Invitation to Exfo...

[exfo]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Spurious point....


Anytime you discuss history, it will not be 100% accurate... so we rely on eye witnesses, memoirs, documents, etc...


I lost my chance? Please, you are the one who was making fun of anyone who wanted the genocide recognized by saying things..

"1.5 mllion turks should die?" --- sarcasm perhaps, but you are insulting our intelligence.

or

"maybe we should give turkey back to armenia" - again stupid remark

or

"all armenians are obsessed with turkish issues" - again how can you say something liek this? do you know all armenians?

or

"you have no normal life, your children will have hatred, your diaspora should live differently" -- do you understand how you are crossing lines?

or

"intelectual terror, armenian's comitted genocide in azerbejian"


by saying things the above on an armenian forum, you are inviting insults...


you say you're not sure of "reality" yet you call Dr. Bernard Lewis "the most important historian of middle east
You say you're not certain yet don't hesitate to call it a "myth" if you're not certain why do you call it a myth.

"victim of psyhcology and national identity based on this genocide." i dont refute this.... you have the similar issue regarding USA... doesnt mean 4/15/1915 was a myth.

"Second, I think you did not understand my point. Unlike you I am not sure about the reality, because as I said several times before the reality is being distorted by two sides. If you wouldn't lose your chance for a civilised discussion and we would start it, I know what kind of picture you will draw to me. You will start from the 1895-96 massacres, Hamidian troops, 1915 Van, and then 24 April arrests and killings, and then deportation, taking Armenian men to the military without guns, and then massacres, and then your secret telegrams that proove CUP has a plan for genocide, and then so called Naim Bey memoires, Morhenthau's book, blue book, Istanbul trials at 1919, etc. And you will conclude as there were around 2 million Armenians at 1914 and 150.000 remained at 1920"

I honestly don't want turkey to recgonize the genocide, because its not realistic... but i would like them to speak of the above (waht you stated) and let their citizens decide if it was a genocide or not... but they dont!!! Freedom of speech? Hah --- that is all i want for turkey to establish amreican constitutions first amendment... that's all

You seem more of a psychologist than a historian....

enter the Matrix!

Gunner I can give you a chance always, I have no superiority on you. But it is very clear that you are not capable to even understand what I write. I considered you were ready to be mature and try to understand the other side. But no, whatever I say, you only understand the ones that you are capable. How many more I have to repeat that my point is not "you and me", or "genocide" or "how USA is superiour to Turkey"? MY POINT IS THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH WHICH TWO SIDES ARE GUILTY TO RESTRAIN IT EQUALLY!!!!! Before postin a reply to this just go and read my previous post again.
***I dont remember I mentioned about "Azerbaijan genocide", did I?

[Sip]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Sip, you are turning into a pathetic loser, you just losed your autocontrol about me. I wrote clearly that I dont want to discuss anything with you or Gunner anymore and I dont even reply your provocative posts about me. I dont beg any intelligent discussion, especially with you. Why do you still humiliate yourself? There are many other members here without me. Go and post to them, you can continue to post them about me, but just stop to post me, capish?

You still haven't said anything intelligent. Maybe you will say something useful under one of your other login names.

By the way Kuja, I hope you don't take exfo seriously. All he does is insult people here. He has refused to discuss anything intelligent. I hope you will be different.

[Gunner14]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Gunner I can give you a chance always, I have no superiority on you. But it is very clear that you are not capable to even understand what I write. I considered you were ready to be mature and try to understand the other side. But no, whatever I say, you only understand the ones that you are capable. How many more I have to repeat that my point is not "you and me", or "genocide" or "how USA is superiour to Turkey"? MY POINT IS THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH WHICH TWO SIDES ARE GUILTY TO RESTRAIN IT EQUALLY!!!!! Before postin a reply to this just go and read my previous post again.
***I dont remember I mentioned about "Azerbaijan genocide", did I?

oh yeah, you said it... along with usa/iraq genocide...

wow, i just got completely bored of exefo...

[exfo]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

Dear Sip,

1. I dont have any other login name.
2. It seems that you will not be ashamed and will still continue to spam about me. Good, you can post whatever you want. Just for your information: I dont read them anymore.

[exfo]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

oh yeah, you said it... along with usa/iraq genocide...

wow, i just got completely bored of exefo...

Good, I wasnt expecting an answer from you about the fact I said about the FREEDOM OF SPEECH. Then stop to invite me to any other discussions. Unlike Sip I believe you have an honour and can understand this time that I dont want to continue any discussion with you anymore. Have a nice day and best regards.

[Sip]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

2. It seems that you will not be ashamed and will still continue to spam about me. Good, you can post whatever you want. Just for your information: I dont read them anymore.

PWNED!!!!

[Gunner14]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

PWNED!!!!

Sip i play BF2 online and people always type "pwned" why not "owned"

i never got the reason people typed "pwned"

[Sip]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

It's one of those online things ... since 'p' is right next to 'o' on the keyboard, a lot of people make the mistake of typing pwned instead of owned when they do it quickly. After a while, people started doing it on purpose and then it became a new word. The other "leet" variations are own3d and pwn3d.

[Gunner14]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

It's one of those online things ... since 'p' is right next to 'o' on the keyboard, a lot of people make the mistake of typing pwned instead of owned when they do it quickly. After a while, people started doing it on purpose and then it became a new word. The other "leet" variations are own3d and pwn3d.

i should have guessed as much

[Anonymouse]

Re: Invitation to Exfo...

First, you lose your chance for a civilised discussion. After many insults from you to me, I have no willingness to continue any debate.

Second, I think you did not understand my point. Unlike you I am not sure about the reality, because as I said several times before the reality is being distorted by two sides. If you wouldn't lose your chance for a civilised discussion and we would start it, I know what kind of picture you will draw to me. You will start from the 1895-96 massacres, Hamidian troops, 1915 Van, and then 24 April arrests and killings, and then deportation, taking Armenian men to the military without guns, and then massacres, and then your secret telegrams that proove CUP has a plan for genocide, and then so called Naim Bey memoires, Morhenthau's book, blue book, Istanbul trials at 1919, etc. And you will conclude as there were around 2 million Armenians at 1914 and 150.000 remained at 1920, so Turks made genocide.

Many of them are really correct, but Turks also claim many things which I am sure you know, they claim that most of your evidences for a planned genocide are either fake or war propoganda of ww1 against Ottoman Empire. They have also many other claims as you know. I will not repeat them to start a useless discussion.
The point here is, to get a solution both sides should establish a relation first and discuss the points one by one without distorting history at the internationla arena.

Dont say me that "oh western world support our thesis so probably we are the good guys and you are the bad ones" Your diaspora lobby distort the reality as much as Turkish government. How can we discuss a historical fact when one of the most important scholar of a middle east history, Bernard Lewis is on trial at the court just because he expressed his scientific opinion that do not match with your official history? How can we discuss anything since your diaspora force the governments and even it is a crime to discuss against your thesis at France and Switzerland? How can we discuss anything when you parrot the same "there is nothing to discuss, all the facts are clear, just confess it and get out of here" thing at "your" every post. How can we discuss anything when you (this one is singular you) are full of prejudices and stereotypes about Turks and Islam? How can we discuss anything when you believe that it is free to insult Turks if they dont accept your claims?

I have no willingness to discuss anythin with you Gunner.
The point here is not whether the Armenian genocide was a reality or not. The point is the freedom of speech.
Both sides restrain it. And the difference between you and me is I am ready to critisize the blind propoganda of Turkish government against Armenians and 1915, but you are not ready to critisize anything from you side because of your victim psyhcology and national identity based on this genocide myth.

First of all, Bernard Lewis is one of the typical hacks that only takes away integrity from the field of historiography. His adamant stance against the Armenian genocide is not out of the honesty of inquisitive minds. His political associations with the Turkish government have created a strong Pro-Turkish bias which has damaged his reputation as a historian.

Furthermore, Bernard Lewish being a Jeew, and a Zionist also sheds light on his stance against the Armenian genocide, which most Jeewish Zionists see as negligent, or outright deny. This is also the position of the Israeli government, and its close ties to the Turkish government.

Citing Bernard Lewis as a source of credibility is about as lame as citing Bush as a source of credibility for the White House.

EDIT: And for what it's worth, I am against all laws that prohibit the free exchange of ideas. I am definitely against Lewis' lynching in France for his not calling the Armenian genocide a genocide. But then again, it's France, a socialist utopia where you can be jailed and or fined for questioning the Holocaust and the Armenian genocide.