Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

[Haykakan]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

Haykakan, as far as those of us in the Armenian communities and its inner circles, we all know the "typical Armenian upbringing". We also know that we are exposed to our surrounding environment, where ever we might be whether it's the US, Canada, France, Turkey, UK, Australia, Armenia, Lebanon, Iran, etc. You can tell that certain Armenians have picked up some of the good and bad habits from other cultures in addition to their Armenian culture. Some countries tend to assimilate culture more than others. Most Armenians struggle with their Armenian identity while trying to fit into their social circles in school and their new society in general. The situation you described was more of the influence of American culture than "Armenian upbringing" because I know exactly what you're talking about and let's face it, as hard as we try to maintain our culture and identity, we'll win some, and we'll lose some.

You raise some very good points there and we as Armenians have plenty to be proud of like our culture, history, beutifull languadge and the fact that we are still here! I think by sticking to our humanity we can mitigate much of the negative effects other cultures/environments have on us.Many Armenians from the middle east are more arab then armenian and they have embraced the money loving culture of that area, some russian armenians living in russia feel too ashamed to be labeled "chorni"(dark skinned) by the racist russian society and will do anything to hide their armenian side.There are many examples but the answer to all of these situations is the same "just be yourself".Be the natural human being you were meant to be and these other factors will have minimal effect on you.it is not always a good idea to "fit in" especially when in your gutt you feel that something is wrong with the society.The best way to maintain your Armenian heritage is to go to armenia and establish ties there and absorb the nature and feel of whats left of our homeland. Armenia itself is changing and unfortunatly becoming more like what they consider "western" countries, but still it is the best thing we got going.I am so sick of listening to all these people who claim to be true patriots in their later years yet they have never been to Armenia, give me a break if you are so damn armenian then howcome you couldn't muster enoughf of your armenian spirit to go see your homeland even once in your whole "patriotic life", its only a couple hour flight from most middle eastern countries which are full of these "patriotic" armenians.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

But you just said it was not the upbringing in your earlier post.I guess you changed your mind.Yes like i said it has everything to do with her upbringing the problem is this was not the upbringing "most armenian girls undergo" because thats not what most armenian girls did.

Haykakan, as far as those of us in the Armenian communities and its inner circles, we all know the "typical Armenian upbringing". We also know that we are exposed to our surrounding environment, where ever we might be whether it's the US, Canada, France, Turkey, UK, Australia, Armenia, Lebanon, Iran, etc. You can tell that certain Armenians have picked up some of the good and bad habits from other cultures in addition to their Armenian culture. Some countries tend to assimilate culture more than others. Most Armenians struggle with their Armenian identity while trying to fit into their social circles in school and their new society in general. The situation you described was more of the influence of American culture than "Armenian upbringing" because I know exactly what you're talking about and let's face it, as hard as we try to maintain our culture and identity, we'll win some, and we'll lose some.

[Haykakan]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

First of all, really happy for your sister. Bravo!
Second, don't you think that she managed to go that far, exactly because of those things like perseverence, hard work and determination, that usually form part of that traditional upbringing we Armenian girls undergo?!

But you just said it was not the upbringing in your earlier post.I guess you changed your mind.Yes like i said it has everything to do with her upbringing the problem is this was not the upbringing "most armenian girls undergo" because thats not what most armenian girls did.

[meline]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

I strongly disagree. My sister grew up in the same environment and went to the exact same school but she has a PHD in physical chemistry and a job in Berkley.I agree this behaviour exists in other communities also as a matter of fact i said it myself in my post, maybe you didn't read the whole thing?This is definetly the result of upbringing, the girls i talked about lived in a environment where they could have gone either way, they could have used the education they were being provided with like me and my sister did and actually made something of themselves but they chose to be brainless skanks instead.This choice has everything to do with the values their parents instilled in them.

First of all, really happy for your sister. Bravo!
Second, don't you think that she managed to go that far, exactly because of those things like perseverence, hard work and determination, that usually form part of that traditional upbringing we Armenian girls undergo?!

[KanadaHye]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

I strongly disagree. My sister grew up in the same environment and went to the exact same school but she has a PHD in physical chemistry and a job in Berkley.I agree this behaviour exists in other communities also as a matter of fact i said it myself in my post, maybe you didn't read the whole thing?This is definetly the result of upbringing, the girls i talked about lived in a environment where they could have gone either way, they could have used the education they were being provided with like me and my sister did and actually made something of themselves but they chose to be brainless skanks instead.This choice has everything to do with the values their parents instilled in them.

That just means your sister had stronger character and was able to overcome the negative aspects of her surrounding environment. We are discussing the traditional Armenian upbringing (kids stay home until they are independent and mature enough to make it on their own and/or get married)

[KanadaHye]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

What you are talking about is not the upbringing, but the environment. There is a world of difference between the two of them. Needless to say, this type of behaviour exists in many other communities. Should we blame it on a specific type of upbringing or rather on the soap opera style of environment they grow up in?

Thank you Meline... finally someone who understands where the finger should be pointed.

[Haykakan]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

What you are talking about is not the upbringing, but the environment. There is a world of difference between the two of them. Needless to say, this type of behaviour exists in many other communities. Should we blame it on a specific type of upbringing or rather on the soap opera style of environment they grow up in?

I strongly disagree. My sister grew up in the same environment and went to the exact same school but she has a PHD in physical chemistry and a job in Berkley.I agree this behaviour exists in other communities also as a matter of fact i said it myself in my post, maybe you didn't read the whole thing?This is definetly the result of upbringing, the girls i talked about lived in a environment where they could have gone either way, they could have used the education they were being provided with like me and my sister did and actually made something of themselves but they chose to be brainless skanks instead.This choice has everything to do with the values their parents instilled in them.

[meline]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

I got a whole school worth of examples for you. I graduated from AGBU and most of the school was females. Most but not all were patheticly self absorbed and always tried to outcompete each other by wearing the more expencive and flashy cloth. It got so bad that these girls were wearing freakin designer nightgowns to class. The school was forced to institute a strict dress code which ruined it for all the guys cause now we had to wear uncomfortable uniforms because of some self absorbed wenches.These girls did not have jobs they could not have bought these clothes with their own money so they went to dady or momy and asked for it and the stupid parents let their kids wear thousend dollar dresses to school.We had a 16 yearold girl get married and drop out of school not because she fell in love with a boyfriend but because some old ass rich xxxler wanted to merry her and she wanted the easy life so xxxx school and her parents were so happy about the whole thing. Then we had a couple 17 year olds get married the same way. Couple 18 yearolds after that all the same stupid story. These women were very much hurt by their upbringing, it was their parents who said it was ok and good to get married at 16 to some bald rich dude. It was the parents that bought those expencive dresses and let them wear it to school. Needless to say non of these girls got anything out of school because their parents never stressed education for their girls instead they fed the stupid sleazfest of who can make her mom or dad buy her the more expencive gown so she can wear it to school and show it off. These parents considered this bullxxxx "traditional upbringing" and their daughters were very much hurt by it because they grew up to be ignorent, self absorbed women whose husbands eventually left them.

What you are talking about is not the upbringing, but the environment. There is a world of difference between the two of them. Needless to say, this type of behaviour exists in many other communities. Should we blame it on a specific type of upbringing or rather on the soap opera style of environment they grow up in?

[KanadaHye]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

Yes, I did. No, her comment does not sound like a "whole lot of disrespect". Do you make even the slightest effort to understand and communicate or your sole purpose is to be part of a conversation and kill time? Is this a chatroom for you?

I call them like I see them... I don't waste time beating around the bush or using "politically correct" language.

So let me be clear so there is no confusion.... what is it that you're trying to get at? You want to be free to do what ever you want like the french/english women you associate with? Who is stopping you? Well, here is a little hint..... they already have power over you and that's exactly what they want you to do. Read up on assimilation and understand it's psychological effects. Enough with this "old minded" and "handicapped upbringing" crap.

[Haykakan]

Re: Are Armenian women handicapped because of their upbringing?

I will not discuss the details, but I've seen cases where the man was eager to be with an Armenian woman, but ended up with a non-Armenian because of those handicaps, I will mention only two: Once the magic of the encounter faded away, the men complained that the women were either unwilling or "unable" to charm, as if something was holding them back, or as if they were not even aware that it's part of the game. No, the women did not want to break up and were apparently satisfied with the relationship.
The second handicap is the fact that they are not allowed to freely communicate with the men.

I am glad you spelled out the issues.I have had the first problem with my wife and i know exactly what you mean.I think that what men and women expect their long term relationship to be like differs based on the gender.If a man is "charmed" by a women he expects that same level of "charm" to continue. The woman does not have the same expectation or need in this field as the man does plus men also stop being as romantic after a while and this can effect the womens willingness to charm.In long term relationships or marriages women need to actually work on charming their partner, and i say work because it really is work for the women since she does not feel the same need and is doing it for her partner.Many times women will have sex not because they feel like it but because their partner does and they want to keep him happy.You can consider this right or wrong it is up to you but the fact is men need sex more often then women, it is in our biology.It also helps to try new things with your partner to liven things up sometimes.it is perfectly normal for a relationship to lose its luster after the initial fire subsides as a matter of fact it is in our nature as humans as i discussed in earlier posts.The keys to making it last is having things in common, willing to please your partner even sometimes when your not in the mood and devotion to eachother during good times and in bad. I hope this helps and i am happy you asked. As for your other question about communication, i think maybe being less reserved about what you want to say may help. If something is bothering you just tell him and then you can gage from his reaction how he feels about it.Communication is usefull but there is also such a thing as too much of it and again you can tell when that level is reached by observing his reaction.If you don't feel comfortable speaking to him then maybe he is not the one for you.