Greek Genocide of Asia Minor

[phantom]

[QUOTE=Ixtanbul]x


Next time you gaze your evil eyes at the Dolmabahce Palace, or the dozens of other architectural wonders of Istanbul, remember who built them stupid!

[phantom]

I restate it, if Armenians were treated like kings would you expect them to live under Azerbeyjan?

Haven't they lived under Persian rule for 400 years? Do you see Armenians rioting in the streets of America? Do you see them demonstrating for freedom in France, or Lebanon, or Egypt, or Russia, or Canada, or Argentina?

[Gavur]

These children of the borderlands of the Ottoman Empire and the refugees of lost lands could not stand the fact that we were more of a Ottoman then they were ,so they decided to eliminate us and when they got the chance they implimanted their genocidal policys.
They still continue this by Deniocide!

[ScythianVizier]

These children of the borderlands of the Ottoman Empire and the refugees of lost lands could not stand the fact that we were more of a Ottoman then they were ,so they decided to eliminate us and when they got the chance they implimanted their genocidal policys. They still continue this by Deniocide!

Sorry, but my forefathers emigrated from Caucasus and Crimea, and they were the Ottomans as much as the Armenians.

The Ottomans initially settled us in Balkans, and then with the loss of Balkans, we were settled in Anatolia. Obviously, neither did loss of lands necessiate Russians to expulse the Crimean Tatars or the Circassians, nor the shrinking Ottoman presence in Balkans did require to expel the Albanians, Pomaks, Bosniaks, Muslim Greeks and Muslim Macedonians (as well as the Jews) out of their native habitat. However, the Russians and the Christian Balkan Nations did change the demographic structure of these lands by seizing property, oppression, mass sluaghters, and plunder.

In this respect, I dont think that placing the blame on the migrants from other Ottoman territories could explain what happened to the native Armenian population of Anatolia.

[Gavur]

What about These?

http://www.armeniangenocide.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1315

[cosmos2]

[QUOTE=Gavur]These children of the borderlands of the Ottoman Empire and the refugees of lost lands could not stand the fact that we were more of a Ottoman then they were QUOTE]

This expression supports you. I don't know by whom it was said. (but certainly by a Turk).

''In the Ottoman Empire, many nations had place/home, even Turks.''

Actually, even Ottomans had despised Turks, especially their nomadic way of life was despiced.

If I am not wrong, they used to call Turks ''kaba köylüler'' (rude villagers). Of course, when I use the word ''Ottoman'', refer to people who lived in the Pallace or were from its outside congregations. And I suppose most people don't know that Ottomans never called themselves Turk.

[TurQ]

I have read that article, thanks.
I think the following excerpt supports my, Elendil, and Vezir's point of view.


[QUOTE=Gavur]What about These?
http://www.armeniangenocide.com/foru...ead.php?t=1315[/
......
In 1912-1913 all of the Young Turk officers and civil servants who had been born in the Balkan provinces some thirty years earlier, lost their ancestral homes. In many cases their families had to flee and became refugees (muhacirs) in what remained of the Ottoman Empire. Perhaps surprisingly, this did not give rise to a strong irredentism or revanchism among the Young Turks. It did lead them to adopt Anatolia, which to many of them was a completely foreign country as their new fatherland. There was an upsurge in interest for the population and culture of Anatolia, as expressed in research and in articles in the press. At the same time, the feeling that what had happened should never be allowed to happen again; that Anatolia should not go the way of the Balkans and was in a very real sense the “Turk’s last stand” was certainly instrumental in the decisions to embark on the wholesale extermination of the Armenians and the expulsion of the Greek Orthodox. Armenian scholars usually seek the explanation for the persecution of the Armenians in 1915-16 in the Pan-Turkist dreams of the Young Turk leadership, but in fact the experiences of ethnic warfare in the Balkans and in the Caucasus had far more to do with it. After all: at least a quarter of the inhabitants of Anatolia in 1915 were either Muslim refugees (muhacirs) themselves or children of refugees.
QUOTE]

[phantom]

[QUOTE=TurQ]I have read that article, thanks.
I think the following excerpt supports my, Elendil, and Vezir's point of view.

What about These?
http://www.armeniangenocide.com/foru...ead.php?t=1315[/
......
In 1912-1913 all of the Young Turk officers and civil servants who had been born in the Balkan provinces some thirty years earlier, lost their ancestral homes. In many cases their families had to flee and became refugees (muhacirs) in what remained of the Ottoman Empire. Perhaps surprisingly, this did not give rise to a strong irredentism or revanchism among the Young Turks. It did lead them to adopt Anatolia, which to many of them was a completely foreign country as their new fatherland. There was an upsurge in interest for the population and culture of Anatolia, as expressed in research and in articles in the press. At the same time, the feeling that what had happened should never be allowed to happen again; that Anatolia should not go the way of the Balkans and was in a very real sense the “Turk’s last stand” was certainly instrumental in the decisions to embark on the wholesale extermination of the Armenians and the expulsion of the Greek Orthodox. Armenian scholars usually seek the explanation for the persecution of the Armenians in 1915-16 in the Pan-Turkist dreams of the Young Turk leadership, but in fact the experiences of ethnic warfare in the Balkans and in the Caucasus had far more to do with it. After all: at least a quarter of the inhabitants of Anatolia in 1915 were either Muslim refugees (muhacirs) themselves or children of refugees.
QUOTE]

What point of view are you referring to and how does this excerpt support it. Furthermore, do you think the article as a whole supports that point of view, and if so, how?

[Joseph]

[QUOTE=TurQ]I have read that article, thanks.
I think the following excerpt supports my, Elendil, and Vezir's point of view.

What about These?
http://www.armeniangenocide.com/foru...ead.php?t=1315[/
......
In 1912-1913 all of the Young Turk officers and civil servants who had been born in the Balkan provinces some thirty years earlier, lost their ancestral homes. In many cases their families had to flee and became refugees (muhacirs) in what remained of the Ottoman Empire. Perhaps surprisingly, this did not give rise to a strong irredentism or revanchism among the Young Turks. It did lead them to adopt Anatolia, which to many of them was a completely foreign country as their new fatherland. There was an upsurge in interest for the population and culture of Anatolia, as expressed in research and in articles in the press. At the same time, the feeling that what had happened should never be allowed to happen again; that Anatolia should not go the way of the Balkans and was in a very real sense the “Turk’s last stand” was certainly instrumental in the decisions to embark on the wholesale extermination of the Armenians and the expulsion of the Greek Orthodox. Armenian scholars usually seek the explanation for the persecution of the Armenians in 1915-16 in the Pan-Turkist dreams of the Young Turk leadership, but in fact the experiences of ethnic warfare in the Balkans and in the Caucasus had far more to do with it. After all: at least a quarter of the inhabitants of Anatolia in 1915 were either Muslim refugees (muhacirs) themselves or children of refugees.
QUOTE]

Interesting. I would be interested to know if there are is a comprehensive study in English on various CUP leaders and there views regarding Pan-turkism and/or pan-islam, Ottomanism, etc. It seems that some like Enver Pasha were definitely more pan-turkic than others.

I do agree that the subject has not been studied enough. I would imagine that many of the Turkish refugees from the Balkans were probably resettled in Anatolia and were probably not predisposed to think highly of their Christian neighbors after what happend. This may be another cause of the Genocide and probably why an event was basically unavoidable

[TurQ]

As how Balkan and Caucusian events affected 1915 events.
I am from Malatya, my grandmother who passed away long before was from Caucusia. We have her memories of Caucusian events(eventhough she was little).
As avarage Armenian being the scapegoats for those events and + activities of Tashnak/Hinjak.


[QUOTE=phantom]

I have read that article, thanks.
I think the following excerpt supports my, Elendil, and Vezir's point of view.




What point of view are you referring to and how does this excerpt support it. Furthermore, do you think the article as a whole supports that point of view, and if so, how?