Armenian Patriarch Of Turkey Issues Bold Message On Genocide

[bell-the-cat]

Your comments are pointless.

But yours are not, since they reveal your ignorance.

I have no sympathies towards the Ramkavar party what-so-ever.

Who said that you did? You, however, implied that you did, since you posted one of their press releases without comment .

They certainly knew how filthy the Patriarchate of Istanbul was, but as long as they were on friendly terms with them, they did not bother to complain. Now that they have had a falling out, they are begining to expose Mutafian for what he trully is.

Which is exactly what I said, minus the word filthy.

So, lets just stay on topic here, if you dont mind.

Talking about something that you posted IS on topic. Or are you saying that what you had posted is off-topic?

Pure and typical bullkaka.

Hmmm. More relevations about your stupidity, perhaps?

The reason why there is no Genocide recognition by AMERICA has nothing to do with our political representation and has everything to do with global geo-strategic formulations of various major powers who see Turkey as a large and powerful buffer state.

I did not use the word "recognition", precisely because there is no value to be had in these superficial political recognitions even if it were possible for them to be attained.

I used the word "ignoring". Ignoring because those that would normally be willing to publicly express concern about the relevant issues and support Armenia are conciously reluctant to do so because they do not wish to be used by self-seeking Armenian political groups, and have no way of distinguishing the good ones (if there are any) from the bad ones.

Listen, I don't know what your obession is with us Armenians, but at the very least, be mindful of how you converse with us.

Listen, I'll converse with whoever I want in whatever manner I deem suitable for the occasion, regardless of whether it is to an Armenian, to a non-Armenian, or to you, the self-proclaimed "The" Armenian (talk about walking talking egos!).

[Red Brigade]

Why is Melkonian of Cyprus closing and what corruption in Melkonian?
From what i know its simply because there aren't anymore many students attending there.

[bell-the-cat]

Why is Melkonian of Cyprus closing and what corruption in Melkonian?
From what i know its simply because there aren't anymore many students attending there.

And what better way to ensure that not many students are attending than by announcing its closure? The school has been deliberately run-down over many years with the aim of closing it and selling the property. But the (American based) AGBU now wants the closure done quickly before Cyprus becomes a EU member and the school can be used by European Armenians.

But there is plenty of info elsewhere on the internet about this issue (some of which may even be impartial) - so why not look there, not here.

[bezjian]

In my humble opinion, Patriarch Mutafian needs to be flogged in public, tarred and feathered (I only say this because I can't wish his murder).

i wonder if in your dealings with the eastern diocese any of the tenets of christianity ever rubbed off on you. flogging people in public isn't exactly christian behavior. i also wonder if khajag barsamian, the primate of the eastern diocese and a bolsahye, would agree with you in your assessment of the istanbul patriarchate and armenian community's right to existence. i suppose for you gomidas (not komitas), siamanto, krikor zohrab (not grigor), taniel varoujan, ganatchian, and all the other great istanbul armenians, they were turkified too because they (undoubtedly) spoke turkish and lived in istanbul.

i gather you would prefer that those of us who trace our roots to western armenia, in my case gesaria, gurun, trabzon, yozgat - relinquish our identities and become hayastantsis like you. i've thought about moving to armenia myself at one point to be honest, but decided against it since i really can't stand all the russian influence in the culture there. it's so cold and, for lack of a better word, white. i mean we have a sovereign country there, there is no reason to surrender any of our cultural sovereignty to anyone, unlike what the armenians of turkey have to live with. it's a miracle there are even people who call themselves armenian living in turkey, given the suffocating prejudice that exists there (armenian language taught only one hour a day in the shools, armenian history completely revised and distorted). that there are is an enormous credit to the armenians living there. the armenians of turkey have been cut off from the rest of the armenian world since the genocide - armenians of foreign nationality are not allowed to enroll in the seminary there and the schools are not allowed to hire foreign nationals either. what exists of an armenian identity is due entirely to the strong will of the armenians there passed down over 90 years from the few survivors who stayed in turkey.

so yes, i did think about moving to armenia at one point, but then thought, why should i give myself up to help repopulate the country when it's people like you who stabbed your nation in the back by leaving in the first place to live the good life here in america? losing a third of its population was a good thing for armenia, was it?

moving on, let's try to think what else might happen if all of a sudden everyone became hayastantsi. well, for one most of the yerkchakhumps in the churches here would disappear, since most of the members are bolsahyes. ditto for the ranks of sargavaks. contrast with hayastantsis, who, while bolsahyes are serving in church, are running their credit card scams and crime rings, gangbanging in hollywood and glendale while driving their fancy cars, attempting to smuggle arms into the u.s. while boasting of ties to al qaeda, and otherwise ruining the excellent reputation armenian genocide survivors (mostly western armenians) and their progeny built up for all of us in places like boston, detroit, wisconsin, fresno, in the 90 or so years since they first came here. bolsahyes have an anti-hayastantsi bias? maybe it's not such a misplaced bias after all. besides, any such bias could never even approach the prejudice and mistreatment shown by deghatsis towards the immigrants that came to soviet armenia from lebanon, syria, greece, and elsewhere in the 40s/50s. my family living there now told me all about it when i was there last year. everyone knows the derogatory names that were used to refer to them as they were trying to start new lives out of a sense of patriotism in a country they thought would welcome them.

half of my family were born and raised in turkey. they come originally from near gesaria (the original caesarea and today's kayseri, which is where krikor lusavorich was himself baptized and later consecrated as the first armenian catholicos of the armenian church, according to agatangeghos). of my parents' generation almost all grew up in istanbul. all of us speak armenian, have armenian names (more than you can say of american-armenians), and don't need to prove our armenianness to you or to anyone else.

the ramgavar attack on mutafyan was for his opposition to the closure of melkonian, which represents another nail in the coffin of the decaying western armenian culture. the property melkonian sits on is worth over one hundred million dollars, while building a new school in armenia to replace it will cost a fraction of that amount. some people will be making a handsome profit (this is what liberals and their armenian variant, ramgavars, are known for doing). cypriot armenians are probably a hundred times more armenian speaking than american armenians are, so why should american-armenians have the right to deprive them of their only high school? i'm behind mutafyan 100% on this one. cyprus loses a school so that armenia can get one? considering how many well-intentioned diasporan armenians have been swindled trying to make a difference in armenia, does armenia really deserve to get a school?

armenia is a great country but it would be better were it populated by bolsahyes.

[Armenian]

Paron Bezjian:

Listen, my intent here is not to argue with nationalist Armenians, whether they are from Turkey or elsewhere. If you are a nationalist Armenian, that is, if you identify yourself as an Armenian culturally and you regularly visit Armenia, I have no problems with you and I would consider you a brother. However, if you are an Armenian and you identify yourself with a place other than Armenia - you are a lost soul. Listen, I would like to make a distinction between old "Polsahais" and the new "Istanbultsis." The old Polis we once knew, the center of Western Armenian culture, died physically, spiritually and culturally during the First World War.

What we have left today are remnants of peasants, Turk loving porniks and penny pinching low-lives. For all intents and purposes, these folk are Turks with a Christian flavor. Moreover, I have never seen more vile anti-Hayastan and anti-Hayastanci behavior from any other Armenian group. And this anti-Armenian behavior is something I will never forgive Polsahais.

For better or for worst, Armenia is our Fatherland and our Motherland, it is all we have left. Armenia today is something to be truly proud of. Armenia is the most stable nation, politically and economically, within the region. Armenia, with all its trouble, is one of the most safest countries within the world. Armenians are perhaps one of the most talented and educated peoples on earth. And when push came to shove, its was Armenians that took up arms against great odds and soundly defeated Turks in the battlefield.

When I travel to Yerevan, I see plenty of French Armenians, American Armenians, Persian Armenians, Lebanese Armenians, Russian Armenians - the only group I don't see <<at all>> are your Polsahais. If you don't realize any of what I have wrote, I suggest you start asking yourself questions about your true allegiance and identity.

You can't adhere to Western Armenian culture because its foundation was destroyed in 1915. Moreover, there is no point in being a Diasporan Armenian because sooner or later the Diaspora will die. If you think you Will preserve a Diaspora you are simply delusional. The sole purpose of existence of us Armenians needs to revolve around the preservation of the Armenian nation. Thus, if your "ego" can't allow you to see this, you are as good as a Turk to me.

To be objective, I would have to say that I have seen some good Polsahais. The person that readily comes to mind is that Hratch Kaprielian guy within the NYC diamond district. This man has spent tons of money within Artsakh and takes his family there regularly - instead of going to the beaches of Izmir. BTW: Hratch has had some of the same complaints I have about his kind - Polsahais. The typical Polsahai is a typical Turk. If you deny it, you are simply lying.

Therefore, instead of arguing with me, I suggest you tell Polsahais to stop speaking that ugly language called Turkish. Also tell them to stop listening to Turkish music and stop visiting Turkey on their holidays. Its time Polashais realized that they have a fatherland called Armenia not Turkey.

Regarding Christianity:

First, it does not matter what Archbishop Khajak thinks about Mutafian - that does not change the realty of what Mutafian is. Besides, Khajak is not all that innocent himself. I suggest you don't get me started about him in public. If being a Christian from Polis means acting like a Turk, I would rather be a Turk. If being a Christian means allowing anti-Armenian filth to run the Church, I would much rather be an atheist.

Mutafian and all his supporters need to be tarred and feathered. If that makes me un-Christian then so-be-it. Armenians like Mutafian are traitors to the Armenian nation and to Christ. Reread what I posted, I suspect that you don't know that Turk loving low life very well. I don't care why Ramkavars had a falling out with him, for years they knew what filth Mutafian was, but they had kept quiet for their selfish reasons; now that they have stepped on each others toes, the crap comes out.

Incidentally, you would do well to learn your Aybuben properly. Its Komitas Vartapet, Grigor Zohrap and Daniel Varoujan. The official language of Armenia and, thus, Armenians is the Eastern Dialect. And as all historians will tell you, the correct pronunciations of Armenian letters was preserved within the Eastern dialect.

My problem is not with Western Armenian culture, my problem is with so-called Armenians who act like Turks.

[Red Brigade]

Western Armenian spelling is the correct one and the Eastern Armenian pronouncing is the correct one.Although the Hayastantsis have elements of Russification in their own very country.The way they pronounce the Armenian language , is the way they pronounce the Russian one and their whole cultural behavour has been changed and replaced the Russian slavic mentality.For example ''Eli ara ari steg''.There is no such thing as ''eli'' neither ''ara'' in the offical correct Armenian language which is Grabar and not Eastern Armenian.They all have been Russified, in their own country.As a result their spelling is wrong.It is not surprise that all of them speak slavic Russian as well, even though they are Armenians.Something must be done with the educational system in Armenia and in the Diaspora , and teach the kids one Armenian language based on Grabar.Neither that plastic Russian Armenian that Haystantsis speak, neither that irritiating Western Armenian pronouncing with midle eastern arabic elements.

[Armenian]

Western Armenian spelling is the correct one and the Eastern Armenian pronouncing is the correct one.Although the Hayastantsis have elements of Russification in their own very country.The way they pronounce the Armenian language , is the way they pronounce the Russian one and their whole cultural behavour has been changed and replaced the Russian slavic mentality.For example ''Eli ara ari steg''.There is no such thing as ''eli'' neither ''ara'' in the offical correct Armenian language which is Grabar and not Eastern Armenian.They all have been Russified, in their own country.As a result their spelling is wrong.It is not surprise that all of them speak slavic Russian as well, even though they are Armenians.Something must be done with the educational system in Armenia and in the Diaspora , and teach the kids one Armenian language based on Grabar.Neither that plastic Russian Armenian that Haystantsis speak, neither that irritiating Western Armenian pronouncing with midle eastern arabic elements.

I agree with all you have stated.

Some additional thoughts:

The Armenian nation, for natural reasons, has been effected by Russian culture to some degree - not to the extent that you claim. Please, don't base your opinion on the low-lives from Yerevan you meet. There is an Armenian saying, every village has its dogs. However, this is gradually changing within the new generation. Although there still are worthless people that walk the streets of Yerevan today, a lot is gradually changing. This will take time. And you, as a concerned Armenian, need to understand this.

Don't forget, we did not have national sovereignty within historic Armenia for close to a thousand years. For a thousand years, we were forced to live amongst Turks, Arabs, Kurds and Persians. There were the Mongol, Tatar, Turkmen invasions that devestated the land and turned Asia Minor into a cesspool that it is today. Then there was the Genocide (1895-1923). And finally, there was seventy years of Soviet rule, with its anti-God and anti-Nationalistic propaganda.

Thus, in-spite of the aforementioned peculiar circumstances of Armenian history, that fact that we have preserved our nation and national culture is nothing but a miracle. The credit for the preservation of our nation goes to Armenian individuals worldwide who did not forget who they were and what they needed to do to preserve our nation.

Today, Armenia is a major player within the Trans-Caucasus

Today, Armenia is the most stable and the most powerful nation within the Trans-Caucasus

Today, Armenia has actually grown larger for the first time in a thousand years

Today, Yerevan is a beautiful city and its getting prettier by the day.

The aforementioned is enough to make any Armenian extremely proud regardless of where they are born. Yet, all you hear about today is how bad the situation is in Armenia, how Hayastantsis and so forth. Nevertheless, I am glad that there are nationalist individuals like you who have broken with the previous generation's anti-Armenian ideologies. Look at Armenia objectively. Its not a fairytale land, its real. Armenia has its serious problems, but its up to us to fix it - to each in his/her own way.

Regarding Language:

The eastern Armenian term "Ara" is the same as the western Armenian term "Tso," it is the language of the lower classes. Therefore, I don't want to discuss it.

Eastern Armenian has preserved correct pronunciations and western Armenian has preserved proper speech structure. I only brought up the language issue because the previous poster was trying be sarcastic.

Nothing would please me more than reinstating Grabar as our state language. Eastern and Western Armenian were essentially the language of the simple folk who were, for the most part uneducated at the time.

You are right, something must be done about the education system within Armenia and the Diaspora. Within Armenia, I see a lot of positive change. After several years of chaos within the academia, the nation is slowly going back to its cultural roots. However, I do not see any positive change within the Diaspora. We, in the Diaspora, are still largely ignorant of our Homeland, and all our national identity is still based upon the Genocide.

The Diaspor should exist for the sole benefit of the Armenian Homeland. The entire concept of a "Diasporan Armenian mentality" is absurd and self-defeating. Whether we were born in Yerevan, Tehran, Paris or New York we are Armenians and we must establish a foothold within our homeland.

Anyway, this thread is concerning Mutafian. Lets stick to the topic.

[bezjian]

Paron Bezjian:

Listen, my intent here is not to argue with nationalist Armenians, whether they are from Turkey or elsewhere. If you are a nationalist Armenian, that is, if you identify yourself as an Armenian culturally and you regularly visit Armenia, I have no problems with you and I would consider you a brother. However, if you are an Armenian and you identify yourself with a place other than Armenia - you are a lost soul.

I am Armenian and I identify myself with a place other than Armenia. They are places Armenians were wiped off the map of. If we don't feel some sort of attachment to these places then why do we care to seek genocide recognition? You are underestimating the strength of the various Armenian sub-identities that have existed for centuries. I know what eastern Armenian culture is like and I don't identify with it, nor do I have any desire to make myself eastern Armenian (now that I have been exposed to the eastern dialect I understand it fine, but I have no desire to speak it because it just isn't me. It has a totally different feel and rhythm to it. You said you have nothing against western armenian culture, so you should be fine with that.

Listen, I would like to make a distinction between old "Polsahais" and the new "Istanbultsis." The old Polis we once knew, the center of Western Armenian culture, died physically, spiritually and culturally during the First World War.

What we have left today are remnants of peasants, Turk loving porniks and penny pinching low-lives. For all intents and purposes, these folk are Turks with a Christian flavor.

What good does it do to narrow the definition of who is Armenian and who is not, as if we are not small enough in numbers already? If a person considers themself Armenian, they should be accepted as an Armenian. Differences should be celebrated as a reminder of the accomplishments of the past, when Armenians excelled in trade and commerce to such a degree, being spread out in many countries, that the great economic historian Fernand Braudel devoted an entire chapter to the role of Armenians and Jews in the history of commerce and trade (not that I have any desire to be compared to Jews). Who are you to tell somebody what they are or are not? If you narrow the definition of who is Armenian and who is not then you decrease the number of Armenians in the world, and for that you are a bigger traitor to your nation than all the bolsahyes combined.

Moreover, I have never seen more vile anti-Hayastan and anti-Hayastanci behavior from any other Armenian group. And this anti-Armenian behavior is something I will never forgive Polsahais.

I explained to you the likely reasons for anti-Hayastantsi sentiment. Read my original post: it has to do with the actions and behavior of Hayastantsis who come into communities already long-settled by other Armenians and ruin the good name of Armenians. Please don't try to explain this away as having something to do with the hardships involved in adjusting to life in a new country. The conditions recent immigrants have to put up with are hardly any worse than what the original genocide survivors had to deal with, and almost without exception they created an unimpeachable name for Armenians. Not so anymore thanks to you guys.

For better or for worst, Armenia is our Fatherland and our Motherland, it is all we have left. Armenia today is something to be truly proud of. Armenia is the most stable nation, politically and economically, within the region. Armenia, with all its trouble, is one of the most safest countries within the world. Armenians are perhaps one of the most talented and educated peoples on earth. And when push came to shove, its was Armenians that took up arms against great odds and soundly defeated Turks in the battlefield.

When I travel to Yerevan, I see plenty of French Armenians, American Armenians, Persian Armenians, Lebanese Armenians, Russian Armenians - the only group I don't see <<at all>> are your Polsahais. If you don't realize any of what I have wrote, I suggest you start asking yourself questions about your true allegiance and identity.

Last time I was in Yerevan I was told there were a lot of Bolsahye businessmen in Armenia. Isn't that Chez Garo place owned by a Bolsahye? My cousins in Istanbul have Armenian flags hanging on their bedroom walls.
I couldn't disagree more with your idea that Armenians should leave Turkey. As far as I'm concerned we should strengthen the Armenian communities of historical cities like Constantinople, Aleppo, Jerusalem, Cairo, Isfahan, etc. as a way of honoring our storied past. Practically any architecture of note in Istanbul is due to Armenians (Balian family). Weren't the 9-10th centuries known as the Armenian centuries in Byzantine history for the domination of Armenians in the military/political sphere of that time? As far as Armenia today goes the people whose responsibility it is first to ensure it is a strong country are the ones who actually come from there, Hayastantsis themselves, the ones living in LA, New York, Moscow, etc. As I said before, why should I move to Armenia when a third of the country got up and left to live the good life in hollywood/glendale?

You can't adhere to Western Armenian culture because its foundation was destroyed in 1915. Moreover, there is no point in being a Diasporan Armenian because sooner or later the Diaspora will die. If you think you Will preserve a Diaspora you are simply delusional. The sole purpose of existence of us Armenians needs to revolve around the preservation of the Armenian nation. Thus, if your "ego" can't allow you to see this, you are as good as a Turk to me.

If you think this way you don't know Armenian history very well. Armenians have had a diaspora since almost the very beginning, and diasporan Armenians have played a pivotal role in advancing the Armenian cause, e.g. Armenians of India before the British got there, Armenians of Amsterdam, Geneva, Manchester, St. Petersburg etc. I'll back you up on repatriation to Armenia only when the last Hayastantsi who left after independence goes back.

I agree the diaspora can't survive everywhere. Without replenishment it will die in the U.S., European countries, South America etc. But it can survive in Lebanon/Syria/Palestine as long as external factors, i.e. conflict in those countries, doesn't cause Armenians to leave in large numbers for America.

Incidentally, you would do well to learn your Aybuben properly. Its Komitas Vartapet, Grigor Zohrap and Daniel Varoujan. The official language of Armenia and, thus, Armenians is the Eastern Dialect. And as all historians will tell you, the correct pronunciations of Armenian letters was preserved within the Eastern dialect.

My problem is not with Western Armenian culture, my problem is with so-called Armenians who act like Turks.

This is a form of cultural imperialism. It's like Americans telling Iraqis they have to pronounce the name of their country Ay-rak. Gomidas Vartabed, Krikor Zohrab, and Taniel Varoujan were all from Constantinople, so they spoke Western Armenian and pronounced Armenian words, as well as their own names, with the Western pronunciation. If they were alive today would you be correcting their speech? Who the hell are you!

[winoman]

Bezjian - extremely well put - bravo!


Diaspora communities existed long before even the Genocide. Such things - which developed due to difficult circumstances - in fact have become a great strength for us. The Diaspora communities and even individual Armenains living and excelling in nations and societies throughout the world is both a testament to the strength of our people and is an incredible asset to us. It is somethign to be celebrated. Additionally - the Diaspora is the only hope for the furture of the nation of Armenia itself. The situation of Armenia in the Caucuses without sufficient resources, with the continuing baggage of the Soviet legacy and with significant and powerful enemies (and powerful, dubious friends - Russia primarily - that would swallow Armenia up in an instant if it could...) at her doorstep makes the nations existence and outlook a rather tenuous one. It is in the strength and success and cooperation with the Diaspora where Armenia's bright future lies - and in practically no other way. Look at the State of Israel and attempt to imagine it without its Diaspora - it would not exist.

[Armenian]

Paron Bezjian:

To tell you the truth, I agree with most of what you have said. From what I have seen, I consider you a true Armenian, although some of your ideological convictions need to be adjusted somewhat- in my opinion, if that matters to you.

I have answered a lot of your questions with my reply to Red Brigade. However, I'll try entertaining your questions even further. However, I hope we can get off this topic because this thread is concerning that Turkish filth we call the Armenian Patriarch.

I am Armenian and I identify myself with a place other than Armenia. They are places Armenians were wiped off the map of. If we don't feel some sort of attachment to these places then why do we care to seek genocide recognition? You are underestimating the strength of the various Armenian sub-identities that have existed for centuries. I know what eastern Armenian culture is like and I don't identify with it, nor do I have any desire to make myself eastern Armenian (now that I have been exposed to the eastern dialect I understand it fine, but I have no desire to speak it because it just isn't me. It has a totally different feel and rhythm to it. You said you have nothing against western armenian culture, so you should be fine with that.

I am fine with that. However, you need to get through your thick head that there is ONE Armenia for all Armenians. What are you telling me, if and when we liberate some of our historic lands you are going to creat the "Western Armenian Republic." Don't be stupid. History has given us our present circumstances, thus, we have to deal with what we have.

There is one Armenian Fatherland, one Armenian nation, one Armenian national culture, I say this to Yerevantsis, Lebananahais and Americahais. Get rid of your William Saroyan mentality - when two Armenians in the world meet, they will create a new Armenia. Today the official language of Armenia is Eastern Armenian. If world politics does not change drastically within the near future, Eastern Armenian will eventually overtake Western Armenian, because Western Armenian does not have a foundation within our historic lands. Also keep in mind that when the day comes to liberate our lands (Turks will not simply give it to us), it will be the youth from the Caucasus that will be doing the fighting.

Moreover, you don't know anything about what Eastern Armenian culture, if you did you would not dare to talk the way you did. Its obvious you are basing your opinions on low class people from Armenia you have either heard about or met. Besides which, I would much rather have an aggressive, loud, annoying Russified Armenian from Yerevan - than a polite, decent, Turkified Armenian from Istanbul.

Just take a step back and look at the big picture.

What good does it do to narrow the definition of who is Armenian and who is not, as if we are not small enough in numbers already? If a person considers themself Armenian, they should be accepted as an Armenian. Differences should be celebrated as a reminder of the accomplishments of the past, when Armenians excelled in trade and commerce to such a degree, being spread out in many countries, that the great economic historian Fernand Braudel devoted an entire chapter to the role of Armenians and Jews in the history of commerce and trade (not that I have any desire to be compared to Jews). Who are you to tell somebody what they are or are not? If you narrow the definition of who is Armenian and who is not then you decrease the number of Armenians in the world, and for that you are a bigger traitor to your nation than all the bolsahyes combined.

Like I said, one Armenia, one Armenian nation. If you, as a Polsahai see this, than you are my brother. Although we are discussing Polashais here, due to Mutafian, my concerns apply towards all Armenians - including Yerevantsis. Therefore, don't take it personally, its just that I can't stand modern Polsahais because of their Turkish sentiments. Did you know that over fifty percent of your people in Istanbul are marrying Turks, according to your Mutafian, AND YOU HAVE THE NERVE TO COMPLAIN ABOUT HAYASTANTSIS???

I explained to you the likely reasons for anti-Hayastantsi sentiment. Read my original post: it has to do with the actions and behavior of Hayastantsis who come into communities already long-settled by other Armenians and ruin the good name of Armenians. Please don't try to explain this away as having something to do with the hardships involved in adjusting to life in a new country. The conditions recent immigrants have to put up with are hardly any worse than what the original genocide survivors had to deal with, and almost without exception they created an unimpeachable name for Armenians. Not so anymore thanks to you guys.

I have heard these stupid reasons and I am sick of it. What you raised has nothing to do with the big picture of Armenia and Armenian culture. These are internal sociologiocal issues that all nations have - including the Jews. There is a large minority of Armenians from Armenia today who have lost their God and their concept of what the Armenian nation is, due to eighty years of Soviet rule. I will rejoice when these people simply disappear one day. However, like I said, I would much rather have these unruly Russified folk, then Turkified Armenian folk. By the way, who was it that liberated Artsakh? Last I checked, it was thousands of Hayastantsis, along with a handful of Lebananahais, who spilt their blood on the battlefield.

Last time I was in Yerevan I was told there were a lot of Bolsahye businessmen in Armenia. Isn't that Chez Garo place owned by a Bolsahye? My cousins in Istanbul have Armenian flags hanging on their bedroom walls.

I never said there are no Polsahais in Armenia. I never said you and your family are Turkified. I simply said, your nationalistic ideologies are not well defined and you have to admit that the majority of Polsahais are more Turkish than Armenian. Reread my comments, you are misreading what I am trying to state. BTW: Do you have any Turks in your extended family? I am not being malicious here. Simply put, according to your Patriarch, you people there are marrying Turks in droves.

If you think this way you don't know Armenian history very well. Armenians have had a diaspora since almost the very beginning, and diasporan Armenians have played a pivotal role in advancing the Armenian cause, e.g. Armenians of India before the British got there, Armenians of Amsterdam, Geneva, Manchester, St. Petersburg etc. I agree the diaspora can't survive everywhere. Without replenishment it will die in the U.S., European countries, South America etc. But it can survive in Lebanon/Syria/Palestine as long as external factors, i.e. conflict in those countries, doesn't cause Armenians to leave in large numbers for America. I'll back you up on repatriation to Armenia only when the last Hayastantsi who left after independence goes back.

I know we have had a diaspora and I also know that all the disporas we have had have not survived. As a matter of fact, no dispora on earth has survived. BTW: Just in case you are thinking "what about the Jews." Jews are not a nation, they are a religion, thus, you can't compare the two. They more-or-less stick together because they are under constant threat. They have been hated by all nations, eccept Turks. And we Armenians have been loved by all nations, exccept Turks. Makes you wonder, no? The bottom line is, no ethnic dispora has ever survived the course of history. All our efforts within the Diaspora is a waste, if we don't place our eyes upon our one and only Fatherland.

Your argument regarding going back to Armenia when Hayastantsis go back is utterly childish. You are simply too comfortable within the Diaspora, so why ruin your comfort with stuff like that. Right? The truth is, I would much rather see Armenians like you going back to Armenia, then some of the crap that have come out of Yervan. As for me, I am already making plans on buying a place in Yerevan this summer. I want to move, with my children, within the next five to ten years. BTW: I don't know when you were there last, but now there are thousands of Persian Armenians living in Yerevan, along with hundreds of Lebanese and American Armenians. I am hopeful, if things go at this pace, Armenia will be a truly great nation to live in within the next ten to fifteen years, that is, unless your Turkish buddies in the west decide to make trouble.

This is a form of cultural imperialism. It's like Americans telling Iraqis they have to pronounce the name of their country Ay-rak. Gomidas Vartabed, Krikor Zohrab, and Taniel Varoujan were all from Constantinople, so they spoke Western Armenian and pronounced Armenian words, as well as their own names, with the Western pronunciation. If they were alive today would you be correcting their speech? Who the hell are you!

Deal with reality, it will only help you. Again, the official language is Eastern Armenian. I love Western Armenian, when it is spoken properly. All school children in Armenia read Western Armenian literature. If those great men that you mentioned were alive today, if we had our western lands intact today, then Western Armenian culture would still have a foundation. But we don't have our historic lands and those men are not alive today. Nevertheless, you need to see that there is a vast gap between those great men and their culture you noted, and what you have within Istanbul today.

Like I said, I love Western Armenian culture, for that was the language I was raised with. I was born in Lebanon, I was raised in New York City and I am planning to move to Armenia within the near future. Therefore, I am not Eastern Armenian, I am not Western Armenian. I am not Lebananahai. I am not Americahai. I AM AN ARMENIAN.