likely will hinge on, among other issues, its failure to open its ports and airports to Cyprus, which opposes all talk of membership. The Netherlands, Germany, Austria and France are cool to admitting Turkey and are backing Cyprus.

Lingering in the background, though, will be the ghosts of the Armenian genocide, a crime Turkey has denied at every turn and is still “investigating” to this day.

As recently as March, 2005, Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan called for an “impartial study” into the genocide as if the facts of the slaughter of a milion Armenians were ever in doubt.

When the “Young Turk” nationalists created the Republic of Turkey after World War I, they refused to punish the perpetrators of the 1915 genocide. Mustapha Kemal formed a new government in 1920 that forced the Allies to sign the Treaty of Lausanne, ceding Anatolia, home of the Armenians, to Turkish control. Two years earlier Anatolia had been parceled out to Italy and Greece after the Ottoman Empire’s surrender to the Allies.

As author Elizabeth Kolbert put it in the November 6th The New Yorker, “For the Turks to acknowledge the genocide would thus mean admitting that their country was founded by war criminals and that its existence depended on their crimes.”

“Turkey has long sought to join the European Union, and, while a history of genocide is clearly no barrier to membership, denying it may be; several European governments have indicated that they will oppose the country’s bid unless it acknowledges the crimes committed against the Armenians.”

So opposed is Turkey to discussion of the subject, when the U.S. Congress sought a resolution in 2000 to memorialize the Armenian genocide, Turkey threatened to refuse the U.S. use of its Incirlik airbase and warned it might break off negotiations for the purchase of $4.5-billion worth of Bell Textron attack helicopters.

President Clinton informed House Speaker /Dennis Hastert passage of the resolution could “risk the lives” of Americans and that put an end to the bill. Like his predecessor, President George Bush has bowed down to Ankara’s wishes and issues Armenian Remembrance Day proclamations “without ever quite acknowledging what it is that’s being remembered,” The New Yorker points out.

The cover up denies Turkey’s historic victimization of some 2-million Christian residents treated as second-class citizens by special taxation, harassment, and extortion. After Sultan Abdulhamid II came to power in 1876, he closed Armenian schools, tossed their teachers in jail, organized Kurdish regiments to plague Armenian farmers and even forbid mention of the word “Armenia” in newspapers and textbooks.

In the last decade of the 20th Century, Armenians were already being slaughtered by the thousands but systematic extermination began April 24, 1915, with the arrest of 250 prominent Armenians in Istanbul. In a purge anticipating Hitler’s slaughter of European xxxry, Armenians were forced from their homes, the men led off to be tortured and shot, the women and children shipped off to concentration camps in the Syrian desert.

At the time, the U.S. consul in Aleppo wrote Washington, “So severe has been the treatment that careful estimates place the number of survivors at only 15 percent of those originally deported. On this basis the number surviving even this far being less than 150,0000…there seems to have been about 1,000,000 persons lost up to this date.”

In our own time, the Turkish Historical Society published “Facts on the Relocation of Armenians (1914-1918”). It claims the Armenians were relocated during the war “as humanely as possible” to keep them from aiding the Russian armies.

In 2005, Turkish Nobel Prize recipient Orhan Pamuk, was said to have violated Section 301 of the Rurkish penal code for “insulting Turkishness” in an interview he gave to a Swiss newspaper. “A million Armenians were killed and nobody but me dares to talk about it,” Pamuk said. Also, Turkish novelist Elif Shafak was brought up on a like charge for having a fictional character in her “The Bastard of Istanbul” discuss the genocide.

Fortunately for him, Turkish historian Tanar Akcam resides in America. His new history, “A Shameful Act: The Armenian Genocide and the Question of Turkish Responsibility”(Metropolitan) otherwise probably would land him in jail.

As there are few nations that have not dabbled in a bit of genocide, one wonders why Turkey persists in its denials? After all, genocide is hardly a bar to UN admission or getting a loan from the World Bank.

Turkey has every right to membership in the same sordid club as Spain, Great Britain, Belgium, Russia, Germany, Italy, Japan, France, China, and America. Why must it be so sensitive? Let them confess and sit down with the other members to enjoy a good cup of strong coffee. They’ll be made to feel right at home, as long as they don’t mention Tibet, Iraq, Cambodia, the Congo, Chechnya, Timor, Darfur, Rwanda ad nauseum. After all, there are ghosts everywhere.


--Sherwood Ross is an American reporter and columnist. Reach him at [email protected]

Source: http://www.politicalaffairs.net/arti...ew/4469/1/223/

[Norserunt]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Hrant Dink, 53

Astvadz hokin lusavor e...

Husam ays tepki hedevankov mer Bolsahaier@ yev michaskayin bedutyunner@ verchabes gartennan.


I, at times, spoke against this man for getting involved in the complex politics of Armenian-Turkish affairs. Nonetheless, I feel deep sorrow over his death. He did not deserve to die in such a manner. His mistake was attempting to engage Turks in a 'civilized' debate. I hope the world sees what we have been dealing with for a thousand years.

I hope this becomes a wake up call to all Bolsahais.

We Armenians must learn that we can not engage Turks in any kind debate, within any level. Only through armed struggle will we be able to correct the wrongs of our history.

Miyayn zenkov ga Hayots prgutyun!!!

[Aurathen]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

I believe Syrians, Iraqis, Armenains, and Bulgarians have a hate for the Turks.

Look Turk, no1 enters your forum and speaks about your nation. I have been to turkish forums, and let me tell you, besides military and how great you once WERE, there is nothing else being debated there.

That is REALLY why Turkey will never enter the European Union. They care nothing about law, nor about people, their prime concern is Military! Here is a reallly pathetic thing about TUrkey.

YOUR NAVY is as powerful as the Greek Navy. Your AIRFORCE is smaller than the GREEK one! Your Army operates obsolete M48 and M60s! Your population is that of Germany's yet your economy is poorer than HOLLAND! Turkish men outside Turkey marry foreign because they realize what big xxxxs their women are. Vice Versa!

If you really think that your race of "iron and fire" is something special, get in line, we all think we are great. That is until we get hit in the face with a hard slab of TRUTH.

Now please, we have our forum, you have yours...I ask you nicely to leave this forum alone. If you would like to engage in a conversation, you are free to do so.

We may be poor but care to explain why your people born and living in Armenia become borderjumpers and flee to Turkey for jobs and food illegally? What have we got ? We are nothing as you have clearly stated

[Aurathen]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

My friend Norserunt you don't know anything about Hrant Dink and his accomplishments. You were against him for telling the truth? (Sure that is not in you best interest at all). Before you start typing those frustrating words watch his funeral in the Tv. See how the Turks condemn this trachery

[Armenian]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Turkish Court Blocks Islamic Candidate



Turkish expert: “Turkey is like a transvestite. The spirit and the body are in conflict.”

ANKARA, Turkey, May 1 — Turkey’s highest court on Tuesday blocked a presidential candidate with a background in Islamic politics, pitching the country into early elections and a referendum on the role of religion in its future. In a 9-to-2 ruling, the court upheld an appeal by Turkey’s main secular political party, which sought to block Abdullah Gul, a close ally of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, from becoming president, objecting to what they said were his Islamic credentials.

But Mr. Gul, an observant Muslim who is Turkey’s foreign minister, has kept Islam out of public policy in his four years in government, and his supporters said the decision was simply an attempt to hold on to power by Turkey’s secular elite, which has controlled the state since Ataturk’s revolution in 1923. Turkey is an important American ally and its stability is seen as crucial in a troubled region. It shares borders with Iran, Iraq and Syria. It is a member of NATO and has good relations with Israel. It has also been critical for the American military in Iraq, providing an air base in the south of the country that supplies much of northern and central Iraq.

In the ruling, the court annulled a vote for Mr. Gul held in Parliament on Friday because there were not enough lawmakers present. Secular parties boycotted the vote. But the ruling was more political than legal, his supporters charged. Previous presidents have been elected with fewer lawmakers present in the first round of voting. The court, they argue, reflects the interests of a secular establishment that is now mounting an assault against Mr. Erdogan and the emerging class of religious Turks that he represents.

The court “is a product of the military coup in 1960,” said Eser Karakas, a professor at Bahcesehir University in Istanbul. The court was formed after the coup to interpret the Constitution, which enshrines secularism at the heart of the state. In remarks broadcast Tuesday, Mr. Erdogan said his party would press for early elections in late June or early July. Parliament must vote to begin elections, but the measure is supported by parties across the political spectrum and is expected to pass.

He also made what is likely to be a highly controversial proposal that would take the presidential selection process out of the hands of Parliament altogether and place it in a popular vote, which he would like to see happen soon, but which is unlikely to affect the current election. Turkey is a parliamentary system, and Turks vote for parties, which then form governments based on their allotment in Parliament. Currently the president, Turkey’s highest-ranking secular official, is elected by Parliament. The president commands the military, vetoes legislation and appoints judges. “There is nowhere more beautiful than the ballot box for criticism,” Mr. Erdogan said.

“In order to free ourselves from this blockage,” he continued, “the only place to go is to the nation that indisputably owns sovereignty.”

Mr. Erdogan’s confidence springs from the vast network that his party, known by its Turkish initials AK, has established in the grass roots of Turkish society. He represents the conservative heartland, which for years had been on the periphery but now is moving into the mainstream, since its constituents migrated in vast numbers to the cities and were elevated by an economic boom. Some analysts expected him to come out even stronger in early elections. His party currently holds 351 seats in the 550-member Parliament.

The open question on Tuesday night was what action, if any, Turkey’s powerful military would take. The military sees itself as the defender of Ataturk’s secular legacy and has ousted four elected governments since 1960. It issued a sharp warning to the government on Friday night that it would intervene if Mr. Erdogan strayed too far from the secularism that is the backbone of the state. Turkish political analysts said Tuesday that the military was unlikely to intervene for now, thinking it had won a victory with the court decision. But some said the secular parties seem to be overestimating their popularity. Mr. Gul, 56, an English speaker who has led Turkey’s push to join the European Union, tried to allay Turkish fears on Tuesday.

“If I had had a secret agenda as claimed, if those concerns were truly a part of my secret agenda, the European Union membership could not have been my policy,” he said. Then, in a conciliatory tone unusual for members of his party, who ordinarily dismiss secular concerns as old-fashioned and unreasonable, Mr. Gul added, “But if there are concerns as such, we need to work together to understand and correct them.”

Heightening the tension was the arrest of more than 500 protestors, who were marching in an unauthorized May Day rally unrelated to the current political impasse. Television networks broadcast images of police officers in riot gear beating demonstrators and spraying them with pepper gas. The Turkish stock market continued its fall, and Mr. Erdogan made public remarks to restore faith in it. His supporters deplored the court’s decision as unfair.

“In the last four years I’ve been going around Europe saying that Turkey has made all these reforms and it is a democratic place,” said Egemen Bagis, an adviser to Mr. Erdogan and a lawmaker. “Now I don’t know what to tell them. Turkey doesn’t deserve this.”

Deniz Baykal, the leader of the secular Republican People’s Party, which appealed to the court, hailed its action. “From now on, no party has the chance to dictate a president,” he said on national television. The verdict “will claim its place in legal history as highly respectable and important.”

The changes in Turkish society have raised concerns among secular Turks that their lifestyles will not be respected once the rank and file of Mr. Erdogan’s party settle deeper into state institutions. That worry drew hundreds of thousands of secular protesters onto the streets here and in Istanbul last month.

“I’m very worried about the future of society,” said Asli Aydintasbas, Ankara bureau chief for Sabah, a daily newspaper. “I’ve never seen such an emotional debate. It’s so polarized.”

Hakan Yavuz, an expert in Turkish religion and politics at the University of Utah in Salt Lake City, used a colorful metaphor: “Turkey is like a transvestite. The spirit and the body are in conflict.”

In four years of power, Mr. Erdogan failed to build bridges to the secular community, Mr. Yavuz said, and vastly underestimated the depth of secular concerns. Mr. Gul on Tuesday tried to assuage those concerns.

“I, consciously or unconsciously, might have made mistakes,” he said. “Has it never happened to you? The important thing is to be able to notice these mistakes, correct and direct them into a better direction.”

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/02/wo.../02turkey.html

[Siamanto]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

With the election of Sarkozy as the next French president, I would consider the hopes of TEMPORARILY SO CALLED Turkey to join the EU almost vaporized or severely compromized.
Though he was not my candidate, he was the best for Armenian interests and, simultaneously, the worse for *urkish interests. For instance, three days ago, during the Presidential Debate, he insisted - on many occasions - that the future French president should clearly say to the *urks that they simply don't belong to Europe and there is no need to pursue with the discussions.
He is very close to Patrick Devedjian - one of his main advisers - who is an active member of the Armenian Community.


Note: I have chosen to auto censor the words "*urk," "*urkish" or *urkic" because it is commonly perceived as unpleasant and offending, evokes unpleasant emotions and imagery and is pregnant with immoral and evil connotations

[Էլիա]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Մի՛ մտահոգուիք: Բնաւ կարելիութիւն չի կայ՝ Թուրքիոյ ընդունելութեան Եւրոպայի մէջ: Ինչպէ՞ս կ'ընդունուի Թուրքիան եթէ իր «ըսուած ազգը» գոյութիւն չ'ունի: Ի՞նչ թուրքեր: Իրականութիւնը՝ ամէն «թուրքերը» խառնուած են յոյներու, պարսիկներու, եւ ուրիշ արեւմտեան ասիական ազգերու հետ:

[exfo]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

With the election of Sarkozy as the next French president, I would consider the hopes of TEMPORARILY SO CALLED Turkey to join the EU almost vaporized or severely compromized.
Though he was not my candidate, he was the best for Armenian interests and, simultaneously, the worse for *urkish interests. For instance, three days ago, during the Presidential Debate, he insisted - on many occasions - that the future French president should clearly say to the *urks that they simply don't belong to Europe and there is no need to pursue with the discussions.
He is very close to Patrick Devedjian - one of his main advisers - who is an active member of the Armenian Community.


Note: I have chosen to auto censor the words "*urk," "*urkish" or *urkic" because it is commonly perceived as unpleasant and offending, evokes unpleasant emotions and imagery and is pregnant with immoral and evil connotations

Siamanotthing, unlike you, we do not consider ourselves as European and %70 of Turkey do not want to your racist Europe anymore. You can keep continue to flatter Europeans to have their symphaty, but this is not valid for us. It is very simple for us. If EU will give us money then I welcome EU, if no money no EU. You may have some emotional problems about your identity. When you look to a mirror you may see an Armenian, a Turk, a European, an Asian or only a middle eastern face girl or whatever, but, nobody care with you or Deveciyan or Sarkozy or any other racist. Just try to understand this. Actually my idea, do not care with Turks that much. Relax, take it easy. Take your pills.

[TomServo]

Re: Why Turkey will never be admitted into the European Union

Siamanotthing, unlike you, we do not consider ourselves as European

Who's "we"? You are speaking on behalf of every single person in Turkey?