The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

[Armenian]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

not only are the facts quite disputable but, morally speaking, such arguments are totally unacceptable.

The facts may be disputable, however, the end results of his actions are not. And historically speaking, morals or ethics have never played any role in politics. The bottom line is, Stalin played a pivotal role in Russian history: He thoroughly cleansed the communist movement; through brute force he held together the Russian empire during its worst period; and he successfully rallied the Russian nation against the Nazi invasion.

And at the end of the Second World War the Russian lead Soviet Union was the world's greatest power. Had Stalin not be as brutal as he was he would not have been able to hold on to power and Russia would have simply fallen apart. Regardless of how brutal he was, Stalin will be remembered as one of the greatest figures in Russian history.

In a certain sense the same attributes can be applied to Vladimir Putin. Albeit much less bloody, Putin cleansed the Russian government of its Joo lead oligarchs; he held together the Russian Federation through force; he rallied the Russian nation against NATO and American imperialism.



I am a great admirer of Solzhnicyn, however, referring to his personal experiences during communism is not appropriate for this discussion. Under the peculiar circumstances of the brutal time period in question millions suffered under Stalin. But that is not the point I'm trying to make here. I am simply asking you to look at the big geopolitical picture and the role Stalin played within it.

Anyway, let's leave it at that.

[Armenian]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Russia on Its Mind, Georgia Flexes Its Muscle in Iraq



KUT, Iraq, Oct. 8 — The United States has found an unlikely ally in the struggle to block what American commanders suspected to be Iranian weapons smuggling in this rural agricultural region south and east of Baghdad: soldiers from the former Soviet republic of Georgia. At a time when other countries are pulling troops out, Georgia has more than doubled its troop levels in Iraq, to 2,000 soldiers from 850, and agreed to send them from the safer Green Zone in Baghdad to this area along the Iranian border. That gives Georgia, a tiny Caucasus mountains nation, the second-largest troop presence among American allies in Iraq, behind Britain.

At a ceremony marking the formal start of their mission on Monday, soldiers knelt and were sprinkled with holy water by their Eastern Orthodox priest. But it is hardly fear of Iran that impels the Georgians to contribute so significantly to the war. As the United States is searching for allies, so is Georgia, which aspires to NATO membership as a security guarantee against Russia.

“As soldiers here, we help the American soldiers,” Cpl. Georgi N. Zedguidze explained, peering past the sun-scorched checkpoint where he was guarding a bridge over the Tigris River. “Then America as a country will help our country.”

The United States supports NATO membership for Georgia, but neither nation has formally linked the deployment in Iraq with that. Georgian officials play down the idea of even an informal quid pro quo. They say that after their initial decision to send troops in 2003, the current contingent reflects a commitment to maintaining security.

“We should show everyone that we are not stepping back and running away from a difficult situation,” Georgia’s president, Mikheil Saakashvili, said March 9 when he announced the troop buildup. However, for Georgian soldiers risking their lives to interdict what is described as the southern Shiite trafficking in bombs made with explosively formed penetrators, the sense of making a down payment on their own security is strong. The penetrators are armor-piercing weapons that are a leading cause of death for American soldiers.

A dozen or so of the Georgians said in interviews that they understood their service in Iraq as directly linked to their own security — as a means of helping Georgia join NATO when Russia’s international ambitions are stirring again. Sgt. Koba Oshkhereli, looking out of the dusty gate of Forward Operating Base Delta at the trash-strewn streets of Kut and all the danger it holds, put it this way: “The bear was sleeping. Now the bear is awake and stomping his feet.”

The Georgians are not the first former Soviet or Eastern Bloc soldiers to arrive in Iraq with those notions. Of the 25 nations contributing troops to Iraq, 18 are in one or the other of those categories, including Poland, Ukraine and small nations like Estonia, according to a tally by the Brookings Institution in Washington. A majority are either new members of NATO or aspirants to membership. Within Georgia, opposition parties have criticized Mr. Saakashvili’s use of the deployment to receive American counterinsurgency training for the army, saying it is a sign that he intends to use military force to regain control of two Russian-supported separatist regions in Georgia, Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

Extending NATO membership to Georgia would entangle the alliance in those two conflicts on Russia’s unstable southern border and along the export routes for Caspian basin oil, in a region Russia considers within its sphere of influence. Just this year, Georgia has twice accused Russia of releasing rockets from aircraft that had flown into Georgian airspace. Meanwhile, support for American operations in Iraq is dwindling. Foreign troops peaked at 25,600 in January 2004 and were down to 12,300 in September, according to the Brookings tally. Prime Minister Gordon Brown of Britain said Monday that he would reduce the British presence by half, to 2,500 troops, by spring. The United States currently has about 165,000 troops in Iraq.

Wasit, a large province south of Baghdad where Georgia is now the main troop contributor, is 98 percent Shiite but is divided in its loyalties between two groups fighting for dominance: the Badr Organization, a party with origins among Iraqi defectors to Iran during the Iran-Iraq war in the 1980s, and the group led by the anti-American cleric Moktada al-Sadr. American commanders say Iran is backing both. The Georgians here — a rough-hewn group of Caucasus mountain men, many of them veterans of one or another post-Soviet conflict — carry Kalashnikov rifles with scuffed wooden stocks. The brigade has adopted a strategy based on contacts with the local population and tribal sheiks, an approach also being used now by American commanders.

The Georgian soldiers, who arrived in late August although the formal deployment began on Monday, have taken to giving medical treatment to Iraqis with non-life-threatening ailments showing up at their checkpoints. The patients are typically children with burns from kerosene lamps, common in a country whose electric service is only intermittent. Capt. Mamuka Tskrialashvili, who trained at an elite Russian paratrooper school, credited the free clinics with creating a buffer of good will among residents. But he conceded that such efforts go only so far. In the spring, on an earlier mission here, Georgians guarding a checkpoint on a bridge befriended a man who drove past often and always waved. One day, the man drove to the middle of the bridge and blew himself up, collapsing the span. “He waved when he went past,” Captain Tskrialashvili said.

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/09/wo...georgians.html

[crusader1492]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Russia on Its Mind, Georgia Flexes Its Muscle in Iraq In the spring, on an earlier mission here, Georgians guarding a checkpoint on a bridge befriended a man who drove past often and always waved. One day, the man drove to the middle of the bridge and blew himself up, collapsing the span. “He waved when he went past,” Captain Tskrialashvili said.

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/09/wo...georgians.html

Sounds like that man had a case of SJS (sudden jihad syndrome).

[Կարմիր Բ]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Ok. So the question is why do you knowledgeably post a propaganda poster equating Putin with this monstrous dictator?

some reading for you
http://www.amazon.com/Gulag-Archipel.../dp/0813332893

I agree. There can be no comparison between CTALNH and putin.

[Կարմիր Բ]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

LOL replacing Voroshilov with the face of mr nobody.

[Armenian]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

The following news report is a very significant development in international politics.

According to Kommersant, CST general secretary Nikolai Bordiuzha stated:

“Any crisis spot in the world can become a zone of peacekeeping activity. Moreover, in the area of responsibility (Armenia, Belarus, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan) the bloc can implement the operations absolutely independently, without the UN sanction. The main thing is that in case the situation dangerous for stability and internal security of one CST members appears, our organization can solve it by own forces without external interference”, - was explained to Kommersant in the principal office of the organization in Moscow."

Moscow is essentially stating that it will resort to taking drastic measures in defense of CIS republics if the need arises without attempting to gain international approval. This move by Moscow is most probably aimed against NATO and the United States and is a direct response to actions the West has taken in the region during the past fifteen years. Nevertheless, Moscow is clearly in the process of solidifying its geopolitical borders and reestablishing its political influences within former Soviet block nations.

Armenian

************************************************** ***************

Russia can implement «peacekeeping operations» in Belarus without UN sanction?



The decisions taken on Saturday on Collective Security Treaty (CST) summit in Dushanbe are turning this amorphous structure into powerful military-political bloc, Kommersant running. Belarusian analytical center “Strategiya” head Leanid Zaika thinks, the Kremlin wants to spread the KGB reincarnation upon the whole Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS).

According to Kommersant, now CST will begin to form its peacekeeping forces and the bloc members can buy Russian weapon at internal prices. These steps and recent appointment of Foreign Intelligence Service ex-director Sergei Lebedev for a post of CIS executive secretary mean that Moscow is going to work seriously for strengthening of the Commonwealth with the aim to stop the decline of Russian influence there and not to allow Color revolutions on the post-Soviet territory.

According to the ratified provisions on the peacekeeping forces, CST can form the peacekeeping brigades of international status. As CST general secretary Nikolai Bordiuzha explained “Any crisis spot in the world can become a zone of peacekeeping activity. Moreover, in the area of responsibility (Armenia, Belarus, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan) the bloc can implement the operations absolutely independently, without the UN sanction.

“The main thing is that in case the situation dangerous for stability and internal security of one CST members appears, our organization can solve it by own forces without external interference”, - was explained to Kommersant in the principal office of the organization in Moscow.

It is clear that by CST Russia is meant. It is hard to imagine that Armenia or Kyrgyzstan were concerned about the establishing order in Belarus. But the Kremlin has its interests here, which it can defend with weapon. A day before the CST summit, the new CIS executive secretary became FIS Director Sergei Lebedev. “This is the man who we need for the external policy of Russia that has foreground meaning for us – CIS, - Vladimir Putin commented this appointment. - Sergei Lebedev did not only lead the FIS, it may be said without exaggeration that he was engaged in state activity”.

By the nature of his previous office Sergei Lebedev was undoubtedly well informed about the situation in every CIS country. Formally FIS doesn’t conduct intelligence in the Commonwealth countries, it is forbidden by Almaty Treaty of 1992, according to which the secret services of the CIS members do not work against each other. In 2002 the treaty was prolonged. And Sergei Lebedev stressed many times that his department is fulfilling the treaty: FIS does not work against the CIS members, but “cooperate with their young secret services”.

However, the experts suppose that finding out the situation in a CIS country is possible under the pretence of preventing the third countries secret services activity. It is not forbidden to FIS, but it is its duty.

That’s why career intelligence officer Sergei can fulfill the most responsible tasks of the Center on the post-Soviet territory. Former deputy of Sergei Lebedev in FIS and present State Duma Security Committee deputy head Vitali Margelov thinks, that Sergei Lebedev will manage to from the good conception of CIS work: “On the threshold of the elections in Russia the president put right people on right places. That means we will work seriously in this direction: Lebedev has power not to allow the problems we have with Belarus, or Georgia, or Ukraine”.

However the attempts of Moscow to build a hard structure of the post-Soviet area can lead to the effect different from one the Kremlin expects. Many republics of the former USSR have accepted the existence of the CIS because the organization was ineffective and practically didn’t threaten their independence.

Another thing is really acting CIS. Moreover, it is headed now by career intelligence officer. All these can make many states on the post-Soviet area turn back on Moscow and search patrons on the West or in China. The actions of the presidents of Georgia and Turkmenistan Mikheil Saakashvili and Gurbanguly Berdimuhammedow, who refused to sign many documents in Dushanbe, became the forerunner of merely such developments. Such apprehension can already be heard in the CIS.

- Lebedev is the right man for looking over the CIS. He, like Putin, is a typical secret service officer from the last USSR period, - Belarusian analytical center “Strategiya” head Leanid Zaika declared to Kommersant. – They are evidently going to spread the KGB reincarnation upon the whole Commonwealth. The main thing today is not to break it down to the end.

Source: http://www.charter97.org/en/news/2007/10/9/517/

Russia vows more arms for bigger peacekeeping role



DUSHANBE (Reuters) - Russia promised on Saturday to sell more weapons at cheaper prices to its ex-Soviet allies in exchange for their playing a bigger role in peacekeeping operations in the region, including conflict-torn Georgia. The deals on peacekeeping and the sale of Russian military hardware were among more than 20 documents signed by the leaders of the Moscow-dominated Collective Security Treaty Organisation (CSTO) during a summit in the Tajik capital, Dushanbe.

"CSTO members will now get special equipment at domestic Russian prices," Russian President Vladimir Putin told reporters after the summit. The grouping, which includes Russia, Belarus, Armenia, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan, has grown more active in the past few years as new rifts have appeared in Moscow's relations with the West. Russia, alarmed at peaceful pro-Western revolutions in Ukraine and Georgia, has stepped up security cooperation with the leaders of Belarus and some Central Asian states. Russia's security umbrella is also seen as an important survival instrument by Belarussian President Alexander Lukashenko and Uzbek President Islam Karimov, blamed by the West of crushing democratic freedom at home.

MORE PARTICIPATION

Moscow, which alone carries the peacekeeping burden of the broader Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS), which groups 12 former Soviet countries, said during the meeting it wants more active participation by its allies.

"The CIS peacekeeping force is now deployed in (Georgia's breakaway region of) Abkhazia, but it is 100 percent Russian," Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov told reporters. "We have always wanted more states to take part in this work."

Under the agreement signed at the summit, each CSTO member state will allocate a detachment for a peacekeeping force that could be used should a joint decision be made to launch a mission. Lavrov said the agreement was not drafted with any specific country in mind. But the declaration drew attention to conflicts on the fringes of the CSTO member states.

"We are concerned by a conflict potential which has been accumulating in the immediate proximity of the CSTO zone of responsibility," it said. "This is fraught with the creation of new division lines and mutual suspicions."

CSTO Executive Secretary Nikolai Bordyuzha did not rule out that Abkhazia and another Georgian breakaway region, South Ossetia, could be options for a joint peacekeeping mission. "The use of the peacekeeping force in Abkhazia and South Ossetia is possible if all sides involved in the conflict agree," he told a news conference ahead of the summit. Pro-Western Georgia wants to win back control of the two provinces, which broke away in the early 1990s, and blames Russian peacekeepers for backing separatists. Georgia, which is seeking NATO membership, wants the Russian peacekeepers to be replaced by a neutral force.

Source: http://ca.today.reuters.com/news/New...mber=0&summit=

[skhara]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Russia can implement «peacekeeping operations» in Belarus without UN sanction?

I'm a bit confused by this title. Why is this being questioned?

[Armenian]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

I'm a bit confused by this title. Why is this being questioned?

Why is what being questioned? Did you read the body of the article?

[skhara]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Yes. I was confused by the "?".

Belarus is a member state of CSTO, so UN doesn't have any say in the affairs of the member states.

[Armenian]

Re: The Rise of the Russian Empire: Russo-Armenian Relations

Yes. I was confused by the "?". Belarus is a member state of CSTO, so UN doesn't have any say in the affairs of the member states.

From an English language standpoint, the article in question is very poorly written. So disregard the "?."

You and I don't know the legal aspects of CSTO/CIS and how they relate to the mandate given to an international organization like the UN. However, the message of the article is clear: Russia reserves the right to intervene militarily in any of the nations that Moscow considers to be within its zone of influence, CST/CIS states, if Moscow perceives a danger. This is an unprecedented move by the Russian Federation. They are essentially telling NATO, in diplomatics terms, to stay away from their zones of influence or face a military response.

Let's also not loose sight of the fact that NATO and American interests have been actively working within various CIS states with anti-Russian agendas for a long time. And until now Russia had been more-or-less silent. And nations such as Belarus and Kyrgyzstan, for example, remain quite vulnerable to western manipulations to this day. If you recall, US had a military presence in Uzbekistan until recently, when the Uzbek government got wind of what they were up to and evicted them.

You can find some of the information here:

“Velvet Revolutions” Backfire in Central Asia

Central Asia was the scene of several British-sponsored and American-sponsored attempts at regime change. The latter were characterised by velvet revolutions similar to the Orange Revolution in Ukraine and the Rose Revolution in Georgia. These velvet revolutions financed by the U.S. failed in Central Asia, aside from Kyrgyzstan where there had been partial success with the so-called Tulip Revolution. As a result the U.S. government has suffered major geo-strategic setbacks in Central Asia. All of Central Asia’s leaders have distanced themselves from America.

Russia and Iran have also secured energy deals in the region. America’s efforts, over several decades, to exert a hegemonic role in Central Asia seem to have been reversed overnight. The U.S. sponsored velvet revolutions have backfired. Relations between Uzbekistan and the U.S. were especially hard hit. Uzbekistan is under the authoritarian rule of President Islam Karamov. Starting in the second half of the 1990s President Karamov was enticed into bringing Uzbekistan into the fold of the Anglo-American alliance and NATO. When there was an attempt on President Karamov’s life, he suspected the Kremlin because of his independent policy stance. This is what led Uzbekistan to leave CSTO. But Islam Karamov, years later, changed his mind as to who was attempting to get rid of him.

According to Zbigniew Brzezinski, Uzbekistan represented a major obstacle to any renewed Russian control of Central Asia and was virtually invulnerable to Russian pressure; this is why it was important to secure Uzbekistan as an American protectorate in Central Asia. Uzbekistan also has the largest military force in Central Asia. In 1998, Uzbekistan held war games with NATO troops in Uzbekistan. Uzbekistan was becoming heavily militarized in the same manner as Georgia was in the Caucasus. The U.S. gave Uzbekistan huge amounts of financial aid to challenge the Kremlin in Central Asia and also provided training to Uzbek forces. With the launching of the “Global War on Terror,” in 2001, Uzbekistan, an Anglo-American ally, immediately offered bases and military facilities to the U.S. in Karshi-Khanabad.

The leadership of Uzbekistan already knew the direction the “Global War on Terror” would take. To the irritation of the Bush Jr. Administration, the Uzbek President formulated a policy of self-reliance. The honeymoon between Uzbekistan and the Anglo-American alliance ended when Washington D.C. and London contemplated removing Islam Karamov from power. He was a little too independent for their comfort and taste. Their attempts at removing the Uzbek President failed, leading eventually to a shift in geo-political alliances.

The tragic events of Andijan on May 13, 2005 were the breaking point between Uzbekistan and the Anglo-American alliance. The people of Andijan were incited into confronting the Uzbek authorities, which resulted in a heavy security clampdown on the protesters and a loss of lives. Armed groups were reported to have been involved. In the U.S., Britain, and the E.U., the media reports focused narrowly on human rights violations without mentioning the covert role of the Anglo-American alliance. Uzbekistan held Britain and the U.S. responsible accusing them of inciting rebellion.

M. K. Bhadrakumar, the former Indian ambassador to Uzbekistan (1995-1998), revealed that the Hezbut Tahrir (HT) was one of the parties blamed for stirring the crowd in Andijan by the Uzbek government. [9] The group was already destabilizing Uzbekistan and using violent tactics. The headquarters of this group happens to be in London and they enjoy the support of the British government. London is a hub for many similar organizations that further Anglo-American interests in various countries, including Iran and Sudan, through destabilization campaigns. Uzbekistan even started clamping down on foreign non-governmental organizations (NGOs) because of the tragic events of Andijan.

The Anglo-American alliance had played its cards wrong in Central Asia. Uzbekistan officially left the GUUAM Group, a NATO-U.S. sponsored anti-Russian body. GUUAM once again became the GUAM (Georgia, Ukraine, Azerbaijan and Moldava) Group on May 24, 2005. On July 29, 2005 the U.S. military was ordered to leave Uzbekistan within a six-month period.[10] Literally, the Americans were told they were no longer welcome in Uzbekistan and Central Asia. Russia, China, and the SCO added their voices to the demands. The U.S. cleared its airbase in Uzbekistan by November, 2005.

Uzbekistan rejoined the CSTO alliance on June 26, 2006 and realigned itself, once again, with Moscow. The Uzbek President also became a vocal advocate, along with Iran, for pushing the U.S. totally out of Central Asia. [11] Unlike Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan continued to allow the U.S. to use Manas Air Base, but with restrictions and in an uncertain atmosphere. The Kyrgyz government also would make it clear that no U.S. operations could target Iran from Kyrgyzstan.

Source: http://www.payvand.com/news/07/sep/1274.html

In short: Moscow is basically telling the West that if they start any kind of trouble in anyone of the countries noted, it will intervene militarily without seeking international approval. It is logical to assume that this reasoning by Moscow can also be eventually applied to strategically important nations that are not a part of the CIS, nations such as Serbia, Ukraine, Ossetia and Abkhazia.