"what would you do?"

[mthT]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

[Edoman]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

Ottoman’s couldn’t even govern themselves let alone us Armenians, are you kidding?

It would have been to their favor to allow Armenians to run their own lives and let them live and thrive in an independent state, which would have been economically connected to the Ottoman’s sphere of influence.

Any human being who had any respect for himself as a man would have stood up the human rights violations that the Turkish State was imposing on its minority citizens. I like to ask you now what you would have done if you were in our shoe.

[phantom]

Ask your "professor" if this is history class or mythology class? It sounds more like he is teaching mythology. Armenians were the most loyal (stupidly) of the Ottoman millet. All they wanted was equality, freedom from persecution, and protection by the authorities from Kurdish bandits. You see, Armenians are good at doing business, but that is sort of hard to do if every time you make a buck, some lowlife neanderthal chieftain comes down from his tent in the mountains and steals it with impunity. Ask your worthless professor if that was too much to ask!

[ardakilic]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

Every "argument" of him/her need to be evaluated, so we can see how much of his/her mythological legend is real:

1. Did Armenian citizens of Ottoman Empire looked for an independent Armenian state?
- A part of Armenian community could have a desire to have their own state and this is self-determination right of people. However, another part tried to solve the problem by autonomy, federation, equal citizenship or some other formulas. Another part was totally loyal and conservative.

2. Was Eastern Anatolia predominantly Muslim?
- I don't think so. In some cities, for example Mush, Armenians are majority.

3. Did Armenians collaborate with Russian army?
- Yes, some of them. This happened because of fear of massacre, desire of autonomy or some other reasons. But, professor, for God's sake, how can this legalize the Genocide? Also Genocide acts started before the war. It was a stage of systematic ethnical cleansing.

4. Did Armenian self-defense commitees or gangs or whatever you call, armed forces kill Muslim innocent villagers?
- As far as i read, some Armenian groups who survived from Genocidal acts attacked Turk and Kurd villages for revenge aims. But this is so minor.

And what would i do?

It is always my dream, maybe it could sound so wierd or utopic but a loose confederation between Turks, Kurds, Arabs, Armenians, Greek, Assyrians might make me so happy.

[VaheTheGreat(e)]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

It is pity you didn’t say it loud, it would be so hilarious…

But you could ask a conterquestion:
Imagine you are an Armenian, one of the most loyal millets of Ottoman empire, you have contributed so much for prosperity of it, your nation built the greatest palaces and mosques, your nation contributed so much to trade and economy, most of your men are fighting for Ottoman Empire on fronts of WW1 and you are systematically persecuted and oppressed and recently ordered to live your house and march to desert until death..
What would you do, professor?

[Steph]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

First. I assume this university is in turkey? Sitting lectures on Sundays tends not to happen in many countries.
Second. Enough said.

[lal]

- you are the sultan of the ottoman empire. your armenian citizens wants to have an independent state in the eastern anatolia, which is predominantly muslim. they are revolting against the government, collaborating with the russians, sabotaging the ottoman army which is already short on soldiers, weapons and ammunitions; killing innocent villagers in order to provoke muslims to retaliate and etc. what would you do? how would you solve this problem?

my history lecturer at the university came up with these yesterday. needless to say, she was justifying the tehcir law. I would like to learn your opinion.


- yeah, I would order all armenians in these area to march till they die or get killed. because every single of them is conspiring against my glorious empire. you're right professor. I'm enlightened. they totally got what they deserved.

(I didn't say it out loud. Unfortunately, I need a higher GPA this term.)

well, the same thing is happening today with kurds. should we do the same thing now?

the way you think is quite common in turkey, why didnt you say it loud. if you taught it was an injustice done against armenians ,than you should hide it though.

this is a problem of, what kind of a country we want to live in. if todays turkey is democratic enough, if you have no uncertainaties about your future life, if you think that you have justice in turkey today, than it is okay ,you may keep on thinking the same way.

but if you want a better country, and if you have problems that you wouldnt have in forward countries, than ı think it may be a good idea to start cleaning ourselves by listening the cries of armenians.

[bell-the-cat]

Phantom - in Turkey, all history seem to be mythology.

The country is packed full of worthless "professor doctors" that squat in Turkish schools and universities, spewing out their propaganda year after year. Worse still, I think, are the western organisations and academics who have professional contacts with these people and their institutions yet say nothing - looking on the behaviour as just a slightly embarassing local custom that it would be impolite to actually criticise.

mthT has a point. Why put yourself at risk by publically refusing to accept the propaganda, especially since you will never get a genuine thank-you from Armenians for doing it. But Lal's point is better. For the sake of Turkey's future, and for a better life for all its citizens, these people need to be opposed. If nobody opposes them, these things will continue to exist.

[VaheTheGreat(e)]

the way you think is quite common in turkey, why didnt you say it loud. if you taught it was an injustice done against armenians ,than you should hide it though.

lal, I do not think the poster thinks that way, his answer is an ironic; the question is stated the way that there is no correct answer (or the answer is the "deportation") Although the question has nothing to do with real history the answer is ironically truthful!!

[mthT]

First. I assume this university is in turkey? Sitting lectures on Sundays tends not to happen in many countries.
Second. Enough said.

yeah, it's a turkish university. but she didn't ask the question during a lecture.

the way you think is quite common in turkey, why didnt you say it loud. if you taught it was an injustice done against armenians ,than you should hide it though.

if the way I think were quite common in turkey, we wouldn't be having this conversation. you should read my post again.

1. Did Armenian citizens of Ottoman Empire looked for an independent Armenian state?
- A part of Armenian community could have a desire to have their own state and this is self-determination right of people. However, another part tried to solve the problem by autonomy, federation, equal citizenship or some other formulas. Another part was totally loyal and conservative.

2. Was Eastern Anatolia predominantly Muslim?
- I don't think so. In some cities, for example Mush, Armenians are majority.

3. Did Armenians collaborate with Russian army?
- Yes, some of them. This happened because of fear of massacre, desire of autonomy or some other reasons. But, professor, for God's sake, how can this legalize the Genocide? Also Genocide acts started before the war. It was a stage of systematic ethnical cleansing.

4. Did Armenian self-defense commitees or gangs or whatever you call, armed forces kill Muslim innocent villagers?
- As far as i read, some Armenian groups who survived from Genocidal acts attacked Turk and Kurd villages for revenge aims. But this is so minor.

I don't think that these arguments are pure myths. however, blaming every armenian for conspiring against the government and justifying the tehcir law because some armenians "did bad things" is a sick perspective, which is so prevalent among turkish historians.

"eastern anatolia was predominantly muslim" - as far as I know, this one is a fact.