Current Condition of Armenia

[Tali]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Ah, ok. Thank you Eddo and KanadaHye.

Levon and Mos, I owe you an apology then. Sorry for attempting to stop what is apparently inherent to your nature,

[KanadaHye]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Ah, ok. Thank you Eddo and KanadaHye.

Levon and Mos, I owe you an apology then. Sorry for attempting to stop what is apparently inherent to your nature,

@Tali... do you like varoonk?

[Federate]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

@Tali... do you like varoonk?

Oh boy, this could go anywhere...

[KanadaHye]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Oh boy, this could go anywhere...

I just want to know if Tali prefers varoonk over turshi

[Nare]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Well, I must say this is a rather pessimistic post. The bottom line is, like it or not, our country is in a very sad economic state. Few years ago things were looking better, but things have worsened over last few years. People are sick of not finding well paying jobs, being pressured and threatened by taxes and regulations that are often over the top by the government, and as a result many are leaving.

Most other are able to get by with money sent over by diasporan armenians, and if it was not for that money, our situation would be much more grave. I hear stories of all the apartments that are for sale in Yerevan, and when you go, at every apartment there are suitcases, and people are getting ready to leave the country. I can attest also by the experiences of my relatives and friends.

A thing on many people's minds is how to get out of Armenia, not how to improve or change, but how to get out. People are have no hope in the government and are very pessimistic in the future, and especially the government and president.

It's near impossible to succeed with your own business if you don't have the right connections, and with the gap between the oligarchic elite class and the lower class is very wide, with little chance of jumping into that elite class. The morale of our people is at a low, especially regarding the state of the republic.

What must be done to save our country from this sorry state, to revitalise economy, to make more jobs available to people, and protect rights of workers? To cut down on monopolies and encourage private businesses? And to limit heavily the influence of big business and oligarchs on government? And most importantly, to cut down on the corruption plaguing our country, and make the government and police respectable to the people. And finally, to make an army a place people want to serve, not a place people do anything to evade.

We cannot let our country continue in this way, or else the results will be disastrous.

Spot on! Apres...

Today's news which shows why people are immigrating and doing business in other countries. Sorry for some incorrect google translation. It is already wide spread and they always get away with murder,scott free

Lfik Samo's Nephew is accused of brutal beating



A resident of the Armenian town of Schagen Razdan Hayrapetyan accused Artak Alexanian, a nephew of MP Samvel Alexanian (Lfik Samo), the brutal beating and the use of violence against him.

As reported by Schagen Hayrapetyan Radio "Liberty" that he applied the crime to the Prosecutor General of Armenia, waiting for the prosecutor to institute criminal proceedings against persons who have been subjected to violence and beatings, as well as ensure the safety of him and his family. Statement applies not only to Artak Aleksanyan, but about ten of his other accomplices.

According to Shahen Hayrapetyan, working truck in importing sweets firm Soir, he was threatened that if he does not return the debt of 1.5 million drams, formed by the closure of several stores where Hayrapetyan delivers the goods, his house in Razdan will blown up, and his and his family is waiting for the massacre. Currently, Hayrapetyan and his family left their home.

For debt repayment Hayrapetyan offered his employers to work without pay. According to him, February 3, Comrade Artak Aleksanyan called him and offered to come to the store "Yerevan City" on the street Komitas to conclude an agreement. However, upon arrival at the supermarket he was brought to the basement and subjected to severe beating.

According to Hayrapetyan, this was done by order of Artak Alexanian, who himself, together with a dozen other thugs, beaten with a stick Hayrapetyan.

Mother Shahen Hayrapetyan said that with him went to the meeting to the supermarket "Yerevan City" and was waiting for him upstairs. When she saw her son was beaten, she became ill, after which she was taken to Razdan hospital, and Shahen was taken to a carriage-house, situated in Malatya, where he was held 4 days, stating that he would not come out until the amount is not refunded . According Shahen, at night, when his guards slept, he managed to escape from there, but the threat did not stop after the escape.

Hayrapetyan showed bruises on his body and reported that to the police Razdan, but did not give the cause of stroke.

At the supermarket, "Yerevan City" on the street. Komitas Radio Liberty was assured that nothing like this in their basement does not happen. A call to a mobile phone Artak Alexanian said the man who introduced himself as a friend Alexanian, Vartan, and stated that there were no problems with the delivery man was not

[KanadaHye]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

This isn't just a problem in Armenia. It doesn't matter where you run, if the system is working off of debt, it's eventually going to turn sour and sink. In north america, the corruption is just institutionalized so it appears as though there is none on the surface.

[Nare]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

Slightly confused!

What does this mean?
Is there a problem that needs to be addressed or not.

Again google translation from Armenian blogger, he is like walking statistics on all issues.
Moved from Georgia to Armenia several years ago.



Armenia's population declined by 13 thousand people

Feb. 2nd, 2011 at 12:27 PM

According to official statistics, Armenia's permanent population grew by 12.5 thousand people., Amounting to approximately 3.26 million people.

In reality, the population declined by slightly more than 13 thousand (13 thousand 58 people):

Born 44.810 (1%)
Died 28.008 (2%)
Natural increase thus amounted to 16.802 (-0.3%), and migration decline this year climbed to 29,860 people (compared to 25 thousand in 2009, 23 thousand in 2008 and 3 thousand in 2007 (from 2004 to 2006 was migration gain).

For comparison, in 2009, the total loss of population was 4.8 thousand, in 2008, 9,263 in 2007, growth was 9.4 thousand (an increase has been since 2002, from 2002 to 2006 the population increased by 74.4 thousand people).

Tentatively, the population of Armenia is from 2.95 million to 3.05 million people, only more or less reliable data - census data on the actual population - 3,002.6 thousand people.

For all this the number of marriages was 18 thousand (decreased by 4%), and the number of divorces - 3 thousand (increased by 0.5%). Among other negative indicators - even more increased disparity between boys and girls - in the past year for every 100 girls born 114 boys. Infant mortality rose 10% to $ 3.11 per thousand.

By Region fertility was:
(For the base population when taking the census)

Yerevan - 14.3,
Aragatsotn - 17.1
Ararat - 15.7
Armavir - 15.9,
Gegharkunik - 16.1,
Lori - 14.6
Kotayk - 16.4
Chirac - 15.0,
Syunik - 12.8,
Vayots Dzor - 13.0,
Tavush - 13.7

The number of births has increased in Yerevan (+1%), Laurie (+9%), Armavir (+1.5%), Ararat (+4%), Aragatsotn (+6%), decreased - in Shirak, Syunik, Tavush, Vayots Dzor and Kotayk, and Gegharkunik not changed.

The number of deaths has remained virtually unchanged, as in previous years. In all regions the number of deaths increased equally by about 1.5-2.5%. Migration by regions - no data.

Some comments:
1. The number of births grows rapidly until mid-2010, July recession began - and if the first-half growth was + 6.7% in the second half was already recession and compared with July-December 2009, he was just over 4%. This trend is likely to be long and especially the efforts from 2015.
2. Migration: the trend seems to be further developed. In any case, in 2011, is a negative migration growth (unless of course nothing extraordinary happens in Russia): according to a study CRRC, 57% of the population would be temporary, and 25% of the population - ever - leave the country.
Moreover, in Armenia 56% have family members or relatives abroad (for Georgia is 37% in Azerbaijan - 40%), while 36% have friends abroad (also the biggest indicator). Also a general feeling of dissatisfaction with life, according to this poll, more. See: http://crrc-caucasus.blogspot.com/20...e-armenia.html



Other studies on migration (quantitative), see:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/141746/Million-CIS-Migrate-Temporarily-Work-Study.aspx

http://www.gallup.com/poll/142364/Migration-Triple-Populations-Wealthy-Nations.aspx

http://www.gallup.com/poll/144287/Developed-Nations-Attract-Young-Educated-Migrants.aspx

For comparison:
2007 data,
2008,
2009.

[Nare]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

This isn't just a problem in Armenia. It doesn't matter where you run, if the system is working off of debt, it's eventually going to turn sour and sink. In north america, the corruption is just institutionalized so it appears as though there is none on the surface.

I have family members living in Canada. And eventually they are able to work hard (but not as hard as in Armenia where you are forced to work 24/7 and to feed oligarchs and their families ) but now they get their money and sleep without worries unlike in Armenia.

P.S.
I am not sure why I am even comparing Armenia with Canada, this type of conversations are not serious and serve no purpose.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

I have family members living in Canada. And eventually they are able to work hard (but not as hard as in Armenia where you are forced to work 24/7 and to feed oligarchs and their families ) but now they get their money and sleep without worries unlike in Armenia.

P.S.
I am not sure why I am even comparing Armenia with Canada, this type of conversations are not serious and serve no purpose.

Nobody "gets" money without working unless they "borrowed" money.

I'll have to add though.... what some Armenians are good at is free loading off of hard working Armenians. They have perfected that, it's like a natural instinct.

[Haykakan]

Re: Current Condition of Armenia

The emmigration problem is not new and it is a huge problem which has its roots in the lack of economic opportunities found inside the country. There was talk of using the Singapour development model for Hayastan but it never amounted to much. Those who wanted Armenia to emulate the west and its capitalistic market system (includes most diasporan armenians) got their wish but appearantly were not smart enough to realize that capitalism is not only bad for all countries but it is particularly bad for Armenia which is landlocked, blockaded and without valuable resources. The ideal development of capitalism is the Henry Ford model where the rich realize that by paying higher wages they are doing themselves a favor because workers who have money will buy more of their stuff. It is painfully obvious this model is not applied to Armenia's situation. People who leave Armenia have very good reasons (mainly economic)for doing so and unless these reasons are adressed they will keep leaving. Unfortunately the nature of the capitalist system which has now entrenched itself into the country prevents the implimenting of any real solutions to the problem. As of now there are only two options which can bring about a favorable outcome for the country i love. Option 1 is the oligarchs adopt a henry ford style model thus improving living standards, this model will be difficult to impliment in Armenia because it is at a competative disadvantage (landlocked, few resources...). Option 2 is a revolution (oligarcks are not going to give up power volentarily)followed by some form of socialist government which will allow for a more normal distribution of wealth. The dangers of revolution for Armenia are huge because her enemies (turckish neighbors) will invariably take advantage of her internal struggles by attacking Artsagh and Armenia. The lack of a real solution to a extremly important problem points to what i have been saying all along that Armenia is a dependent state without the ability to sustain itself. The only reason why there is a Armenia today is because Russia needs us to be there. No dashnak wetdream can save Armenia if Russia should lose interest in her. Armenia would be better served under a socialist model because it would be easier for the diaspora to help without worrying as much about their donations being stolen. Under a capitalist system if you give free stuff to someone then you are hurting the business (oligarch) that is profiting off of selling that stuff. Naturaly the owners are not going to stand for such actions and this limits the diasporas ability to help. A socialist system can use diasporas help much more efficiently with more of the sent help reaching the targeted people and places without too many issues with conflict of interest. The situation looks pretty bleak-with the potential solutions being very risky. To say that emmigration is a real problem is a understatement and the solutions are unlikely to be implimentd. The diasporans can help Armenia best by forming personal connections with her. By going there and befriending its people we can make the personal connections which wil keep us going back and this is the best way we can help our country by bringing the armenian people closer togather. There are more Armenians outside Armenia then in it so just imagine how helpful it would be if we in the diaspora visited her on a regular bases. This personal connection will lead to further involvement of the diaspora with our homeland. Maybe some diasporans will want to eventualy set up busineses there or maybe they have enough money and want to live in Armenia,....there are many positive outcomes possible. The worst thing is to do what has been lately mentioned-setting up a legislature branch composed of diasporans who are going to be making laws they wont have to live with. Unfortunately the track record of the diaspora is horrid, it tends to choose the wrong options - then gets discouraged - then gives up - then does it all over again. While our diaspora has some financial clout it lacks the ability to form a effective solution to existing problems and this is what it needs to work on. Perhaps forming a personal bond between diasporans and Armenia will help in developing the insight and understanding both people need to work togather efficiently.